Sandy Larsen Posted November 12, 2023 Author Share Posted November 12, 2023 15 hours ago, Douglas Caddy said: Biden has committed one of the biggest geopolitical mistakes in all of history. He has no geopolitical savvy. I don't think so, Doug. https://www.cnn.com/2023/11/08/opinions/opinion-why-biden-supports-israel-so-wholeheartedly/index.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
W. Niederhut Posted November 12, 2023 Share Posted November 12, 2023 (edited) 3 hours ago, Sandy Larsen said: I don't think so, Doug. https://www.cnn.com/2023/11/08/opinions/opinion-why-biden-supports-israel-so-wholeheartedly/index.html Geez, Sandy, talk about pretzel logic and Orwellian Double Speak. With all due respect, this lady's putative defense of Biden green-lighting the bombing of Gaza civilians makes no sense. In fact, it's gibberish. Her first argument is that historic anti-Semitism somehow justifies Israeli war crimes against Palestinians. We could use that "logic" to justify Chivington's Sand Creek Massacre. Her second argument is that Bibi and Biden are upholding "international norms." Huh? Is Netanyahu's relentless bombing of non-combatant civilians-- including women and children-- in Gaza an example of Israel upholding, "the international norms crafted over decades since World War II, norms that allowed the world to make progress in preserving peace and advancing democracy?" Edited November 12, 2023 by W. Niederhut Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Douglas Caddy Posted November 12, 2023 Share Posted November 12, 2023 Not to be missed. Full of new and useful information about our bodies. The Bodily Indignities of the Space Life – DNyuz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Douglas Caddy Posted November 12, 2023 Share Posted November 12, 2023 6 hours ago, Sandy Larsen said: I don't think so, Doug. https://www.cnn.com/2023/11/08/opinions/opinion-why-biden-supports-israel-so-wholeheartedly/index.html My formal education was at the Walsh School of Foreign Service at Georgetown University. I graduated with a B.S degree in International Relations. The education was for someone who wanted to become a foreign service officer in the U.S. Department of State. I was gradated in 1960. Bill Clinton was graduated seven years later. What Biden has done in foreign affairs Is basically contrary to everything that is known to successfully engage in the conduct of foreign policy. The biggest critic of his ability to screw things up is Obama. On domestic policy, Biden is equal to FDR. We have been blessed with what he has accomplished as president in this area. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sandy Larsen Posted November 13, 2023 Author Share Posted November 13, 2023 12 hours ago, W. Niederhut said: Geez, Sandy, talk about pretzel logic and Orwellian Double Speak. With all due respect, this lady's putative defense of Biden green-lighting the bombing of Gaza civilians makes no sense. In fact, it's gibberish. Her first argument is that historic anti-Semitism somehow justifies Israeli war crimes against Palestinians. We could use that "logic" to justify Chivington's Sand Creek Massacre. Her second argument is that Bibi and Biden are upholding "international norms." Huh? Is Netanyahu's relentless bombing of non-combatant civilians-- including women and children-- in Gaza an example of Israel upholding, "the international norms crafted over decades since World War II, norms that allowed the world to make progress in preserving peace and advancing democracy?" Biden's task is a complicated balancing act involving several international factors. With all due respect, your view of the situation is overly simplistic. There is no way that Biden didn't know that embracing Netanyahu would be exceedingly problematic. He had a strategic reason for doing so. P.S. You cherry-picked the article I cited to make it sound like Israel was the writer's (and Biden's) only concern. Good job. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sandy Larsen Posted November 13, 2023 Author Share Posted November 13, 2023 9 hours ago, Douglas Caddy said: My formal education was at the Walsh School of Foreign Service at Georgetown University. I graduated with a B.S degree in International Relations. The education was for someone who wanted to become a foreign service officer in the U.S. Department of State. I was gradated in 1960. Bill Clinton was graduated seven years later. What Biden has done in foreign affairs Is basically contrary to everything that is known to successfully engage in the conduct of foreign policy. 9 hours ago, Douglas Caddy said: The biggest critic of his ability to screw things up is Obama. Citation please. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
W. Niederhut Posted November 13, 2023 Share Posted November 13, 2023 37 minutes ago, Sandy Larsen said: Biden's task is a complicated balancing act involving several international factors. With all due respect, your view of the situation is overly simplistic. There is no way that Biden didn't know that embracing Netanyahu would be exceedingly problematic. He had a strategic reason for doing so. Sandy, Biden's embrace of Netanyahu was an appropriate response to the October 7th Hamas attacks on Israeli citizens. But, as I said from the beginning, Biden and Blinken should have done more to prevent Netanyahu's massive retaliatory bombing of Gaza's 2.3 million civilians. Instead, the Biden administration vetoed the UN resolution calling for a halt to the bombing of Gaza -- while pledging to give Netanyahu even more bombs! Aside from the ethical issue of complicity in war crimes, how is enabling the Gaza bombing strategically sound for the U.S.? On the contrary, it has damaged our fragile alliances with the Islamic world. In consequence, our military bases in Iraq and Syria have been attacked, and a mob tried to burn down the U.S. embassy in Beirut. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sandy Larsen Posted November 13, 2023 Author Share Posted November 13, 2023 10 hours ago, W. Niederhut said: Instead, the Biden administration vetoed the UN resolution calling for a halt to the bombing of Gaza -- while pledging to give Netanyahu even more bombs! William, Because of the way Biden has handled the situation, he has Netanyahu's ear and is able to influence his decisions to some extent. Had his administration voted for the UN resolution to stop the bombing, Biden likely would have lost that ability. And Biden would have nothing to show for it (other than approval from his anti-Netanyahu critics) because Netanyahu would have ignored the resolution. Just like he has no-doubt ignored some of Biden's private advice and requests. Biden is doing what he thinks is best for the long-term stability of the region, not so he can get re-elected. Good for him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sandy Larsen Posted November 13, 2023 Author Share Posted November 13, 2023 20 hours ago, Douglas Caddy said: My formal education was at the Walsh School of Foreign Service at Georgetown University. I graduated with a B.S degree in International Relations. The education was for someone who wanted to become a foreign service officer in the U.S. Department of State. I was gradated in 1960. Bill Clinton was graduated seven years later. What Biden has done in foreign affairs Is basically contrary to everything that is known to successfully engage in the conduct of foreign policy. (I responded to this earlier, but somehow it disappeared.) With all due respect, Doug, you were not taught in your college classes how to handle the complex situation Biden has been handed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
W. Niederhut Posted November 13, 2023 Share Posted November 13, 2023 15 minutes ago, Sandy Larsen said: William, Because of the way Biden has handled the situation, he has Netanyahu's ear and is able to influence his decisions to some extent. Had his administration voted for the UN resolution to stop the bombing, Biden likely would have lost that ability. And Biden would have nothing to show for it (other than approval from his anti-Netanyahu critics) because Netanyahu would have ignored the resolution. Just like he has no-doubt ignored some of Biden's private advice and requests. Biden is doing what he thinks is best for the long-term stability of the region, not so he can get re-elected. Good for him. Sandy, Your argument is predicated on the notion that the UN, the U.S., NATO, and the international community have no power to intervene to stop Netanyahu's war crimes in Gaza-- in the same way that they intervened against Belgrade in Bosnia and Kosovo. In other words, the right-wing Israeli Likud Party tail is wagging the American dog, and American politicians are afraid to cross AIPAC-- the powerful American-Israeli Political Action Committee. This week AIPAC has even announced plans to attack and defeat members of Congress who have dared to criticize Netanyahu. Israel Lobby’s Disastrous Domination (consortiumnews.com) Ariel Sharon once boasted that U.S. politicians would never dare to cross the Israeli government. He was correct. Therein lies the problem. Even Jimmy Carter was attacked as "anti-Semitic" for his low-key efforts to advocate for a fair two-state solution to the Israeli-Palestinian conflict. Reagan, the Bushes, and Obama scarcely tried. Then Trump was bribed to move the U.S. embassy to Jerusalem and recognize Israel's seizure of the Golan Heights. Whatever happened to the historic U.S./UN role in mediating the Israeli-Palestinian conflict? JFK was the last POTUS who tried. Somewhere along the line, U.S. Presidents turned their backs on the Palestinian people-- not for geopolitically sound, "strategic" reasons, as you imagine, but because it was politically expedient, at home. Meanwhile, it looks like some honest State Department officials agree with Douglas Caddy. Internal State Dept. memo blasts Biden, U.S. policy on Israel-Hamas war (axios.com) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Thomas Posted November 13, 2023 Share Posted November 13, 2023 Their existence will be crushed': Trump spokesperson delivers ominous warning to critics By Travis Gettys November 13, 2023 https://www.rawstory.com/donald-trump-vermin/ - Donald Trump - “We pledge to you that we will root out the communists, Marxists, fascists and the radical left thugs that live like vermin within the confines of our country…” “ Numerous historians and other experts were disturbed by Trump language, saying they echoed words used by fascist dictators in the past to stir up violence against their enemies, but a spokesman for the ex-president offered a menacing denial. “Those who try to make that ridiculous assertion are clearly snowflakes grasping for anything because they are suffering from Trump Derangement Syndrome and their entire existence will be crushed when President Trump returns to the White House," Steven Cheung, a Trump campaign spokesman, told the newspaper.” So, are you a Snowflake or a Vermin? Steve Thomas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Douglas Caddy Posted November 13, 2023 Share Posted November 13, 2023 Electricity Use Booms in Texas, a Harbinger for the Country - WSJ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Douglas Caddy Posted November 13, 2023 Share Posted November 13, 2023 12 hours ago, Sandy Larsen said: Citation please. Barack Obama was right to be wary of Joe Biden's ability to 'f--k things up' (nypost.com) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
W. Niederhut Posted November 13, 2023 Share Posted November 13, 2023 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sandy Larsen Posted November 13, 2023 Author Share Posted November 13, 2023 25 minutes ago, W. Niederhut said: Your argument is predicated on the notion that the UN, the U.S., NATO, and the international community have no power to intervene to stop Netanyahu's war crimes in Gaza-- in the same way that they intervened against Belgrade in Bosnia and Kosovo. In other words, the right-wing Israeli Likud Party tail is wagging the American dog, and American politicians are afraid to cross AIPAC-- the powerful American-Israeli Political Action Committee. This week AIPAC has even announced plans to attack and defeat members of Congress who have dared to criticize Netanyahu. Israel Lobby’s Disastrous Domination (consortiumnews.com) Ariel Sharon once boasted that U.S. politicians would never dare to cross the Israeli government. He was correct. Therein lies the problem. Even Jimmy Carter was attacked as "anti-Semitic" for his low-key efforts to advocate for a fair two-state solution to the Israeli-Palestinian conflict. Reagan, the Bushes, and Obama scarcely tried. Then Trump was bribed to move the U.S. embassy to Jerusalem and recognize Israel's seizure of the Golan Heights. Whatever happened to the historic U.S./UN role in mediating the Israeli-Palestinian conflict? JFK was the last POTUS who tried. I don't know if you realize it, but you just gave points in support of what I said. 25 minutes ago, W. Niederhut said: Somewhere along the line, U.S. Presidents turned their backs on the Palestinian people-- not for geopolitically sound, "strategic" reasons, as you imagine, but because it was politically expedient, at home. I never said that U.S. Presidents turned their backs on the Palestinians for strategic reasons. I said that President Biden cozied up the Netanyahu hoping to gain some influence over him, for strategic reason's. I should tell you that I have been a critic of Israel's and the U.S. government's treatment of Palestinians for decades. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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