Top US scientist commits suicide?

[Nathaniel Heidenheimer]

That Madsen article is necessary reading, for things that you will not be reminded of elsewhere, including the article I am about to post.

Also here is a very important Greenwald article on the Propaganda role played by ABC News in turning the weaponizing the Anthrax Letters for the

Government's Propaganda War against its former CIA ally in Iraq.

Unlike most of the other accounts it reminds us of the psychological effect of the Anthrax letters-- coming just one week after 9/11 -- in the creation of a broad and virtually homogenous fear of radical islam.-------

The 2001 anthrax attacks remain one of the great mysteries of the post-9/11 era. After 9/11 itself, the anthrax attacks were probably the most consequential event of the Bush presidency. One could make a persuasive case that they were actually more consequential. The 9/11 attacks were obviously traumatic for the country, but in the absence of the anthrax attacks, 9/11 could easily have been perceived as a single, isolated event. It was really the anthrax letters — with the first one sent on September 18, just one week after 9/11 — that severely ratcheted up the fear levels and created the climate that would dominate in this country for the next several years after. It was anthrax — sent directly into the heart of the country’s elite political and media institutions, to then-Senate Majority Leader Tom Daschle (D-SD), Sen. Pat Leahy (D-Vt), NBC News anchor Tom Brokow, and other leading media outlets — that created the impression that social order itself was genuinely threatened by Islamic radicalism.

-------

aticle: http://www.commondreams.org/archive/2008/08/01/10738/

I guess you must live an a different USA than I live in. In my USA, 9/11 was just the final straw that broke the camels back when it came to Islamic radicalism. In my USA, we had a vivid memory of all the other attacks that came first. Anthrax was just a sideshow.

had a vivid memory??? Does this imply before 9/11? Were those investigations ever followe up on or were they blocked? Was the lead story in most of the US Corporate Media Shark attacks on swimmers during your america's summer of 01? Or was your america only reading online stories that could reach 13 people at a time? If so your america was cozy, real cozy.

Yep, a very vivid memory. There was no real doubt about the cause of the attacks that came before 9/11. What was to block? Why did we fail to act would be a far better question.

------

9/11 being the final straw to convince the US population to go onto a war on terror. Well, no doubt there had been a lot of prep work. Did US intelliegence have a lot of warnings? Yep far more than they cared to admit. Buy you are wrong if you imply that the public in general was talking a lot about Islamic terror during the summer of 2001. They needed 9/11 and and the anthrax attacks were fit into the islamic pattern, to induce a broad surrender of liberties, and cash for a war that was aimed on a country that had nothing to do with 9/11. Now the extent to which the anthrax letters were part of the overall islamaphobe campaign is being minimized by the corporate war media.

Oh please, The Cole attack was less than a year old by the time the towers fell. Anyone with half a brain had islamic terror on their minds. And I gotta love your conclusion "they" "needed" anything as if you 'know" it was all part of some grand plan by the "powers that be" How original. "They" didn't need anthrax. It could have been sold after the Cole. All that was missing then was a President willing to do the right thing. Lucky for us that President was in charge on 9/11.

-----

WHat I said was the Radical Islamic terrorism was not very prevelant at all in the mass media during the summer of 2001. Of course it was all over the place in intelligence reports. How original to lick the government. Oh please!

[Nathaniel Heidenheimer]

The 9/11 attacks were obviously traumatic for the country, but in the absence of the anthrax attacks, 9/11 could easily have been perceived as a single, isolated event. It was really the anthrax letters — with the first one sent on September 18, just one week after 9/11 — that severely ratcheted up the fear levels and created the climate that would dominate in this country for the next several years after. It was anthrax — sent directly into the heart of the country’s elite political and media institutions, to then-Senate Majority Leader Tom Daschle (D-SD), Sen. Pat Leahy (D-Vt), NBC News anchor Tom Brokow, and other leading media outlets — that created the impression that social order itself was genuinely threatened by Islamic radicalism.

I agree with this quote by the author of the posted article.

To imply that the Cole and other Al Q actions were even on the richter scale of the national consciousness before 9/11 is just not true. Were there periodic stories? Of course. But to conflate these as the first punch to 9/11 2nd? Do you live in a Langley lunchroom? Oh please how original!!

[Nathaniel Heidenheimer]

The 9/11 attacks were obviously traumatic for the country, but in the absence of the anthrax attacks, 9/11 could easily have been perceived as a single, isolated event. It was really the anthrax letters — with the first one sent on September 18, just one week after 9/11 — that severely ratcheted up the fear levels and created the climate that would dominate in this country for the next several years after. It was anthrax — sent directly into the heart of the country’s elite political and media institutions, to then-Senate Majority Leader Tom Daschle (D-SD), Sen. Pat Leahy (D-Vt), NBC News anchor Tom Brokow, and other leading media outlets — that created the impression that social order itself was genuinely threatened by Islamic radicalism.

I agree with this quote by the author of the posted article.

To imply that the Cole and other Al Q actions were even on the richter scale of the national consciousness before 9/11 is just not true. Were there periodic stories? Of course. But to conflate these as the first punch to 9/11 2nd? Do you live in a Langley lunchroom? Oh please how original!!

[Craig Lamson]

That Madsen article is necessary reading, for things that you will not be reminded of elsewhere, including the article I am about to post.

Also here is a very important Greenwald article on the Propaganda role played by ABC News in turning the weaponizing the Anthrax Letters for the

Government's Propaganda War against its former CIA ally in Iraq.

Unlike most of the other accounts it reminds us of the psychological effect of the Anthrax letters-- coming just one week after 9/11 -- in the creation of a broad and virtually homogenous fear of radical islam.-------

The 2001 anthrax attacks remain one of the great mysteries of the post-9/11 era. After 9/11 itself, the anthrax attacks were probably the most consequential event of the Bush presidency. One could make a persuasive case that they were actually more consequential. The 9/11 attacks were obviously traumatic for the country, but in the absence of the anthrax attacks, 9/11 could easily have been perceived as a single, isolated event. It was really the anthrax letters — with the first one sent on September 18, just one week after 9/11 — that severely ratcheted up the fear levels and created the climate that would dominate in this country for the next several years after. It was anthrax — sent directly into the heart of the country’s elite political and media institutions, to then-Senate Majority Leader Tom Daschle (D-SD), Sen. Pat Leahy (D-Vt), NBC News anchor Tom Brokow, and other leading media outlets — that created the impression that social order itself was genuinely threatened by Islamic radicalism.

-------

aticle: http://www.commondreams.org/archive/2008/08/01/10738/

I guess you must live an a different USA than I live in. In my USA, 9/11 was just the final straw that broke the camels back when it came to Islamic radicalism. In my USA, we had a vivid memory of all the other attacks that came first. Anthrax was just a sideshow.

had a vivid memory??? Does this imply before 9/11? Were those investigations ever followe up on or were they blocked? Was the lead story in most of the US Corporate Media Shark attacks on swimmers during your america's summer of 01? Or was your america only reading online stories that could reach 13 people at a time? If so your america was cozy, real cozy.

Yep, a very vivid memory. There was no real doubt about the cause of the attacks that came before 9/11. What was to block? Why did we fail to act would be a far better question.

------

9/11 being the final straw to convince the US population to go onto a war on terror. Well, no doubt there had been a lot of prep work. Did US intelliegence have a lot of warnings? Yep far more than they cared to admit. Buy you are wrong if you imply that the public in general was talking a lot about Islamic terror during the summer of 2001. They needed 9/11 and and the anthrax attacks were fit into the islamic pattern, to induce a broad surrender of liberties, and cash for a war that was aimed on a country that had nothing to do with 9/11. Now the extent to which the anthrax letters were part of the overall islamaphobe campaign is being minimized by the corporate war media.

Oh please, The Cole attack was less than a year old by the time the towers fell. Anyone with half a brain had islamic terror on their minds. And I gotta love your conclusion "they" "needed" anything as if you 'know" it was all part of some grand plan by the "powers that be" How original. "They" didn't need anthrax. It could have been sold after the Cole. All that was missing then was a President willing to do the right thing. Lucky for us that President was in charge on 9/11.

-----

WHat I said was the Radical Islamic terrorism was not very prevelant at all in the mass media during the summer of 2001. Of course it was all over the place in intelligence reports. How original to lick the government. Oh please!

So..you need the MSM to understand the problem of Radical Islamic terrorism? Oh please. I guess all of the attacks worldwide from first WTC attack on just fell away in Nathaniel's fantasy USA rabbit hole? Do you always suck this badly?

Edited August 3, 2008 by Craig Lamson

[William Kelly]

Bruce E. Ivins

It would have been interesting to see how the Wiki page on Bruce E. Ivins developed, as I don't think he had a posted profile until a few days ago.

Wiki:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bruce_E._Ivins

Scholarly articles BE Ivins contributed to:

http://scholar.google.com/scholar?as_q=&am...r=&safe=off

Plot to kill co workers:

http://www.cnn.com/2008/CRIME/08/02/anthra...ref=mpstoryview

Files to be released if the case is closed:

http://ap.google.com/article/ALeqM5gH1fcT1...xHs9EQD92AFEA80

NYT:

http://topics.nytimes.com/top/reference/ti...inline=nyt-per

://http://topics.nytimes.com/top/refer...nline=nyt-per

://http://topics.nytimes.com/top/refer...nline=nyt-per

://http://topics.nytimes.com/top/refer...nline=nyt-per

://http://topics.nytimes.com/top/refer...nline=nyt-per

://http://topics.nytimes.com/top/refer...nline=nyt-per

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/08/03/us/03anthrax.html?ref=us

Smoking Gun document:

http://www.thesmokinggun.com/archive/years...81anthrax1.html://http://www.nytimes.com/2008/08/03/u...thrax1.html

://http://www.nytimes.com/2008/08/03/u...hrax1.html://http://www.thesmokinggun.com/archiv.../u...hrax1.html://http://www.thesmokinggun.com/archiv.../u...hrax1.html

BE Ivins was at one time a "person of interest" before he became a targted suspect.

Also please note that BE Ivins works for the same small US Army Unit at Fort Detrick as Dr. Jose Rivera, who has been a "subject of interest" in the JFK assassination for some time now. The USARIID.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States...ctious_Diseases

There's now a job opening at:

Protect - Project - Sustain

http://chemdef.apgea.army.mil/

BK

Edited August 3, 2008 by William Kelly

[Mark Stapleton]

Unless Ivans was a nut with antisocial tendencies, there's no motive. I don't trust NYT reports, or anything from the corporate 'press'.

Edited August 3, 2008 by Mark Stapleton

[William Kelly]

Unless Ivans was a nut with antisocial tendencies, there's no motive. I don't trust NYT reports, or anything from the corporate 'press'.

Then you wouldn't know that the apparent motive was to stimulate government financing for additional Anthrax research, which is exactly what happened.

BK

[Myra Bronstein]

A friday in August...could you pick a better ashtray for a one day news event? By monday this story will already be the X-Files.

Good observation Nathaniel.

After all:

"From a marketing point of view, you don't introduce new products in August."

--White House Chief of Staff Andrew Card, in 2002, after he was asked why the administration waited until after Labor Day to try to sell the American people on military action against Iraq.

http://www.npr.org/programs/morning/transc...917.miller.html

I had merely noticed that it was late in the Bush/Cheney regime and they are tying up loose ends.

But you are absolutely right.

I'm very glad to see this thread here because the link is obvious.

Dead patsies are so convenient.

Especially if they are tried and convicted postmortem in the media.

That seems to be SOP.

Maybe Mark Lane will step forward to defend Mr. Ivins as well.

[Myra Bronstein]

"Ivins died Tuesday at Frederick Memorial Hospital in Maryland. The Times, quoting an unidentified colleague, said the scientist had taken a massive dose of a prescription Tylenol mixed with codeine."

http://ap.google.com/article/ALeqM5gH1fcT1...xHs9EQD929H22G0

The method of the reported "suicide" (who the hell chooses a slow, painful, uncertain demise if they want to snuff it?) is beyond bizarre and very unlikely. This fact leaves me wondering if the "suicide" story being reported is intentionally lame and transparent, possibly as a caveat to those who might oppose the regime.

For more background on my line of reasoning read Naomi Klein's "Shock Doctrine."

Shock and awe shock and awe...

[William Kelly]

"Ivins died Tuesday at Frederick Memorial Hospital in Maryland. The Times, quoting an unidentified colleague, said the scientist had taken a massive dose of a prescription Tylenol mixed with codeine."

http://ap.google.com/article/ALeqM5gH1fcT1...xHs9EQD929H22G0

The method of the reported "suicide" (who the hell chooses a slow, painful, uncertain demise if they want to snuff it?) is beyond bizarre and very unlikely. This fact leaves me wondering if the "suicide" story being reported is intentionally lame and transparent, possibly as a caveat to those who might oppose the regime.

For more background on my line of reasoning read Naomi Klein's "Shock Doctrine."

Shock and awe shock and awe...

Remember the Tylenol Murders?

http://www.tylenol.com/index.jhtml?s_kwcid...enol|1482852173

http://www.emedicinehealth.com/acetaminoph.../article_em.htm

Tylenol Terrorists:

http://www.trutv.com/library/crime/terrori...ders/index.html

http://www.snopes.com/horrors/poison/tylenol.asp

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1982_Chicago_Tylenol_murders

[Pamela Brown]

The tv crawl just stated that Ivin's therapist was 'deathly afraid' of him. She was supposed to testify soon in the investigation.

[Myra Bronstein]

"Ivins died Tuesday at Frederick Memorial Hospital in Maryland. The Times, quoting an unidentified colleague, said the scientist had taken a massive dose of a prescription Tylenol mixed with codeine."

http://ap.google.com/article/ALeqM5gH1fcT1...xHs9EQD929H22G0

The method of the reported "suicide" (who the hell chooses a slow, painful, uncertain demise if they want to snuff it?) is beyond bizarre and very unlikely. This fact leaves me wondering if the "suicide" story being reported is intentionally lame and transparent, possibly as a caveat to those who might oppose the regime.

For more background on my line of reasoning read Naomi Klein's "Shock Doctrine."

Shock and awe shock and awe...

Remember the Tylenol Murders?

http://www.tylenol.com/index.jhtml?s_kwcid...enol|1482852173

http://www.emedicinehealth.com/acetaminoph.../article_em.htm

Tylenol Terrorists:

http://www.trutv.com/library/crime/terrori...ders/index.html

http://www.snopes.com/horrors/poison/tylenol.asp

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1982_Chicago_Tylenol_murders

Are you suggesting the MIC was behind the lacing of tylenol with cyanide?

If so I'm unclear on the motive. Typically when the gov't intentionally spooks the herd (shock and awe) the motive is to make people afraid of speaking or acting out against the regime lest they be charged as "enemy combatants."

For example, making no attempt to hide torture sends a message to the sheeple to stay in line or else.

What was the intended outcome if the MIC was behind the tylenol episode?

[Myra Bronstein]

The tv crawl just stated that Ivin's therapist was 'deathly afraid' of him. She was supposed to testify soon in the investigation.

Yes, well, a whole back story is being concocted.

I'm guessing that someone in Ivin's position, a gov't scientist working on deadly bio-weapons, had to have high level security clearance.

Yet he was supposedly a thundering homicidal loony blathering about killing people as long ago as 2000?

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/08/03/a...p_n_116566.html

... 'Kay.

[Paul Rigby]

All that was missing then was a President willing to do the right thing. Lucky for us that President was in charge on 9/11.

A direct quote from Putin?

[Nathaniel Heidenheimer]

A friday in August...could you pick a better ashtray for a one day news event? By monday this story will already be the X-Files.

Good observation Nathaniel.

After all:

"From a marketing point of view, you don't introduce new products in August."

--White House Chief of Staff Andrew Card, in 2002, after he was asked why the administration waited until after Labor Day to try to sell the American people on military action against Iraq.

http://www.npr.org/programs/morning/transc...917.miller.html

I had merely noticed that it was late in the Bush/Cheney regime and they are tying up loose ends.

But you are absolutely right.

I'm very glad to see this thread here because the link is obvious.

Dead patsies are so convenient.

Especially if they are tried and convicted postmortem in the media.

That seems to be SOP.

Maybe Mark Lane will step forward to defend Mr. Ivins as well.

--------------

"From a marketing point of view, you don't introduce new products in August."

--White House Chief of Staff Andrew Card, in 2002, after he was asked why the administration waited until after Labor Day to try to sell the American people on military action against Iraq.

Myra ja genau-- that is the quote I had in mind. We can try to prevent this issue from dying out by posting about it on mainstream big newspaper sites tomorrow. Otherwise, we will continue to allow the corporate media to determine what is news.