William Greer and JFK

[Barry Keane]

Al

Your article can be actually found in the March 2003 issue which can be read online on The Mary Ferrell Foundation's website http://www.maryferrell.org

All back issues of the Dealey Plaza Echo (up to March 2006) can be viewed as well.

Barry Keane

Secretary

Dealey Plaza UK

[Paul Rigby]

If there was a conspiracy -- and I think we're all beyond that point -- would the power behind this crime take the chance on all their plans being foiled by one alert Secret Service man doing his job?

After a couple of rounds are squeezed off, Greer turns to see JFK wounded and puts a foot on the gas and gets the hell out of Dealey Plaza, and Kennedy survives to return to Washington and his brother, the Attorney General. What happens then to those that plotted this crime?

I can see the plotters gathered around Parkland when they learn Kennedy is alive. "Oops. We forgot about the driver."

Would the conspirators really have taken that chance?

To me, it defies logic.

Excellent post, the proposition that the plotters overlooked the role of the SS is fantastic!

Best wishes,

Paul

[Thomas H. Purvis]

Seymour Weitzman played a key role more than once on November 22, 1963. Not only was he one of the two officers who found a rifle on the 6th floor (both of them signing sworn affidavits that it was a German Mauser), he encountered the aforementioned SS agent, and also found a piece of skull, which apparently belonged to JFK. I have always wondered why he wasn't interviewed in the years following the assassination. We do know that he had some kind of mental problems later, and was institutionalized. You can still access online (sorry, don't have the url) the HSCA report on him, as well as a long interview with a psychiatrist who treated him. According to these reports, Weitzman talked often about all the people who had died that had connections to the assassination, and definitely believed there was a conspiracy.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

According to the best witness(IMO) on the 6th floor after the shooting, Weitzman wasn't even there. Tom Alyea of WFAA has always been critical of the DPD's handling of evidence that afternoon, but he was there when the rifle was found, and it was not a Mauser. IMO Weitzman's affidavit was made after he heard all the speculation that took place, ie, "looks like a Mauser". Many researchers have also accredited Weitzman with being a firearms expert, although he simply worked in a sporting goods store for awhile. He actually spent years in the ladies garment business, which was where his expertise was.

If the second officer is Roger Craig, he changed his story so often he cannot be considered a credible witness regarding the rifle. During an interview with the LA Free Press in 1968, Penn Jones(who was with Craig) had to keep correcting him because he made so many misstatements. And Craig was never close enough to the rifle(by his own admission) to read MAUSER stamped on the rifle.

I suggest if anyone is interested, do a search on Tom Alyea. A good starting point would be Allan Eaglesham's excellent site:

www.manuscriptservice.com

RJS

looks like a Mauser

Actually! The Italian Mannlicher Carcano was referred to as the "Italian Mauser".

Just as were many other variations of the rifle as manufactured and utilized by numerous other countries in which the weapon was either referred to as a "Mauser Type" weapon, or even specifically by name such as "Argentine Mauser"; "Belgium Mauser"; "German Mauser", all of which utilized a version of the "Mannlicher Clip" system.

The "Mauser" name refers primarily to the bolt design, in which the Mauser Family, under US Patent# 78603 developed and produced the first successful military bolt action rifle.

The patent was granted for the "Norris-Mauser" design, with Mr. Norris being the Samuel Norris of Springfield, Mass who was at the time the Remington representative in Europe.

This "bolt action" was later defined/modified to include the rearward extraction capability of the bolt as well as the forward locking mechanism of the bolt.

Later, the Germans copied much of the "Mauser" bolt design and produced the first "Mauser" repeating rifle. (Infanteriegewher M 71/84) which carried the additional cartridges in a tube/chamber located under the length of the barrell, similar to the Swiss Vetelli and even the American Winchester repeating rifle.

Von Mannlicher, developer of the "Mannlicher Clip" system of feeding rounds to the chamber of the rifle, was actually an Austrian firearms designer.

In 1885, his clip fed design was incorporated into the first of the Austrian clilp fed weapons.

This design required that the clip be ejected out the top of the magazine, not unlike the later US M-1 Garand Rifle which in reality utilizes the "Mannlicher Clip" design as well.

Later modifications to this design lead to the "Mannlicher Clip" system of the later version German as well as Italian versions of the design.

The Italian Mannlicher Carcano Rifle:

1. It utilized the Mannlicher clip system which for all practical purposes was identical to the system utilized by/in all later date "Mauser" type rifles in which the clip ejected out the bottom of the weapon after chambering/ejection of the last round.

2. It utilized the "Mauser" type modified bolt which contained the integral firing pin which automatically "cocked" the weapon upon ejection of the round/operation of the bolt, as well as the later developed forward locking lugs on the bolt and the ability to fully extract the bolt out the rear of the weapon.

3. It is also known as the : "Mauser Paravicino"!

Lastly;

Unless extremely experienced in the literally dozens of various "Mauser"/Mannlicher clip fed design weapons, in some instances, it would be almost impossible to immediately identify one of these weapons

from 5 to 10 feet away from the rifle, as they are so near being identical in design.

And, one IS NOT incorrect if they refer to the Itallian Mannlicher Carcano rifle as being a "Mauser".

[Thomas H. Purvis]

Several witnesses said that Greer stopped the car after the first shot was fired. This included Jean Hill, who was the closest witness to the car when Kennedy was hot: According to Hill "the motorcade came to almost a halt at the time the shots rang out". James Chaney (one of the four Presidential motorcyclists) - stated that the limousine "after the shooting, from the time the first shot rang out, the car stopped completely, pulled to the left and stopped." Mary Woodward, a journalist with the Dallas Morning News wrote: "Instead of speeding up the car, the car came to a halt... after the first shot". (John Simkin)

Something I have never been able to understand is if you watch the Zapruder film, the limo continues with momentum through the attack. I remember reading somewhere that the vehicle speed was approximately 11 MPH. So, how does Clint Hill manage to jump off the following vehicle and actually catch the limo in such a short space if the limo didn't slow considerably which the Z film doesn't show?

Close examination of the film shows that Hill was at the back of the limo at approximately the time of the head shot. So, if he reacts to the first shot of which no one else seems to have, he has about 6 seconds to leap off the vehicle and to sprint toward the limo which hasn't appeared to have considerably slowed.

For me, that doesn't quite add up. Am I missing something?

Below is the article by Mary Woodward.

James

Something I have never been able to understand is if you watch the Zapruder film, the limo continues with momentum through the attack. I remember reading somewhere that the vehicle speed was approximately 11 MPH. So, how does Clint Hill manage to jump off the following vehicle and actually catch the limo in such a short space if the limo didn't slow considerably which the Z film doesn't show?

Since you have asked the salient question, it would certainly be to your advantage to find the answer.

Close examination of the film shows that Hill was at the back of the limo at approximately the time of the head shot. So, if he reacts to the first shot of which no one else seems to have, he has about 6 seconds to leap off the vehicle and to sprint toward the limo which hasn't appeared to have considerably slowed.

For me, that doesn't quite add up. Am I missing something?

The "Running Man"/"Jumping Man" has yet to reveal all of his secrets.

Below is the article by Mary Woodward.

Which by the way, tells of the President "Slumping in the car", and after which, "This was followed rapidly by another shot"

One of the very first steps that should have been taken in a real investigation of the assassination of JFK would have been the intense grilling of each Secret Service agent in the presidential contingent. They should have been asked the hard questions about total lack of reaction, the late night drinking the night before, and the undeniable fact that LBJ's Secret Service contingent was not confused at all, reacting instantly and keeping their man out of the line of fire.

It's true that it's easy to be a Monday morning quarterback and second-guess the response of these agents, in an undeniably stressful and fast-paced series of events. However, that was their job, and they had all been well-trained for it. Presumably, they had all been told that when shots are fired, there is very little time to react, and that they must be prepared to protect the president instantly. I can understand one, or two, or even three agents being lethargic and not reacting at all to the sound of gunfire, but for every agent there to stare into space, or actually slow the car down in the case of Greer, without running towards JFK to push him down out of the line of fire, is completely unbelievable to me. In terms of conspiracy, the most obvious participants, IMHO, were the Secret Service agents assigned to protect JFK.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Several witnesses said that Greer stopped the car after the first shot was fired. This included Jean Hill, who was the closest witness to the car when Kennedy was hot: According to Hill "the motorcade came to almost a halt at the time the shots rang out". James Chaney (one of the four Presidential motorcyclists) - stated that the limousine "after the shooting, from the time the first shot rang out, the car stopped completely, pulled to the left and stopped." Mary Woodward, a journalist with the Dallas Morning News wrote: "Instead of speeding up the car, the car came to a halt... after the first shot".

Kenneth O'Donnell (special assistant to Kennedy), who was riding in the motorcade, later wrote: "If the Secret Service men in the front had reacted quicker to the first two shots at the President's car, if the driver had stepped on the gas before instead of after the fatal third shot was fired, would President Kennedy be alive today? He added "Greer had been remorseful all day, feeling that he could have saved President Kennedy's life by swerving the car or speeding suddenly after the first shots."

William Manchester claims that Greer told Jackie Kennedy at Parkland Hospital: "Oh, Mrs. Kennedy, oh my God, oh my God. I didn't mean to do it, I didn't hear, I should have swerved the car, I couldn't help it. Oh, Mrs. Kennedy, as soon as I saw it I swerved. If only I'd seen it in time!"

Senator Ralph Yarborough, who was riding with Lyndon B. Johnson, was highly critical of the actions of Greer: "When the noise of the shot was heard, the motorcade slowed to what seemed to me a complete stop... After the third shot was fired, but only after the third shot was fired, the cavalcade speeded up, gained speed rapidly, and roared away to the Parkland Hospital... The cars all stopped... 'I don't want to hurt anyone's feelings but for the protection of future Presidents, they (the Secret Service) should be trained to take off when a shot is fired."

It has been estimated that 59 witnesses and the Zapruder Film indicated that Greer stopped after the first shot was fired. However, when interviewed by the Warren Commission, Greer claimed: "I heard this noise. And I thought that is what it was. And then I heard it again. And I glanced over my shoulder. And I saw Governor Connally like he was starting to fall. Then I realized there was something wrong. I tramped on the accelerator, and at the same time Mr. Kellerman said to me, "Get out of here fast." And I cannot remember even the other shots or noises that was. I cannot quite remember any more. I did not see anything happen behind me any more, because I was occupied with getting away."

Greer's testimony on Kennedy's head wound did suggest that a conspiracy had taken place. He claimed that when he got to Parkland Hospital he noticed Kennedy's "head was all shot, this whole part was all a matter of blood... it looked like that (his head) was all blown off." This contradicts the pictures of Kennedy's head that were published sometime after his death.

There is evidence that Greer also believed that John F. Kennedy had been a victim of a conspiracy. The daughter of Roy Kellerman, the Secret Agent in Kennedy's car, told Harold Weisberg in the 1970's that "I hope the day will come when these men (Kellerman and Greer) will be able to say what they've told their families".

William Greer died on 23rd February, 1985. His son, Richard Greer, was interviewed in 1991. When asked, "What did your father think of JFK," Richard did not respond the first time. When asked a second time, he responded: "Well, we're Methodists... and JFK was Catholic..."

This is what Michael L. Kurtz (Crime of the Century: The Kennedy Assassination From a Historians Perspective) had to say about the behaviour of Kellerman and Greer.

The Zapruder and other films and photographs of the assassination clearly reveal the utter lack of response by Secret Service agents Roy Kellerman and James Greer, who were in the front seat of the presidential limousine. After the first two shots, Greer actually slowed the vehicle to less than five miles an hour. Kellerman merely sat in the front seat, seemingly oblivious to the shooting. In contrast, Secret Service Agent Rufus Youngblood responded instantly to the first shot, and before the head shots were fired, had covered Vice-President Lyndon Johnson with his body.

Trained to react instantaneously, as in the attempted assassinations of President Gerald Ford by Lynette Fromme and Sara Jane Moore and of President Ronald Reagan by John Warnock Hinckley, the Secret Service agents assigned to protect President Kennedy simply neglected their duty. The reason for their neglect remains one of the more intriguing mysteries of the assassination.

Senator Ralph Yarborough, who was riding with Lyndon B. Johnson, was highly critical of the actions of Greer: "When the noise of the shot was heard, the motorcade slowed to what seemed to me a complete stop... After the third shot was fired, but only after the third shot was fired, the cavalcade speeded up, gained speed rapidly, and roared away to the Parkland Hospital...

Just may assist in resolution of the "Running Man" scenario. Not to mention attempting to resolve issues such as:

1. How fast could Clint Hill run?

2. How fast did Clint Hill have to run?

3. How high could Clint Hill Jump?

4. How many times did Clint Hill Jump?

5. Exactly why is it that the Z-film depicts virtually no reduced speed for the Presidential Limousine?

[Peter McGuire]

Several witnesses said that Greer stopped the car after the first shot was fired. This included Jean Hill, who was the closest witness to the car when Kennedy was hot: According to Hill "the motorcade came to almost a halt at the time the shots rang out". James Chaney (one of the four Presidential motorcyclists) - stated that the limousine "after the shooting, from the time the first shot rang out, the car stopped completely, pulled to the left and stopped." Mary Woodward, a journalist with the Dallas Morning News wrote: "Instead of speeding up the car, the car came to a halt... after the first shot". (John Simkin)

Something I have never been able to understand is if you watch the Zapruder film, the limo continues with momentum through the attack. I remember reading somewhere that the vehicle speed was approximately 11 MPH. So, how does Clint Hill manage to jump off the following vehicle and actually catch the limo in such a short space if the limo didn't slow considerably which the Z film doesn't show?

Close examination of the film shows that Hill was at the back of the limo at approximately the time of the head shot.

So, if he reacts to the first shot of which no one else seems to have, he has about 6 seconds to leap off the vehicle and to sprint toward the limo which hasn't appeared to have considerably slowed.

For me, that doesn't quite add up. Am I missing something?

Below is the article by Mary Woodward.

James

Something I have never been able to understand is if you watch the Zapruder film, the limo continues with momentum through the attack. I remember reading somewhere that the vehicle speed was approximately 11 MPH. So, how does Clint Hill manage to jump off the following vehicle and actually catch the limo in such a short space if the limo didn't slow considerably which the Z film doesn't show?

Since you have asked the salient question, it would certainly be to your advantage to find the answer.

Close examination of the film shows that Hill was at the back of the limo at approximately the time of the head shot. So, if he reacts to the first shot of which no one else seems to have, he has about 6 seconds to leap off the vehicle and to sprint toward the limo which hasn't appeared to have considerably slowed.

For me, that doesn't quite add up. Am I missing something?

The "Running Man"/"Jumping Man" has yet to reveal all of his secrets.

Below is the article by Mary Woodward.

Which by the way, tells of the President "Slumping in the car", and after which, "This was followed rapidly by another shot"

One of the very first steps that should have been taken in a real investigation of the assassination of JFK would have been the intense grilling of each Secret Service agent in the presidential contingent. They should have been asked the hard questions about total lack of reaction, the late night drinking the night before, and the undeniable fact that LBJ's Secret Service contingent was not confused at all, reacting instantly and keeping their man out of the line of fire.

It's true that it's easy to be a Monday morning quarterback and second-guess the response of these agents, in an undeniably stressful and fast-paced series of events. However, that was their job, and they had all been well-trained for it. Presumably, they had all been told that when shots are fired, there is very little time to react, and that they must be prepared to protect the president instantly. I can understand one, or two, or even three agents being lethargic and not reacting at all to the sound of gunfire, but for every agent there to stare into space, or actually slow the car down in the case of Greer, without running towards JFK to push him down out of the line of fire, is completely unbelievable to me. In terms of conspiracy, the most obvious participants, IMHO, were the Secret Service agents assigned to protect JFK.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Several witnesses said that Greer stopped the car after the first shot was fired. This included Jean Hill, who was the closest witness to the car when Kennedy was hot: According to Hill "the motorcade came to almost a halt at the time the shots rang out". James Chaney (one of the four Presidential motorcyclists) - stated that the limousine "after the shooting, from the time the first shot rang out, the car stopped completely, pulled to the left and stopped." Mary Woodward, a journalist with the Dallas Morning News wrote: "Instead of speeding up the car, the car came to a halt... after the first shot".

Kenneth O'Donnell (special assistant to Kennedy), who was riding in the motorcade, later wrote: "If the Secret Service men in the front had reacted quicker to the first two shots at the President's car, if the driver had stepped on the gas before instead of after the fatal third shot was fired, would President Kennedy be alive today? He added "Greer had been remorseful all day, feeling that he could have saved President Kennedy's life by swerving the car or speeding suddenly after the first shots."

William Manchester claims that Greer told Jackie Kennedy at Parkland Hospital: "Oh, Mrs. Kennedy, oh my God, oh my God. I didn't mean to do it, I didn't hear, I should have swerved the car, I couldn't help it. Oh, Mrs. Kennedy, as soon as I saw it I swerved. If only I'd seen it in time!"

Senator Ralph Yarborough, who was riding with Lyndon B. Johnson, was highly critical of the actions of Greer: "When the noise of the shot was heard, the motorcade slowed to what seemed to me a complete stop... After the third shot was fired, but only after the third shot was fired, the cavalcade speeded up, gained speed rapidly, and roared away to the Parkland Hospital... The cars all stopped... 'I don't want to hurt anyone's feelings but for the protection of future Presidents, they (the Secret Service) should be trained to take off when a shot is fired."

It has been estimated that 59 witnesses and the Zapruder Film indicated that Greer stopped after the first shot was fired. However, when interviewed by the Warren Commission, Greer claimed: "I heard this noise. And I thought that is what it was. And then I heard it again. And I glanced over my shoulder. And I saw Governor Connally like he was starting to fall. Then I realized there was something wrong. I tramped on the accelerator, and at the same time Mr. Kellerman said to me, "Get out of here fast." And I cannot remember even the other shots or noises that was. I cannot quite remember any more. I did not see anything happen behind me any more, because I was occupied with getting away."

Greer's testimony on Kennedy's head wound did suggest that a conspiracy had taken place. He claimed that when he got to Parkland Hospital he noticed Kennedy's "head was all shot, this whole part was all a matter of blood... it looked like that (his head) was all blown off." This contradicts the pictures of Kennedy's head that were published sometime after his death.

There is evidence that Greer also believed that John F. Kennedy had been a victim of a conspiracy. The daughter of Roy Kellerman, the Secret Agent in Kennedy's car, told Harold Weisberg in the 1970's that "I hope the day will come when these men (Kellerman and Greer) will be able to say what they've told their families".

William Greer died on 23rd February, 1985. His son, Richard Greer, was interviewed in 1991. When asked, "What did your father think of JFK," Richard did not respond the first time. When asked a second time, he responded: "Well, we're Methodists... and JFK was Catholic..."

This is what Michael L. Kurtz (Crime of the Century: The Kennedy Assassination From a Historians Perspective) had to say about the behaviour of Kellerman and Greer.

The Zapruder and other films and photographs of the assassination clearly reveal the utter lack of response by Secret Service agents Roy Kellerman and James Greer, who were in the front seat of the presidential limousine. After the first two shots, Greer actually slowed the vehicle to less than five miles an hour. Kellerman merely sat in the front seat, seemingly oblivious to the shooting. In contrast, Secret Service Agent Rufus Youngblood responded instantly to the first shot, and before the head shots were fired, had covered Vice-President Lyndon Johnson with his body.

Trained to react instantaneously, as in the attempted assassinations of President Gerald Ford by Lynette Fromme and Sara Jane Moore and of President Ronald Reagan by John Warnock Hinckley, the Secret Service agents assigned to protect President Kennedy simply neglected their duty.

The reason for their neglect remains one of the more intriguing mysteries of the assassination.

The reason for their very existance is to protect the President. "Intriguing" is an understatement

Senator Ralph Yarborough, who was riding with Lyndon B. Johnson, was highly critical of the actions of Greer: "When the noise of the shot was heard, the motorcade slowed to what seemed to me a complete stop... After the third shot was fired, but only after the third shot was fired, the cavalcade speeded up, gained speed rapidly, and roared away to the Parkland Hospital...

Just may assist in resolution of the "Running Man" scenario. Not to mention attempting to resolve issues such as:

1. How fast could Clint Hill run?

2. How fast did Clint Hill have to run?

3. How high could Clint Hill Jump?

4. How many times did Clint Hill Jump?

5. Exactly why is it that the Z-film depicts virtually no reduced speed for the Presidential Limousine?

Hill and or Kellerman COULD have got to Kennedy if that is what they were supposed to do that day.

[Thomas H. Purvis]

Several witnesses said that Greer stopped the car after the first shot was fired. This included Jean Hill, who was the closest witness to the car when Kennedy was hot: According to Hill "the motorcade came to almost a halt at the time the shots rang out". James Chaney (one of the four Presidential motorcyclists) - stated that the limousine "after the shooting, from the time the first shot rang out, the car stopped completely, pulled to the left and stopped." Mary Woodward, a journalist with the Dallas Morning News wrote: "Instead of speeding up the car, the car came to a halt... after the first shot". (John Simkin)

Something I have never been able to understand is if you watch the Zapruder film, the limo continues with momentum through the attack. I remember reading somewhere that the vehicle speed was approximately 11 MPH. So, how does Clint Hill manage to jump off the following vehicle and actually catch the limo in such a short space if the limo didn't slow considerably which the Z film doesn't show?

Close examination of the film shows that Hill was at the back of the limo at approximately the time of the head shot.

So, if he reacts to the first shot of which no one else seems to have, he has about 6 seconds to leap off the vehicle and to sprint toward the limo which hasn't appeared to have considerably slowed.

For me, that doesn't quite add up. Am I missing something?

Below is the article by Mary Woodward.

James

Something I have never been able to understand is if you watch the Zapruder film, the limo continues with momentum through the attack. I remember reading somewhere that the vehicle speed was approximately 11 MPH. So, how does Clint Hill manage to jump off the following vehicle and actually catch the limo in such a short space if the limo didn't slow considerably which the Z film doesn't show?

Since you have asked the salient question, it would certainly be to your advantage to find the answer.

Close examination of the film shows that Hill was at the back of the limo at approximately the time of the head shot. So, if he reacts to the first shot of which no one else seems to have, he has about 6 seconds to leap off the vehicle and to sprint toward the limo which hasn't appeared to have considerably slowed.

For me, that doesn't quite add up. Am I missing something?

The "Running Man"/"Jumping Man" has yet to reveal all of his secrets.

Below is the article by Mary Woodward.

Which by the way, tells of the President "Slumping in the car", and after which, "This was followed rapidly by another shot"

One of the very first steps that should have been taken in a real investigation of the assassination of JFK would have been the intense grilling of each Secret Service agent in the presidential contingent. They should have been asked the hard questions about total lack of reaction, the late night drinking the night before, and the undeniable fact that LBJ's Secret Service contingent was not confused at all, reacting instantly and keeping their man out of the line of fire.

It's true that it's easy to be a Monday morning quarterback and second-guess the response of these agents, in an undeniably stressful and fast-paced series of events. However, that was their job, and they had all been well-trained for it. Presumably, they had all been told that when shots are fired, there is very little time to react, and that they must be prepared to protect the president instantly. I can understand one, or two, or even three agents being lethargic and not reacting at all to the sound of gunfire, but for every agent there to stare into space, or actually slow the car down in the case of Greer, without running towards JFK to push him down out of the line of fire, is completely unbelievable to me. In terms of conspiracy, the most obvious participants, IMHO, were the Secret Service agents assigned to protect JFK.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Several witnesses said that Greer stopped the car after the first shot was fired. This included Jean Hill, who was the closest witness to the car when Kennedy was hot: According to Hill "the motorcade came to almost a halt at the time the shots rang out". James Chaney (one of the four Presidential motorcyclists) - stated that the limousine "after the shooting, from the time the first shot rang out, the car stopped completely, pulled to the left and stopped." Mary Woodward, a journalist with the Dallas Morning News wrote: "Instead of speeding up the car, the car came to a halt... after the first shot".

Kenneth O'Donnell (special assistant to Kennedy), who was riding in the motorcade, later wrote: "If the Secret Service men in the front had reacted quicker to the first two shots at the President's car, if the driver had stepped on the gas before instead of after the fatal third shot was fired, would President Kennedy be alive today? He added "Greer had been remorseful all day, feeling that he could have saved President Kennedy's life by swerving the car or speeding suddenly after the first shots."

William Manchester claims that Greer told Jackie Kennedy at Parkland Hospital: "Oh, Mrs. Kennedy, oh my God, oh my God. I didn't mean to do it, I didn't hear, I should have swerved the car, I couldn't help it. Oh, Mrs. Kennedy, as soon as I saw it I swerved. If only I'd seen it in time!"

Senator Ralph Yarborough, who was riding with Lyndon B. Johnson, was highly critical of the actions of Greer: "When the noise of the shot was heard, the motorcade slowed to what seemed to me a complete stop... After the third shot was fired, but only after the third shot was fired, the cavalcade speeded up, gained speed rapidly, and roared away to the Parkland Hospital... The cars all stopped... 'I don't want to hurt anyone's feelings but for the protection of future Presidents, they (the Secret Service) should be trained to take off when a shot is fired."

It has been estimated that 59 witnesses and the Zapruder Film indicated that Greer stopped after the first shot was fired. However, when interviewed by the Warren Commission, Greer claimed: "I heard this noise. And I thought that is what it was. And then I heard it again. And I glanced over my shoulder. And I saw Governor Connally like he was starting to fall. Then I realized there was something wrong. I tramped on the accelerator, and at the same time Mr. Kellerman said to me, "Get out of here fast." And I cannot remember even the other shots or noises that was. I cannot quite remember any more. I did not see anything happen behind me any more, because I was occupied with getting away."

Greer's testimony on Kennedy's head wound did suggest that a conspiracy had taken place. He claimed that when he got to Parkland Hospital he noticed Kennedy's "head was all shot, this whole part was all a matter of blood... it looked like that (his head) was all blown off." This contradicts the pictures of Kennedy's head that were published sometime after his death.

There is evidence that Greer also believed that John F. Kennedy had been a victim of a conspiracy. The daughter of Roy Kellerman, the Secret Agent in Kennedy's car, told Harold Weisberg in the 1970's that "I hope the day will come when these men (Kellerman and Greer) will be able to say what they've told their families".

William Greer died on 23rd February, 1985. His son, Richard Greer, was interviewed in 1991. When asked, "What did your father think of JFK," Richard did not respond the first time. When asked a second time, he responded: "Well, we're Methodists... and JFK was Catholic..."

This is what Michael L. Kurtz (Crime of the Century: The Kennedy Assassination From a Historians Perspective) had to say about the behaviour of Kellerman and Greer.

The Zapruder and other films and photographs of the assassination clearly reveal the utter lack of response by Secret Service agents Roy Kellerman and James Greer, who were in the front seat of the presidential limousine. After the first two shots, Greer actually slowed the vehicle to less than five miles an hour. Kellerman merely sat in the front seat, seemingly oblivious to the shooting. In contrast, Secret Service Agent Rufus Youngblood responded instantly to the first shot, and before the head shots were fired, had covered Vice-President Lyndon Johnson with his body.

Trained to react instantaneously, as in the attempted assassinations of President Gerald Ford by Lynette Fromme and Sara Jane Moore and of President Ronald Reagan by John Warnock Hinckley, the Secret Service agents assigned to protect President Kennedy simply neglected their duty.

The reason for their neglect remains one of the more intriguing mysteries of the assassination.

The reason for their very existance is to protect the President. "Intriguing" is an understatement

Senator Ralph Yarborough, who was riding with Lyndon B. Johnson, was highly critical of the actions of Greer: "When the noise of the shot was heard, the motorcade slowed to what seemed to me a complete stop... After the third shot was fired, but only after the third shot was fired, the cavalcade speeded up, gained speed rapidly, and roared away to the Parkland Hospital...

Just may assist in resolution of the "Running Man" scenario. Not to mention attempting to resolve issues such as:

1. How fast could Clint Hill run?

2. How fast did Clint Hill have to run?

3. How high could Clint Hill Jump?

4. How many times did Clint Hill Jump?

5. Exactly why is it that the Z-film depicts virtually no reduced speed for the Presidential Limousine?

Hill and or Kellerman COULD have got to Kennedy if that is what they were supposed to do that day.

Hill and or Kellerman SHOULD have got to Kennedy, however, Hill was assigned to Jackie, thus we must look at who else SHOULD have been able to get to JFK after the first show which was not a mortal wound.

Therein lies much of the reason for the SS being willing to be kept quite, as well as cooperating with the Arlen Specter "fairy tale".

Of course, there was someone "much closer" to JFK who immediately recognized that shots were being fired!

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so I turned to look back over my right shoulder, and I saw nothing unusual except just people in the crowd, but I did not catch the President in the corner of my eye, and I was interested, because once I heard the shot in my own mind I identified it as a rifle shot, and I immediately--the only thought that crossed my mind was that this is an assassination attempt.

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That AIN'T what he said in an interview at Parkland Hospital!

Tom

P.S. If it looks like a "Duck"!

[Chuck Robbins]

Just may assist in resolution of the "Running Man" scenario. Not to mention attempting to resolve issues such as:

1. How fast could Clint Hill run?

2. How fast did Clint Hill have to run?

3. How high could Clint Hill Jump?

4. How many times did Clint Hill Jump?

5. Exactly why is it that the Z-film depicts virtually no reduced speed for the Presidential Limousine?

Fastest human running speed is 23 mph. Rounded off that is 2 times the speed attributed to the limo.

Hill might have been capable of running at 15 mph...? That's 22 ft. per second.

Is the distance the limo traveled, from the time Hill left his car, until he caught he limo known? 11 mph = 16 ft. per second.

Limo traveled known distance, Hill traveled same distance + distance separating his position on queen mary from limo.

My math skills have gone the way of the dodo. I would not be able to give a reliable result.

A link to a conversion webpage is provided for anyone who has the data.

http://www.projects.ex.ac.uk/trol/scol/ccspeed.htm

Chuck

Edited August 21, 2006 by Chuck Robbins

[Thomas H. Purvis]

Since we have traversed back to vehicle speed, etc; and there are most definitely and definitively some enlightened persons reviewing this forum, hopefully for the last time I am providing some of that information which was discovered back in the 1989/1990 period and written up.

And although JFK Lancer was allowed a "one-time" publishing of this information, I now find that it has been also included in the Mary Ferrell sight as well.

Which I do consider as noteworthy.

[Thomas H. Purvis]

Since we have traversed back to vehicle speed, etc; and there are most definitely and definitively some enlightened persons reviewing this forum, hopefully for the last time I am providing some of that information which was discovered back in the 1989/1990 period and written up.

And although JFK Lancer was allowed a "one-time" publishing of this information, I now find that it has been also included in the Mary Ferrell sight as well.

Which I do consider as noteworthy.

[Thomas H. Purvis]

Since we have traversed back to vehicle speed, etc; and there are most definitely and definitively some enlightened persons reviewing this forum, hopefully for the last time I am providing some of that information which was discovered back in the 1989/1990 period and written up.

And although JFK Lancer was allowed a "one-time" publishing of this information, I now find that it has been also included in the Mary Ferrell sight as well.

Which I do consider as noteworthy.

Since we have traversed back to vehicle speed, etc; and there are most definitely and definitively some enlightened persons reviewing this forum, hopefully for the last time I am providing some of that information which was discovered back in the 1989/1990 period and written up.

And although JFK Lancer was allowed a "one-time" publishing of this information, I now find that it has been also included in the Mary Ferrell sight as well.

Which I do consider as noteworthy.

[Thomas H. Purvis]

Since we have traversed back to vehicle speed, etc; and there are most definitely and definitively some enlightened persons reviewing this forum, hopefully for the last time I am providing some of that information which was discovered back in the 1989/1990 period and written up.

And although JFK Lancer was allowed a "one-time" publishing of this information, I now find that it has been also included in the Mary Ferrell sight as well.

Which I do consider as noteworthy.

In continuation, one must look at the "slicky boy" methods of the now illustrious Senator from PA.