Dave Greer Posted January 9, 2007 Share Posted January 9, 2007 (edited) I first read about the FBI ordering the LM and lunar buggy blueprints destroyed on the pro Apollo site called 'Who Mourns for Apollo ? ' ... It has also been mentioned on several hoax sites and even some guys were discussing this fact on either Bad Astronomy or clavius ( can't remember which) a couple of years ago ... So this is common knowledge on both sides of the Apollo fence . I'd heard it mentioned on various forums, but haven't found an official source for it. I'll do some more digging. What say you about the SR-71 plans and machine parts being ordered to be destroyed by the then President? (I need to find the source for this). Does it make you view Apollo blueprints being destroyed in a different light? EDIT Here's what the Clavius website has to say on the matter - no mention of the FBI. I can't find anything on Apollohoax.net either. Source 32. Why did ALL of the blueprints and plans for the Lunar Module and Moon Buggy get destroyed if this was one of History's greatest accomplishments?The aren't all destroyed. Many of the detailed plans for the Apollo hardware are on microfilm at the United States National Archives. Unfortunately the design documentation for something as complicated as a space ship or the lunar rover is not something that just comfortably fits in a file cabinet. It typically occupies several hundred thousand cubic feet. Grumman engineers were, at one point, producing more than 4,000 drawings per week. In addition, each unit produced requires installation, service, and modification documentation for each individual part on the unit. Congress provided no funding for the storage and archive of the detailed design documentation. The private companies who had custody of it did not have the funds nor the desire to archive materials that required an inconveniently large building in which to house it. They are for-profit companies, not museums. Thus the detailed documentation was regretfully discarded while the basic documentation was preserved. There is a very large amount of information available on the design and construction of these spacecraft, both in print and online. Incidentally, "Who Mourns For Apollo" isn't a pro-Apollo site, as shown by this quote below:-NASA spent millions to insure that the astronauts that went to the Moon were protected from the physical threats of deep space. We now know (from literally hundreds of thousands of pages of official documents) that the Space Agency literally spent billions doing the necessary research and developing the necessary technologies to get them there and back safely. These are not really the issues.The underlying reasons for NASA's deception and duplicitousness regarding what is really on other planets in our solar system -- including the 30+ year pattern of withholding crucial Lunar information from the people who paid for Apollo in the first place, and what we now know from NASA's own photography is on the Moon -- are the REAL issues here. It is TIME to get the focus back on track where it belongs. Edited January 10, 2007 by Dave Greer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evan Burton Posted February 7, 2007 Share Posted February 7, 2007 Ref my question: so why don't you have a look through some of the websites of people with the required technical expertise, and pick some that meet your standards. Let me know who they are, and I'll ask them to examine the Apollo hardware for a technical opinion. How about some of the companies that are trying for the latest X-Prize? They'd have to understand a lot of the space-related activity.You will have to pick the experts so I can be sure they will meet your standard of proof. It would be unfortunate if I got a technical opinion and then you decided they didn't meet your requirements. I'd have to repeat the whole process over again with someone new; best get it right the first time. Bump for Duane. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Len Colby Posted February 7, 2007 Share Posted February 7, 2007 I first read about the FBI ordering the LM and lunar buggy blueprints destroyed on the pro Apollo site called 'Who Mourns for Apollo ? ' ... It has also been mentioned on several hoax sites and even some guys were discussing this fact on either Bad Astronomy or clavius ( can't remember which) a couple of years ago ... So this is common knowledge on both sides of the Apollo fence . <snip> Incidentally, "Who Mourns For Apollo" isn't a pro-Apollo site, as shown by this quote below:- Falsely claiming that sites which support his case are "pro Apollo" is one of Duane's tactics he has done it at least to or three times already Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duane Daman Posted February 7, 2007 Author Share Posted February 7, 2007 Unbelievable .... We have been through this one before just recently .... Here are the first two paragraphs of the link you are complaining about not being a pro Apollo site .... "In our first two pieces in this series “Who Mourns for Apollo,” (Part I and Part II) we dealt with a series of silly and irresponsible assertions by the “Moon Hoax Advocates” who say that we never went to the Moon. One of the centerpiece claims is that the Apollo astronauts never could have passed through the Van Allen radiation Belts on their way to the Moon and survived. Although we addressed this issue briefly in our first article, since they use this argument as a ‘big-gun’ in attacking the validity and credibility of Apollo, we decided a more complete deconstruction of the issue was appropriate. Included in their disinformation campaign are seemingly logical but blatantly mistaken prevarications about the “fatal” dangers the astronauts faced from various types of radiation exposure. According to them, cosmic rays going through the spacecraft’s thin skin, and “massive” doses of solar radiation would have resulted in the astronauts being transformed into hairless crispy critters." ......................................................... I understand that you are not the sharpest knife in the rack on this forum , but if those statements are not pro Apollo and ANTI HOAX , then I don't know what would be . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Ulman Posted February 7, 2007 Share Posted February 7, 2007 (edited) Unbelievable .... We have been through this one before just recently .... Here are the first two paragraphs of the link you are complaining about not being a pro Apollo site .... <SNIP> I understand that you are not the sharpest knife in the rack on this forum , but if those statements are not pro Apollo and ANTI HOAX , then I don't know what would be . Duane- If you had actually read the entire page you would have found the truth. The last paragraphs on the page: However, in this case they foolishly stepped over the line and tried to bite off more than they could chew -- by trying to debunk a clearly proven era of science: the sojourns of Apollo. They have failed. Because their miserable attempts have now been recognized for what they are (ignorant and temporary "distractions"), perhaps we can finally move on to more significant issues ... about what NASA really doesn't want us to know. As Mike Bara said in his second piece in this series, maybe it's a case of ignorance obviating the rational mind. Perhaps their agenda (the "Moon Hoaxer" crowd) is political, and they're hooked up with other "higher-level distracters." They have desperately and deliberately attempted to take the focus off of what is really important about our Moon, by making the mistake of challenging the validity of Apollo and the integrity of scientific fact. Like thieves, they have chosen to make their dollars off of the impressionable American public, and they'll have to live with that when all is said and done.NASA spent millions to insure that the astronauts that went to the Moon were protected from the physical threats of deep space. We now know (from literally hundreds of thousands of pages of official documents) that the Space Agency literally spent billions doing the necessary research and developing the necessary technologies to get them there and back safely. These are not really the issues. The underlying reasons for NASA's deception and duplicitousness regarding what is really on other planets in our solar system -- including the 30+ year pattern of withholding crucial Lunar information from the people who paid for Apollo in the first place, and what we now know from NASA's own photography is on the Moon -- are the REAL issues here. It is TIME to get the focus back on track where it belongs. They don't think that apollo was faked - just that NASA found something on the moon and elswhere and are covering it up. Edited February 7, 2007 by Steve Ulman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duane Daman Posted February 7, 2007 Author Share Posted February 7, 2007 Steve ... Do you really not understand DISINFORMATION when you read it ? 'Who Mourns for Apollo ' is NOT A HOAX SITE .... It is PRO APOLLO .... but with a very clever twist ....The authors of that web site are smart enough to realize that millions of people are onto the fact that nasa faked the manned moon landings ... So what better way to distract from that fact than to put out some more confusing disinformation ? This web site is offering another solution as why nasa has been caught in so many lies and also about why their Apollo photos are so obviously fake .... Here is the quote which proves this sad fact . "The underlying reasons for NASA's deception and duplicitousness regarding what is really on other planets in our solar system -- including the 30+ year pattern of withholding crucial Lunar information from the people who paid for Apollo in the first place, and what we now know from NASA's own photography is on the Moon -- are the REAL issues here." ..................... So what they are saying here is that nasa faked the Apollo photography and gave the world moon set photos because they really did get to the moon and they really did find ancient or even present day alien civilizations there and just had to disguise that fact from the people of planet Earth .... Oh pleassseeeeee !! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Ulman Posted February 7, 2007 Share Posted February 7, 2007 So what they are saying here is that nasa faked the Apollo photography and gave the world moon set photos because they really did get to the moon and they really did find ancient or even present day alien civilizations there and just had to disguise that fact from the people of planet Earth .... Oh pleassseeeeee !! Hate to tell you this Duane - Their evidence is more persuasive than yours! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duane Daman Posted February 7, 2007 Author Share Posted February 7, 2007 Steve .... Regardless of who's evidence you find more compelling , the bottom line still remains the same ... THE APOLLO PHOTOS ARE FAKE ! ... And this is even admitted to on web sites which are trying to convince everyone that nasa really did land men on the moon ... but just didn't want us to see the REAL APOLLO PHOTOS ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Ulman Posted February 7, 2007 Share Posted February 7, 2007 <SNIP>THE APOLLO PHOTOS ARE FAKE ! <SNIP> No proof has EVER been presented that the photos are fake. NONE, ZIP, NADA - It doesn't matter how many times you make the false claim. its never been proved! The only place they've ever been proved are in your fantasies! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duane Daman Posted February 7, 2007 Author Share Posted February 7, 2007 Steve ... If you refuse to see what is right before your eyes , then you are the one living in a fantasy ... You and the other nasa defenders who refuse to see the truth of nasa's fantasy of going to the moon . The photos have been proven to be fake by those who know ... and are not on nasa's payroll to lie for them , or blinded by their devotion to a lost cause . Your brainwashing on Bad Astronomy is what keeps you from seeing the truth ... Along with the rest of your clavius clone friends who post here .. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Greer Posted February 7, 2007 Share Posted February 7, 2007 The photos have been proven to be fake by those who know ... and are not on nasa's payroll to lie for them , or blinded by their devotion to a lost cause . A statement so sad, it's no longer funny. Duane... Peace. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evan Burton Posted February 8, 2007 Share Posted February 8, 2007 So what they are saying here is that nasa faked the Apollo photography and gave the world moon set photos because they really did get to the moon and they really did find ancient or even present day alien civilizations there and just had to disguise that fact from the people of planet Earth .... Oh pleassseeeeee !! Why should their position be any less credible than yours? To we "Apollogists", there is overwhelming scientific evidence to support the belief that the Apollo programme happened as recorded. To look at your position with regard to the people who believe that there were some type of aliens on the Moon, you are saying 'get real!' while they believe that they have evidence that supports their position. You look at the evidence and decide it is invalid for whatever reasons. So aren't you now in the position of possibly being called a "CIA disinfo agent" by the people who hold beliefs contrary to yours? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duane Daman Posted February 8, 2007 Author Share Posted February 8, 2007 Evan ... You're right ... We are all entitled to have our own opinions about this subject and every other subject also . But my position of Apollo being a hoax is not as sad or as misguided as Dave or you or some of the other people who defend Apollo would like to have everyone believe ... but then I believe you are already very well aware of this and that might even be one of the reasons why you defend the Apollo Program as hard as you do . But think about this ... None of nasa's other space missions have been challenged as being a possible hoax , except for Apollo .... The reasons are many , and contrary to popualr belief , have not all been debunked . Many of nasa's claims of landing on the moon can not be proven by anyone , including nasa. .. There are too many holes in the official Apollo record and one of the most glaring of these holes is the photography which looks completely faked and has been questioned and doubted by millions of people , including professional photographers ... So my position on this may still be in the minority , but that does not mean it is wrong . As far as the overwhelming scientific evidence that the Apollo program happened as recorded .... I have never seen any ... Where and what is it ? .... Besides the moon rocks , which are even now in question also . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Greer Posted February 9, 2007 Share Posted February 9, 2007 (edited) Many of nasa's claims of landing on the moon can not be proven by anyone , including nasa. .. There are too many holes in the official Apollo record and one of the most glaring of these holes is the photography which looks completely faked and has been questioned and doubted by millions of people , including professional photographers ... So my position on this may still be in the minority , but that does not mean it is wrong .As far as the overwhelming scientific evidence that the Apollo program happened as recorded .... I have never seen any ... Where and what is it ? .... Besides the moon rocks , which are even now in question also . Hours of video clearly shot in a vacuum and 1/6th g. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=khDI2MsWSYc Look from 5 minutes onwards. Edited February 9, 2007 by Dave Greer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Ulman Posted February 9, 2007 Share Posted February 9, 2007 <snip>Besides the moon rocks , which are even now in question also . They are in question by whom? I assume you can provide a reference to someone qualified to discuss the lunar samples. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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