Tripple Underpass

[Shanet Clark]

Okay

Bill, thank you for making a few reasonable posts.

Tosh, thank you for telling your story and presenting the possibility of a south knoll shooter...very professional, both of you.

BUT Bill, I must point out a few things.

The badgeman photos just look like a Rorshach test, random.

I never see the badgeman.

But many of the photos posted on this thread show a Classic Gunman

in position.

Tosh, do you think a south shooter might explain that nasty wound around

JFK's right ear that is in the Zapruder film and the autopsy photo?

In other words was the big right side wound an exit wound from a shot fired from the south knoll?

Neither Tosh nor the south knoll shooter is in the photo posted so often,

but it is after the shooting, and the shooter (if there was one over there)

has slipped back into the parking lot.

Bill, though, raised his tone to a more professional level, so that's good.

Tosh is not happy because the thread went from the south knoll theory

over to the Classic gunman, and he's right, we need to look into the

south knoll.

James, do you have any other shots of the south Knoll?

Maybe those pix are what got destoyed and rounded up.

Let's keep working together, even though we don't agree.

shanet

shanet

Shanet...most people have no trouble seeing the badgeman image.

Jack

Jack

thanks for the good clean image, I can see the BADGEMAN individual now..........

(I brought the thread back to remind people about Tosh's scenario)

best wishes and thanks for the good badgeman slide

shanet

Edited July 24, 2006 by Shanet Clark

[Thomas Graves]

Okay

Bill, thank you for making a few reasonable posts.

Tosh, thank you for telling your story and presenting the possibility of a south knoll shooter...very professional, both of you.

BUT Bill, I must point out a few things.

The badgeman photos just look like a Rorshach test, random.

I never see the badgeman.

But many of the photos posted on this thread show a Classic Gunman

in position.

Tosh, do you think a south shooter might explain that nasty wound around

JFK's right ear that is in the Zapruder film and the autopsy photo?

In other words was the big right side wound an exit wound from a shot fired from the south knoll?

Neither Tosh nor the south knoll shooter is in the photo posted so often,

but it is after the shooting, and the shooter (if there was one over there)

has slipped back into the parking lot.

Bill, though, raised his tone to a more professional level, so that's good.

Tosh is not happy because the thread went from the south knoll theory

over to the Classic gunman, and he's right, we need to look into the

south knoll.

James, do you have any other shots of the south Knoll?

Maybe those pix are what got destoyed and rounded up.

Let's keep working together, even though we don't agree.

shanet

shanet

Shanet...most people have no trouble seeing the badgeman image.

Jack

Jack

thanks for the good clean image, I can see the BADGEMAN individual now..........

(I brought the thread back to remind people about Tosh's scenario)

best wishes and thanks for the good badgeman slide

shanet

___________________________

Bump a bagel

___________________________

[Miles Scull]

___________________________

Bump a bagel

___________________________

Pmub a legab hehehehe....

[Thomas Graves]

___________________________

Bump a bagel

___________________________

Pmub a legab hehehehe....

_________________________

Miles,

I'm a' wondering (seriously) if that's a Native American phrase that you posted.

I'm 1/16 Native American myself (Choctaw), and I was a-wonderin' if what you posted was a dialect you had to learn when you was a-teachin' English up there in northern Arizonia.

I used to live in Peeples Valley on old Highway 89. Ever been to Skull Valley? Beautiful, absolutely beautiful.

Yours,

Thomas

_________________________

[Thomas Graves]

I have said that nobody was on the bridge at the time the President came into the zone. I do remember that there were people above the President on the north side on the underpass, on the bridge, about six or seven as the Limo passed under. I remember Sergio and I questioned that.

"... there were people above the president on the bridge after he had been shot...". (de-briefing West Palm Beach Florida to Rex Beardsley and Bob Bennette and Tracy Barns, report of debriefing transmitted to field HQ, Miami to Bill Harvery, JMWAVE HQ., November 25, 1963) Miami Desk Miami Florida)

The FBI told me in Denver at a latter datem ( Feb 1964) that I was wrong. They said.

"That area above the bridge had been cleared of people before the President came into the Plaza. Nobody was on the bridge. That area had been cleared by the Secret Service before the President got to the Plaza. Why do you insist on incerting yourself into this? You know giving false (FAG) information to a Federal officer can keep you in this jail for a very long time?" (ref; Scott Warner, SAC interview at Denver County Jail Feb. 1964)

"FAG" charge. "False Information to Government officials".

However, I do know that the South side of the underpass was cleared and nobody was there. The north side is another matter. I have questioned over the years photos of this area and of the people on the underpass. One set of prints shows nobody there... another set before the limo came into the zone shows people on the bridge and another six seconds after the fatal shot does not show anyone on the south side or above the President as he and the Limo crossed under. I remember a man leaning over the back of the Limo and notice that people were on the bridge above the limo as it past under. That was just before we reached the man in the pickup truck. Sergio and I were in shock for a few seconds before we started walking away toward the underpass. Most of the people on the north side of the "Tripple Underpass" crossed over the bridge and watched the Limo head for Parkland.

note: It has been said that a south knoll shot would put Jackie and the Texas Gov. in the path and a shot could not have come from the south side of the Plaza. I might point out the slight curve to the southwest at the point of impact about four or five degrees just before it makes a more of a turn, about ten or twenty degrees) before reaching the underpass. If you draw a line and the Limo is even with Main, then the line would rule out a south shot, but turn the limo five degrees to the left (south) and what do you have? A second or two and.., "An open window for a clean shot"...: Check it out. Thank you Tosh.

[Thomas Graves]

I have said that nobody was on the bridge at the time the President came into the zone. I do remember that there were people above the President on the north side on the underpass, on the bridge, about six or seven as the Limo passed under. I remember Sergio and I questioned that.

"... there were people above the president on the bridge after he had been shot...". (de-briefing West Palm Beach Florida to Rex Beardsley and Bob Bennette and Tracy Barns, report of debriefing transmitted to field HQ, Miami to Bill Harvery, JMWAVE HQ., November 25, 1963) Miami Desk Miami Florida)

The FBI told me in Denver at a latter datem ( Feb 1964) that I was wrong. They said.

"That area above the bridge had been cleared of people before the President came into the Plaza. Nobody was on the bridge. That area had been cleared by the Secret Service before the President got to the Plaza. Why do you insist on incerting yourself into this? You know giving false (FAG) information to a Federal officer can keep you in this jail for a very long time?" (ref; Scott Warner, SAC interview at Denver County Jail Feb. 1964)

"FAG" charge. "False Information to Government officials".

However, I do know that the South side of the underpass was cleared and nobody was there. The north side is another matter. I have questioned over the years photos of this area and of the people on the underpass. One set of prints shows nobody there... another set before the limo came into the zone shows people on the bridge and another six seconds after the fatal shot does not show anyone on the south side or above the President as he and the Limo crossed under. I remember a man leaning over the back of the Limo and notice that people were on the bridge above the limo as it past under. That was just before we reached the man in the pickup truck. Sergio and I were in shock for a few seconds before we started walking away toward the underpass. Most of the people on the north side of the "Tripple Underpass" crossed over the bridge and watched the Limo head for Parkland.

note: It has been said that a south knoll shot would put Jackie and the Texas Gov. in the path and a shot could not have come from the south side of the Plaza. I might point out the slight curve to the southwest at the point of impact about four or five degrees just before it makes a more of a turn, about ten or twenty degrees) before reaching the underpass. If you draw a line and the Limo is even with Main, then the line would rule out a south shot, but turn the limo five degrees to the left (south) and what do you have? A second or two and.., "An open window for a clean shot"...: Check it out. Thank you Tosh.

_____________________________________

Bump and run

_____________________________________

Edited February 17, 2008 by Thomas Graves

[William Plumlee]

FROM AN OLD POST. OCT. 28, 2004 BROUGHT FORWARD IN REFERENCE TO RECENT QUESTIONS ASK ABOUT THE SOUTH KNOLL

Then it was said that this alleged assassin had maybe fired from atop the South end of the overpass. The problem I found with that was there were no witnesses that heard such a shot. Furthermore, there was a News truck in the parking lot and the newsman never saw anyone on the South knoll side of the underpass, nor did he hear any shots from there. JC Price atop of the now Dallas Morning News building had a birds eye view of the plaza and he never heard a shot from the South side of the overpass, nor mentioned seeing anyone there. James Tague is another witness who only heard gunfire from the North side of Elm Street. So I have not spent a great deal more time on the South Knoll shooter claim because it is too far fetched in my view.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

This is the first I've ever heard of a newsman and news truck in the South Knoll parking lot. As for earwitnesses, Tosh has a funny story about setting off a firecracker on the South Knoll during a subsequent visit and having everyone in the Plaza turn toward the North Knoll. He says the police were there rather quickly. I think Al Carrier's stuff is very good about the advantageous LOS from the front on the South Knoll, as well as how it could explain the lack of a left side head blowout. As I have said previously, Al gave me permission to post his stuff here, but I just don't feel comfortable doing that. When I'm there in a few weeks, I will be taking many pictures and hope that my study of the classic gunman LOS is not thwarted by an overgrown pyracantha [sp?] tree. I want to again emphasize that I have no certainty about this issue, and that maybe walking the walk rather than just talking the talk will convince me on a personal level that I have resisted. I just don't know. I'm going on the same weekend as the conferences but not attending any except possibly the COPA Friday night, so I hope you can appreciate what an effort that is to make in order to have the sun and conditions be optimal for the understanding of light and shadow.

Tim

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Plumlee reply:

"... I have read most of the material that has been presented on this thread about the lights and shadows, a person there.., a person not there..., why he was there and why he was not there. All seem to present good points in their arguments. But all is just wild speculations as far as I am concern. Some have become so entrenched in their work that this subject matter has become their main focal point and they have become blinded to others valid points or none valid points and miss the whole picture. JFK was EXECUTED, in public. There is no simple answer. And lights and shadows, people there, and people not there brings us no closer to the truth, or identification, of who shot him, or how many additional shooters there were, if any.

Now I will throw my spuculations into the fray.

(1) I do not believe that there was a shooter anywhere near the north knoll; behind a fence; on a car hood; in the parking lot; behind a wall. I do not care what the "Experts" say. They have not proven their case to me beyond a resonable doubt. That goes for the South Knoll as well as the North Knoll locations.

Today we have better equipment to photo work these pictures. That technique should be applied by professional personal.., example Law enforcement or private corp. that deal with such matters. What I think. What you think. And what the public has been led to think is of no value today.

(2) I do not believe that a professional snipper team would place a shooter that close to the public with a rifle or a pistol. (within twenty five feet of people watching the motorcade and between the personal on the overpass and the kill zone.) If that WAS the case it would have been done by amatures and they would have been caught before they got away from their position.

(3) I was there. I helped Sergio spot for that type of stuff. And there were others, from our team, who were at the North Knoll. I have been told by the expert researchers, over the years, that they (my team) were part of the assassination team and that I was also. B.S. That too, is speculation or their part and not a proven fact. I have never said that I know all the facts behind the assassination. But, I damn well know a few of them. If we had tried to interfer with the assins and "Take them out" , as some have said (if we had found them) Then a lot of innocent people would have been killed or hurt that day and the OPS and the background information of how it was obtained would have been compromised. It would have been a blood bath in the plaza. Our job was to interupt their timing and remain "in the background" None of this was to ever be known by the public. It was a military Covert Ops. Anyone ever associated with that type of warfare knows what that means.

I hope this helps.. Its not meant to be critical. Thanks for all the information. Tosh