Nellie Connally Destroys the Single-Bullet Theory

[Sandy Larsen]

1 hour ago, David Von Pein said:

Plus.....Connally, at Z225, is clearly also reacting in different ways to having just been hit by a bullet --- his mouth opens, a discernible grimace comes across his face (IMO), his eyes close, his shoulders jerk upward in a reflex action (a very typical "startle" type of response), and there's also the lapel/tie movement at Z224/225. The clip below ends at Z225....

1 hour ago, David Von Pein said:

 

Connally looks perfectly fine. His shoulder is rising because this is where he begins to lift his hat. Actually, part of that dark area may be part of his hat.

 

[David Von Pein]

1 hour ago, Sandy Larsen said:

Furthermore, it is clear that JFK began reacting before Z225, but Connally didn't. Others in this thread have pointed out that it was concluded in at least one of the official investigations that JFK began reacting before he even went behind the sign. So your contention is inconsistent with the SBT.

The HSCA was wrong. Their ridiculously early Z190 timing for the SBT is....well, as I just said....ridiculous.

If JFK had been hit in the back by a bullet as early as Z190, it is inconceivable that we would see his hands AS LOW as they are in Z224 and Z225....

And, btw, when watching the above Z224-Z225 Z-Film clip a few times in a row, a good argument can be made for Kennedy actually LOWERING his right hand a little bit between those two frames, which only further tends to discredit the HSCA's absurdly early Z190 timeline for the SBT shot.

 

Edited June 10, 2023 by David Von Pein

[David Von Pein]

17 minutes ago, Sandy Larsen said:

Connally looks perfectly fine [in THIS CLIP]. His shoulder is rising because this is where he begins to lift his hat. Actually, part of that dark area may be part of his hat.

Well, Sandy, since you're an anti-SBT conspiracy theorist, naturally I wouldn't expect you to believe that all (or any) of that Connally shoulder-flinching and lapel-bulging and eye-closing and mouth-opening and grimacing and arm-jerking (one frame later at Z226) had anything whatsoever to do with the bullet that even you know did strike Governor Connally's body at just about the exact same time in Dealey Plaza.

All of that "jerky" kind of stuff we see happening with Mr. Connally between Z225 and approx. Z230 is probably just a fantastic coincidence of some kind. But none of those reactions can possibly be related to the bullet that hit him in the back that day. Right, Sandy?

 

Edited June 10, 2023 by David Von Pein

[Sandy Larsen]

37 minutes ago, David Von Pein said:

All of that "jerky" kind of stuff we see happening with Mr. Connally between Z225 and approx. Z230 is probably just a fantastic coincidence of some kind. Right, Sandy?

 

When you cycle back and forth between two frames, it's naturally going to make any movement look jerky.

 

 

[David Von Pein]

44 minutes ago, Sandy Larsen said:

You're the only one who sees all that grimacing, etc. I see a pleasant-looking face and his hand raising his hat as if he wanted to wear it. And yes there is some jerking as he shifts in his seat to return to his normal position.

(Though it appears he changed his mind about the hat, because as you continue observing the frames, the hat comes back down and to his right side, at which time he turns and looks over his right shoulder a second time. This time he is loudly saying something to Kennedy. He returns to his normal position a second time, and is shot around that time. That is the second BANG in his BANG.... BANG, BANG sequence.)

Oh brother!

And the incredible SBT Denial continues unabated!

Congratulations, Sandy, on continuing that rich tradition.

 

(EDIT -- I'm glad I was able to capture the original version of Sandy's last post, before he decided to completely delete/change those comments to something else almost as equally absurd.)

 

Edited June 10, 2023 by David Von Pein

[Gerry Down]

3 hours ago, David Von Pein said:

The HSCA was wrong. Their ridiculously early Z190 timing for the SBT is....well, as I just said....ridiculous.

If JFK had been hit in the back by a bullet as early as Z190, it is inconceivable that we would see his hands AS LOW as they are in Z224 and Z225....

And, btw, when watching the above Z224-Z225 Z-Film clip a few times in a row, a good argument can be made for Kennedy actually LOWERING his right hand a little bit between those two frames, which only further tends to discredit the HSCA's absurdly early Z190 timeline for the SBT shot.

 

Plus it could be argued that JFKs right hand is in a relaxed position at z224 but begins to become a fist in z225. This is the same fist we then see him having in the next few seconds of the Zapruder film as he raises his arms up to shoulder level.

JFKs right hand becomes a fist at the exact same time connallys shoulders noticeably jump upwards.

[Gerry Down]

The disappearance of the shadow below the knuckle line on JFKs right hand at z225 is clear evidence his hand is making a very sharp movement at this time.

[David Von Pein]

21 minutes ago, Gerry Down said:

The disappearance of the shadow below the knuckle line on JFKs right hand at z225 is clear evidence his hand is making a very sharp movement at this time.

Good observation, Gerry. Thank you.

 

[Michael Griffith]

8 hours ago, David Von Pein said:

Plus.....Connally, at Z225, is clearly also reacting in different ways to having just been hit by a bullet --- his mouth opens, a discernible grimace comes across his face (IMO), his eyes close, his shoulders jerk upward in a reflex action (a very typical "startle" type of response), and there's also the lapel/tie movement at Z224/225. The clip below ends at Z225....

Really?! Is it not very odd that Connally himself, the man who actually experienced the wounding, said just the opposite? After carefully studying high-quality blowups of the Zapruder film for Life magazine, he said he was certain he was not hit before he began to turn leftward, which he starts to do no later than Z224. Connally told Life,

          "You can see my leftward movement clearly," Connally told Life as he studied these frames. "I had turned to the right when the limousine was behind the sign. Now I'm turning back again. I know that I made that turn to the left before I was hit. You can see the grimace in the President's face. You cannot see it in mine. There is no question about It. I haven't been hit yet." (LINK)

Connally chose Z234 as the moment of impact, which dovetails perfectly with the dramatic collapse of his shoulder and the puffing of his cheeks starting in Z238.

14 hours ago, Gerry Down said:

Connally could not tell when he was hit. He made a mistake. As far as I know, no one ever confronted him with z224 lapel movement.

Mrs Connally also made a mistake. On Pat Speers website he lists out Nellies testimonies over the years. She said that jfk was hit, then connally started yelling no no, and THEN connally was hit. Yes you read that right, nellie thought connally yelled no no BEFORE he was hit.

More "mistakes"! Oh, this is rich. So Connally, the guy who actually felt the bullet hit him, could not tell when he was hit! Not even after studying high-quality enlargements of the Zapruder film! Well, no one can stop you from making such a silly claim. Again, you will see whatever you need to see, even if it is clearly not there.

The Z224 lapel flip had nothing to do with a shot. It was caused by the wind that was gusting in the plaza. Moreover, the lapel was nowhere near the point where the bullet exited anyway.

The only thing that Nellie Connally was ever unclear about was exactly when she heard her husband yell "no, no, no." In her WC and HSCA testimonies, she was consistent on every other key aspect, especially about the fact that the governor was not hit until after she had turned to look at JFK, saw him grabbing his throat, and saw a blank look on his face. The Zapruder film undeniably confirms her account that her husband was not hit until after JFK had begun to react to his first wound, if a person is willing to admit what is plainly visible.

Again, if Connally was hit at Z224-225, why is his shoulder not slammed downward until Z238? How can he still be holding his hat if his radius bone has been shattered? 

Yes, of course you guys cannot accept the HSCA PEP's finding that JFK starts to react to his first wound in Z200, because that blows the SBT to pieces. Yet, the PEP was clearly and obviously correct, as anyone who studies the Zapruder film can see--again, as long as they are willing to admit what is plainly visible. BTW, the Z186-190 shot matches the timing of Willis 5 perfectly, as the PEP correctly noted. 

The PEP realized that JFK began to bring his hands toward his throat before he went behind the freeway sign. In Z205-206, JFK's right hand is already near and in front of his throat). This is why Jackie suddenly turned her head to the right to look at JFK starting at around Z202, and why she is intently looking at him when she reemerges from behind the freeway sign at Z221.

When JFK reemerges from behind the freeway sign in Z224, his left hand is at the level of his throat. Clearly, he had begun grabbing his throat with both hands before this point. Yet, you guys say that he was not wounded until Z224! No human could whip his left hand up to his throat in fewer than 54 milliseconds (one Z frame equals 54.6 milliseconds).

Edited June 10, 2023 by Michael Griffith

[Gerry Down]

If jfk is reacting to being shot just before he goes behind the sign then it is a very unusual reaction because he moves so slow. No sudden movements. Just a grimace. Kind of like how Clint Eastwood would react to being shot.

[Gerry Down]

Even if you go with the idea of the back wound being a shallow 1 inch wound, imagine someone ramming a steel poker into your back 1 inch. Would you just grimace with no sudden movements? 

[Sandy Larsen]

1 minute ago, Gerry Down said:

If jfk is reacting to being shot just before he goes behind the sign then it is a very unusual reaction because he moves so slow. No sudden movements. Just a grimace. Kind of like how Clint Eastwood would react to being shot.

 

I believe that the autopsists were right when they hypothesized that the reason there was no throat exit wound is because the bullet was one of those blood soluble ones produced the CIA's MK-Ultra program.

If so, the toxin in it would have been a paralytic. I imagine that what we see with JFK is about what we'd see if had been given a paralytic shot.

It fits the known facts rather nicely.

 

[Sandy Larsen]

11 minutes ago, Gerry Down said:

Even if you go with the idea of the back wound being a shallow 1 inch wound, imagine someone ramming a steel poker into your back 1 inch. Would you just grimace with no sudden movements? 

 

I think you would if it was another MK-Ultra water-soluble bullet.

 

[Gerry Down]

2 minutes ago, Sandy Larsen said:

 

I believe that the autopsists were right when they hypothesized that the reason there was no throat exit wound is because the bullet was one of those blood soluble ones produced the CIA's MK-Ultra program.

If so, the toxin in it would have been a paralytic. I imagine that what we see with JFK is about what we'd see if had been given a paralytic shot.

It fits the known facts rather nicely.

 

So he becomes paralyzed at z200 and then his arms jump up at z225.

[David Von Pein]

1 hour ago, Michael Griffith said:

Connally chose Z234 as the moment of impact...

And if John Connally had been able to study this Z-Film clip of Z222-Z225 below (which I know he never was able to do before he died in 1993), what do think his opinion would have been regarding when he was hit?

Edited June 10, 2023 by David Von Pein