The significance of the forward moving fragment

[Denise Hazelwood]

I like Dr. Mantik's "occipital" placement of the Harper fragment, especially because the Methodist Hospital pathologists, who photographed and X-rayed the fragment before turning it over to federal authorities, described it as "occipital." His placement of the HF in his reconstruction places the metallic smear exactly at the EOP in-shoot location.

As for the frontal bone fragment, I do not entirely trust it to be authentic. That's not where witnesses placed a blow-out location. Custer had already been asked to fake an X-ray by taping a bullet fragment to it (Mantik's fake 6.5 mm object apparently replaced that.) It's entirely possible that this frontal bone fragment--where did it come from/ It was not X-rayed during the night of the autopsy!) was fraudulent evidence intended to reinforce the notion of a front of the head blow-out. 

[Pat Speer]

1 hour ago, Denise Hazelwood said:

I like Dr. Mantik's "occipital" placement of the Harper fragment, especially because the Methodist Hospital pathologists, who photographed and X-rayed the fragment before turning it over to federal authorities, described it as "occipital." His placement of the HF in his reconstruction places the metallic smear exactly at the EOP in-shoot location.

As for the frontal bone fragment, I do not entirely trust it to be authentic. That's not where witnesses placed a blow-out location. Custer had already been asked to fake an X-ray by taping a bullet fragment to it (Mantik's fake 6.5 mm object apparently replaced that.) It's entirely possible that this frontal bone fragment--where did it come from/ It was not X-rayed during the night of the autopsy!) was fraudulent evidence intended to reinforce the notion of a front of the head blow-out. 

Oh my. 

Let me clarify a few things. First of all, the pathologists who viewed the bone in Dallas did so while under the impression the back of the head was blown out, as that is what had been reported in the papers--an entrance wound in the throat possibly connected to a large wound on the back of the head. They were not forensic anthropologists or neuroanatomists and had no special expertise in anatomy. So they were presented with a bone and asked if it could be from Kennedy and they said "Well, it looks kinda like occipital bone." But it didn't really. The occipital bone in that region is like Colorado (mountainous), and the Harper fragment is more like Kansas (flat). 

As far as the frontal bone fragment--you could not be more wrong. The 10cm fragment/triangular fragment/late arriving fragment are one and the same--the largest fragment retrieved, far larger than the Harper fragment. It was found on the floor of the limousine by Secret Service agent Sam Kinney, and presented to the autopsy doctors at Bethesda, and added back into the skull during reconstruction. Before this was done, moreover, the doctors studied it and came to the conclusion it showed exit beveling, and assumed this meant the large head wound was an exit for the entrance wound they found down by the EOP. (The Harper fragment-which would complicate this scenario--had not yet been discovered). The fragment was not photographed, but it was x-rayed, and the x-rays have been part of the record since the night of the autopsy. This failure to photograph the fragment became a problem, of course. When the HSCA pathology panel realized it would need to be parietal bone to support the single-assassin conclusion, they claimed the x-ray was taken from the opposite side of the bone as their consultant had assumed, and flipped it over from frontal bone to parietal bone. (The great John Hunt proved this to be a hoax.) And this failure to photograph was probably not part of a conspiracy. Several witnesses, including Clint Hill, made note of a large fragment in the car with hair still attached. This would have to have been the triangular fragment. We can suspect then that they felt photographing this hairy piece of bone to be a bit much.

So, no, the fragment did not appear out of nowhere as part of a conspiracy. It was seen by Clint Hill in Dallas, and recovered by Sam Kinney on the plane back from Dallas. And it is presumed to be authentic, and frontal bone, by Mantik, and Livingstone, etc. 

 

Edited March 5 by Pat Speer

[Micah Mileto]

One day I'll post a master list of every purported bone fragment. In the meantime, I have this:

Neither Drs. Humes nor Boswell were experienced in gunshot wounds. Dr. Finck was experienced (Bugliosi, Reclaiming History, 2007, Book One: Matters of Fact: What Happened, Kennedy's Autopsy and the Gunshot Wounds to Kennedy and Connally), but he only arrived at the autopsy AFTER the brain had been removed through the skull (ARRB MD 28, 1/25/1965 and 2/1/1965 Reports From Dr. Finck to Gen. Blumberg; Finck's Shaw trial testimony, 2/24-2/25/1969 [text]; ARRB MD 30, Finck's HSCA testimony, 3/11/1978 [text] [audio]). While the autopsy was in progress, the pathologists were given a portion of skull bone which was reportedly found in the Limousine (HSCA Vol. 7, p. 23, 3/29/1979, Medical Panel Report, Section II. Performance of Autopsy). According to the official autopsy protocol and Humes' testimony, there were three late-arriving skull fragments (WC D 77, p. 4 [text]; WC Vol. 2, p. 347, 3/16/1964 WC testimony [text]). There is an x-ray in the official record showing three skull fragments, one large and two small (HSCA Vol. 7, p. 121). The pathologists said a large skull fragment they received showed external beveling which suggested it was a part of a bullet exit (WC D 77, p. 4, autopsy protocol [text]; WC D 7, p. 280, Sibert and O'Neill FBI report, 11/26/1963; WC Vol. 2, p. 347, Humes WC testimony, 3/16/1964 [text]; WC Vol. 2, p. 377, Finck's WC testimony, 3/16/1964 [text]), as well as dense particles resembling metal (ARRB MD 149, 11/23/1963 FBI teletype from James Sibert and Francis X. O'Neill; WC D 77, p. 4, autopsy protocol [text]; WC D 7, p. 280, Sibert and O'Neill FBI report, 11/26/1963; WC Vol. 2, p. 347, Humes WC testimony, 3/16/1964 [text]). Dr. Humes told the Warren Commission “I would estimate that approximately one-quarter of that defect was unaccounted for by adding these three fragments together and seeing what was left” (WC Vol. 2, p. 347, 3/16/1964 testimony [text]). When the body was being prepared for burial, a type of plaster was used to fill the empty voids in the skull (ARRB MD 65, HSCA report on 8/24/1977 interview with James Curtis Jenkins; ARRB MD 64, HSCA interview of Paul O'Connor, 8/29/1977; O’Connor, 4/20/1990 and 5/9/1990 interviews by Harrison Livingstone, High Treason 2, 1992, p. 256-257, Chapter 12. The Recollections of Paul O’Connor; O’Connor, 6/11/1990 interview by Harrison Livingstone, Killing The Truth, 1993, p. 729, Appendix J, Encyclopedia of Medical Events And Witness Testimony, PREPARING THE BODY FOR BURIAL; Jenkins, 4/6/1991 Dallas conference [video, part 1, 14:17] [video, part 2, 35:33, 57:20]; Joe Hagen, 8/15/1991 interview by Livingstone and Kathlee Fitzgerald, Killing the Truth, 1993, p. 728-729, Appendix J, Encyclopedia of Medical Events And Witness Testimony, PREPARING THE BODY FOR BURIAL; Tom Robinson, 8/17/1991 interview by Harrison Livingstone, High Treason 2, 1992, p. 580-581, Chapter 28. What Really Happened, Who Benefited?; Notes on 5/26/1992 interview with Tom Robinson by Joe West [Link] [link 2] [link 3, Journal News, 12/28/2013]; ARRB MD 182, ARRB report on 5/17/1996 interview with Joseph E. Hagan; Humes ARRB deposition, 2/13/1996 [text]; ARRB MD 180, ARRB report on 6/21/1996 interview with Robinson; Jenkins, A Meeting Of The Minds, Nov. 2017 [video, 49:30]; At the Cold Shoulder Of History by William Law and James Jenkins, 2018 [link]), and a piece of rubber was used to cover the area of missing scalp (ARRB MD 63, HSCA interview of Tom Robinson, 1/12/1977; ARRB MD 64, HSCA interview of Paul O'Connor, 8/29/1977; HSCA Vol. 7, p. 243, HSCA interview with Humes and Boswell, 9/16/1977 [text] [audio]; O’Connor, 4/20/1990 and 5/9/1990 interviews by Harrison Livingstone, High Treason 2, 1992, p. 256-257, Chapter 12. The Recollections of Paul O’Connor; O’Connor, 6/11/1990 interview by Harrison Livingstone, Killing The Truth, 1993, p. 729; 8/17/1991 interview of Robinson by Livingstone, High Treason 2, 1992, p. 580-581, Chapter 28. What Really Happened, Who Benefited?; Notes by Joe West on 5/26/1992 interview with Robinson [link 2] [link 3, Journal News, 12/28/2013]; Humes ARRB deposition, 2/13/1996 [text]; ARRB MD 180, ARRB report on 6/21/1996 interview with Robinson; In The Eye Of History by William Law, 2004, Paul K. O’Connor, James C. Jenkins; Jenkins, A Meeting Of The Minds, Nov. 2017 [video, 49:30]; Jenkins and Law, At the Cold Shoulder Of History, 2018 [link]).

- More bone fragments were either reported but never recovered or recovered but later lost. These fragments could have held valuable evidence. We know of a fragment reportedly found on 11/23/1963 by William Allen “Billy” Harper, lying on the ground in Dealey Plaza. Billy Harper gave the fragment to his uncle, Dr. Jack C. Harper, who then brought it to Methodist Hospital in Dallas. By 11/25/1963, it was examined and photographed along with Dr. A.B. Cairns and M. Wayne Balleter. (HSCA Vol. 7, p. 122, Medical Panel Report, Section V. Report of the Forensic Pathology Panel, Description of President Kennedy's Wounds, Exit (outshoot) wound of the side of the head, 4. "Harper bone fragment" [text]). On 11/26/1963, custody of the Harper fragment was given to James W. Anderton of the Dallas FBI office (WC D 5, p. 150 [scan 2] [scan 3] [scan 4] [scan 5]; FBI 62-109060 JFK HQ File, Section 1, p. 99 [scan 2]). A 11/25/1963 document by Anderton discussed planning to have the Secret Service obtain the fragment, until deciding that the FBI should receive it for examination at their Laboratory in Stafford County, Virginia (FBI 89-43-479 [scan 2]). At the FBI lab, more photographs were taken, as well as x-rays (Into Evidence, presentation by John Hunt). The photos and x-rays still survive in the storage of the National Archives, even if the fragment itself has gone missing (HSCA Vol. 7, 3/29/1979, p. 24, Medical Panel Report, Section III. Chain of Custody of the Materials Acquired During the Autopsy, 2. Physical specimens retained during the autopsy or discovered at the scene of the assassination [text]). Documents from the FBI detail how the fragment was given to Dr. George Burkley, JFK’s former personal physician, on or around 11/27/1963 (FBI 62-109060 JFK HQ File, Section 1, p. 99; FBI 62-109060-438; FBI HQ RN 124-10017-10014; USSS RN 179-10001-10039 [scan 2]; FBI 62-109060-990). Handwriting on the lab work sheet says the fragment was delivered to Dr. Burkley at the White House by "McWright", at "4:30 PM 11/27 by his request" (FBI 62-109060 JFK HQ File, Section 1, p. 100-102 [scan 2] [scan 3]). A 11/27/1963 document from Burkley reads “11/27/63 5:15 p.m. Just received a small Neman Markus box about 2 1/2" x 3 1/2" containing material which had been discussed previously with them. A letter of the full report will be made. This material will be deposited with the Commanding Officer of the Bethesda Naval Hospital for subsequent retention with other material of similar nature. Material was received in the presence of Dr. James M. Young and me. The contact with the FBI was Roy Jevous at Code 175 x 353”. What may be the last word we have on the whereabouts of the fragment is from a HSCA report on a 8/17/1977 interview with Burkley: “Regarding the skull fragments, DR. BURKLEY said the one which was found on the street had been given to the FBI. He said he'd received a letter from the uncle (presumably DR. HARPER) and that the fragment came to him at the White House and he then gave it to the FBI”, “DR. BURKLEY does not recall who he gave the single skull fragment to (associated with the FBI), but remembers having it taken to the FBI” (ARRB MD 19, p. 4-6 [text]). A total discrepancy – the FBI said they gave the fragment to Burkley, and Burkley said he gave it to the FBI. This issue was not pursued in the Committee's medical panel report (HSCA Vol. 7, 3/29/1979, p. 24 [text]).

 

The FBI Lab notes on the Harper fragment claim that no bullet metal was found, but that Spectrochemical Analysis was not performed, which would have proven whether or not metal was present. There is a notation saying "no report to be made" (FBI 62-109060 JFK HQ File, Section 1, p. 100-102 [scan 2]). The lab findings were summarized in FBI documents, saying the fragment was "examined microscopically" for bullet metals but "none were found" (FBI HQ RN 124-10017-10014; WC D 5, p. 151 [scan 2] [scan 3]; FBI 62-109060 JFK HQ File, Section 5, p. 170; USSS RN 179-10001-10039 [scan 2]). There is a lot of information contradicting this. A HSCA report on a 8/9/1977 interview with Dr. A.B. Cairns reads "DR. CAIRNS remembered a small area of the skull fragment showing grayish discoloration suggesting metal had stained the bone. He said he had had experience with lead-caused damage in the past which looked similar to this discoloration" (ARRB MD 19). In 2005, researcher John Hunt pointed out that an x-ray of the Harper fragment shows a small amount of high-density material on it's corner edge (Hunt, Into Evidence). In the same area of that dense material, Dr. David Mantik said the original photos of the Harper fragment show some dark discoloration on the outer surface of the bone (The JFK Autopsy Materials: Twenty Conclusions after Nine Visits; JFK assassination conference evidence presentation, Nov. 2018).

 

There were more possible sightings of lost bone fragments (ARRB MD 54, Burkley receipt, 11/27/1963; HSCA Vol. 7, p. 23, 3/29/1979, Medical Panel Report, Section III. Chain of Custody of the Materials Acquired During the Autopsy, 2. Physical specimens retained during the autopsy discovered at the scene of the assassination [text]; WC D 80, Secret Service report on the Presidential Limousine, 1/6/1964, p. 4; WC Vol. 7, p. 105, WC testimony of Seymour Weitzman, 4/1/1964 [text]; Murder From Within by Fred T. Newcomb and Perry Adams, written 1974 and published 2011, Part II: The Body Snatchers, Chapter Six: Bethesda How Kennedy’s Wounds Were Altered, interview with Harry D. Holmes; No More Silence by Larry A. Sneed, 1998, interviews with Jack Faulkner, Vincent Drain, and Joe Cody).

Edited March 5 by Micah Mileto

[Sandy Larsen]

From everything I've read, the following appears to have taken place with that large fragment found inside the limo:

 

A large fragment of bone was blown out the back of Kennedy's head and onto the grass. A child picked it up, and a Secret Service agent subsequently took it and tossed it onto the back seat of the presidential limousine. (According to motorcycle patrolman Stavis Ellis.) It was witnessed there by a number of Secret Service agents.

The fragment was later seen by SS Agent Sam Kinney while onboard the C-130 cargo plane that returned the limo to Washington. He said it reminded him of a clay pot. Once in Washington, the fragment was taken to the autopsy.

The fragment arrived too late to be put back in place. (Which explains why the embalmer had to insert a rubber dam on the back of the skull. It also explains why Humes always referred to the EOP entrance wound as being "on the margin" of the large hole. Because he had in front of him only half the entrance wound hole. The other half was on the missing "clay pot" like fragment.)

Somehow the FBI ended up with the large, unused fragment.

A coverup artist in the FBI had a bright idea on how to add evidence to support gunshots solely from the rear. A piece of the large fragment was broken off and returned to Dallas, and that smaller fragment re-introduced at the scene of crime in Dealey Plaza. It was dropped onto the grass IN FRONT of where the limousine had been during the head shot.

The plan was for an average citizen to find the fragment and become a star witness to a fragment resulting from a shot from the rear. Unfortunately for the coverup artist, the fragment was found by Billy Harper, a young man with close medical connections. And these connections would unanimously identify the bone as being occipital, thereby causing the scheme to backfire on the coverup artist!

The rest is history.

 

[Denise Hazelwood]

On 3/5/2024 at 4:02 AM, Pat Speer said:

Let me clarify a few things. First of all, the pathologists who viewed the bone in Dallas did so while under the impression the back of the head was blown out, as that is what had been reported in the papers--an entrance wound in the throat possibly connected to a large wound on the back of the head. They were not forensic anthropologists or neuroanatomists and had no special expertise in anatomy. So they were presented with a bone and asked if it could be from Kennedy and they said "Well, it looks kinda like occipital bone." But it didn't really. The occipital bone in that region is like Colorado (mountainous), and the Harper fragment is more like Kansas (flat). 

As far as the frontal bone fragment--you could not be more wrong. The 10cm fragment/triangular fragment/late arriving fragment are one and the same--the largest fragment retrieved, far larger than the Harper fragment. It was found on the floor of the limousine by Secret Service agent Sam Kinney, and presented to the autopsy doctors at Bethesda, and added back into the skull during reconstruction. Before this was done, moreover, the doctors studied it and came to the conclusion it showed exit beveling, and assumed this meant the large head wound was an exit for the entrance wound they found down by the EOP. (The Harper fragment-which would complicate this scenario--had not yet been discovered). The fragment was not photographed, but it was x-rayed, and the x-rays have been part of the record since the night of the autopsy. This failure to photograph the fragment became a problem, of course. When the HSCA pathology panel realized it would need to be parietal bone to support the single-assassin conclusion, they claimed the x-ray was taken from the opposite side of the bone as their consultant had assumed, and flipped it over from frontal bone to parietal bone. (The great John Hunt proved this to be a hoax.) And this failure to photograph was probably not part of a conspiracy. Several witnesses, including Clint Hill, made note of a large fragment in the car with hair still attached. This would have to have been the triangular fragment. We can suspect then that they felt photographing this hairy piece of bone to be a bit much.

Dr. Mantik's reconstruction of the skull is based, in part, on the F8 "Mystery" photograph. Mantik saw this in the Archives and noted "landmarks" more clearly visible I that image than can be see online. The "landmarks" included the "Y" incision and a nipple. These indicated that the hole was at the back of the head. Neurologist Dr. Michael Chesser concurs with Dr. Mantik's placement. Both men note that there is an area of the hole that is "highly suggestive of the Harper Fragment," which again, both men place at the back of the head. Yes, the Parkland doctors reported a BACK of the head blow-out (reiterated in the recently released "What the Doctors Saw"). Surely if they had seen a FRONT of the head blow-out, they would have said so. Nurse Audrey Bell didn't know where any head wound was located until one of the doctors turned the head so she could see the wound in the back. I don't know whether the Methodist Hospital doctors were aware of the Parkland doctors' observations or not, but there are characteristics contained in the fragment itself that suggest it is occipital--arterial ridges and what-not, which Dr. Mantik describes in his book. I trust his and Chesser's analysis of the F8 photo, and I trust the Methodist Hospital doctors, who said "occipital." Surely if it was inconclusive as to where on the skull it came from, they would have said so. The blow-out was at the back of the head, not the front. 

As for the triangular-shaped fragment, Dr. Mantik did identify it as "frontal bone." However, given the evidence of alterations to the Z-film and autopsy X-rays and photographs, brain discrepancies, etc. I think the provenance of the triangular fragment can be questioned. Custer did not X-ray it. I am not questioning that Sam Kinney found a fragment, or that bone fragments were brought in to the autopsy from the limousine. I am questioning whether the triangular frontal bone fragment was among those, or if was falsely attributed to have come from Kennedy. I think it entirely possible that this (obviously frontal bone) fragment was added to the "evidence" to perpetuate the notion of a "front" of the head blow-out. 

I've read the autopsy report multiple times, and I don't recall any mention of a "triangular" fragment identified as "frontal"--just "small fragments brought into the autopsy." 

I would also assume that any skull fragment that was separated from the body would show "exit beveling," as having been ejected from the skull in an outward direction. The question is whether there is indication of a BULLET entrance or exit, and associated beveling. Whether any metallic smear was on the inside or outside of such a hole would be another indicator. The Harper Fragment has a tiny metallic smear on the outside of the bone, indicating an entrance, although no mention was made of beveling on the HF. What was left in the skull indicated an entrance at the EOP location, where the autopsy doctors insisted there was an entrance. The Mantik reconstruction, to which Chesser agreed, puts this metallic smear entrance at the EOP location.

-Denise

[Pat Speer]

58 minutes ago, Denise Hazelwood said:

Dr. Mantik's reconstruction of the skull is based, in part, on the F8 "Mystery" photograph. Mantik saw this in the Archives and noted "landmarks" more clearly visible I that image than can be see online. The "landmarks" included the "Y" incision and a nipple. These indicated that the hole was at the back of the head. Neurologist Dr. Michael Chesser concurs with Dr. Mantik's placement. Both men note that there is an area of the hole that is "highly suggestive of the Harper Fragment," which again, both men place at the back of the head. Yes, the Parkland doctors reported a BACK of the head blow-out (reiterated in the recently released "What the Doctors Saw"). Surely if they had seen a FRONT of the head blow-out, they would have said so. Nurse Audrey Bell didn't know where any head wound was located until one of the doctors turned the head so she could see the wound in the back. I don't know whether the Methodist Hospital doctors were aware of the Parkland doctors' observations or not, but there are characteristics contained in the fragment itself that suggest it is occipital--arterial ridges and what-not, which Dr. Mantik describes in his book. I trust his and Chesser's analysis of the F8 photo, and I trust the Methodist Hospital doctors, who said "occipital." Surely if it was inconclusive as to where on the skull it came from, they would have said so. The blow-out was at the back of the head, not the front. 

As for the triangular-shaped fragment, Dr. Mantik did identify it as "frontal bone." However, given the evidence of alterations to the Z-film and autopsy X-rays and photographs, brain discrepancies, etc. I think the provenance of the triangular fragment can be questioned. Custer did not X-ray it. I am not questioning that Sam Kinney found a fragment, or that bone fragments were brought in to the autopsy from the limousine. I am questioning whether the triangular frontal bone fragment was among those, or if was falsely attributed to have come from Kennedy. I think it entirely possible that this (obviously frontal bone) fragment was added to the "evidence" to perpetuate the notion of a "front" of the head blow-out. 

I've read the autopsy report multiple times, and I don't recall any mention of a "triangular" fragment identified as "frontal"--just "small fragments brought into the autopsy." 

I would also assume that any skull fragment that was separated from the body would show "exit beveling," as having been ejected from the skull in an outward direction. The question is whether there is indication of a BULLET entrance or exit, and associated beveling. Whether any metallic smear was on the inside or outside of such a hole would be another indicator. The Harper Fragment has a tiny metallic smear on the outside of the bone, indicating an entrance, although no mention was made of beveling on the HF. What was left in the skull indicated an entrance at the EOP location, where the autopsy doctors insisted there was an entrance. The Mantik reconstruction, to which Chesser agreed, puts this metallic smear entrance at the EOP location.

-Denise

Yikes. It's not a matter of trusting anyone. I used the drainage hole to prove the proper orientation for the photo 15 years ago. 

 

As far as the large fragment, yikes. It is mentioned in the FBI report. It is mentioned in the autopsy report. And three x-rays were taken of it along with the other two fragments flown back from Dallas. And the man taking these x-rays was...Jerrol Custer. 

As demonstrated ad nauseam, its existence is a huge problem for the single-assassin scenario. So, no, it's extremely doubtful it was added into the record by a mysterious they in order to fool anybody. 

Edited March 7 by Pat Speer

[Sandy Larsen]

35 minutes ago, Pat Speer said:

....[the large skull fragment's] existence is a huge problem for the single-assassin scenario.

 

Not so if one doesn't delve into all the evidence.

The large frontal-bone fragment was removed during the pre-autopsy "surgery" in order for the surgeon-made wound on the top of the head to correspond to the painted-in wound in the Zapruder film.

 

[Pat Speer]

On 3/5/2024 at 2:03 PM, Sandy Larsen said:

From everything I've read, the following appears to have taken place with that large fragment found inside the limo:

 

A large fragment of bone was blown out the back of Kennedy's head and onto the grass. A child picked it up, and a Secret Service agent subsequently took it and tossed it onto the back seat of the presidential limousine. (According to motorcycle patrolman Stavis Ellis.) It was witnessed there by a number of Secret Service agents.

The fragment was later seen by SS Agent Sam Kinney while onboard the C-130 cargo plane that returned the limo to Washington. He said it reminded him of a clay pot. Once in Washington, the fragment was taken to the autopsy.

The fragment arrived too late to be put back in place. (Which explains why the embalmer had to insert a rubber dam on the back of the skull. It also explains why Humes always referred to the EOP entrance wound as being "on the margin" of the large hole. Because he had in front of him only half the entrance wound hole. The other half was on the missing "clay pot" like fragment.)

Somehow the FBI ended up with the large, unused fragment.

A coverup artist in the FBI had a bright idea on how to add evidence to support gunshots solely from the rear. A piece of the large fragment was broken off and returned to Dallas, and that smaller fragment re-introduced at the scene of crime in Dealey Plaza. It was dropped onto the grass IN FRONT of where the limousine had been during the head shot.

The plan was for an average citizen to find the fragment and become a star witness to a fragment resulting from a shot from the rear. Unfortunately for the coverup artist, the fragment was found by Billy Harper, a young man with close medical connections. And these connections would unanimously identify the bone as being occipital, thereby causing the scheme to backfire on the coverup artist!

The rest is history.

 

Wait. What? You're joking, right? 

The large fragment was x-rayed at the autopsy, and put back in the skull. The Harper fragment was found the next day, and gives no appearance of having been broken off from the large fragment. As both the x-rays of the large fragment, and photos of the Harper fragment, show beveling--but not the identical beveling--they depict either two different exits or two parts of one exit.

[Pat Speer]

3 minutes ago, Sandy Larsen said:

 

Not so if one doesn't delve into all the evidence.

The large frontal-bone fragment was removed during the pre-autopsy "surgery" in order for the surgeon-made wound on the top of the head to correspond to the painted-in wound in the Zapruder film.

 

Wait. You're saying they mutilated the president's corpse to fake a photo no one was supposed to see and make it match a film no one was supposed to see, and that they did this within hours of the assassination?

And that Clint Hill--who said he saw a large fragment on the floor of the limo on the road to Parkland...was lying?

And Sam Kinney--who said he found the fragment on the floor of the limo...was lying? 

[Sandy Larsen]

1 minute ago, Pat Speer said:

On 3/5/2024 at 3:03 PM, Sandy Larsen said:

From everything I've read, the following appears to have taken place with that large fragment found inside the limo:

 

A large fragment of bone was blown out the back of Kennedy's head and onto the grass. A child picked it up, and a Secret Service agent subsequently took it and tossed it onto the back seat of the presidential limousine. (According to motorcycle patrolman Stavis Ellis.) It was witnessed there by a number of Secret Service agents.

The fragment was later seen by SS Agent Sam Kinney while onboard the C-130 cargo plane that returned the limo to Washington. He said it reminded him of a clay pot. Once in Washington, the fragment was taken to the autopsy.

The fragment arrived too late to be put back in place. (Which explains why the embalmer had to insert a rubber dam on the back of the skull. It also explains why Humes always referred to the EOP entrance wound as being "on the margin" of the large hole. Because he had in front of him only half the entrance wound hole. The other half was on the missing "clay pot" like fragment.)

Somehow the FBI ended up with the large, unused fragment.

A coverup artist in the FBI had a bright idea on how to add evidence to support gunshots solely from the rear. A piece of the large fragment was broken off and returned to Dallas, and that smaller fragment re-introduced at the scene of crime in Dealey Plaza. It was dropped onto the grass IN FRONT of where the limousine had been during the head shot.

The plan was for an average citizen to find the fragment and become a star witness to a fragment resulting from a shot from the rear. Unfortunately for the coverup artist, the fragment was found by Billy Harper, a young man with close medical connections. And these connections would unanimously identify the bone as being occipital, thereby causing the scheme to backfire on the coverup artist!

The rest is history.

 

Expand  

Wait. What? You're joking, right? 

 

Nope. It makes perfect sense. (If it doesn't, I'd like to know the problem so I can adjust my working hypothesis accordingly.)

 

1 minute ago, Pat Speer said:

The large fragment was x-rayed at the autopsy, and put back in the skull.

 

The large frontal-bone fragment that was x-rayed at the autopsy was never sitting in the limo. It was part of Kennedy's skull till it was removed in pre-sutopsy surgery to create a top-of-head wound roughly matching the one painted on in the Z film.

The fragment I was talking about was the one found in the limo. It looked like a clay pot, according to SS Agent Sam Kinney.

 

1 minute ago, Pat Speer said:

The Harper fragment was found the next day, and gives no appearance of having been broken off from the large fragment.

 

It was broken off from the clay-pot-looking fragment that was found in the limo.

 

[Sandy Larsen]

7 minutes ago, Pat Speer said:

Wait. You're saying they mutilated the president's corpse to fake a photo no one was supposed to see and make it match a film no one was supposed to see, and that they did this within hours of the assassination?

 

They (probably Humes) secretly mutilated the top of Kennedy's head so that the participants of the autopsy would see it and think it was the bullet wound, and also so it would show up in the autopsy photos. Because that is where the gaping wound was supposed to be according to the lone-gunman narrative. (This was all planned before the assassination took place.)

The back-of-head photo was faked later on to eliminate the gaping back-of-head wound.

 

7 minutes ago, Pat Speer said:

And that Clint Hill--who said he saw a large fragment on the floor of the limo on the road to Parkland...was lying?

 

No, Clint Hill and the others didn't lie. They saw the clay-pot looking fragment sitting in the limo. What they didn't see was the frontal-bone, triangular-shaped fragment that you've been talking about. The one removed via pre-autopsy surgery.

 

7 minutes ago, Pat Speer said:

And Sam Kinney--who said he found the fragment on the floor of the limo...was lying?

 

Sam Kinney saw the fragment in the limo, and he picked it up. He said it reminded him of a clay pot. The frontal-bone fragment you've been talking about doesn't look like a clay pot.

 

[Pat Speer]

3 minutes ago, Sandy Larsen said:

 

Nope. It makes perfect sense. (If it doesn't, I'd like to know the problem so I can adjust my working hypothesis accordingly.)

 

 

The large frontal-bone fragment that was x-rayed at the autopsy was never sitting in the limo. It was part of Kennedy's skull till it was removed in pre-sutopsy surgery to create a top-of-head wound roughly matching the one painted on in the Z film.

The fragment I was talking about was the one found in the limo. It looked like a clay pot, according to SS Agent Sam Kinney.

 

 

It was broken off from the clay-pot-looking fragment that was found in the limo.

 

Okay. Let's say "they" did replace the fragment found in the limo with a piece of JFK's frontal bone removed at autopsy. This fragment had both exit beveling and metallic fragments at the site of the beveling. Are you claiming they shot the bone after prying it loose from JFK's skull? Since this area of frontal bone is missing on the x-rays, moreover, and the x-rays show brain still in the skull cavity, your theory holds that they broke this bone from the skull with the brain drill in situ. Does that make sense? 

As far as the other part--where you now have the Harper fragment being broken off from the actual bone fragment found in the limo... The Harper fragment shows exit beveling. So that would mean the fragment found in the limo had exit beveling.  Well, then why break it up? Why not just use the original fragment? I'll give you an out here and offer that IF the large fragment included the low occipital bone, they might want to break that part off so they could pass the remaining part (the Harper fragment) off as parietal bone. But why go to the trouble? The autopsy doctors had already declared the other bone had exit beveling. And besides, the doctors were not even told about the Harper fragment for some fifteen years or so. So who did the faking? And for what audience? 

[Pat Speer]

7 minutes ago, Sandy Larsen said:

 

They (probably Humes) secretly mutilated the top of Kennedy's head so that the participants of the autopsy would see it and think it was the bullet wound, and also so it would show up in the autopsy photos. Because that is where the gaping wound was supposed to be according to the lone-gunman narrative. (This was all planned before the assassination took place.)

The back-of-head photo was faked later on to eliminate the gaping back-of-head wound.

 

 

No, Clint Hill and the others didn't lie. They saw the clay-pot looking fragment sitting in the limo. What they didn't see was the frontal-bone, triangular-shaped fragment that you've been talking about. The one removed via pre-autopsy surgery.

 

 

Sam Kinney saw the fragment in the limo, and he picked it up. He said it reminded him of a clay pot. The frontal-bone fragment you've been talking about doesn't look like a clay pot.

 

Clay pot = porcelain. White bone looks like porcelain. 

[Sandy Larsen]

17 minutes ago, Pat Speer said:

Clay pot = porcelain. White bone looks like porcelain. 

 

If he was referring to the color, why did he say "clay pot." Neither "clay" nor "pot" is white.

I'd say he had in mind the general shape, plus the smooth surface.

Clay pots:

 

[Keven Hofeling]

On 3/5/2024 at 3:03 PM, Sandy Larsen said:

From everything I've read, the following appears to have taken place with that large fragment found inside the limo:

 

A large fragment of bone was blown out the back of Kennedy's head and onto the grass. A child picked it up, and a Secret Service agent subsequently took it and tossed it onto the back seat of the presidential limousine. (According to motorcycle patrolman Stavis Ellis.) It was witnessed there by a number of Secret Service agents.

The fragment was later seen by SS Agent Sam Kinney while onboard the C-130 cargo plane that returned the limo to Washington. He said it reminded him of a clay pot. Once in Washington, the fragment was taken to the autopsy.

The fragment arrived too late to be put back in place. (Which explains why the embalmer had to insert a rubber dam on the back of the skull. It also explains why Humes always referred to the EOP entrance wound as being "on the margin" of the large hole. Because he had in front of him only half the entrance wound hole. The other half was on the missing "clay pot" like fragment.)

Somehow the FBI ended up with the large, unused fragment.

A coverup artist in the FBI had a bright idea on how to add evidence to support gunshots solely from the rear. A piece of the large fragment was broken off and returned to Dallas, and that smaller fragment re-introduced at the scene of crime in Dealey Plaza. It was dropped onto the grass IN FRONT of where the limousine had been during the head shot.

The plan was for an average citizen to find the fragment and become a star witness to a fragment resulting from a shot from the rear. Unfortunately for the coverup artist, the fragment was found by Billy Harper, a young man with close medical connections. And these connections would unanimously identify the bone as being occipital, thereby causing the scheme to backfire on the coverup artist!

The rest is history.

 

I think your analysis brings together some important missing parts of the puzzle Sandy, and you incorporate into it an important piece of forbidden knowledge about a large skull fragment that was confiscated from a child (possibly Charles Brehm's son) by a Secret Service Agent and placed back in the limo while it was either in the process of a rolling stop or at a full stop on Elm Street (the stop that has been completely excised from the extant Zapruder film).

You may recall that when I posted some of Larry Rivera's work concerning this important testimony of DPD supervising motorcycle patrolman Stavis Ellis earlier in this thread (See https://educationforum.ipbhost.com/topic/30206-the-significance-of-the-forward-moving-fragment/?do=findComment&comment=530074) within a few short moments I received the following shaming response from Pat Speer:

"You may as well have said the tooth fairy put the fragment in the limo. Or, even better, that it was teleported into the limo by Scotty under orders from Mr. Spock."   https://educationforum.ipbhost.com/topic/30206-the-significance-of-the-forward-moving-fragment/?do=findComment&comment=530076

Translation: "We will make every effort to humiliate you each time you attempt to present forbidden knowledge of this variety into the discussion."

Whenever I get such a response from establishment proxies, I react to it as a prompt to do a deep dive into the forbidden knowledge at issue, and when I did so in this case it resulted in quite an interesting journey.

Contrary to Speer's implied conclusion that serious researchers are not interested in this, I found the following references to it in Dr. David Mantik's most recent book

Linked to the excerpt were two 2014 podcast interviews of researcher Larry Rivera entitled "The JFK Horsemen":

Part 1: https://youtu.be/jlMwxZPNpTM?si=PvVCm5p-KIy5WTC1

Part 2: https://youtu.be/DP7YvelagHA?si=D-VY8mSJHUwm7IwB

 

The segment from the podcasts most relevant to the subject at hand (and which included the actual audio of the statements of Stavis Ellis) is the following eight minute excerpt:

 

Larry Rivera lays out a proposed scenario much like the one set forth by you in the post to which this is a response, and I thought it might be of interest to you.

 

Edited March 11 by Keven Hofeling