LHO's Markmanship Ability

[Thomas H. Purvis]

http://www.audiblox2000.com/dyslexia_dysle...dyslexia005.htm

To be able to study at the Swiss Polytechnic (the later ETH) in Zurich also without A-levels, Albert Einstein had to take a college entrance exam in October 1895. His performance in physics and mathematics was excellent. The performances in some of the other tested areas however were not sufficient. Albert Einstein did not pass the exam!

[John Dolva]

LHO military weapons record

(image for above quote on past page post 60)

_______________

just a bit more on the pipes:

Hopefully the top image here is clear. It seems that sitting the shoulder could not be high enough. On the left knee perhaps. Then the pipes would make leaning over the boxes a problem, which in turn makes Brennans testimony a problem. Perhaps the lower two rest boxes are more as Beers photographed them?

Edited November 28, 2006 by John Dolva

[Thomas H. Purvis]

One cannot,yet most do, ignore the pipes. They clearly define available space.

The only diagram where Alan includes the pipes is the one on the right. The pipes are incorrectly placed. He has the bottom rest box standing an inch or so into the correct pipe place. I think he is almost right so the bottom box is up against the pipe.

The diagram on the left is, I think, correct. See Oswald there scaled to match and the overhead crated from this. This is Oswald sitting upright on the corner of the seat box.

In the right diagram:

Move your shooter more forward, left elbow on first tier of boxes approximately mid point, just in from left edge of top box.

Left knee on floor directly under body, right knee 45-degree angle across right corner of boxes, foot on floor, knee bent 90-degrees.

This should afford you the best position in which one would want to utilize the boxes and attempt to shoot from this position and location.

[John Dolva]

Can't use the right one beacuse I think it's wrong. But I presume you mean something like this?

[Thomas H. Purvis]

Can't use the right one beacuse I think it's wrong. But I presume you mean something like this?

Leaning forward, left elbow on boxes approximately mid-way, with upward turned palm of left hand holding rifle and located at approximately leading edge of first tier of boxes.

Also:

http://www.usmcweapons.com/articles/m16/m1...entm16qual.html

Gives a little better understanding of the 5 firing stations which constitutes the basic Rangefire Qualification.

[Thomas H. Purvis]

Can't use the right one beacuse I think it's wrong. But I presume you mean something like this?

Leaning forward, left elbow on boxes approximately mid-way, with upward turned palm of left hand holding rifle and located at approximately leading edge of first tier of boxes.

Also:

http://www.usmcweapons.com/articles/m16/m1...entm16qual.html

Gives a little better understanding of the 5 firing stations which constitutes the basic Rangefire Qualification.

"The Unites States Marine Corps is the only branch of the military in the world which requires qualification with the rifle at 500 yards."

[Antti Hynonen]

Thomas H. Purvis Posted Dec 8 2006, 02:40 AM

QUOTE(Thomas H. Purvis @ Nov 28 2006, 10:09 PM)

QUOTE(John Dolva @ Nov 28 2006, 09:43 PM)

Can't use the right one beacuse I think it's wrong. But I presume you mean something like this?

Leaning forward, left elbow on boxes approximately mid-way, with upward turned palm of left hand holding rifle and located at approximately leading edge of first tier of boxes.

Also:

http://www.usmcweapons.com/articles/m16/m1...entm16qual.html

Gives a little better understanding of the 5 firing stations which constitutes the basic Rangefire Qualification.

"The Unites States Marine Corps is the only branch of the military in the world which requires qualification with the rifle at 500 yards."

Seems like 68 yards would be enough to amaze most folks. Right?

[Thomas H. Purvis]

Thomas H. Purvis Posted Dec 8 2006, 02:40 AM

QUOTE(Thomas H. Purvis @ Nov 28 2006, 10:09 PM)

QUOTE(John Dolva @ Nov 28 2006, 09:43 PM)

Can't use the right one beacuse I think it's wrong. But I presume you mean something like this?

Leaning forward, left elbow on boxes approximately mid-way, with upward turned palm of left hand holding rifle and located at approximately leading edge of first tier of boxes.

Also:

http://www.usmcweapons.com/articles/m16/m1...entm16qual.html

Gives a little better understanding of the 5 firing stations which constitutes the basic Rangefire Qualification.

"The Unites States Marine Corps is the only branch of the military in the world which requires qualification with the rifle at 500 yards."

Seems like 68 yards would be enough to amaze most folks. Right?

Not too likely that any of LHO's shooting ability as exhibited during rangefire qualification or in Dealy Plaza would have either amazed or impressed these six-year old to 14-year old kids who went deer hunting last week down here in the south.

[Thomas H. Purvis]

Digging out some old information and compiling it.

Just in case anyone here is actually interested in facts.

LHO Rifle Qualification:

http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/russ/testimony/anderson.htm

The following day on record day, he fires over the course 50 rounds for his qualification score record. At this time the coach may give him any assistance possible as long as he is behind the firing line. Once he steps onto the firing line. assumes the firing position, then he is completely on his own. He cannot be helped by any gestures or comments or in any way given any assistance from anyone whatsoever. He completes this firing and the score that he attains then becomes his qualification score.

[u]Firing Station Score Percentile Rating Rating[/u]

200 yard Slow Fire/Standing/Off-hand 39 out of 50 78 Marksman

200 yard Rapid Fire/Sitting 48 out of 50 96 Expert

300 yard Rapid Fire/Prone 48 out of 50 96 Expert

300 yard Slow Fire /Sitting Position 33 out of 50 72* Less Than Marksman

500 yard Slow Fire/Prone 46 out of 50 92 Expert

Total:-----------212 out of 250

*Wind speed went from previously 0 mph at all other firing stations to 5mph during this firing station. Repeated adjustments to “windage” setting in attempt to compensate.

It should be noted that at each of the three firing stations in which LHO fired in the “EXPERT” category, he fired well above the minimum level for this qualification.

(220/250 = 88 percentile for “EXPERT” rating.)

The firing station at which he actually failed, appears to be primarily associated with an increase in wind speed which affected accuracy at the 300 yard range.

The firing station at which he fired only in the "Marksman" category was from a standing unsupported firing position.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marine_Corps_...t_Parris_Island

Only in the Marine Corps is each recruit required to qualify at 500 yards on the rifle range.

http://www.usmcweapons.com/

The 1958 FM 23-5 uses different terminology; for the "Proficiency Course" (200 yards or 1000 inches):

Possible Superior Excellent Satisfactory

250 202 175 150

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

For that facility, at that time, the scores were Marksman 190, Sharpshooter 210, Expert 220. This was all out of a possible 250.

Edited September 24, 2007 by Thomas H. Purvis

[Thomas H. Purvis]

Methinks that someone has been fabricating another fairy tale!

Firing Record: Lee Harvey Oswald

200 Yard Rapid Fire Station:

Maximum scoring ability = 5 points per round fired.

Scoring progressively decreasing from center of target outwards.

Target area for 5-point scoring is 12-inch wide X 10-inch height tapering silhouette

resembling the tapering shoulder and head of an individual.

1. Initiation/windage & elevation firing. 200 yard rapid fire.

3 shots/3- “5’s”------score 15-----------Maximum Score:-----15---------100 percentile

2. Thursday Practice: 200 yard rapid fire.

8 shots/7- “5”s” & 1-”4”-----Score 39---Maximum Score:----40--------98th percentile

3. Monday Practice: 200 yard rapid fire.

10 shots/7- “5’s” & 3- “4”s---Score 47--Maximum Score-----50--------94th percentile

4. Tuesday Practice: 200 yard rapid fire.

16 shots/12-”5’s”/2-”4’s”/1-”3”/& 1-”2”--Score 73--Maximum Score-80---

91.5st percentile.

5. Wednesday Practice: 200 yard rapid fire.

16 shots/13-”5’s” & 3- “4’s”--Score 77--Maximum Score---80-------96.25 percentile

6. Thursday Practice: 200 yard rapid fire./sitting position

10 shots/5-”5’s/3-”4’s”/1-”3”/1-”2”---Score 42*--Maximum Score--50--84th percentile

*Score sheet erroneously added total to = 43

7. Friday/Rangefire Qualification/200 yard rapid fire/sitting position

10 shots/8-”5’s”/2-”4’s”--Score 48-----------Maximum Score 50------------96th percentile

Note: Anything at or above the 88th percentile rating is in the qualification range for EXPERT! (220 points minimum/250 points maximum = 88th percentile)

[Pat Speer]

Tom, do you have the breakdown for Oswald's 191?

Edited September 27, 2007 by Pat Speer

[Thomas H. Purvis]

Tom, do you have the breakdown for Oswald's 191?

No!

And that I am aware, no one does.

The initial "Rangefire Qualification" is what gives you initial Marksmanship badge rating and the book is a record of your practice prior to actually shooting for qualification in order to remind oneself of windage & elevation corrections.

Thereafter, annual requalification is done and scores are merely kept for initial recording. Thereafter, orders are generally issued which indicated that the individual conducted their requalification on a given date, fired a given score, and thus requalified at a specific marksmanship level.

I am attempting to present the basic facts which demonstrate that LHO entered the USMC as a relatively good shooter, and that his ability certainly exceeded even the 212/Sharpshooter rating which he ultimately ended up with on the day of final rangefire qualification.

And, at short ranges from a fixed/stable firing position, he consistently fired in the upper echelon of what would have been EXPERT rating.

It is unknown as to exactly how much of the initial marksmanship training LHO obtained while still young and attending the Point Gibson Military Academy with his two brothers.

John Pic, his half-brother was a member of the Rifle Team at this school, and all indications are that LHO took after this interest from this source.

[Thomas H. Purvis]

Methinks that someone has been fabricating another fairy tale!

Firing Record: Lee Harvey Oswald

200 Yard Rapid Fire Station:

Maximum scoring ability = 5 points per round fired.

Scoring progressively decreasing from center of target outwards.

Target area for 5-point scoring is 12-inch wide X 10-inch height tapering silhouette

resembling the tapering shoulder and head of an individual.

1. Initiation/windage & elevation firing. 200 yard rapid fire.

3 shots/3- “5’s”------score 15-----------Maximum Score:-----15---------100 percentile

2. Thursday Practice: 200 yard rapid fire.

8 shots/7- “5”s” & 1-”4”-----Score 39---Maximum Score:----40--------98th percentile

3. Monday Practice: 200 yard rapid fire.

10 shots/7- “5’s” & 3- “4”s---Score 47--Maximum Score-----50--------94th percentile

4. Tuesday Practice: 200 yard rapid fire.

16 shots/12-”5’s”/2-”4’s”/1-”3”/& 1-”2”--Score 73--Maximum Score-80---

91.5st percentile.

5. Wednesday Practice: 200 yard rapid fire.

16 shots/13-”5’s” & 3- “4’s”--Score 77--Maximum Score---80-------96.25 percentile

6. Thursday Practice: 200 yard rapid fire./sitting position

10 shots/5-”5’s/3-”4’s”/1-”3”/1-”2”---Score 42*--Maximum Score--50--84th percentile

*Score sheet erroneously added total to = 43

7. Friday/Rangefire Qualification/200 yard rapid fire/sitting position

10 shots/8-”5’s”/2-”4’s”--Score 48-----------Maximum Score 50------------96th percentile

Note: Anything at or above the 88th percentile rating is in the qualification range for EXPERT! (220 points minimum/250 points maximum = 88th percentile)

Firing Record: Lee Harvey Oswald

500 Yard Slow Fire Station:

Maximum scoring ability = 5 points per round fired.

Scoring progressively decreasing from center of target outwards.

CORRECTION:

Target is a series of concentric circles, enclosed in a 12-inch square.

Inner circle (5 point circle) is 4-inches in diamerer.

Next outer circle (4-point circle) is an additional 3 & 1/2-inches in diameter (7-inch total diameter)

Next outer circle (3-point circle) is an additional 3 inches in diameter (10-inch total diameter)

Outside that, the round must land within a 12-inch square which contains the centered circles in order to award points.

1. Monday-Practice

10 shots/2-’5’s”/3-”4’s”/4-”3’s”/1-”2”---Score--36---Possible Score--50--72nd percentile

2. Tuesday-Practice

10 shots/4-”5’s”/5-”4’s”/1-”3”---Score--43--Possible Score--50---86th percentile

3. Wednesday-Practice

10 shots/5-”5’s”/2-”4’s”/2-”3’s”/1-”2”--Score 41--Possible Score--50--82nd perecentile

4. Thursday-Practice

10 shots/6-”5’s”/2-”4’s”/2-”3‘s”---Score 44---Possible Score---50-----88th percentile

5. Friday/Rangefire Qualification

10 shots/6-”5’s”/4-”4’s”--Score--46---Possible Score---50------92nd percentile

==============================================================================

For that facility, at that time, the scores were Marksman 190, Sharpshooter 210, Expert 220. This was all out of a possible 250.

==============================================================================

220/250 = .88--------Thus, anything at the 88th percentile or above, rates in the category of EXPERT.

210/250 = .84--------Thus, anything from the 84th percentile to the 87th percentile, rates as SHARPSHOOTER

190/250 = .76

209/250 = .836-------Thus, anything from the 76th percentile to the 83.6 percentile, rated as MARKSMAN.

Edited September 27, 2007 by Thomas H. Purvis

[Thomas H. Purvis]

200 yard "Rapid Fire" firing station:

First time at Bat!

3-home runs. ("5's)

Possible Score: 15------------Actual Score-----------15----Percentile Rating-------------100%

http://www.history-matters.com/archive/jfk...Vol16_0342b.htm

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http://www.history-matters.com/archive/jfk...Vol16_0344a.htm

Last time at Bat (Rangefire Qualification for 200 yard Rapid Fire Station)

8-home runs ("5's) & 2-triple's ("4's")

Possible Score: 50-------------Actual Score------------48--------------Percentile Rating---------96%

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Perhaps all of these "claim-to-be" shooters would demonstrate (post) their corresponding Rangefire Record in order that some "comparative shopping" can be done.

Edited September 29, 2007 by Thomas H. Purvis

[Thomas H. Purvis]

200 yard "Rapid Fire" firing station:

First time at Bat!

3-home runs. ("5's)

Possible Score: 15------------Actual Score-----------15----Percentile Rating-------------100%

http://www.history-matters.com/archive/jfk...Vol16_0342b.htm

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

http://www.history-matters.com/archive/jfk...Vol16_0344a.htm

Last time at Bat (Rangefire Qualification for 200 yard Rapid Fire Station)

8-home runs ("5's) & 2-triple's ("4's")

Possible Score: 50-------------Actual Score------------48--------------Percentile Rating---------96%

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Perhaps all of these "claim-to-be" shooters would demonstrate (post) their corresponding Rangefire Record in order that some "comparative shopping" can be done.

Shot#1:---------------------184 feet (+/-)-------------------------61.33 yards

Shot# 2/aka Z313:--------267 feet (+/-)-------------------------89 yards--------Stationing 4+65.3

http://history-matters.com/archive/jfk/wc/...Vol17_0464b.htm

http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/russ/exhibits/ce2112.htm

"a second shot followed immediately and hit the right rear high of the Boss's head"

http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/russ/testimony/hudson.htm

Mr. HUDSON- I was trying to get a good look at President Kennedy. I happened to be looking right at him when that bullet hit him - the second shot.

Mr. LIEBELER - That was when the bullet hit him in the head; is that correct?

Mr. HUDSON - Yes; it looked like it ht him somewhere along about a little bit behind the ear and a little bit above the ear.

Mr. LIEBELER - On the right-hand side or the left-hand side?

Mr. HUDSON - Right hand.

Mr. LIEBELER - You say that it was the second shot that hit him in the head; is that right?

Mr. HUDSON - Yes; I do believe that - I know it was.

Mr. LIEBELER - You saw him hit in the head, there wasn't any question in your mind about that, was there?

Mr. HUDSON - No, sir.

Mr. LIEBELER - And after you saw him hit in the head, did you here another shot?

Mr. HUDSON - Yes, sir.

Mr. HUDSON - Yes; so right along about even with these steps, pretty close to even with this here, the last shot was fired - somewhere right along in there.

http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/russ/testimony/brehm.htm

BREHM said when the President was hit by the second shot, he could notice the President's hair fly up, and then roll over to his side, as Mrs. KENNEDY was apparently pulling him in that direction.

BREHM said that a third shot followed and that all three shots were relatively close together.

Shot#3/aka in front of Altgens:------294 feet (+/-)-------------98 yards---------Stationing 4+96/4+95

http://history-matters.com/archive/jfk/wc/...Vol17_0449a.htm

http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/russ/testimony/altgens.htm

Mr. ALTGENS - This would put me at approximately this area here, which would be about 15 feet from me at the time he was shot in the head--about 15 feet from the car on the west side of the car--on the side that Mrs. Kennedy was riding in the car.

There was flesh particles that flew out of the side of his head in my direction from where I was standing,

Mr. LIEBELER - So, it is clear from your testimony that the third shot--the last shot, rather--hit the President?

Mr. ALTGENS - Well, off and on we have been referring to the third shot and the fourth shot; but actually, it was the last shot, the shot did strike the President and there was no other sound like a shot that was made after that.

Note#1: All shots are platted/plotted to an impact point on Elm St. which was the determined location of JFK. Distance and actual angles did not take into consideration the 4+ feet elevation of the head of JFK above thej pavement.

Note#2: Exactly who all actually believed "THE SHOT THAT MISSED"?

http://history-matters.com/archive/jfk/wc/...eport_0068a.htm

Note#3: Would someone who at least has the reading comprehension which exceeds Jethro Bodine (sixth grade level), kindly explain the difference to Mr. Von Pein between survey stationing 4+65.3 and 4+95/4+96, as well as the difference between "Second Shot" and "Last Shot" when it is quite well determined that there were three shots fired in the assassination shooting sequence.