The lonesome Parkland Doc Dr. Kenneth Salyer

[Pat Speer]

...I think that [McClelland's drawing] pretty much corresponds to what I said, occipitoparietal. It looks a little further down in the occiput in this picture, I think, but it was pretty far posteriorly because you had to be able to see the cerebellum -- " (Peters, ARRB Parkland doctors interview)

Pat, are you saying that the doctors who all said the wound was in the occipitoparietal area of the head were wrong?

I discuss this at great length in chapters 18c and 18d of my free online book, and have discussed this in probably hundreds of posts on this forum. When one studies ALL the statements of those viewing Kennedy's head wounds on 11-22-63, it seems almost certain the Parkland witnesses thinking this wound to have been on the far back of the head were wrong.

The reasons for this are:

1. Those seeing the actual shooting described a wound on the right side of the head--where the Parkland witnesses failed to report a wound--that matched the size and nature of the wound SOME of the Parkland witnesses thought they saw on the back of the head.

2. The wound described by these witnesses to the shooting was in the location of the wound depicted in the Zapruder film and autopsy photos.

3. A few of the Parkland witnesses made statements more suggestive of the wound portrayed in the autopsy photos than the wound on the back of the head described by some of their colleagues.

4. A number of the Parkland witnesses describing a wound on the back of the head--Carrico, Perry, and Jenkins--later made statements suggesting they'd realized their error.

5. A number of other Parkland witnesses purportedly claiming the wound was on the far back of the head, e.g. Peters, Jones, described a wound higher up on the skull than pushed by most CTs, and refused to claim the autopsy photos were faked.

5. The "star" witnesses--the Parkland witnesses sticking to their claim the wound was on the far back of the head--McClelland, Crenshaw, and Bell--have tremendous problems with their credibility. McClelland originally said the wound was on the left temple, and Crenshaw and Bell made no statements at all for decades after the shooting. When asked to mark the location of the wound on anatomy drawings by the ARRB, even worse, Crenshaw and Bell marked the drawings in different locations on the rear view and lateral viewings. In other words, they either had no grasp of anatomy, or their memory of the wound's location differed from minute to minute.

FWIW, I, as most CT's, started out thinking the Parkland witnesses were the key. When I looked at it closer, and realized that very few of the "back of the head" witnesses ever claimed the wound was in the occipital location pushed by most CT writers on the medical evidence, however, I realized I'd been had. In time I decided to add chapters 18c and 18d to my website, which discuss the "back of the head" witnesses in detail, and expose the many lies told about these witnesses in order to prop up the myth the wound observed at Parkland was low on the back of the head.

I do acknowledge, however, that a majority of the Parkland witnesses believed or came to believe the head wound was further back on the skull than shown in the autopsy photos. That, to me, is irrefutable. Should a researcher wish to run with this--and make the argument the wound was where these witnesses said it was--he or she would receive very little complaint from me. No, my complaint is with those pretending these witnesses said the wound was low on the back of the head, in a location compatible with the Harper fragment's being occipital bone. That is pure nonsense, and should be exposed as such.

Edited May 12, 2013 by Pat Speer

[Pat Speer]

Pat Speer

"And what about Audrey Bell? Has anyone ever found ANY corroboration she was actually in Emergency Room 1?"

What makes you think she was lying, Pat?

Thirty something years after the shooting, and well into her retirement, Bell made some statements suggesting she'd barged into Trauma Room One and studied Kennedy's head wound with Dr. Perry. I come from a family of nurses, and this, to me, seems silly on its face. When one looks a bit deeper it gets even sillier. There is absolutely no corroboration this incident occurred, not from Perry, nor any of the other doctors or nurses present. And it's worse than that. If I recall correctly--and I trust you'll correct me if I'm wrong--there's not one bit of evidence suggesting Bell was ever in Trauma Room One during Kennedy's treatment. If I recall correctly, she was working on Connally.

Now, do I think she was lying? No. I have no opinion one way or the other. It seems quite possible to me she walked in and took a quick look and was outta there. But her story smells of exaggeration, at the very least. And there's no reason to believe it.

[Pat Speer]

There was a 1/4" hole in the right forehead yes or no?.

There was a big hole in the back of the head yes or no?.

Why do the photos not show this?.

Answer they are not meant to.perhaps the originals did.

If you want to get the 75 % who believe in the conspiracy

To understand it you have to simplify the explanations.

There was no 1/4 hole in the right forehead.

There was damaged skull at the back of the head, but no corresponding hole in the scalp.

[Robert Prudhomme]

...I think that [McClelland's drawing] pretty much corresponds to what I said, occipitoparietal. It looks a little further down in the occiput in this picture, I think, but it was pretty far posteriorly because you had to be able to see the cerebellum -- " (Peters, ARRB Parkland doctors interview)

Pat, are you saying that the doctors who all said the wound was in the occipitoparietal area of the head were wrong?

I discuss this at great length in chapters 18c and 18d of my free online book, and have discussed this in probably hundreds of posts on this forum. When one studies ALL the statements of those viewing Kennedy's head wounds on 11-22-63, it seems almost certain the Parkland witnesses thinking this wound to have been on the far back of the head were wrong.

The reasons for this are:

1. Those seeing the actual shooting described a wound on the right side of the head--where the Parkland witnesses failed to report a wound--that matched the size and nature of the wound SOME of the Parkland witnesses thought they saw on the back of the head.

2. The wound described by these witnesses to the shooting was in the location of the wound depicted in the Zapruder film and autopsy photos.

3. A few of the Parkland witnesses made statements more suggestive of the wound portrayed in the autopsy photos than the wound on the back of the head described by some of their colleagues.

4. A number of the Parkland witnesses describing a wound on the back of the head--Carrico, Perry, and Jenkins--later made statements suggesting they'd realized their error.

5. A number of other Parkland witnesses purportedly claiming the wound was on the far back of the head, e.g. Peters, Jones, described a wound higher up on the skull than pushed by most CTs, and refused to claim the autopsy photos were faked.

5. The "star" witnesses--the Parkland witnesses sticking to their claim the wound was on the far back of the head--McClelland, Crenshaw, and Bell--have tremendous problems with their credibility. McClelland originally said the wound was on the left temple, and Crenshaw and Bell made no statements at all for decades after the shooting. When asked to mark the location of the wound on anatomy drawings by the ARRB, even worse, Crenshaw and Bell marked the drawings in different locations on the rear view and lateral viewings. In other words, they either had no grasp of anatomy, or their memory of the wound's location differed from minute to minute.

FWIW, I, as most CT's, started out thinking the Parkland witnesses were the key. When I looked at it closer, and realized that very few of the "back of the head" witnesses ever claimed the wound was in the occipital location pushed by most CT writers on the medical evidence, however, I realized I'd been had. In time I decided to add chapters 18c and 18d to my website, which discuss the "back of the head" witnesses in detail, and expose the many lies told about these witnesses in order to prop up the myth the wound observed at Parkland was low on the back of the head.

I do acknowledge, however, that a majority of the Parkland witnesses believed or came to believe the head wound was further back on the skull than shown in the autopsy photos. That, to me, is irrefutable. Should a researcher wish to run with this--and make the argument the wound was where these witnesses said it was--he or she would receive very little complaint from me. No, my complaint is with those pretending these witnesses said the wound was low on the back of the head, in a location compatible with the Harper fragment's being occipital bone. That is pure nonsense, and should be exposed as such.

Mr. Speer

Do I understand your last paragraph to say you consider the possibility of a wound in the rear of JFK's head where no wound exists in the official autopsy photo of the back of JFK's head, as long as it is not solely confined to the occipital bone but possibly inclusive of some occipital bone?

Edited May 12, 2013 by Robert Prudhomme

[Pat Speer]

...I think that [McClelland's drawing] pretty much corresponds to what I said, occipitoparietal. It looks a little further down in the occiput in this picture, I think, but it was pretty far posteriorly because you had to be able to see the cerebellum -- " (Peters, ARRB Parkland doctors interview)

Pat, are you saying that the doctors who all said the wound was in the occipitoparietal area of the head were wrong?

I discuss this at great length in chapters 18c and 18d of my free online book, and have discussed this in probably hundreds of posts on this forum. When one studies ALL the statements of those viewing Kennedy's head wounds on 11-22-63, it seems almost certain the Parkland witnesses thinking this wound to have been on the far back of the head were wrong.

The reasons for this are:

1. Those seeing the actual shooting described a wound on the right side of the head--where the Parkland witnesses failed to report a wound--that matched the size and nature of the wound SOME of the Parkland witnesses thought they saw on the back of the head.

2. The wound described by these witnesses to the shooting was in the location of the wound depicted in the Zapruder film and autopsy photos.

3. A few of the Parkland witnesses made statements more suggestive of the wound portrayed in the autopsy photos than the wound on the back of the head described by some of their colleagues.

4. A number of the Parkland witnesses describing a wound on the back of the head--Carrico, Perry, and Jenkins--later made statements suggesting they'd realized their error.

5. A number of other Parkland witnesses purportedly claiming the wound was on the far back of the head, e.g. Peters, Jones, described a wound higher up on the skull than pushed by most CTs, and refused to claim the autopsy photos were faked.

5. The "star" witnesses--the Parkland witnesses sticking to their claim the wound was on the far back of the head--McClelland, Crenshaw, and Bell--have tremendous problems with their credibility. McClelland originally said the wound was on the left temple, and Crenshaw and Bell made no statements at all for decades after the shooting. When asked to mark the location of the wound on anatomy drawings by the ARRB, even worse, Crenshaw and Bell marked the drawings in different locations on the rear view and lateral viewings. In other words, they either had no grasp of anatomy, or their memory of the wound's location differed from minute to minute.

FWIW, I, as most CT's, started out thinking the Parkland witnesses were the key. When I looked at it closer, and realized that very few of the "back of the head" witnesses ever claimed the wound was in the occipital location pushed by most CT writers on the medical evidence, however, I realized I'd been had. In time I decided to add chapters 18c and 18d to my website, which discuss the "back of the head" witnesses in detail, and expose the many lies told about these witnesses in order to prop up the myth the wound observed at Parkland was low on the back of the head.

I do acknowledge, however, that a majority of the Parkland witnesses believed or came to believe the head wound was further back on the skull than shown in the autopsy photos. That, to me, is irrefutable. Should a researcher wish to run with this--and make the argument the wound was where these witnesses said it was--he or she would receive very little complaint from me. No, my complaint is with those pretending these witnesses said the wound was low on the back of the head, in a location compatible with the Harper fragment's being occipital bone. That is pure nonsense, and should be exposed as such.

Mr. Speer

Do I understand your last paragraph to say you consider the possibility of a wound in the rear of JFK's head where no wound exists in the official autopsy photo of the back of JFK's head, as long as it is not solely confined to the occipital bone but possibly inclusive of some occipital bone?

Yes, I consider the possibility. I strongly suspect that the wound was at the top of the head, where it is shown in the autopsy photos. But I agree there is support among many of the Parkland witnesses for a wound further back on the skull. What I strongly disagree with is the notion among some prominent CTs that, since these witnesses offer support for a wound in a location other than its location in the autopsy photos, then its okay to pretend these witnesses ALL agreed the wound was on the far back of the head, and in the location depicted in the McClelland drawing. That's not remotely honest, and is the kind of thing I'd expect from an Arlen Specter.

[Robert Prudhomme]

Would you not agree, though, that the drawing Dr. McClelland agreed to showed a large gaping wound in the rear of JFK's head that would have involved occipital AND parietal bone? Would you also not agree that the majority of Parkland medical witnesses described, in their testimony to the Warren Commission, a head wound that was in the occipital-parietal region of JFK's head?

[Daniel Gallup]

...I think that [McClelland's drawing] pretty much corresponds to what I said, occipitoparietal. It looks a little further down in the occiput in this picture, I think, but it was pretty far posteriorly because you had to be able to see the cerebellum -- " (Peters, ARRB Parkland doctors interview)

Pat, are you saying that the doctors who all said the wound was in the occipitoparietal area of the head were wrong?

I discuss this at great length in chapters 18c and 18d of my free online book, and have discussed this in probably hundreds of posts on this forum. When one studies ALL the statements of those viewing Kennedy's head wounds on 11-22-63, it seems almost certain the Parkland witnesses thinking this wound to have been on the far back of the head were wrong.

The reasons for this are:

1. Those seeing the actual shooting described a wound on the right side of the head--where the Parkland witnesses failed to report a wound--that matched the size and nature of the wound SOME of the Parkland witnesses thought they saw on the back of the head.

2. The wound described by these witnesses to the shooting was in the location of the wound depicted in the Zapruder film and autopsy photos.

3. A few of the Parkland witnesses made statements more suggestive of the wound portrayed in the autopsy photos than the wound on the back of the head described by some of their colleagues.

4. A number of the Parkland witnesses describing a wound on the back of the head--Carrico, Perry, and Jenkins--later made statements suggesting they'd realized their error.

5. A number of other Parkland witnesses purportedly claiming the wound was on the far back of the head, e.g. Peters, Jones, described a wound higher up on the skull than pushed by most CTs, and refused to claim the autopsy photos were faked.

5. The "star" witnesses--the Parkland witnesses sticking to their claim the wound was on the far back of the head--McClelland, Crenshaw, and Bell--have tremendous problems with their credibility. McClelland originally said the wound was on the left temple, and Crenshaw and Bell made no statements at all for decades after the shooting. When asked to mark the location of the wound on anatomy drawings by the ARRB, even worse, Crenshaw and Bell marked the drawings in different locations on the rear view and lateral viewings. In other words, they either had no grasp of anatomy, or their memory of the wound's location differed from minute to minute.

FWIW, I, as most CT's, started out thinking the Parkland witnesses were the key. When I looked at it closer, and realized that very few of the "back of the head" witnesses ever claimed the wound was in the occipital location pushed by most CT writers on the medical evidence, however, I realized I'd been had. In time I decided to add chapters 18c and 18d to my website, which discuss the "back of the head" witnesses in detail, and expose the many lies told about these witnesses in order to prop up the myth the wound observed at Parkland was low on the back of the head.

I do acknowledge, however, that a majority of the Parkland witnesses believed or came to believe the head wound was further back on the skull than shown in the autopsy photos. That, to me, is irrefutable. Should a researcher wish to run with this--and make the argument the wound was where these witnesses said it was--he or she would receive very little complaint from me. No, my complaint is with those pretending these witnesses said the wound was low on the back of the head, in a location compatible with the Harper fragment's being occipital bone. That is pure nonsense, and should be exposed as such.

Mr. Speer

Do I understand your last paragraph to say you consider the possibility of a wound in the rear of JFK's head where no wound exists in the official autopsy photo of the back of JFK's head, as long as it is not solely confined to the occipital bone but possibly inclusive of some occipital bone?

Yes, I consider the possibility. I strongly suspect that the wound was at the top of the head, where it is shown in the autopsy photos. But I agree there is support among many of the Parkland witnesses for a wound further back on the skull. What I strongly disagree with is the notion among some prominent CTs that, since these witnesses offer support for a wound in a location other than its location in the autopsy photos, then its okay to pretend these witnesses ALL agreed the wound was on the far back of the head, and in the location depicted in the McClelland drawing. That's not remotely honest, and is the kind of thing I'd expect from an Arlen Specter.

If it was at the top of the skull, Jackie made a big mistake trying to hold the back of his head on, as she reported to the WC, and Clint Hill confused the back of his head with the top as well, even though he had a good amount of time to see his wounds, just as the Parkland doctors did. No wonder they could not save Kennedy -- they couldn't find the wound on his head, mistakenly thinking it was occipitoparietal, when in reality the top of his skull was missing.

[Pat Speer]

Would you not agree, though, that the drawing Dr. McClelland agreed to showed a large gaping wound in the rear of JFK's head that would have involved occipital AND parietal bone? Would you also not agree that the majority of Parkland medical witnesses described, in their testimony to the Warren Commission, a head wound that was in the occipital-parietal region of JFK's head?

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If one were to average out the descriptions and depictions of the wound by the Parkland witnesses, the wound would be at the top of the back of the head, chiefly in the parietal area, but extending slightly into the occipital area. The McClelland drawing depicts a wound chiefly in the occipital area, extending into the parietal area. It is roughly two inches lower on the skull. While many CTs accept the accuracy of this drawing--and believe it supports the quick opinion of one doctor that the Harper fragment was occipital bone, they miss that the Harper fragment's being parietal bone--as subsequently interpreted by both the HSCA's Dr. Lawrence Angel and Neuroanatomist Dr. Joseph Riley--also suggests a conspiracy. As demonstrated by John Hunt at the 2003 Wecht conference, and discussed on my website, bullet lead is visible on the long-suppressed x-ray of the Harper fragment, in a location suggesting the fatal bullet impacted near Kennedy's temple.

FWIW, Tink Thompson is a member of this forum, and has discussed the McClelland drawing a number of times here and elsewhere. The drawing was made for Tink's book by a college student, working from Dr. McClelland's testimony. According to Tink, he never spoke to McClelland about the drawing. While this could be a he-said/she said situation, Dr. McClelland never mentioned his involvement in the drawing until many years after its creation, and has at times both claimed he'd helped create the drawing, and claimed he'd actually made the drawing. It seems almost certain then that his memory is just not to be relied upon, and that Tink's memory is the more accurate.

[Pat Speer]

If it was at the top of the skull, Jackie made a big mistake trying to hold the back of his head on, as she reported to the WC, and Clint Hill confused the back of his head with the top as well, even though he had a good amount of time to see his wounds, just as the Parkland doctors did. No wonder they could not save Kennedy -- they couldn't find the wound on his head, mistakenly thinking it was occipitoparietal, when in reality the top of his skull was missing.

Daniel, you need to put down the CT books you've been reading, and continue your research.

Here is my discussion of Jackie's statements in chapter 18c:

Let's remember the words of Mrs. Kennedy. While many have used her statement "from the front there was nothing" as evidence the bullet erupted from the back of her husband’s skull, they largely ignore the context of her statements. When describing the fatal shot, she told the Warren Commission “just as I turned to look at him, I could see a piece of his skull, sort of wedge-shaped like that, and I remember it was flesh colored.” (The words "sort of wedge-shaped like that" were in the court reporter's transcript but never published. They are presumably a reference to the bone flap visible in the right lateral autopsy photos.) She then described cradling her husband in her arms, and getting a closer look at the wound. She said: “from the front there was nothing. I suppose there must have been. But from the back you could see, you know, you were trying to hold his hair on, and his skull on.” Her words do not describe the wound's exact location, and suggest merely that the gaping wound on President Kennedy's head did not extend as far as his face. They do not detail an exit on the back of his head, as mistakenly purported by Dr. James Fetzer in his January 12, 2010 radio interview of Doug Horne, in which he claimed she had testified that "she had a terrible time holding the back of his head and skull together," an assertion, by the way, to which Horne readily agreed. Still, one might wonder about the exact location of this wound.

Fortunately, only a week after the assassination, in a conversation with historian Theodore White, Mrs. Kennedy was far more descriptive. According to White's notes, released to the public in May 1995 and subsequently published in the September 1995 Kennedy Assassination Chronicles, she said: “I could see a piece of his skull coming off…this perfectly clean piece detaching itself from his head; then he slumped in my lap.” Now, this would seem to be a reference to the detachment of skull seen in frame 314 of the Zapruder film, and can be taken as an indication of the film's legitimacy.

But that's not all she had to say. According to White's notes, she also said: "All the ride to the hospital, I kept bending over him saying, 'Jack, Jack, can you hear me, I love you, Jack.' I kept holding the top of his head down trying to keep the..." White's notes then detail that when discussing her husband's condition at the hospital, Mrs. Kennedy said "From here down"--and here she made a gesture indicating her husband's forehead--"his head was so beautiful. I'd tried to hold the top of his head down, maybe I could keep it in...I knew he was dead." Thus, according to White, she said the wound was at the "top" of her husband's head--not once but twice...

And that wasn't the last time she described the wound in such a manner. In her interview with White Mrs. Kennedy worried that the history of her husband's Presidency would be written by the likes of AP correspondent "Merriman Smith, that bitter man," who, irony of all ironies, would soon thereafter win a Pulitzer Prize for his reporting on the assassination. This no doubt contributed to her subsequent decision to hire an historian of her own, William Manchester, to write an authorized book on the assassination. She was interviewed by Manchester on 4-7-64, 5-4-64, 5-7-64, 5-8-64, and 7-20-64. While Manchester's notes on these interviews have never been released, it's clear she told him, as White, that the fatal wound was at the top of Kennedy's head. In late 1966, she had a falling out with Manchester over his use of these interviews. His book could not be released without her approval. This, then, led to her reading a draft of his book, The Death of a President, and giving it her personal approval. Here is how the final draft described her husband's death: "The First Lady, in her last act as First Lady, leaned solicitously toward the President. His face was quizzical. She had seen that expression so often, when he was puzzling over a difficult press conference question. Now, in a gesture of infinite grace, he raised his right hand, as though to brush back his tousled chestnut hair. But the motion faltered. The hand fell back empty. He had been reaching for the top of his head. But it wasn't there any more."

Now this can't be any more clear. Mrs. Kennedy had told Manchester that the fatal wound she saw was at the top of her husband's head.

That the descriptions of Kennedy’s head wound by the First Lady and the earliest descriptions of the wound and/or impact location by Newman and Zapruder and so many others match the wound seen in the Zapruder film, autopsy photos, and X-rays leads me to suspect that the large head wound observed at Parkland was on the top of Kennedy's skull in front of his ear, and not on the back of his head as suggested by the Parkland witnesses.

As for Hill... he has discussed Kennedy's head wound dozens of times over the last decade, and has claimed over and over again that the wound he saw was at the top of the head above the ear. He has even pointed out this location on TV. Claiming him as a "back of the head" witness based upon a few early statements, in which he was never asked to specify the location, and failing to admit he has long disputed your interpretation of his earliest statements, is a bit desperate, IMO.

Edited May 13, 2013 by Pat Speer

[Daniel Gallup]

If it was at the top of the skull, Jackie made a big mistake trying to hold the back of his head on, as she reported to the WC, and Clint Hill confused the back of his head with the top as well, even though he had a good amount of time to see his wounds, just as the Parkland doctors did. No wonder they could not save Kennedy -- they couldn't find the wound on his head, mistakenly thinking it was occipitoparietal, when in reality the top of his skull was missing.

Daniel, you need to put down the CT books you've been reading, and continue your research.

I mean no disrespect, Pat, but I have read your chapters as part of my research. The CT books, at least some of them, have it all over your special pleading. Jackie's words are plain enough that everyone but you seems to think she was holding his head down because the wound was in the right rear. Nothing you posted of Jackie's words admit of any other conclusion. One doesn't hold the top of his head down if the top of his head is missing. Your condescending remark which I put in bold is groundless and only demeans yourself. As a moderator maybe you think you can get away with insults, but in my eyes you damage your own case. An insult is just an admission of defeat -- that you cannot win by a carefully crafted argument. If what you have written really held water, I as a reasonable man would be inclined to agree with you. Your overall mistake in PatSpeer.com is to put faith in the so called evidence. The Parkland and Bethesda description of the wounding cannot be reconciled except by recourse to the loss of the chain of possession of Kennedy's body, for which there is considerable evidence. You are trying to put a round peg in a square hole, and it won't fit no matter how hard you try. The butchering you have done to Jackie's words are a case in point. But this is just one of a long list of examples one might note in this thread. You attempt to obfuscate the clear statements of McClelland by a peculiar interpretation of his words to Dudman; thus you make muddy what is really very clear (and well-corroborated).

When someone disagrees with you it is not due to a lack of research, but due to someone coming to quite a different conclusion than yourself. Maybe it's time for you to admit that.

[Robert Prudhomme]

If it was at the top of the skull, Jackie made a big mistake trying to hold the back of his head on, as she reported to the WC, and Clint Hill confused the back of his head with the top as well, even though he had a good amount of time to see his wounds, just as the Parkland doctors did. No wonder they could not save Kennedy -- they couldn't find the wound on his head, mistakenly thinking it was occipitoparietal, when in reality the top of his skull was missing.

Daniel, you need to put down the CT books you've been reading, and continue your research.

Here is my discussion of Jackie's statements in chapter 18c:

Let's remember the words of Mrs. Kennedy. While many have used her statement "from the front there was nothing" as evidence the bullet erupted from the back of her husband’s skull, they largely ignore the context of her statements. When describing the fatal shot, she told the Warren Commission “just as I turned to look at him, I could see a piece of his skull, sort of wedge-shaped like that, and I remember it was flesh colored.” (The words "sort of wedge-shaped like that" were in the court reporter's transcript but never published. They are presumably a reference to the bone flap visible in the right lateral autopsy photos.) She then described cradling her husband in her arms, and getting a closer look at the wound. She said: “from the front there was nothing. I suppose there must have been. But from the back you could see, you know, you were trying to hold his hair on, and his skull on.” Her words do not describe the wound's exact location, and suggest merely that the gaping wound on President Kennedy's head did not extend as far as his face. They do not detail an exit on the back of his head, as mistakenly purported by Dr. James Fetzer in his January 12, 2010 radio interview of Doug Horne, in which he claimed she had testified that "she had a terrible time holding the back of his head and skull together," an assertion, by the way, to which Horne readily agreed. Still, one might wonder about the exact location of this wound.

Fortunately, only a week after the assassination, in a conversation with historian Theodore White, Mrs. Kennedy was far more descriptive. According to White's notes, released to the public in May 1995 and subsequently published in the September 1995 Kennedy Assassination Chronicles, she said: “I could see a piece of his skull coming off…this perfectly clean piece detaching itself from his head; then he slumped in my lap.” Now, this would seem to be a reference to the detachment of skull seen in frame 314 of the Zapruder film, and can be taken as an indication of the film's legitimacy.

But that's not all she had to say. According to White's notes, she also said: "All the ride to the hospital, I kept bending over him saying, 'Jack, Jack, can you hear me, I love you, Jack.' I kept holding the top of his head down trying to keep the..." White's notes then detail that when discussing her husband's condition at the hospital, Mrs. Kennedy said "From here down"--and here she made a gesture indicating her husband's forehead--"his head was so beautiful. I'd tried to hold the top of his head down, maybe I could keep it in...I knew he was dead." Thus, according to White, she said the wound was at the "top" of her husband's head--not once but twice...

And that wasn't the last time she described the wound in such a manner. In her interview with White Mrs. Kennedy worried that the history of her husband's Presidency would be written by the likes of AP correspondent "Merriman Smith, that bitter man," who, irony of all ironies, would soon thereafter win a Pulitzer Prize for his reporting on the assassination. This no doubt contributed to her subsequent decision to hire an historian of her own, William Manchester, to write an authorized book on the assassination. She was interviewed by Manchester on 4-7-64, 5-4-64, 5-7-64, 5-8-64, and 7-20-64. While Manchester's notes on these interviews have never been released, it's clear she told him, as White, that the fatal wound was at the top of Kennedy's head. In late 1966, she had a falling out with Manchester over his use of these interviews. His book could not be released without her approval. This, then, led to her reading a draft of his book, The Death of a President, and giving it her personal approval. Here is how the final draft described her husband's death: "The First Lady, in her last act as First Lady, leaned solicitously toward the President. His face was quizzical. She had seen that expression so often, when he was puzzling over a difficult press conference question. Now, in a gesture of infinite grace, he raised his right hand, as though to brush back his tousled chestnut hair. But the motion faltered. The hand fell back empty. He had been reaching for the top of his head. But it wasn't there any more."

Now this can't be any more clear. Mrs. Kennedy had told Manchester that the fatal wound she saw was at the top of her husband's head.

That the descriptions of Kennedy’s head wound by the First Lady and the earliest descriptions of the wound and/or impact location by Newman and Zapruder and so many others match the wound seen in the Zapruder film, autopsy photos, and X-rays leads me to suspect that the large head wound observed at Parkland was on the top of Kennedy's skull in front of his ear, and not on the back of his head as suggested by the Parkland witnesses.

As for Hill... he has discussed Kennedy's head wound dozens of times over the last decade, and has claimed over and over again that the wound he saw was at the top of the head above the ear. He has even pointed out this location on TV. Claiming him as a "back of the head" witness based upon a few early statements, in which he was never asked to specify the location, and failing to admit he has long disputed your interpretation of his earliest statements, is a bit desperate, IMO.

From the statement of SA Clinton J. Hill, Secret Service, November 30, 1963:

"As I lay over the top of the back seat I noticed a portion of the President's head on the right rear side was missing and he was bleeding profusely. Part of his brain was gone. I saw a part of his skull with hair on it lieing in the seat. The time of the shooting was approximately 12:30 p.m., Dallas time. I looked forward to the jump seats and noticed Governor Connally's chest was covered with blood and he was slumped to his left and partially covered up by his wife. I had not realized until this point that the Governor had been shot."

From the Warren Commission testimony of SA Clinton J. Hill, Secret Service:

"Mr. SPECTER. What did you observe as to President Kennedy's condition on arrival at the hospital?

Mr. HILL. The right rear portion of his head was missing. It was lying in the rear seat of the car. His brain was exposed. There was blood and bits of brain all over the entire rear portion of the car. Mrs. Kennedy was completely covered with blood. There was so much blood you could not tell if there had been any other wound or not, except for the one large gaping wound in the right rear portion of the head."

[Daniel Gallup]

If it was at the top of the skull, Jackie made a big mistake trying to hold the back of his head on, as she reported to the WC, and Clint Hill confused the back of his head with the top as well, even though he had a good amount of time to see his wounds, just as the Parkland doctors did. No wonder they could not save Kennedy -- they couldn't find the wound on his head, mistakenly thinking it was occipitoparietal, when in reality the top of his skull was missing.

Daniel, you need to put down the CT books you've been reading, and continue your research.

Here is my discussion of Jackie's statements in chapter 18c:

Let's remember the words of Mrs. Kennedy. While many have used her statement "from the front there was nothing" as evidence the bullet erupted from the back of her husband’s skull, they largely ignore the context of her statements. When describing the fatal shot, she told the Warren Commission “just as I turned to look at him, I could see a piece of his skull, sort of wedge-shaped like that, and I remember it was flesh colored.” (The words "sort of wedge-shaped like that" were in the court reporter's transcript but never published. They are presumably a reference to the bone flap visible in the right lateral autopsy photos.) She then described cradling her husband in her arms, and getting a closer look at the wound. She said: “from the front there was nothing. I suppose there must have been. But from the back you could see, you know, you were trying to hold his hair on, and his skull on.” Her words do not describe the wound's exact location, and suggest merely that the gaping wound on President Kennedy's head did not extend as far as his face. They do not detail an exit on the back of his head, as mistakenly purported by Dr. James Fetzer in his January 12, 2010 radio interview of Doug Horne, in which he claimed she had testified that "she had a terrible time holding the back of his head and skull together," an assertion, by the way, to which Horne readily agreed. Still, one might wonder about the exact location of this wound.

Fortunately, only a week after the assassination, in a conversation with historian Theodore White, Mrs. Kennedy was far more descriptive. According to White's notes, released to the public in May 1995 and subsequently published in the September 1995 Kennedy Assassination Chronicles, she said: “I could see a piece of his skull coming off…this perfectly clean piece detaching itself from his head; then he slumped in my lap.” Now, this would seem to be a reference to the detachment of skull seen in frame 314 of the Zapruder film, and can be taken as an indication of the film's legitimacy.

But that's not all she had to say. According to White's notes, she also said: "All the ride to the hospital, I kept bending over him saying, 'Jack, Jack, can you hear me, I love you, Jack.' I kept holding the top of his head down trying to keep the..." White's notes then detail that when discussing her husband's condition at the hospital, Mrs. Kennedy said "From here down"--and here she made a gesture indicating her husband's forehead--"his head was so beautiful. I'd tried to hold the top of his head down, maybe I could keep it in...I knew he was dead." Thus, according to White, she said the wound was at the "top" of her husband's head--not once but twice...

And that wasn't the last time she described the wound in such a manner. In her interview with White Mrs. Kennedy worried that the history of her husband's Presidency would be written by the likes of AP correspondent "Merriman Smith, that bitter man," who, irony of all ironies, would soon thereafter win a Pulitzer Prize for his reporting on the assassination. This no doubt contributed to her subsequent decision to hire an historian of her own, William Manchester, to write an authorized book on the assassination. She was interviewed by Manchester on 4-7-64, 5-4-64, 5-7-64, 5-8-64, and 7-20-64. While Manchester's notes on these interviews have never been released, it's clear she told him, as White, that the fatal wound was at the top of Kennedy's head. In late 1966, she had a falling out with Manchester over his use of these interviews. His book could not be released without her approval. This, then, led to her reading a draft of his book, The Death of a President, and giving it her personal approval. Here is how the final draft described her husband's death: "The First Lady, in her last act as First Lady, leaned solicitously toward the President. His face was quizzical. She had seen that expression so often, when he was puzzling over a difficult press conference question. Now, in a gesture of infinite grace, he raised his right hand, as though to brush back his tousled chestnut hair. But the motion faltered. The hand fell back empty. He had been reaching for the top of his head. But it wasn't there any more."

Now this can't be any more clear. Mrs. Kennedy had told Manchester that the fatal wound she saw was at the top of her husband's head.

That the descriptions of Kennedy’s head wound by the First Lady and the earliest descriptions of the wound and/or impact location by Newman and Zapruder and so many others match the wound seen in the Zapruder film, autopsy photos, and X-rays leads me to suspect that the large head wound observed at Parkland was on the top of Kennedy's skull in front of his ear, and not on the back of his head as suggested by the Parkland witnesses.

As for Hill... he has discussed Kennedy's head wound dozens of times over the last decade, and has claimed over and over again that the wound he saw was at the top of the head above the ear. He has even pointed out this location on TV. Claiming him as a "back of the head" witness based upon a few early statements, in which he was never asked to specify the location, and failing to admit he has long disputed your interpretation of his earliest statements, is a bit desperate, IMO.

From the statement of SA Clinton J. Hill, Secret Service, November 30, 1963:

"As I lay over the top of the back seat I noticed a portion of the President's head on the right rear side was missing and he was bleeding profusely. Part of his brain was gone. I saw a part of his skull with hair on it lieing in the seat. The time of the shooting was approximately 12:30 p.m., Dallas time. I looked forward to the jump seats and noticed Governor Connally's chest was covered with blood and he was slumped to his left and partially covered up by his wife. I had not realized until this point that the Governor had been shot."

From the Warren Commission testimony of SA Clinton J. Hill, Secret Service:

"Mr. SPECTER. What did you observe as to President Kennedy's condition on arrival at the hospital?

Mr. HILL. The right rear portion of his head was missing. It was lying in the rear seat of the car. His brain was exposed. There was blood and bits of brain all over the entire rear portion of the car. Mrs. Kennedy was completely covered with blood. There was so much blood you could not tell if there had been any other wound or not, except for the one large gaping wound in the right rear portion of the head."

Yes, but Robert, Hill did not really mean right rear portion of the head, even though he used those words, and even though that's what the Dallas doctors closest to Kennedy saw. Though they said "occipitoparietal" they didn't mean it. They really meant top of the skull, as proved by the autopsy pictures and Bill O'Reilly. This is a very important hermeneutical principle: ignore the earliest statements of the witnesses and quote them only after their memory has been sufficiently corrupted by fake evidence and reports based on fake evidence so that they contradict their earliest observations.

[Pat Speer]

From the statement of SA Clinton J. Hill, Secret Service, November 30, 1963:

"As I lay over the top of the back seat I noticed a portion of the President's head on the right rear side was missing and he was bleeding profusely. Part of his brain was gone. I saw a part of his skull with hair on it lieing in the seat. The time of the shooting was approximately 12:30 p.m., Dallas time. I looked forward to the jump seats and noticed Governor Connally's chest was covered with blood and he was slumped to his left and partially covered up by his wife. I had not realized until this point that the Governor had been shot."

From the Warren Commission testimony of SA Clinton J. Hill, Secret Service:

"Mr. SPECTER. What did you observe as to President Kennedy's condition on arrival at the hospital?

Mr. HILL. The right rear portion of his head was missing. It was lying in the rear seat of the car. His brain was exposed. There was blood and bits of brain all over the entire rear portion of the car. Mrs. Kennedy was completely covered with blood. There was so much blood you could not tell if there had been any other wound or not, except for the one large gaping wound in the right rear portion of the head."

Yes, I know, Robert. I just so happen to have researched what Clint Hill said and when. Hill initially made some vague comments about the right rear portion. He later demonstrated what he meant by this, and repeatedly claimed the wound was above the right ear. He was clearly not lying about this either, as he 1) pointed to a location a few inches back of the wound in the autopsy photos, and 2) would occasionally use words like "right rear" to describe the wound in this location.

And so, those citing Hill are in a bind... Do you claim he was lying or horribly wrong about the wound being above the right ear? Or do you acknowledge that your star witness for the accuracy of the McClelland drawing in truth completely rejects the accuracy of the McClelland drawing?

From patspeer.com, chapter 5b:

Clint Hill rode on the outside of the back-up car by the driver’s door. (11-30-63 report, 18H740-745) “On the left hand side was a grass area with a few people scattered along it observing the motorcade passing, and I was visually scanning these people when I heard a noise similar to a firecracker. The noise came from my right rear and I immediately moved my head in that direction. In so doing, my eyes had to cross the Presidential automobile and I saw the President hunch forward and then slump to his left. I jumped from the follow-up car and ran toward the Presidential automobile. I heard a second firecracker type noise but it had a different sound—like the sound of shooting a revolver into something hard. I saw the President slump more toward his left. I jumped onto the left rear step of the Presidential automobile. Mrs. Kennedy shouted, "They've shot his head off;" then turned and raised out of her seat as if she were reaching to her right rear toward the back of the car for something that had blown out. I forced her back into her seat and placed my body above President and Mrs. Kennedy. SA Greer had, as I jumped onto the Presidential automobile, accelerated the Presidential automobile forward. I heard ASAIC Kellerman call SA Lawson on the two-way radio and say, "To the nearest hospital, quick." I shouted as loud as I could at the Lead car, "To the hospital, to the hospital." As I lay over the top of the back seat I noticed a portion of the President's head on the right rear side was missing and he was bleeding profusely. Part of his brain was gone. I saw a part of his skull with hair on it lieing in the seat...At approximately 2:45 A.M., November 23, I was requested by ASAIC to come to the morgue to once again view the body. When I arrived the autopsy had been completed and ASAIC Kellerman, SA Greer, General McHugh and I viewed the wounds. I observed a wound about six inches down from the neckline on the back just to the right of the spinal column. I observed another wound on the right rear portion of the skull. Attendants of the Joseph Gawler Mortuary were at this time preparing the body for placement in the casket.” (3-9-64 testimony before the Warren Commission, 2H132-144) “Well, as we came out of the curve, and began to straighten up, I was viewing the area which looked to be a park. There were people scattered throughout the entire park. And I heard a noise from my right rear, which to me seemed to be a firecracker. I immediately looked to my right and, in so doing, my eyes had to cross the Presidential limousine and I saw President Kennedy grab at himself and lurch forward and to the left... I jumped from the car, realizing that something was wrong, ran to the Presidential limousine. Just about as I reached it, there was another sound, which was different than the first sound. I think I described it in my statement as though someone was shooting a revolver into a hard object--it seemed to have some type of an echo.” (On what he saw upon arrival at Parkland) "The right rear portion of his head was missing. It was lying in the rear seat of the car. His brain was exposed. There was blood and bits of brain all over the entire rear portion of the car. Mrs. Kennedy was completely covered with blood. There was so much blood you could not tell if there had been any other wound or not, except for the one large gaping wound in the right rear portion of the head." (When asked if he saw any wound other than the head wound at the autopsy) "I saw an opening in the back, about 6 inches below the neckline to the right-hand side of the spinal column." (When asked if had an impression of the direction from which the second shot had been fired) "It was right, but I cannot say for sure that it was rear, because when I mounted the car it was--it had a different sound, first of all, than the first sound that I heard. The second one had almost a double sound--as though you were standing against something metal and firing into it, and you hear both the sound of a gun going off and the sound of the cartridge hitting the metal place, which could have been caused probably by the hard surface of the head. But I am not sure that that is what caused it." (Signed statement in the 5-5-64 Secret Service report on the behavior of the presidential detail on the night before the shooting, 18H685) "I departed the Texas Hotel between 1:15 A.M. and 1:30 A.M and went to the Press Club, Fort Worth, arriving there about five minutes after departure from the Texas Hotel. While there I consumed the (?) glass of scotch and water and purchased two packs of cigarettes. I departed the Press Club at approximately 1:45 A.M. I then went to a place known as "The Cellar, arriving there at approximately 1:50 A.M. While at The Cellar I was served a beverage which I can best describe as grape fruit juice and soda. It was called a 'Salty Dick.' I did not drink the entire drink. I departed The Cellar at approximately 2:45 A.M. and returned to my room in the Texas Hotel." (Note: Hill reported for duty at 8:05 A.M.) (11-18-64 and 5-20-65 interviews with William Manchester, as represented in The Death of a President, 1967) (On the first shot) "Lawson, Kellerman, Greer, Ready, and Hill all thought that a firecracker had been exploded."

(December, 1975 interview with Mike Wallace shown on CBS' program 60 Minutes) (When asked if there were multiple shooters) "There were only three shots. It was one gun. Three shots." (When asked if he was satisfied that Oswald acted alone) "Completely." (Television interview found on Youtube as Clint Hill Interview 1, apparently taken from the History Channel program The Secret Service, 1995) "I heard a sound from my right rear. I was on the left-hand front of the follow-up car. As I began to turn to my right toward that sound, my eyes crossed the back of the presidential car. And I saw the president grasp at his throat and lurch a bit to his left. And I realized something had happened. And I got off the car as quickly as I could and ran to the presidential car. By the time I got there two more shots had been fired and he had been hit in the head." (Television interview found on Youtube as Clint Hill interview 2, apparently taken from the Discovery Channel program Inside the Secret Service, 1995)) "We made a left-hand turn, and shortly after we made a left-hand turn there was an explosion to my right rear that sounded a bit like a gun shot or a firecracker. And I responded by looking to my right and as I did so my eyes went across the back of the presidential car. And I saw the president grab at his throat and lurch to the left. And I jumped from the car and ran to the presidential car. Before I got there he had been shot again in the head." (Interview conducted for the National Geographic Channel program Inside the Secret Service, first broadcast 10-24-04. Note that this is, in fact, a compilation of two different edits of the interview as found on Youtube. The sections found in the DVD are in italics.) "We traveled along this open area which was on my left and then made a left turn, but it wasn't a 90 degree left turn, it was like a 120 degree left turn. The open area was still on my left, and shortly after we got into that turn and started on that street, I heard a sound--which I wasn't sure what it was--whether it was a gunshot or a firecracker. I turned to see what was happening, and as I did I saw President Kennedy grab at his throat and lurch forward. I knew something was wrong. Before I could get to the presidential limousine, another shot had been fired and hit President Kennedy in the head. About that time I reached the back of the presidential limousine and tried to get on. I was trying to get my foot up on the back of the car. And I slipped. I had to run three or four more steps before I could get up. By that time Mrs. Kennedy had come out onto the trunk. It appeared to me she was searching for something, trying to retrieve something. But I got up on the back of the car and placed her back in the seat. The President at that time had slumped down into her lap. And I could see the back of his head. And there was a gaping hole above his right ear about the size of my palm. And there was white brain matter and red blood throughout the entire car. We then--the car jolted forward and we sped off to Parkland Hospital."

(Foreword written by Hill for The Kennedy Detail, 2010) "I would be very pleased if the results of the Warren Commission and its investigation would be accepted as the final word." (Interview on Fox News Network promoting the release of The Kennedy Detail, 11-12-10) "I heard the first shot, saw the President grab his throat, and lurch left. I knew something was wrong so I ran out to the car. I tried to get up on the trunk. The driver accelerated. I slipped. When I gained my footing, I got up on the trunk of the car. About that time, Mrs. Kennedy started up on the rear of the trunk. She was trying to retrieve something that came off the President's head. She didn't know I was there. I helped her get back in the back seat and the President fell to the left in her lap." (When asked what he believes happened) "What happened was a single shooter fired three shots from an elevated position to the rear of the motorcade. All three shots hit what they were aimed at. The first one hit President Kennedy. The second one hit Governor Connally. The third one hit President Kennedy in the head. That's the fact. The rest of it is just theory. Unlike fact." (Interview on Free Johnny Dare radio program on 98.9 The Rock in Kansas City, 11-12-10) (When asked what happened after he saw the president react to the first shot) "Well, I tried to get there as quick as I could. I came off the follow-up car, ran to the presidential vehicle. I could not hear the second shot 'cause I was running. By the time I got close the third shot had hit the president in the head. Some material came off the right rear. Mrs. Kennedy came out of her seat and onto the trunk to try to retrieve that material. I slipped, I tried to regain my position. I got up on the trunk. She did not know I was there. And I grabbed her, and put her back in the seat when the president fell to his left onto her lap." (When asked what he saw when he climbed up onto the trunk and looked at the president) "I saw that there was a portion of his skull removed from the upper rear above the right ear about the size of my palm, and brain material and blood was all over the back of the car including myself." (When asked if the president was still breathing when they got to the hospital) "Well, I couldn't tell if that was the case. His eyes were fixed, and a hole was in the upper right portion of his head. So it appeared that he was fatally wounded." (London Daily Mail Online article stupidly entitled "What have they done?': Jackie's words as JFK was shot are revealed by secret service agent who breaks silence after almost 50 years", 11-14-10) "‘I heard the first shot, saw the president grab his throat, lurch left and I knew something was wrong," he recalled, his voice halting. "When I got to the presidential vehicle, just as I approached it, a third shot rang out, hitting the president in the head, just above the right ear, and left a hole about the size of my palm. There were blood and brains spewed about over myself and the car. I helped Mrs Kennedy get in the back seat and the President fell into her lap. I was quite sure it was a fatal wound. The First Lady was in shock. She was doing the best she could, she was covered in blood." On the way to Parkland Hospital, where the president would be certified dead there was little conversation. But, according to Mr. Hill, Mrs Kennedy "said something about, 'Oh, Jack, what have they done? What have they done?'" (Oral History interview performed for the Sixth Floor Museum, 11-18-10) "About 50-60 feet down Elm Street, I was looking to my left, to a grassy area. There were very few people in that area. Some people there were taking pictures and that sort of thing. I heard an explosive noise to my right rear. I had been looking to my left, and so I scanned from my left to my right. When I did that my eyes had to go across the back of the President's car. And I saw the President grab at his throat and lurch to his left. So I knew something was wrong, something had happened. So I jumped from the car and ran toward the Presidential vehicle. Now I didn't hear any shot when I was running, but they tell me there was a shot at that time. But just before I reached the Presidential vehicle, I heard another shot and I felt the results, because the shot hit the President in the head, to the upper right rear of his head, above the right ear, and material came out of that wound, spewing over the back of the car, and over myself. I tried to get up on the back of the car. The driver started to accelerate more. I slipped. I ran a few more feet then got up on the car. About that time Mrs. Kennedy was coming out on the trunk. She looked like she was reaching for something that had come off the right rear of the car from the President's wound. I don't know what it was. She did not know I was there. I helped her as best I could to get back into the back seat of the car. When she got into the back seat and sat down, the President's body fell to its left onto her lap. When he fell like that, the upper right portion of his head was exposed, and I could see that a portion of his skull was missing, that it appeared someone had taken a scoop into the brain matter and removed portions of it, and scattered it around because there was brain and blood matter over the entire interior of the rear of the car, including Mrs. Kennedy. I noticed that his eyes appeared thick. I assumed that it was a fatal wound."

(11-20-10 interview of Hill and Gerald Blaine by Gary Mack at the Sixth Floor Museum, broadcast on CSPAN2, 12-12-10) (When Mack offers "You heard three shots.") "The three shots all came from the same location." (When Mack asks if the three shots were evenly spaced) "I didn't hear the second shot, so I only heard two shots. The first shot came from my right rear. And I was looking to the left of the grassy area on the left hand side of Elm Street when I heard the shot. My vision took me to the right toward that shot. In so doing my eyes went across the back of the President's car. I saw him grab at his throat and he started to lurch to his left. He didn't move too far but he was trying to go to his left. I knew something was wrong. So I jumped off the car and started running to the President's car, trying to get there in time to get on top and cover--what we try to do is cover and evacuate. I was trying to get there to cover up so nobody would impart further damage to the President or Mrs. Kennedy. About the time I got to the car, just before I got there, the third shot--that I heard, and I felt--because it hit the President in the head just above the right ear, right up in here (he places his hand just above his right ear, with some of his fingers to the back of the his ear), and blood and brain matter were spewing all over the place, including on me. About that time Mrs. Kennedy came out of her seat out onto the trunk of the car. She was trying to retrieve something that had come off the President's head and went to the right rear. I slipped at first while trying to get onto the car 'cause Bill Greer the driver accelerated the car. I gained my footing again, got up on the car, and helped her get back in the seat. When I did that the President fell over to his left onto her lap and I could see the upper right portion of his head (he again places his hand above his right ear, only this time he places it directly above the ear, about an inch forward of where he'd placed it only 30 seconds before) had a large hole about the size of my palm. It looked like somebody had taken a scoop and removed brain matter and just thrown it around the car--blood and brain matter and bone particles all around the car. His eyes were fixed. I was quite sure it was a fatal wound." (When Mack points out to him that the scenario Hill has been pushing in his recent interviews entails three shots and three hits) "That is correct." (When Mack points out that this puts Hill at odds with the conclusions of the Warren Commission) "I recognize that. But the two of us believe that the second shot hit Governor Connally. The other person who said that, Nellie Connally, was sitting right beside him when he was hit. So I think I'm in pretty good company in believing that the second shot hit the Governor and that the third shot was the fatal wound to the President."

(Article by Hill in the New York Times, 11-22-10) "We were traveling through Dallas en route to the Trade Mart, where the president was to give a lunchtime speech, when I heard an explosive noise from my right rear. As I turned toward the sound, I scanned the presidential limousine and saw the president grab at his throat and lurch to the left. I jumped off the running board and ran toward his car. I was so focused on getting to the president and Mrs. Kennedy to provide them cover that I didn’t hear the second shot. I was just feet away when I heard and felt the effects of a third shot. It hit the president in the upper right rear of his head, and blood was everywhere. Once in the back seat, I threw myself on top of the president and first lady so that if another shot came, it would hit me instead." (Interview with Bob Barnard on WTTG, Washington D.C.'s channel Fox 5, and subsequently posted on the website promoting The Kennedy Detail, 11-22-10) "I was scanning the left side of the street in Dealey Plaza, and I heard an explosive noise from my right rear. And so I scanned from my left to my right going toward that noise. When I did so I scanned across the back of the car. What I saw was the president grab at his throat, and lurch to his left. And I knew something was wrong. So I jumped from the car and ran, ran toward the presidential vehicle. Now there was another shot, the second shot, I did not hear that because I was running. Just before I got to the car there was a third shot, and it hit the president in the head, causing an explosion to the upper right of his head, and brain material and blood spattered all about, including on myself. Mrs. Kennedy at that had come out on the trunk. She was apparently trying to retrieve something that had come off the president's head, and had gone to the right rear. She didn't know I was there. And so I grabbed her as best I could and put her into the back seat. And as I did that the president fell to his left onto her lap, with his right side of his head exposed. I could see his eyes, they was fixed, with a hole in his head about the size of my palm above his right ear." (11-22-10 CNN.com report by Dugard McConnell and Brian Todd) "'After the first shot hit the president,' former agent Clint Hill says, "I saw him grab at his throat and lean to his left. So I jumped and ran." Hill is the man seen running toward the limousine in the famous film of the shooting, captured by a bystander named Abraham Zapruder. Hill jumped onto the back of the presidential car, in a desperate attempt to protect the president. "Just before I got to the car, the third shot hit him in the head." Hill says."It was too late." (Unidentified book store appearance captured in Youtube video US Secret Service Agent Clint Hill Recalls Dallas, uploaded 11-24-10) "About 50 feet or 60 feet down Elm Street I heard an explosive noise from my right rear. Now I had been looking to my left over the grassy area. So when I looked back toward that explosive noise my vision took me across the back of the President's car. When I did that I saw the President grab at his throat and go left. And I knew something was wrong. So I jumped from the car and ran to the presidential limousine. I didn't hear another shot. They tell me there was a shot that occurred while I was running. By the time I had just about got to the car--I was a few feet from it--there was another shot. It hit the President in the head above the right ear. It removed a portion of his skull about the size of my palm. And there was blood and brain matter spewing about the entire area, including on myself." (Interview on C-Span program Q & A, 11-28-10) (Hill's comments while watching the Zapruder film) "When the third shot hit--which is right about now--I was just about to get onto the car. And I slipped. Then I regained my step. Then I got up on the car. Mrs. Kennedy at that time was coming out onto the trunk. She was coming out on the trunk to try to retrieve something that came off the President's head that went off to the right rear. She did not know I was there. When I got up on the trunk, I pushed her as best I could back into the rear seat. When I did that, the President fell down into her lap with the right side of his head up, exposed. I could see that his eyes were fixed and that there was a large hole above the right ear--just to the rear--above the right ear, about the size of my palm. That part of the skull was missing and there was brain matter--it looked like somebody'd taken an ice cream scoop and gone in there and removed a whole portion of the brain and thrown it around the back of the car. The back of the car and she were covered in blood and brain."

(BBC 4 audio interview published online, 12-1-10) "Well, we were turning left onto Elm Street in Dallas. And as we progressed down Elm Street I heard a sudden explosive noise from the right rear of the motorcade. And so my vision changed from looking left to looking toward that sound, which took my vision across the back of the presidential vehicle. And when I did that I saw the president grab at his throat and lurch to his left. And I knew something was wrong. And so I jumped from the follow-up car which was immediately behind the presidential vehicle and ran toward the presidential vehicle, attempting to get there to throw my body up on top of the car to form a shield between the president and Mrs. Kennedy and whoever was shooting at them." (When asked how many shots he heard) "I only heard two because while I was running apparently the second shot was fired. The third shot which I heard and felt because I was near the presidential vehicle when that happened hit the president in the head--upper right rear of the right ear--and it spewed blood matter, brain matter, and bone fragments out over the car and myself. And then I was getting up on the back of the car and Mrs. Kennedy was trying to come off out on the trunk of the car to retrieve something that had come off the president's head to the right rear. She did not know I was there. I pushed her back into the seat. And then the president's body fell to its left onto her lap." (When asked if at that time he knew Kennedy was dead) "Well, his right side of his face was up. I could see his eyes were fixed, that there was a hole in his skull above his right ear to the rear about the size of my palm. And I was quite sure that the shot had been fatal." (When asked if he felt the shots had come from the same place) "Yes I believe they all came from an elevated position to our right rear of the motorcade--it turned out to be the Texas School Book Depository--that they were all fired by the same rifle, and that they were all fired by one individual." (Interview in Discovery Channel program The Kennedy Detail, first broadcast 12-2-10) "The driver had to slow the car considerably in order to make the turn. Instead of going the 10-12 miles an hour we had been going he had to cut the speed at least in half. About that time, as I was scanning the left area from Elm Street, there was a large explosive noise to my right rear. I thought it was a fire cracker. My eyes passed over the back of the presidential car. And I saw the President grab at his throat and lurch slightly to his left. And I knew something was wrong. (Moments later in the program) Just before I got to the presidential vehicle I heard another large sound from the right rear. And then I heard the sound of an impact like a bullet hitting something hollow. Now Mrs. Kennedy was out on top of the trunk of the car trying to retrieve something she'd seen come off the President's head. I was trying to get up on the car. The driver all of a sudden accelerated. I grabbed the handle, pulled myself up, grabbed Mrs. Kennedy, put her in the back seat. The President slumped over into her lap. I looked down and realized how severe the President had been hit. Above the right ear, there was an area about the size of the palm of my hand that was gone. The skull was gone. It looked like an ice cream scoop had gone in and removed all the brain in that area. There was brain matter, skull, and blood throughout the entire car...(Later in the interview) On the way to Parkland, I had seen Governor Connally's chest covered in blood. That was the first that I realized that he'd also been shot."

(12-3-10 appearance at Warwick's Bookstore, New York City, posted on Youtube) "We had just started to straighten out the vehicle as as we started down Elm Street toward the Stemmons Freeway. At that point, I was scanning to the left, which was a grassy area. I heard an explosive noise to the right rear of the motorcade to my right ear. My eyes took me to the right rear toward that sound. In so doing, I had to scan across the presidential vehicle. When I did that I saw the President grab at his throat and move to his left, and I knew something was wrong. So I jumped from the follow-up car and I ran toward the presidential vehicle. My intent was to get on top of the presidential vehicle and place myself between the President and Mrs. Kennedy and whoever was shooting at them. I ran, and apparently, in that time I ran there was a second shot. I did not hear it. As I approached the vehicle there was a third shot. It hit the President in the head, upper right rear of the right ear, caused a gaping hole in his head, which caused brain matter, blood, and bone fragments to spew forth out over the car, over myself. At that point Mrs. Kennedy came up out of the back seat onto the trunk of the car. She was trying to retrieve something that had gone off to the right rear. She did not know I was there. At that point I grabbed Mrs. Kennedy, put her in the back seat. The President fell over into her lap, to his left. His right side of his head was exposed. I could see his eyes were fixed. There was a hole in the upper right rear portion of his head about the size of my palm. Most of the gray matter in that area had been removed, and was scattered throughout the entire car, including on Mrs. Kennedy. I turned and gave the follow-up car crew the thumbs-down, indicating that we were in a very dire situation. The driver accelerated; he got up to the lead car which was driven by Chief Curry, the Dallas Chief of Police . . ." (When later asked, by someone claiming to have been given permission to inspect the autopsy photos in 1979, about his description of a wound on the right rear of the head) "Above the right ear. (At this point he touches his head above his right ear and slides his hand back behind his ear) It's hard for me to describe so that people like you can understand it." (He places his hand back on his head and turns his back to the audience. The palm of his hand is above his ear and his fingers stretch to the crown of his head.) "Right in here. That portion of the skull was gone. About the size of this..." (He shows the audience his palm.) "My palm. It was an entry wound from the rear (He points to the EOP area of his skull, where the autopsy doctors claimed the bullet entered.) and it caused the entire area of that skull to lift up." (4-16-11 article by Dan Rozek on the Chicago Sun-Times website, reporting on a 4-16 appearance by Hill at Anderson's Bookshop in Naperville Illinois) "Within seconds of shots being fired at President John F. Kennedy, Secret Service Agent Clint Hill climbed onto the president’s still-moving, convertible limousine and saw Kennedy slumped over with a 'gaping' wound in his head. 'I assumed the wound was fatal. I turned, I gave a thumb’s down to the follow-up car,' Hill said Saturday, as he recounted the traumatic Nov. 22, 1963 assassination in Dallas of the nation’s 35th president." (Later) "Hill described how he jumped off his car and ran toward the presidential limousine, reaching the vehicle just as a bullet struck Kennedy in the head. As soon as he saw Kennedy’s injuries, he realized the president likely was dead. 'I could see that his eyes were fixed, there was a gaping hole in the upper right rear of his head about the size of my palm,' said Hill, struggling to hold his composure."

(4-19-11 article in the Chicago Daily Herald on the 4-16 appearance by Hill at Anderson's Bookshop in Naperville Illinois) "Hill, one of the agents closest to Kennedy when shots were fired, told the assassination story from his point of view. On what was a warm November day in Dallas, windows were open at the high-rises surrounding the streets where the president’s vehicles proceeded to a campaign stop, Hill said. He was scanning a building to his left when he heard an “explosive noise” from his right, which turned out to be the first gunshot fired from a sixth-story window by Lee Harvey Oswald. After the first shot: 'What I saw was the president grabbing at his throat and moving to the left,' Hill said, speaking quickly, as though his words were memorized and well-practiced. 'I knew he was in trouble and something was wrong.' After the second shot: Hill said he tried to 'cover and evacuate,' a Secret Service technique that would have allowed his body to block those of the president and Jackie Kennedy. After the third shot: Hill saw a 'gaping hole' in Kennedy’s head as blood, brains and bone sprayed out from the gunshot wound, covering his clothing as well as Jackie Kennedy’s. 'I assumed the wound was fatal,' Hill said." (10-9-11 article on Hill on the Fargo--Moorehead Inforum) "During the motorcade, Hill was positioned behind Jackie Kennedy on the follow-up car and was scanning people taking photos from a grassy area off to the left. Then he heard an explosive noise over his right shoulder, and his eyes scanned past the presidential vehicle. 'I saw the president grab at his throat and kind of move to his left. I knew something had happened,' Hill said. 'I jumped from the follow-up car and ran toward the presidential vehicle,' he said. 'My attempt was to get on the back of the presidential car and place my body above the president and Mrs. Kennedy so that I would shield them from anything that was a possibility of happening. There was a second shot, apparently, but I didn't hear it because I was running. Then the third shot happened just as I was approaching the presidential vehicle. I slipped, had to regain my steps, got up on the car. The president had been hit in the upper right rear of his head with that third shot. There were blood and brain matter and bone fragments throughout the entire area, including myself. He slumped to his left. Mrs. Kennedy came up from her seat onto the trunk of the car trying to grab some of the material that came off his head. I grabbed her and put her back into her seat. When I did that, the president's body fell into her lap. The right side of his face was up, and I could see his eyes were fixed. There was a hole in the upper right rear of his head. It appeared to me that he was dead.'"

(Mrs. Kennedy and Me, co-written with Lisa McCubbin, published March, 2012) (On p. 290) (On his reaction to the first shot) "We turned left onto Elm Street. It was an unusually sharp turn, and because 100X was no ordinary vehicle, Greer had to slow down considerably. Halfback had similar problems and Kinney maneuvered slowly through the turn. The vehicles straightened out and began to return to our normal parade pace of about ten miles per hour. I was scanning to the left at the grassy area when I heard a sudden explosive noise, over my right shoulder, from the back of the motorcade. I turned my head toward the noise, and as my eyes moved across the president's car, I saw President Kennedy grab at his throat and lurch to his left. I jumped off the running board and ran toward 100X. I wasn't thinking, only reacting. Somebody had fired a shot at the President, and I had to get there. I had to get on the car and get myself between the shooter and the president and Mrs. Kennedy. I was running as fast as I could. Nothing else mattered. I have been told there was a second shot which occurred at this time. I did not hear it. My feet were hitting the pavement; the motorcycle engines were loud in my ears. I'm almost there. Mrs. Kennedy is leaning toward the president. I'm almost there. I was almost there and then I heard the shot. The third shot. The impact was like the sound of something hard hitting something hollow--like the sound of a melon shattering onto cement. In the same instant blood, brain matter and bone fragments exploded from the back of the president's head. The president's blood, parts of his skull, bits of his brain were splattered all over me--on my face, my clothes, in my hair. My legs were still moving. I assumed more shots were coming. I reached for the handhold and grabbed it. Just as I grabbed it the car lurched forward. Bill Greer had stepped on the gas and the car reacted with a jolt. I slipped. I was gripping with all my strength, my feet now back on the pavement. My legs kept moving, as I held on, trying to keep up with the rapidly accelerating car. Somehow--I honestly do not know how--I lunged and pulled my body onto the car, and my foot found the step. In that same instant, Mrs. Kennedy rose up out of her seat and started climbing onto the trunk. What is she doing? What is she doing? The car was accelerating; we were really speeding up. Good God, she's going to go flying off the back of the car! Her eyes were filled with terror. She didn't even know I was there. She was reaching for something. She was reaching for a piece of the president's head. I thrust myself onto the trunk, grabbed her arm, and pushed her back into the seat. When I did this the president's body fell into her lap. As I peered into the backseat of the car, I saw the president's head in her lap. His eyes were fixed, and I could see inside the back of his head... I could see inside the back of the president's head...''My God! They have shot his head off!" Mrs. Kennedy screamed. Blood was everywhere. The floor was covered in blood and brain tissue and skull fragments. ''Get us to a hospital! Get us to a hospital." I screamed at Bill Greer." (Later, on p. 305-306, when discussing the autopsy) ''I took a deep breath, as Kellerman opened the door. Lying on a table, covered with a white sheet, was the body of President Kennedy, only his face was exposed and it looked like he was sleeping. Bill Greer was there and Dr. Burkley and General Godfrey McHugh, the President's Air Force aide. There were additional people I did not recognize. A man in a white coat stood beside the table. I'm sure they told me his name but it didn't register. The man gently lowered the sheet just enough to expose the president's neck, and he began describing the wounds to me. A wound in the front neck area where a tracheotomy had been performed at Parkland Hospital in an effort to revive the president. He said it covered an exit wound. Then, rolling the president gently over to one side, he pointed out a wound in the upper back, at the neckline, quite small. This, he said, was the entry wound that corresponded to the exit wound at the throat. Moving the body back and slightly to the left he pointed out the wound in the upper right rear of the head. I swallowed hard, listening closely, as the doctor explained what had happened. It appeared that the impact of the bullet hitting the president's head was so severe, it caused an explosive reaction within the makeup of the skull and brain, so portions of the brain erupted outward, and a portion of the skull with skin and hair attached became like a flap. The image of what I saw when I was wedged up above the backseat came flashing back into my mind. The head wound was exposed to me and I could see into his brain, part of which had exploded outward. It looked like somebody had flipped open the back of his head, stuck in an ice-cream scoop and removed a portion of the brain, then scattered it all over Mrs. Kennedy, the car, and myself. It was a horrific sight. And I couldn't get it out of my mind. "Yes Doctor," I said ''That is exactly what happened. I know I saw it. I was five feet away from the president when the impact occurred.'' If only I had run faster, reacted a little quicker...The explanation by the doctor and my observation of the body was concluded. I thanked the doctor and returned to the seventeenth floor."

(Interview with Savannah Guthrie broadcast on NBC's Today Show, 4-5-12) "That's the one thing I can't get out of my mind. The picture of him lying on her lap, with his head exposed to me...looking into the back of his head, into his brain, his eyes fixed, blood and brain and bone fragments all over the car, over Mrs. Kennedy, and myself." (On Jackie's climb onto the back of the limo) "There was some material from the President's head that had gone off to the right rear. And she had come up on the back of the car trying to retrieve that material." (4-5-12 interview with Piers Morgan on CNN) (When asked when he realized the President was gonna die) "After I got up on the car, Mrs. Kennedy came up on the trunk to retrieve some material that had gone off to the right rear from the President's wound in his head. I put her back in the seat. When I did that, his body fell into her lap, face up. And I could see that his eyes was fixed. There was a wound in the upper right rear of his head. I could see into his brain. Part of his brain was missing. There was brain matter, and bone fragments, and blood spattered all over the rear of the car, including on myself and Mrs. Kennedy. And I was sure at that time that the shot had been a fatal shot." (On his sense of guilt) "I've always felt a sense of guilt. I was the only agent present who had an opportunity to do anything because of the way everything happened. When the shots came in from the right rear, because I was on the left running board, my vision took me across the back of the President's car. I saw the President grab at his throat and lunge to his left. I knew something was wrong. None of the other agents could do that because when they looked toward the shot they looked away from the President's car. So I was really the only one who had a chance." (When asked if he felt it was Oswald acting alone) "Yes, I have no question but what it was Lee Harvey Oswald. There were three shots. They all came from the sixth floor of the school book depository. And that was it." (4-6-12 interview with Megyn Kelly on Fox News Network) (On what Mrs. Kennedy was doing when he got to the limousine) "She was trying to retrieve some material that came off the president's head, from the wound which he had suffered. The wound was so severe that portions of the bone matter, blood and brain matter were scattered all over the car. And she was trying to retrieve it." (4-6-12 interview on the Opie and Anthony radio show, on satellite radio station Sirius/XM) (On his disputing those claiming the first shot missed) "The first bullet hit him in the middle of the back way up there at the neck line and came out through the throat. The second shot did not hit him. Mrs. Connally was sitting next to her husband. She said the second shot was the shot that hit her husband. That is where the magic bullet theory comes in--which I don't believe in either." (On the first shot) "I wasn't sure exactly what it was. I heard the explosive noise. But when I saw him react, then I realized that something had happened. And I jumped and ran. And while I was running there was a second shot, apparently. I didn't hear it." (On the direction of fire) "From the right rear." (On his climbing onto the limo) "When the President was hit in the head with the third bullet, the explosion was so severe in the head that bone fragments and blood and brain matter erupted from the wound. Some of it came off and went to the right rear, across the trunk of the car. She saw that and she was trying to reach some of that material. And then I grabbed her and I put her in the back seat. And then his body fell into her--his head--in her lap." (On whether he knew it was a fatal wound) "I thought it was as soon as I saw him lying in her lap, because his eyes were fixed. I could actually see into his head from the wound. And I could see a lot of the brain matter was gone." (On the sound of the impact) "A bullet hitting something hard but hollow, something like a melon--similar. And it caused the wound to open up and then it caused a flap. The skin from the exterior of the skull didn't actually come off. Part of it was intact, and so it just kinda made a flap forward." (On conspiracy theorists) "They're very annoying, but I've gotten to the point where I just ignore them, because most of it is so foolish and stupid that it's just not believable to anybody." (He then proceeds to mock the "Greer did it" and "Hickey did it" theories) (On why people believe in a conspiracy) "They can't believe that one person did this." (On his strongest memory) "The picture of the President lying in Mrs. Kennedy's lap, the right side of his face up, the eyes fixed, with a hole in the right rear of his head. And my knowing that he was dead." (On his reaction after first seeing the Zapruder film) "I was really surprised at what I did see, because I had no idea what it looked like." (The year he first saw it) "Sometime in 1964." (4-13-12 article on the 10news.com website, the website of KGTV, presumably reporting on a televised interview) "'I saw the president grab his throat and I knew something was wrong,' he said when describing the shooting. Hill threw his body over the back of the presidential car to form a human shield. 'Mrs. Kennedy had come out of the back of the car and she was trying to retrieve part of the president's head. I put her back in the seat. You could see his eyes were still. There was a hole in his head and his brain was missing,' said Hill."

(5-4-12 interview with Chris Matthews on MSNBC program Hardball) (On what happened after he heard the first shot) "Well, I raced to the car, but just before I got there the third shot was fired. I didn't hear the second shot because I was running. The third shot was fired just as I was approaching the car. It hit the President in the head--upper right rear. And it was a tremendous wound, causing blood and brain matter to come out of the wound over myself and the car. About that time Mrs. Kennedy come up on the trunk of the car. She was trying to retrieve material which came off the President's head--off the right rear. And I got up on the car and pushed her back into the seat. And when I did that the President's body fell over into her lap." (On whether the car was still moving at this time) "The car was continuously moving, and began to accelerate just as I got there." (On whether or not there was a conspiracy) "One shooter, three shots, all from the same rifle." (5-9-12 interview on MyFOXNY) (On his memories) "What I see in my head is what happened that day, and the president lying in Mrs. Kennedy's lap in the back seat of the car with his head blown open and blood and brains all over the back of the car and over myself and everybody else." (On the limousine slow-down) "At the time the shots were fired we weren't going at the normal speed which would have been 10-12 miles per hour. And he gradually started to speed up a little bit. But then he heard the first shot, and he thought one of the tires had blown. And if you watch the Zapruder film real close you'll see that the brake lights come on. He tapped the brake to see if he could get any response from the tires because he thought he'd blown a tire. So he did slow down slightly at that time, but he never stopped, and he kept on going. And then he started to accelerate just before I got there." (On the question of conspiracy) "Three shots, all fired from the same location by the same person, Lee Harvey Oswald." (5-22-12 interview with Dan Rea on WBZ radio, CBS Boston) "When we got to the point on Elm Street below the school book depository, I was scanning over to my left, which is a grassy area. There weren't a lot of people there, but there were some. And at that point I heard an explosive noise from over my right shoulder, to the right rear of the motorcade. And when that happened, I looked toward that noise, and in so doing my eyes passed across the back of the Presidential car. And so I saw what happened. I saw the President grab at his throat, move to his left. I knew he was in trouble. So I jumped and ran." (On the question of conspiracy) "There was only one shooter. There were only three shots. They all came from the same place, the sixth floor of the school book depository. And the shooter was Lee Harvey Oswald."

[Pat Speer]

If it was at the top of the skull, Jackie made a big mistake trying to hold the back of his head on, as she reported to the WC, and Clint Hill confused the back of his head with the top as well, even though he had a good amount of time to see his wounds, just as the Parkland doctors did. No wonder they could not save Kennedy -- they couldn't find the wound on his head, mistakenly thinking it was occipitoparietal, when in reality the top of his skull was missing.

Daniel, you need to put down the CT books you've been reading, and continue your research.

I mean no disrespect, Pat, but I have read your chapters as part of my research. The CT books, at least some of them, have it all over your special pleading. Jackie's words are plain enough that everyone but you seems to think she was holding his head down because the wound was in the right rear. Nothing you posted of Jackie's words admit of any other conclusion. One doesn't hold the top of his head down if the top of his head is missing. Your condescending remark which I put in bold is groundless and only demeans yourself. As a moderator maybe you think you can get away with insults, but in my eyes you damage your own case. An insult is just an admission of defeat -- that you cannot win by a carefully crafted argument. If what you have written really held water, I as a reasonable man would be inclined to agree with you. Your overall mistake in PatSpeer.com is to put faith in the so called evidence. The Parkland and Bethesda description of the wounding cannot be reconciled except by recourse to the loss of the chain of possession of Kennedy's body, for which there is considerable evidence. You are trying to put a round peg in a square hole, and it won't fit no matter how hard you try. The butchering you have done to Jackie's words are a case in point. But this is just one of a long list of examples one might note in this thread. You attempt to obfuscate the clear statements of McClelland by a peculiar interpretation of his words to Dudman; thus you make muddy what is really very clear (and well-corroborated).

When someone disagrees with you it is not due to a lack of research, but due to someone coming to quite a different conclusion than yourself. Maybe it's time for you to admit that.

I'm sorry, Daniel, but your post bears out my comments. Anyone believing that the popular CT twist to Jackie's WC testimony (where she never said anything about the wound being on the back of the head) trumps her statements to Theodore White and William Manchester--where she quite clearly specified that the wound was on the top of the head--needs to quit reading conspiracy books and do some actual research. I don't mean this to be insulting, and I'm sorry if you take it that way.

There are many areas of the investigation where we rely upon the research of others. In my experience, the medical evidence is not an area where you can do this, as so much of what has been written, by LNs and CTs alike, is NONSENSE, of the worst kind. That Jackie claimed the wound was on the back of the head is NONSENSE. Feel free to cite her exact words, if you like.

Edited May 13, 2013 by Pat Speer

[Robert Prudhomme]

Mr. Speer

Mr. Hill's story just gets better and better as time goes by. In his statement of November 30, 1963, Jackie is merely raising out of her seat as if reaching for something that has blown out.

By April 6, 2012, we get this grand embellishment of the same event. "When the President was hit in the head with the third bullet, the explosion was so severe in the head that bone fragments and blood and brain matter erupted from the wound. Some of it came off and went to the right rear, across the trunk of the car. She saw that and she was trying to reach some of that material."

Of course, before you go about defending Mr. Hill's remarks of 2012, think of how hard it would be for matter ejected upwards and forwards from JFK's skull, from a shot from the rear and an exit wound toward the front of the head, to land behind him on the trunk of the limo.

This is why witness testimony from a week or a few months following an event is so much more reliable than testimony from the same person fifteen or forty-nine years after that same event. People age, and their memory suffers for it. Mr. Hill would also be under great pressure, over the years, to accept the official story, perhaps to the point he would begin to doubt his own memory.

I find it very interesting that you describe Mr. Hill's original description of JFK's head wound, in his WC testimony and his original statement of Nov. 30, 1963, to be vague. They are nothing of the sort. He clearly states the wound to be in the right rear, not the right side and near the top as he recalls fifty years later.

The reason I find your reference of Mr. Hill's description as being "vague" interesting is that this seems to be the standard Lone Nut answer whenever Mr. Hill's descriptions of the wound are discussed. I spent a good deal of time on the JFK Assassination Forum, a veritable hotbed of Lone Nuts and insanity, and this was always how Mr. Hill's testimony was described.

Mr. Speer, do Lone Nuts have a handbook they work from? Are there instructions in it to always refer to Mr. Hill's early statement and testimony as "vague" and thereby denigrate what is damaging evidence to the Warren Commission?