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The First Shot and that broken Daltex window


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This is my latest video which discusses the earliest shot fired during the attack on President Kennedy. It covers some of the arguments that have been made by skeptics as well as evidence that I had overlooked before which I believe, proves that the blinds were cut in the area of the apparent damage.

First Shot
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How does one think up this stuff? If I understood you correctly, and I hope I didn't, you proposed that JFK reacted somehow to a shot being fired at him even though all the other witnesses didn't hear the first shot until the car was going down Elm Street. Yet there is a photo taken of JFK immediately after Tina Towner stopped filming which shows a relaxed President enjoying the ride down the street. I think the photo that I speak of was taken by a man named 'Croft'. (I hope I got that right for I didn't bother looking the name up in Trask book 'Pictures of the Pain') Then the President continued down Elm smiling and waving at the women standing next to Mary Woodward who like Willis and Betzner said that this is when the first shot was heard. So as much as a political trip as this was, I have grave doubts that JFK reacted to gunfire as you proposed, but instead continued enjoying the ride so not to alarm anyone.

Bill

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How does one think up this stuff? If I understood you correctly, and I hope I didn't, you proposed that JFK reacted somehow to a shot being fired at him even though all the other witnesses didn't hear the first shot until the car was going down Elm Street. Yet there is a photo taken of JFK immediately after Tina Towner stopped filming which shows a relaxed President enjoying the ride down the street. I think the photo that I speak of was taken by a man named 'Croft'. (I hope I got that right for I didn't bother looking the name up in Trask book 'Pictures of the Pain') Then the President continued down Elm smiling and waving at the women standing next to Mary Woodward who like Willis and Betzner said that this is when the first shot was heard. So as much as a political trip as this was, I have grave doubts that JFK reacted to gunfire as you proposed, but instead continued enjoying the ride so not to alarm anyone.

Bill

Your argument totally evades JFK's reactions then. Why did he begin to wave and then pull his hand back within one half of a second, balling it into a fist? Why did he fall to his left and then straighten back up? Those are not actions that any of us would carry out during a Sunday drive in the park. What caused JFK to react like that???

And why did someone cut the cord on the left side of the blinds in that third floor window?

No-one heard that shot, including JFK. And in fact, most witnesses heard only one shot, prior to the very end of the attack. Even the WC admitted that, in spite of the fact that tests conducted by the HSCA proved that shots from Oswald's rifle generated ear shattering sound levels of 130 decibels.

No-one heard the shot at 223 either Bill, not even Governor Connally. The only early shot that some witnesses heard, was the one at app. 160 which struck the pavement and shattered, causing a "firecracker" noise which most witnesses didn't even recognize as a gunshot. Clint Hill, Charles Brehm, and many others heard NONE of the early shots.

That's because ALL of the shots prior to frame 285 were fired from a suppressed weapon, which also explains why two of those early shots missed the President entirely, and the other struck his back, well below his head which was the obvious intended target. Suppressors are notorious for causing wild misses and misfires caused by even microscopic misalignments of the mount.

And that's why none of the limo passengers exhibited startle reactions to those shots as they would following the ones at 285 and 313.

I think JFK was pelted by debris from a missed shot fired during the Towner film, but he was not hurt and he heard no report. We have no way of knowing what went through his head then, but at some point, perhaps after the shot at 160, he said, "My God I've been hit", and you will NEVER find a photo or film which shows JFK smiling during that time period.

I go into more detail on this in an earlier presentation which you can view here:

http://www.jfkhistory.com/ALL/ALL.mov

or if you have problems with that file, you can see the Youtube version here:

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Your argument totally evades JFK's reactions then. Why did he begin to wave and then pull his hand back within one half of a second, balling it into a fist? Why did he fall to his left and then straighten back up? Those are not actions that any of us would carry out during a Sunday drive in the park. What caused JFK to react like that???

No-one heard that shot, including JFK. And in fact, most witnesses heard only one shot, prior to the very end of the attack. Even the WC admitted that, in spite of the fact that tests conducted by the HSCA proved that shots from Oswald's rifle generated ear shattering sound levels of 130 decibels.

No-one heard the shot at 223 either Bill, not even Governor Connally. The only early shot that some witnesses heard, was the one at app. 160 which struck the pavement and shattered, causing a "firecracker" noise which most witnesses didn't even recognize as a gunshot. Clint Hill, Charles Brehm, and many others heard NONE of the early shots.

.

I learned a long time ago that with some people that trying to add common sense to their scenario so to help them see things they obviously didn't consider is like trying to explain Algebra to someone who has yet to learn how to do simple addition and subtraction. However, I will touch on a couple of things you said for the forum record and move on.

The first and most obvious observation that makes me think your theory is whacked is that no one would either think they are being shot at or be hit by a bullet and continue to smile and wave at the public to keep up appearances. I think you'll be hard pressed to ever find one case where someone claimed to have done what you suggest. However, if someone in the car had said something, then I could see JFK lean closer to better hear what was said because of all the many other noises going on around him at that time. Once hearing them, then I could see him straighten back up and get back to business of smiling and waving to the crowd as he was doing until he did react to being shot as Mary Woodward stated.

In the book 'Rush to Judgment' written by Mark Lane, Mark carefully laid out in detail how many shots were heard by witnesses who gave their accounting. I will ask you to review Mark's data and compare it to what you just said. In the case with JFK and/or Connally ... it is not uncommon they would have heard the shot that hit either man for the impact would come before the sound. This was such a case with Connally when he said he felt the impact of being hit, but never heard the sound of the shot. And again consult Lane's book for there were people who heard the first two shots and reported so. I will also add what has been posted many times in the past concerning the 33 or so takes that were done in the making of the movie "JFK" and that is that depending on where people were standing had a bearing on what shots they heard and from where. It was Groden who proposed the idea that JFK stopped waving around Z160 because he heard a gunshot, but that was not supported by witnesses who were actually there.

I will also say that it is not uncommon when hearing a parade of Harley's roaring by and backfiring that there will be people who won't differentiate those loud noises to gunfire just has some might hear backfires and hear them as gunshots. Trying to make a case on anything other than JFK's actions after your chosen point of gunfire is a waste of time. I don't believe for a moment that JFK heard what he took to be a gunshot or was ever hit by a gunshot to the point of being pushed over to only straighten back up and go back to more smiling and waving.

Bill

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Your argument totally evades JFK's reactions then. Why did he begin to wave and then pull his hand back within one half of a second, balling it into a fist? Why did he fall to his left and then straighten back up? Those are not actions that any of us would carry out during a Sunday drive in the park. What caused JFK to react like that???

No-one heard that shot, including JFK. And in fact, most witnesses heard only one shot, prior to the very end of the attack. Even the WC admitted that, in spite of the fact that tests conducted by the HSCA proved that shots from Oswald's rifle generated ear shattering sound levels of 130 decibels.

No-one heard the shot at 223 either Bill, not even Governor Connally. The only early shot that some witnesses heard, was the one at app. 160 which struck the pavement and shattered, causing a "firecracker" noise which most witnesses didn't even recognize as a gunshot. Clint Hill, Charles Brehm, and many others heard NONE of the early shots.

.

I learned a long time ago that with some people that trying to add common sense to their scenario so to help them see things they obviously didn't consider is like trying to explain Algebra to someone who has yet to learn how to do simple addition and subtraction. However, I will touch on a couple of things you said for the forum record and move on.

The first and most obvious observation that makes me think your theory is whacked is that no one would either think they are being shot at or be hit by a bullet and continue to smile and wave at the public to keep up appearances. I think you'll be hard pressed to ever find one case where someone claimed to have done what you suggest. However, if someone in the car had said something, then I could see JFK lean closer to better hear what was said because of all the many other noises going on around him at that time. Once hearing them, then I could see him straighten back up and get back to business of smiling and waving to the crowd as he was doing until he did react to being shot as Mary Woodward stated.

In the book 'Rush to Judgment' written by Mark Lane, Mark carefully laid out in detail how many shots were heard by witnesses who gave their accounting. I will ask you to review Mark's data and compare it to what you just said. In the case with JFK and/or Connally ... it is not uncommon they would have heard the shot that hit either man for the impact would come before the sound. This was such a case with Connally when he said he felt the impact of being hit, but never heard the sound of the shot. And again consult Lane's book for there were people who heard the first two shots and reported so. I will also add what has been posted many times in the past concerning the 33 or so takes that were done in the making of the movie "JFK" and that is that depending on where people were standing had a bearing on what shots they heard and from where. It was Groden who proposed the idea that JFK stopped waving around Z160 because he heard a gunshot, but that was not supported by witnesses who were actually there.

I will also say that it is not uncommon when hearing a parade of Harley's roaring by and backfiring that there will be people who won't differentiate those loud noises to gunfire just has some might hear backfires and hear them as gunshots. Trying to make a case on anything other than JFK's actions after your chosen point of gunfire is a waste of time. I don't believe for a moment that JFK heard what he took to be a gunshot or was ever hit by a gunshot to the point of being pushed over to only straighten back up and go back to more smiling and waving.

Bill

Bill, why exactly would you choose to butt in to an issue when you are totally ignorant of what it is all about? I gave you links to videos which explain my analysis but you obviously could not be bothered with looking at them. Don't you think it would be reasonable to at least know what it is you are attacking before you open your mouth?

If you had, you would have realized that I never claimed and seriously doubt that JFK realized he was being shot at at the time he first reacted. How could he? He neither heard the shot or was wounded by it. Putting myself in his shoes, I probably would have figured that some kid or redneck in the crowd threw a rock.

And it doesn't matter how many shots the witnesses heard. They could only hear the audible shots, which is why most witnesses heard one shot, a period of silence and then closely bunched shots at the endj of the attack. Among professional law enforcement people there were NONE who testified that the early shots were closer together than the final ones. Obviously, they did not hear all the early shots. Are you starting to grasp any of this yet Bill?

And if you had ever bothered to read the HSCA reports you would realize that the motorcycle backfires were meaningless. They brought in Harleys during their tests but the sound of the rifle was many times greater and totally drowned out the motorcycles. Do a little research Bill, so that you don't continue to pass on these bogus myths.

Oswald's rifle generated sound levels that were 16 times as loud as the minimum level which provokes involuntary startle reactions. And yet there were no startle reactions at all, prior to frame 290. That's because the FIRST high powered rifle shot was fired at 285 and the second at 312. Prior to that, ALL of the shots came from a suppressed weapon. If they had not, then the early shots would have been the loudest of all to the ears of the limo passengers due to their proximity to Oswald. But most of those shots went totally unheard and the only one that some did hear, was not recognized as a gunshot by most witnesses.

Why do you suppose Clint Hill never jumped from the running board until just after 285, in direct reaction to a gunshot? Why did Charles Brehm say that JFK was "15-20 feet" from him when he heard the first of three shots? Look at where Brehm and JFK were at 285 Bill. I have them about 18 feet apart. What do you get?

If you refuse to look at the video which explains the analysis that you are attacking, why don't you are least look at my presentation on the shot at 285, so that you can educate yourself a bit about this crime?

And after all this, you STILL evade the most important questions. Why did JFK react as he did during the Towner film? And why is there clear evidence that someone cut out a section of the blinds in that window??

You should be eager to find answers to those questions, my friend. Why are you instead, evading them?

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Bill, why exactly would you choose to butt in to an issue when you are totally ignorant of what it is all about? I gave you links to videos which explain my analysis but you obviously could not be bothered with looking at them. Don't you think it would be reasonable to at least know what it is you are attacking before you open your mouth?

I saw your links. I gave my opinion which expanded beyond your allegations.

If you had, you would have realized that I never claimed and seriously doubt that JFK realized he was being shot at at the time he first reacted. How could he? He neither heard the shot or was wounded by it. Putting myself in his shoes, I probably would have figured that some kid or redneck in the crowd threw a rock.

People were on both sides of the street ... one with a little girl running parallel with the car. If we apply your explanation and JFK didn't hear a shot, then his actions were related to something else like working the crowd on both sides of the street as he did throughout the motorcade. Jean Hill said that she called out to him as he rounded the corner and thought he may have looked in response to that. No one that I recall ever reported a shot being heard before Betzner took his photo. If JFK had been shot, then he would not appear as he does until the first loud shot/firecracker sound was heard and I have already said when that was reported to be. I'm sorry, but I like it seems everyone else here, I think you are way off on making your allegation.

And it doesn't matter how many shots the witnesses heard. They could only hear the audible shots, which is why most witnesses heard one shot, a period of silence and then closely bunched shots at the endj of the attack. Among professional law enforcement people there were NONE who testified that the early shots were closer together than the final ones. Obviously, they did not hear all the early shots. Are you starting to grasp any of this yet Bill?

I am grasping that you say things without offering the supporting data to back it up.

And if you had ever bothered to read the HSCA reports you would realize that the motorcycle backfires were meaningless. They brought in Harleys during their tests but the sound of the rifle was many times greater and totally drowned out the motorcycles. Do a little research Bill, so that you don't continue to pass on these bogus myths.

Thanks for the advice on doing research ... I am probably one of the few people who ever purchased two sets of the 26 Volumes and took the three years to read through it. I have probably studied the Photographic record as much as anyone when it comes to hours spent to it frame by frame. But again ... thanks for the advice. Now having said this - I think your use of those films is whacked!

Oswald's rifle generated sound levels that were 16 times as loud as the minimum level which provokes involuntary startle reactions. And yet there were no startle reactions at all, prior to frame 290. That's because the FIRST high powered rifle shot was fired at 285 and the second at 312. Prior to that, ALL of the shots came from a suppressed weapon. If they had not, then the early shots would have been the loudest of all to the ears of the limo passengers due to their proximity to Oswald. But most of those shots went totally unheard and the only one that some did hear, was not recognized as a gunshot by most witnesses.

So I take it that you don't believe the witnesses who said they heard a loud explosion between Z186 and Z202. I also take it that the Secret Service Agents seen looking back in Altgens 6 which equates with Z255/56 were doing so for other reasons than hearing the sound of gunfire ... maybe because of hearing glass breaking that no one else heard. Again, I don't find any merit in your explanations from the evidence I have studied for the past three decades.

Why do you suppose Clint Hill never jumped from the running board until just after 285, in direct reaction to a gunshot? Why did Charles Brehm say that JFK was "15-20 feet" from him when he heard the first of three shots? Look at where Brehm and JFK were at 285 Bill. I have them about 18 feet apart. What do you get?

I have heard Brehm say that he heard a shot as the car was approaching him.

If you refuse to look at the video which explains the analysis that you are attacking, why don't you are least look at my presentation on the shot at 285, so that you can educate yourself a bit about this crime?

I saw your video and it was a poor interpretation of the facts in my view. I was really gagging at that Dal-tex video image and thought to myself why someone wouldn't look at the assassination day photos and films which showed far better images than what you opted to use.

And after all this, you STILL evade the most important questions. Why did JFK react as he did during the Towner film? And why is there clear evidence that someone cut out a section of the blinds in that window??

You should be eager to find answers to those questions, my friend. Why are you instead, evading them?

Your not liking the answers I gave to your claims doesn't mean that I evaded them ... it just means that you didn't get the answer that you hoped for.

Bill

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croft-4.jpg

Thanks for posting the croft photo, Duncan. The fact that once the limo rounded the corner as seen in the Towner film ... the crowd on the south side of the street was reduced to a small handful of people while the crowd on JFK's side of the street was lined shoulder to shoulder. Some folks just make too much out of things that have more reasonable alternatives.

Bill

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Bill, why exactly would you choose to butt in to an issue when you are totally ignorant of what it is all about? I gave you links to videos which explain my analysis but you obviously could not be bothered with looking at them. Don't you think it would be reasonable to at least know what it is you are attacking before you open your mouth?

I saw your links. I gave my opinion which expanded beyond your allegations.

If you had, you would have realized that I never claimed and seriously doubt that JFK realized he was being shot at at the time he first reacted. How could he? He neither heard the shot or was wounded by it. Putting myself in his shoes, I probably would have figured that some kid or redneck in the crowd threw a rock.

People were on both sides of the street ... one with a little girl running parallel with the car. If we apply your explanation and JFK didn't hear a shot, then his actions were related to something else like working the crowd on both sides of the street as he did throughout the motorcade. Jean Hill said that she called out to him as he rounded the corner and thought he may have looked in response to that. No one that I recall ever reported a shot being heard before Betzner took his photo. If JFK had been shot, then he would not appear as he does until the first loud shot/firecracker sound was heard and I have already said when that was reported to be. I'm sorry, but I like it seems everyone else here, I think you are way off on making your allegation.

And it doesn't matter how many shots the witnesses heard. They could only hear the audible shots, which is why most witnesses heard one shot, a period of silence and then closely bunched shots at the endj of the attack. Among professional law enforcement people there were NONE who testified that the early shots were closer together than the final ones. Obviously, they did not hear all the early shots. Are you starting to grasp any of this yet Bill?

I am grasping that you say things without offering the supporting data to back it up.

And if you had ever bothered to read the HSCA reports you would realize that the motorcycle backfires were meaningless. They brought in Harleys during their tests but the sound of the rifle was many times greater and totally drowned out the motorcycles. Do a little research Bill, so that you don't continue to pass on these bogus myths.

Thanks for the advice on doing research ... I am probably one of the few people who ever purchased two sets of the 26 Volumes and took the three years to read through it. I have probably studied the Photographic record as much as anyone when it comes to hours spent to it frame by frame. But again ... thanks for the advice. Now having said this - I think your use of those films is whacked!

Oswald's rifle generated sound levels that were 16 times as loud as the minimum level which provokes involuntary startle reactions. And yet there were no startle reactions at all, prior to frame 290. That's because the FIRST high powered rifle shot was fired at 285 and the second at 312. Prior to that, ALL of the shots came from a suppressed weapon. If they had not, then the early shots would have been the loudest of all to the ears of the limo passengers due to their proximity to Oswald. But most of those shots went totally unheard and the only one that some did hear, was not recognized as a gunshot by most witnesses.

So I take it that you don't believe the witnesses who said they heard a loud explosion between Z186 and Z202. I also take it that the Secret Service Agents seen looking back in Altgens 6 which equates with Z255/56 were doing so for other reasons than hearing the sound of gunfire ... maybe because of hearing glass breaking that no one else heard. Again, I don't find any merit in your explanations from the evidence I have studied for the past three decades.

Why do you suppose Clint Hill never jumped from the running board until just after 285, in direct reaction to a gunshot? Why did Charles Brehm say that JFK was "15-20 feet" from him when he heard the first of three shots? Look at where Brehm and JFK were at 285 Bill. I have them about 18 feet apart. What do you get?

I have heard Brehm say that he heard a shot as the car was approaching him.

If you refuse to look at the video which explains the analysis that you are attacking, why don't you are least look at my presentation on the shot at 285, so that you can educate yourself a bit about this crime?

I saw your video and it was a poor interpretation of the facts in my view. I was really gagging at that Dal-tex video image and thought to myself why someone wouldn't look at the assassination day photos and films which showed far better images than what you opted to use.

And after all this, you STILL evade the most important questions. Why did JFK react as he did during the Towner film? And why is there clear evidence that someone cut out a section of the blinds in that window??

You should be eager to find answers to those questions, my friend. Why are you instead, evading them?

Your not liking the answers I gave to your claims doesn't mean that I evaded them ... it just means that you didn't get the answer that you hoped for.

Bill

You're an idiot Bill and you're totally ignorant of what is going on here. There was NO photo of the Daltex building that day that was clearer than the Altgens photo, taken at the equivalent of Zapruder frame 255. If you disagree, then why don't YOU post an image for us that gives us a clearer view of that window?

You won't do that, will you Bill? And you won't do it because there is no clearer photo in existence. You just made that up, thinking you needed to say it to "win" this little debate. You seem to have the same respect for honesty as your tag team partner, Duncan does.

And the fact that you totally misrepresented my analysis proves that you either did not view my video presentations as you claimed, or you are incapable of understanding them. Btw, what is this about your brilliant perception that there were people on both sides of the road?? What is the significance of that?

As I told you before Bill, if the images I posted were as worthless as you claim they are, then why do we need you and Duncan to tell us that? Why can't you rely on the intelligence of people and allow everyone to make up their own minds about that??

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You're an idiot Bill and you're totally ignorant of what is going on here. There was NO photo of the Daltex building that day that was clearer than the Altgens photo, taken at the equivalent of Zapruder frame 255. If you disagree, then why don't YOU post an image for us that gives us a clearer view of that window?

You won't do that, will you Bill? And you won't do it because there is no clearer photo in existence. You just made that up, thinking you needed to say it to "win" this little debate. You seem to have the same respect for honesty as your tag team partner, Duncan does.

And the fact that you totally misrepresented my analysis proves that you either did not view my video presentations as you claimed, or you are incapable of understanding them. Btw, what is this about your brilliant perception that there were people on both sides of the road?? What is the significance of that?

As I told you before Bill, if the images I posted were as worthless as you claim they are, then why do we need you and Duncan to tell us that? Why can't you rely on the intelligence of people and allow everyone to make up their own minds about that??

Hell hath no fury like a Harris scorned rears it's ugly head again I see.

Bill is giving you an honest criticism of your analysis. He works completely independant from me, and is not my tag partner.

Everything he said above is true.

Duncan, you need to stop trying to be clever and start trying to be honest.

Bill's "criticism" totally misrepresented my analysis and the only thing it really proved, was his ignorance of the facts related to the shooting. He still buys into the idiotic notion that the motorcycles drowned out the gunshots and he doesn't realize that the Altgens photo gave us the clearest possible look at that third floor window. To his credit however, he is at least capable of discussing the issues, rather than only posting cutesy cartoon characters and engaging in childish name calling :D

BTW, Duncan, did you recruit Bill to help you out?

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You're an idiot Bill and you're totally ignorant of what is going on here. There was NO photo of the Daltex building that day that was clearer than the Altgens photo, taken at the equivalent of Zapruder frame 255. If you disagree, then why don't YOU post an image for us that gives us a clearer view of that window?

You won't do that, will you Bill? And you won't do it because there is no clearer photo in existence. You just made that up, thinking you needed to say it to "win" this little debate. You seem to have the same respect for honesty as your tag team partner, Duncan does.

And the fact that you totally misrepresented my analysis proves that you either did not view my video presentations as you claimed, or you are incapable of understanding them. Btw, what is this about your brilliant perception that there were people on both sides of the road?? What is the significance of that?

As I told you before Bill, if the images I posted were as worthless as you claim they are, then why do we need you and Duncan to tell us that? Why can't you rely on the intelligence of people and allow everyone to make up their own minds about that??

Hell hath no fury like a Harris scorned rears it's ugly head again I see.

Bill is giving you an honest criticism of your analysis. He works completely independant from me, and is not my tag partner.

Everything he said above is true.

Duncan, you need to stop trying to be clever and start trying to be honest.

Bill's "criticism" totally misrepresented my analysis and the only thing it really proved, was his ignorance of the facts related to the shooting. He still buys into the idiotic notion that the motorcycles drowned out the gunshots and he doesn't realize that the Altgens photo gave us the clearest possible look at that third floor window. To his credit however, he is at least capable of discussing the issues, rather than only posting cutesy cartoon characters and engaging in childish name calling :D

BTW, Duncan, did you recruit Bill to help you out?

Three threads on the same topic ... that's a joke in itself in my view.

Your Altgens print is not the best print out there. Thompson has a print that is so clear that the plaid design is visible on Lovelady's shirt. I have posted that photo in the past, so who is making it up as they go???

I offer you information so you can follow-up and see it for yourself. Because I am not in a place where I can access my JFK archives, I will suggest to you that you contact Gary Mack and ask for leads on press photos and films post assassination showing the Dal-tex building .... after all, helping people is part of his job duties. Take the time to look at other windows that show glare from dust and so forth. Compare that to the appearance of how opened windows looked. Compare them with windows that showed the blinds pulled partially down. These are things that I and others have done in detail. The area of the window that you claim to be broken out is just like other closed windows that don't have the blind pulled down in them and windows that are open appear very dark and a broken out window would do the same.

And while your interpretations seem whacked ... you have a lot of nerve calling someone an "idiot". I'll put my reputation for being thorough in my research up against yours any day. I don't speak for Duncan, nor do I need to. Why is it that when ever someones half backed presentation is criticized ... they prefer rather than do doing a little more thorough research ... they resort to calling the critic names like "Idiot" instead of letting their evidence do the talking.

I won't waste any more time on this subject until you have presented something more definitive than what I have seen so far.

Bill Miller

Edited by Bill Miller
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I'm sorry you are angry Bill, but you prove your competence through your understanding of the case, not how many copies of the WC report that you bought.

You were wrong in claiming that the motorcycles drowned out the gunshots. You were totally oblivious to the fact that most witnesses only heard one of the early shots, and that no law enforcement professional recalled the earlier shots being closer together than the final ones. And only a moron would demand documentation for what those officers didn't say.

My claim is falsifiable, because all you have to do is find one contemporaneous statement by one police officer, Sheriff's deputy or member of the Texas Rangers who contradicted me. But you can't do that, can you Bill?

And you are also wrong in your lack of understanding the shot at 160 but we'll save that for another thread.

You are also wrong and outrageously disingenuous to claim that you have a better copy of the Zapruder photo than I do. If you did, you would post it here and now. The truth is that we are probably using the same one, and you are not about to post yours because it will show exactly the same thing that mine does.

But let's cut to the chase Bill. Are you claiming that you cannot see the cords in those blinds at all, or are you agreeing that you can see them but you see no break as I have described.

window.png

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I'm sorry you are angry Bill, but you prove your competence through your understanding of the case, not how many copies of the WC report that you bought.

You were wrong in claiming that the motorcycles drowned out the gunshots. You were totally oblivious to the fact that most witnesses only heard one of the early shots, and that no law enforcement professional recalled the earlier shots being closer together than the final ones. And only a moron would demand documentation for what those officers didn't say.

You first claimed that most witnesses only heard one shot as if to imply the rest were inaudible and yet many witnesses did say they heard three shots and some as many as 6. So one should try and understand why some people heard as many as three to six shots while some heard only one as you say. One answer to this is that the sounds of the motorcade was deafening. I stood in Dealey Plaza and watched 4 Harley Davidson Motorcycles pass down Elm Street at the 35 year anniversary of the assassination and I couldn't hear myself think. Add many more cycles doing the same in the Plaza combined with all the crowd noise and it could certainly explain why the wide variation in how many shots were said to be heard by the many witnesses. Making a statement that the witnesses heard one shot because it was the audible one as if to suggest the others were not audible is not supported by the evidence in my opinion.

I think you are so wrapped up in your own world of fallacy that you cannot see the forest for the trees. For instance you said, "You're an idiot Bill and you're totally ignorant of what is going on here. There was NO photo of the Daltex building that day that was clearer than the Altgens photo, taken at the equivalent of Zapruder frame 255." You are implying that you have seen the entire photographic and film record and I know that you have not. I'm in the mountains of British Columbia and cannot spoon feed you images at this time. However, I did give you a source and you have not said that you investigated it and came up empty. Your lack of effort does not equate there being no other images that are better than what you used. In fact, I clearly said that Thompson has a better A6 print than you used only to have you wrongly claim that I did not offer you a clearer image than the one you provided.

My claim is falsifiable, because all you have to do is find one contemporaneous statement by one police officer, Sheriff's deputy or member of the Texas Rangers who contradicted me. But you can't do that, can you Bill?

Secret Service Agent Bennett: " the Motorcade entered an intersection and then proceeded down a grade. At this point the well-wishers numbered but a few; the motorcade continued down this grade enroute to the Trade Mart. At this point I heard what_sounded like a fire-cracker. I immediately looked from the right/crowd/physical area/and looked towards the President who was seated in the right rear seat of his limousine open convertible. At the moment I looked at the back of the President I heard another fire-cracker noise and saw the shot hit the President about four inches down from the right shoulder. A second shot followed immediately and hit the right rear high of the President's head."

Officer Joe Smith ...

Mr. SMITH. Yes, sir; I glanced around and was watching the crowd to make sure they stayed back out of the way of the motorcade, and also to make sure none of the cars started up or anything. Then I heard the shots, and I immediately proceeded from this point.

Officer Harkness ...

Mr. HARKNESS - On the plaza area with the crowd to observe the President as he went west on Elm Street.

Mr. BELIN - How many shots did you hear?

Mr. HARKNESS - Three.

Now can we agree that Officer Smith is a policeman and "SHOTS" means he heard more then one shot? Can we agree that more than one officer heard multiple shots? Do I need to post more and if so, how many more to show that you were in error? Thats where reading the 26 Volumes comes in handy!!!

And you are also wrong in your lack of understanding the shot at 160 but we'll save that for another thread.

Oh yes ... the in-audible shot that no one heard. I can't wait!

You are also wrong and outrageously disingenuous to claim that you have a better copy of the Zapruder photo than I do. If you did, you would post it here and now. The truth is that we are probably using the same one, and you are not about to post yours because it will show exactly the same thing that mine does.

Please let this "idiot" correct you ... It's not the Zapruder photo, but rather the Altgens 6 photo. It was Josiah Thompson who posted it in a Lovelady/Man in the doorway thread. I saved it to my archives which are not kept in the mountains of British Columbia. I hope I have said it in a way you can follow this time.

But let's cut to the chase Bill. Are you claiming that you cannot see the cords in those blinds at all, or are you agreeing that you can see them but you see no break as I have described.

Yes I am saying the same thing others have told you.

Bill Miller

Edited by Bill Miller
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Robert,

Want to hear what more an "Idiot" like me can tell you concerning what a Sheriff reported about hearing the shots ................

COUNTY OF DALLAS

SHERIFF'S DEPARTMENT

SUPPLEMENTARY INVESTIGATION REPORT

Name of Complainant

ASSASSINATION OF PRESIDENT KENNEDY

Offense

Officer A. D. McCurley, Deputy Sheriff, Dallas County Sheriff's Office

Date: Nov. 22, 1963

I was standing at the front entrance of the Dallas Sheriff's Office at 505 Main Street, Dallas as the President's motorcade passed and was watching the remainder of the parade pass when I heard a retort and I immediately recognized it as the sound of a rifle. I started running around the corner where I knew the President's car should be and in a matter of a few seconds heard a second shot and then a third shot.

Officer Marion Baker said when asked about the spacing of the shots...

Mr. BELIN - Do you have any time estimate as to the spacing of any of these shots?

Mr. BAKER - It seemed to me like they just went bang, bang, bang; they were pretty well even to me.

Edited by Bill Miller
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Robert,

Want to hear what more an "Idiot" like me can tell you concerning what a Sheriff reported about hearing the shots ................

COUNTY OF DALLAS

SHERIFF'S DEPARTMENT

SUPPLEMENTARY INVESTIGATION REPORT

Name of Complainant

ASSASSINATION OF PRESIDENT KENNEDY

Offense

Officer A. D. McCurley, Deputy Sheriff, Dallas County Sheriff's Office

Date: Nov. 22, 1963

I was standing at the front entrance of the Dallas Sheriff's Office at 505 Main Street, Dallas as the President's motorcade passed and was watching the remainder of the parade pass when I heard a retort and I immediately recognized it as the sound of a rifle. I started running around the corner where I knew the President's car should be and in a matter of a few seconds heard a second shot and then a third shot.

Officer Marion Baker said when asked about the spacing of the shots...

Mr. BELIN - Do you have any time estimate as to the spacing of any of these shots?

Mr. BAKER - It seemed to me like they just went bang, bang, bang; they were pretty well even to me.

Bill, what planet are you posting from???

You seem to think that I said none of the cops heard more than one shot. MOST witnesses reported three shots, including most law enforcement people.

And I said that NONE Of the law enforcement people reported that the early shots were closer together than than the final ones.

I have been posting in forums since the early 90's and have never encountered someone who was so totally oblivious to what is going on. Why don't you actually view my presentations so that you a clue about what to attack?

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