For Those Interested - Forgotten - Volume 1

[Gary Murr]

I am [hopefully] attaching, below, a link to the first three parts of volume 1, including their pertinent footnotes, of "Forgotten", my decades plus attempt to not only track but understand the history of the WCC 6.5mm Carcano ammunition said to have been responsible for the assassination of JFK, as well as the wounding of Governor John Connally, Dallas, Texas, November 22, 1963. In total volume 1 currently consists of six individual parts. The first three accessible through the link provided were constructed by myself, in my "spare" time, between 2011 and 2015. In the intervening years, up to and including 2023, I, like many of you, have been allowed access to literally thousands of pages of new documents/research that had been, until their release, unavailable. Additionally, I continued to gather my own research on this subject matter, and continue to do so as I complete volume 2 of this writing. Because of these releases, I did spend some time in 2018 going back over the then "completed" first five parts of volume 1, making corrections and/or additions as they seemed fit. Most of these additions occurred in parts four through the as yet unfinished part six as I still acquire more information relative to volume 1. As the interested reader will see, I owe a gread debt of thanks to the late John Hunt. His generousity in allowing me access to documents and files he had scanned during his numerous visits to NARA only served, and continue to do so, in my attempt to be as historically accurate as possible. 

I have extended the time frame during which this link will be "active" from the previously normal working schedule of five days to one month, meaning the link will no longer work after December 14th of this year. 

In closing all the warts that one may find affixed in this writing, including my various Weisberg-like ramblings, are mine and mine alone.  

LINK:  http://tbf.me/a/BvH0CM  

[Jean Ceulemans]

SUPER !

Thank you very much, I'm printing it right now ! 

[Jean Ceulemans]

Noticed some very interesting information on the investigation right away, I must strongly recommend this to all here

Made a quick print to read (well... not quick, it's a serious volume !), going to make another with better binding.

 

 

Edited November 24, 2023 by Jean Ceulemans

[Gary Murr]

I thank you for your response, Jean... enjoy the read.

[Anthony Thorne]

Thanks Gary, it looks excellent.

[Jean Ceulemans]

Have been reading (it was way too late last night).

It will be very interesting to see how a production of 4 million rounds turns out to be an opportunity later (unless some very good planning was involved...). The guys importing the Italian MC knew the supply of Italian ammo (to go with it) was lvery limited (something like 1.5 bullet / rifle, going by memory here, you mention the correct numbers).   I have learned a lot from this Chapter, on the headstamps, the sale of the MC and ammo, how they avoided mentioning certain names and companies, etccc.

 

[Gary Murr]

I am pleased to see that you are taking the time to read the link I posted yesterday. A lot of the first few chapters is, in my opinion, necessary background important to what was to eventually occur. When I initially mapped an outline on this subject matter I was, obviously, very unaware as to what I would find as the years of research rolled by. And were it not for my eventual discovery and attainment of the surviving records of the OSAAC - Ordance Small Arms Ammunition Center - in St. Louis, the possiblity existed that I would never have found out the reason why the ammunition was produced in the first place and for whom. Though some may feel otherwise, I felt it important that I at least make an effort to understand the experimentation with small arms ammunition that was being pursued in the wake of the ending of WW II. To that end, the role played by Gerald Gustaffson and his search for the "perfect" bullet is important. After all, when the WCC decided to get serious about the capabilities of this specific ammunition they did turn to him and the facilities of the Aberdeen Proving Grounds for their expertise.

FWIW

[Jean Ceulemans]

Don't know about your plans, but please give us a sign when the other parts of volume 1 are ready.  

You have put tons of work in it, so we will be patient (just kidding).

A lot of what you have written is very important on a number of issues, not just JFK

And I think all those who have read the parts so far should be convinced the WCC 6.5mm ammo was not as common as the official version wants us to believe.  I am really curious about the following parts !  

Edited November 17, 2023 by Jean Ceulemans

[Jean Ceulemans]

On 11/16/2023 at 3:02 AM, Gary Murr said:

I am pleased to see that you are taking the time to read the link I posted yesterday. A lot of the first few chapters is, in my opinion, necessary background important to what was to eventually occur. When I initially mapped an outline on this subject matter I was, obviously, very unaware as to what I would find as the years of research rolled by. And were it not for my eventual discovery and attainment of the surviving records of the OSAAC - Ordance Small Arms Ammunition Center - in St. Louis, the possiblity existed that I would never have found out the reason why the ammunition was produced in the first place and for whom. Though some may feel otherwise, I felt it important that I at least make an effort to understand the experimentation with small arms ammunition that was being pursued in the wake of the ending of WW II. To that end, the role played by Gerald Gustaffson and his search for the "perfect" bullet is important. After all, when the WCC decided to get serious about the capabilities of this specific ammunition they did turn to him and the facilities of the Aberdeen Proving Grounds for their expertise.

FWIW

Today I talked about all of this with my Italian friend, saying he was surprised is an understatement !

   

[Jean Ceulemans]

I must re-read a few parts, especially on Footnotes nrs. 36, 37 and 38.   As I understand it FBI 62-109060-1429 is the heavily censored memorandum, and the “unrecorded” copy of this memorandum in the FBI HQ Lee Harvey Oswald Main Office Case file 105-82555.

There is also FBI: 62-109060-488 and -1426.   Strange how material missing from the case file versions is the added note concerning “confidential information” and the USMC, WCC and four million rounds of ammo plus the un-named “Laboratory source” reference regarding the purchase of two million rounds by George Zucker Sales Company"

Had some problems today accessing the archives, so I'm asking it here.    62-109060-1429 is still censored, and never released in full ?   Just asking,but I'm sure you have double checked those matters

Edited November 17, 2023 by Jean Ceulemans

[Gary Murr]

Hi Jean:

Apologies for not responding sooner, but I was away from my files yesterday. In answer to your questions: 62-109060-1429 is not censored. You can find a copy of this file in the Mary Ferrell collection here:  https://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=62268#relPageId=106  

The file mentioned at this point in the manuscript that you were reading that was heavily censored was 62-109060-488.  However, I do seem to recall that I did eventually find an uncensored copy of this file. When I get a chance I will try to locate it for you and send it along your way.

[Gary Murr]

20 hours ago, Jean Ceulemans said:

the un-named “Laboratory source” reference regarding the purchase of two million rounds by George Zucker Sales Company"

And further to this, the un-named laboratory source was Burton Munhall of H. P. White Laboratories. I do go into this in greater detail in a later part of Volume 1, but what I discovered, as a result of documentation from archival files of the WCC, is that Munhall and WCC had exchanged details regarding the 6.5mm WCC carcano ammunition almost two years prior to the assassination event. You will not find copies of these memorandum anywhere but in the WCC files. 

[Jean Ceulemans]

No problem, absolutely no need to apologize.  Thanks for the link,