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J. Raymond Carroll

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  1. Granted that Garrison was a talented writer, and that Oliver Stone's movie led to the release of documents, but it is a pity that Stone relied on such a misleading book. Stone thus created a "countermyth" that is just as misleading as the myth he was countering.
  2. Garrison is all over the map in his out-of-court statements, and often contradicted himself. The only reason he is important is because he brought charges in court - and had his ass handed to him. Garrison's only achievement was to destroy the career of Dean Andrews, whose only crime was being willing to go to Dallas to defend Lee Oswald.
  3. The indictment clearly states the charge that Clay Shaw conspired with Lee Oswald. Clay Shaw could not possibly conspire with Lee Oswald unless Lee Oswald conspired with Clay Shaw. A conspiracy, by definition, is an AGREEMENT, a meeting of the minds. The jury found there was no conspiratorial agreement involving Clay Shaw and Lee Oswald, ergo they found that Lee was innocent of Garrison's charges. There is NO ESCAPE from, and no mealy-mouthed way around that conclusion
  4. Logic and Law are subjects that seem to be a foreign language to all Garrison suckers.
  5. He was named in Garrison's indictment as a co-conspirator with Clay Shaw. Garrison could not actually charge him, because he was dead. The jury found Clay Shaw not guilty of conspiring with Lee Oswald, ergo they found Lee Oswald not guilty of conspiring with Clay Shaw. Like the song says, you can't have one without the other. Elementary deduction, i.e. inevitable logic.
  6. All due respect, Jon, Lee was named as an unindicted co-conspirator. All you have to do is read Jim Garrison's opening statement, which I quoted earlier. When the jury found that Clay Shaw was innocent of conspiring with Lee Oswald they also found, by neccessary inference, that Lee was innocent of conspiring with Clay Shaw. BTW, Clay Shaw could not provide an alibi for the evening of the alleged conspiratorial meeting, since Garrison could not specify a date,so Shaw's best witness was Marina, who testified that Lee was home with her every evening while they lived in New Orleans, and could not possibly have been present. when the alleged conspiracy was hatched. Garrison was an idiot, and so are his followers! As Sylvia Meagher pointed out, so many years ago!
  7. Well the record shows that he was charged (in abstentia) so your post is just a load of codswallop!
  8. From Garrison's Opening Statement: If Lee had been alive, and Clay Shaw dead, then Lee would have been the first-named defendant. When Clay Shaw was found innocent, so was Lee. You Oswald accusers need to get a life! It doesn't matter, because the jury found ALL THREE WERE INNOCENT! Live with it.
  9. Apparently you did. Lee was a named conspirator in Garrison's indictment. When Clay Shaw was acquitted of conspiring with Lee then Lee was automatically acquitted of conspiring with Clay Shaw! DOOOH!
  10. Garrison formally accused Lee Oswald of plotting the murder of JFK, and the jury of 12 New Orleans citizens took less than an hour to find that Lee was innocent of Garrison's silly charge. If you want to be a sucker, Dawn, go ahead and be my guest. I have never seen you post a useful comment in the history of the Education Forum
  11. But if you are going to go with the 'out front with Shelley' statement happening after the assassination then that leaves you with a problem in Fritz's notes of the interrogation. Because it means that Fritz has neglected to ask Oswald where he was during the assassination. I don't find that very likely. Thank you, Vanessa. Ever since the untimely death of Sylvia Meagher we have suffered from a "men only" syndrome in studying this case. It is good to have a feminine point of view again! They say you can't live with women, but you can't live without them!
  12. Greetings, Randy: I Hope all is well with you. As you already know, I have the highest regard for the incredible research of my fellow countryman, Sean Murphy, for which all serious researchers are deeply indebted. There is no doubt Sean is on to something fishy re: the Bookhout Report. But I think Sean made a wrong turn when he concluded that Fritz copied from Bookhout's notes (someone please correct me if I am wrong, but from memory I don't recall that ANYONE has ever seen Bookhout's notes). I believe it was the other way around: Bookhout copied from Fritz's notes, and that is where he learned that Lee was "out with Bill Shelley in front," from which he concocted his ridiculous story. Fritz testified that he "kept no notes at the time," although we know from Lee Oswald, via Secret Service agent Thomas Kelley, that Fritz took notes during the interrogations. When Fritz's notes finally surfaced after the enactment of the JFK Act, it became obvious that Fritz was lying when he said he "kept no notes" of the interrogations. The notes that surfaced were obviously not emotion recollected in tranquility; they were raw notes made in the heat of the moment. So Will Fritz is a PERJURER! Fritz, by his own testimony, began interrogating Lee at about 2. 25. Hosty and Bookhout (by their testimony) did not arrive until 3.15. It is obvious from the testimony of Hosty and Bookhout that the questioning was completely controlled by Fritz, and that the FBI guys were practically mute. I submit that any questions about Lee's whereabouts at the time JFK passed the building had already been asked by the time Hosty/Bookhout arrived, and that their joint report simply includes what Fritz told them. It is amazing that, when Bookhout gave his testimony to the Warren commission, he was never asked about his report and he was never asked where Lee said he was when the President passed by. Bookhout was given the opportunity to add anything that he had not been asked about, but he had nothing to add. http://www.history-matters.com/archive/jfk/wc/wcvols/wh7/pdf/WH7_Bookhout.pdf It is equally amazing that when Hosty testified about that subject, his testimony is almost a word-for-word repeat of the Hosty/Bookhout report. Sean Murphy is right that there is something fishy going on here! And the recessed entrance to the building is on the first floor. And Lee would have been lying if he said he was not "in the building" when the President passed by.
  13. It seems quite IMPROBABLE, since we know that Shelley was gone by the time Lee left the building. The only time he could have been out with Bill Shelley in front was just before and during the time JFK was passing the building. Will Fritz's testimony is weird, and often appears evasive, especially when talking about where Lee said he was. But during Fritz's testimony, this gem slipped out, corroborating his notes: Mr. BALL. Did you ask him what happened that day; where he had been? Mr. FRITZ. Yes, sir. Mr. BALL. What did he say? Mr. FRITZ. Well he told me that he was eating lunch with some of the employees when this happened, and that he saw all the excitement….. and he didn’t think-I also asked him why he left the building…. 4H213 One of the employees, of course, was Bill Shelley. I have no doubt Frazier & his sister lied about the alleged bag. I don't know why they lied, but they did. Jack Daugherty saw Lee arrive at work, and said Lee was carrying no bag. And I have equally no doubt that today Frazier is lying about Prayer Man. Kinda amazin' he can't ID PM, don't you think?
  14. Prayer Man does not remotely look like a woman. He looks like Lee Oswald. And he is leaning back into the corner, which makes him appear shorter. And he told Will Fritz that he was "Out with Bill Shelley in front" when the President passed by. The only extraordinary claim here is the claim that Lee shot JFK. That is the extraordinary claim that requires extraordinary proof -- something no one will ever see. I got news, Pat: Every man is presumed innocent until proven guilty!
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