John Simkin Posted June 28, 2005 Share Posted June 28, 2005 Article in today's Guardian by Jamie Wilson: http://www.guardian.co.uk/international/st...1516184,00.html As an actor he had a sidekick called Bonzo. And as politician, he never quite lived down his quip to start bombing Russia in five minutes. But in life Ronald Reagan was forgiven most of his faults, and in death America now regards him as the greatest of them all. Edging out Abraham Lincoln, the man who abolished slavery and guided the country through civil war, Reagan, the B-movie star whose presidency is commonly regarded as having brought down the Soviet bloc, won the popular vote to be crowned the greatest American ever. While assassinated civil rights leader Martin Luther King Jr came third, just ahead of George Washington, the country's first president and the man considered father of the nation, some of the most notable names in US history - the Nobel prize-winning scientist Albert Einstein; the inventors of the aeroplane, Orville and Wilbur Wright; and the first man to walk on the moon, Neil Armstrong - did not make it into the top 10. However, George Bush and his predecessor, Bill Clinton, secured sixth and seventh places respectively, while the talk show host Oprah Winfrey can claim the title of greatest American woman after taking ninth spot, just behind Elvis Presley. Reagan, who died last year after a battle with Alzheimer's disease, is often derided in Europe as a cowboy and intellectual lightweight. Testing his microphone moments before a 1984 radio address, he joked: "My fellow Americans, I'm pleased to tell you today that I've signed legislation that will outlaw Russia forever. We begin bombing in five minutes." But his two terms as president heralded an era of unprecedented economic growth and restored pride to a nation still reeling from the Vietnam war. His son, Ron Jr, hinted that his father's recent death may have helped swing the vote. He told the Discovery Channel: "People remember the funeral ... I'm sure he would be very honoured to be in the company of these great gentlemen." The American public cast more than 2.4m votes by phone, text or email in the poll, organised by the Discovery Channel and AOL. Voters' top 20 1 Ronald Reagan 2 Abraham Lincoln 3 Martin Luther King Jr 4 George Washington 5 Benjamin Franklin 6 George W Bush 7 Bill Clinton 8 Elvis Presley 9 Oprah Winfrey 10 Franklin D Roosevelt 11 Billy Graham 12 Thomas Jefferson 13 Walt Disney 14 Albert Einstein 15 Thomas Alva Edison 16 John F Kennedy 17 Bob Hope 18 Bill Gates 19 Eleanor Roosevelt 20 Lance Armstrong Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim Gratz Posted June 29, 2005 Share Posted June 29, 2005 (edited) Bravo to most of the list! I would probably rank Martin Luther King, Jr. a little bit lower down (below George Washington to be sure) and I would also rank some of the abolitionists and radical Republicans. And I certainly thging Dwight David Eisenhower belongs in the list rather than some of the entertainment figures. Then again where would Florida be without Walt Disney? Edited June 29, 2005 by Tim Gratz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pat Speer Posted June 29, 2005 Share Posted June 29, 2005 I must confess I actually voted in this stupid poll. I was troubled by the options, however. Virtually every character had some flaw which ruled out my voting for them. I couldn't allow myself to vote for a slave-owner, for example. I consider Reagan pretty much a joke. Men like King, Kennedy, and Clinton, while worthy of respect, were not true to their marriage vows. People like Oprah, Bill Gates and Bob Hope were too materialistic. Einstein wasn't truly an American. Ultimately I decided that the person I could stand behind was one who, while flawed, seemed to have a sense of humor about himself. I voted for Ben Franklin. Although he made decisions that resulted in the deaths of hundreds of thousands, my second choice would probably go to Lincoln Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raymond Blair Posted June 29, 2005 Share Posted June 29, 2005 I think we can chalk the modern ones off as being part of a partisan battle. Clinton and Bush don't belong on the list and I personally can't see the merit of Reagan in being on the list. 1st place is an obviously skewed result. Not voting on the list because the person has flaws?? Well, Jesus, Buddha, Moses, and Mohammad weren't citizens. I would place George Washington in the first spot. Sure he had flaws, but he had the powers to make or break or neuter this nation. He chose the difficult route and made it. Ben Franklin is the quintessential American because he was the Enlightenment figure in the wilderness. His faults and qualities have become distinctly American. Martin Luther King, Jr. should be up high on this list. He stood on the side of right for the entirety of his country even when detesting certain segments of the society was a more natural reaction. Abraham Lincoln may have been involved in a war. He may have had a slow start as the chief executive officer. But without Lincoln the United States may very well have Balkanized. Greatest religious leader? . . . . . Roger Williams Greatest female American? Susan B. Anthony Labor Leader? Cesar Chavez or Samuel Gompers Greatest celebrity? Babe Ruth Others worthy of merit on this list IMHO are Thomas Jefferson, Alexander Hamilton, and Thomas Edison. FDR qualifies and perhaps even Eleanor too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Simkin Posted June 29, 2005 Author Share Posted June 29, 2005 My own choice would have been Martin Luther King. Some great Americans that would have been in my list include (in no particular order). They all have something in common. They were aware of social injustice and spent their lives trying to do something about it. Jane Addams http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/USAaddams.htm Lincoln Steffens http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/Jsteffens.htm Ida Wells http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/FWWwells.htm John P. Altgeld http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/USAaltgeld.htm Eugene V. Debs http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/USAdebs.htm Thaddeus Stevens http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/USASstevens.htm Margaret Sanger http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/Jsanger.htm Robert La Follette http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/USAlafollette.htm Prudence Crandall http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/USAScrandall.htm Ralph Waldo Emerson http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/USAemerson.htm Ida Tarbell http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/Jtarbell.htm Samuel Milton Jones http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/USAjonesS.htm Harriet Tubman http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/USAStubman.htm Walt Whitman http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/USASwhitman.htm Abraham Muste http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/USAmuste.htm Mary White Ovington http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/USASovington.htm Bayard Rustin http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/USArustin.htm Philip Randolph http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/USArandolph.htm Eleanor Roosevelt http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/USArooseveltE.htm Clarence Darrow http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/USAdarrow.htm Vito Marcantonio http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/USAvito.htm Bill Mauldin http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/ARTmauldin.htm Emanuel Celler http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/USAceller.htm Charles Sumner http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/USASsumner.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Juan Carlos Posted June 29, 2005 Share Posted June 29, 2005 This sort of lists are a crazy thing. If I had to think of a 20 top Spaniards or Europeans list, I would probably give up. I wonder why Franklin and Washington are in the list and Thomas Jefferson is not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pat Speer Posted July 1, 2005 Share Posted July 1, 2005 This sort of lists are a crazy thing. If I had to think of a 20 top Spaniards or Europeans list, I would probably give up. I wonder why Franklin and Washington are in the list and Thomas Jefferson is not. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Jefferson has lost a lot of his popularity due to the recent acknowledgement that he created a family with one of his slaves, who, even worse, was his dead wife's half-sister. This combination of exploitation/miscegenation/sexual obsession on his behalf has tarnished his legacy, in the eyes of most Americans. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Stephen Turner Posted July 1, 2005 Share Posted July 1, 2005 No Zimmerman, Brian Wilson,Louis Armstrong, Charlie Parker. Mark Twain? But as a mere Brit I go for Capt James T Kirk.Warrior, Philosopher, & general can do sort of guy.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Toliver Posted July 1, 2005 Share Posted July 1, 2005 My list might look something like this: 1). Abraham Lincoln 2). Thomas Jefferson (sorry, Pat, I don't agree. Otherwise, how would Bill Clinton wind up on the list?) 3). Martin Luther King, Jr. 4). The suffregettes (Margaret Sanger, et al) 5). Georgia O'Keefe 6) Jackson Pollock 7). Malcolm X 8). Mark Twain 9). Kurt Vonnegut 10). Albert Einstein (ok, naturalized American...) In my opinion, celebrities and sports figures don't belong on such a list. I might make an exception for Charlie Chaplin. I can't think of a single sports figure who deserves such listing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek McMillan Posted July 1, 2005 Share Posted July 1, 2005 Rosa Parks. The woman who sat down on a bus and started a revolution. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Jones Posted July 5, 2005 Share Posted July 5, 2005 Wither Tom Paine in any such list? Especially as he could qualify as English/American/French. Even America is rediscovering her own roots!! The Lost Founder : Thomas Paine My apologies to this excellent site for thinking it was associated with religion.....mea culpa. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Stapleton Posted July 7, 2005 Share Posted July 7, 2005 No Zimmerman, Brian Wilson,Louis Armstrong, Charlie Parker. Mark Twain?But as a mere Brit I go for Capt James T Kirk.Warrior, Philosopher, & general can do sort of guy.... <{POST_SNAPBACK}> And Bill Shatner should have recieved an Oscar/Emmy for services to hambone acting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Simkin Posted July 7, 2005 Author Share Posted July 7, 2005 Wither Tom Paine in any such list? Especially as he could qualify as English/American/French. Even America is rediscovering her own roots!! There has been a suggestion this week that Trafalgar Square should change its name to Tom Paine Square. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adam Wilkinson Posted August 6, 2005 Share Posted August 6, 2005 George W Bush at 9? what a joke, what has he ever done to earn that spot? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James Richards Posted October 24, 2005 Share Posted October 24, 2005 I would have thought that Edison deserved to rank higher than 15. Anyway, as to the greatest American, one could not go past Forest Gump. James Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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