Loran Hall and Silvia Odio

[James Richards]

James, my understanding is that Hemming couldn't stand Hall and it wouldn't surprise me if he set Hall up. (Royce Bierma)

Hi Royce,

I think the relationship was strained to say the least. In fact, I think that most of the guys on No Name Key just tolerated Hall. I do indeed believe Hall was to be a designated patsy. Whether Hemming was behind that I don't know.

The following is from an interview Hemming gave to Dick Russell in 1976.

RUSSELL: "You told the Senate investigators that Loran Hall was somehow involved."

HEMMING: Yes, on the day of the assassination, I made a call from Miami to Texas. And I pointedly asked, 'Is Lorenzo Hall in Dallas?' I made the call about 1:30 p.m. or 2:00 p.m. He was there. My contact had seen him in Dallas the day before.

RUSSELL: Why were you suspicious of Loran Hall?

HEMMING: Because he left Miami with the stated intent to kill Kennedy. He had my weapon, a Johnson 30-06 breakdown rifle with a scope on it, that had been prepared for the Bay of Pigs. I'd left it with a private investigator who had previously worked under Agency auspices on the West Coast. Hall got the weapon when we ran short of funds on a return trip from L.A. to Florida, and we ended up using Hall's car.

RUSSELL: You were working closely with Hall?

HEMMING: He came to work with our group in 1963. Then he ran afoul with some people and immediately went to work with a group that I thought was infiltrated by Castro's agents. Hall ignored this. He siphoned off a couple of people who had worked with me in the past, and started organizing his own operation with FRANK STURGIS and some other guys...He knew how to do the job...But I think someone was trying to put him there so he would be one of the patsies."

When Hall was questioned by A.J Weberman about Hemming he said the following. Be warned that the language is quite strong. It is also baffling and bordering on the bizarre.

HALL: Who's GERALD PATRICK HEMMING? Never heard of him. Who is he, some left-winger?

WEBERMAN: He was with INTERPEN and the International Anti-Communist Brigade.

HALL: That's a Communist organization.

WEBERMAN: The International Anti-Communist Brigade is a communist organization?

HALL: Yeah, I wouldn't know anybody like that. Anybody with a name like GERRY PATRICK HEMMING has either got to be a Communist or CIA.

WEBERMAN: Well, I think this man was a dedicated anti-Communist.

HALL: Who? GERRY PATRICK HEMMING? If its the one I heard about he's CIA. I've got nothing to talk to you about. Anybody who associates with GERALD PATRICK HEMMING has either got to be CIA, FBI or an asshole. I got nothing to say. Hey, nobody is going to print anything I got to say, nobody. That's fine. I'm in no hurry to get my head blowed off. HEMMING is a CIA punk. I've known the son-of-a-bitch for fifteen years. He turned his own goddamned crews in so he wouldn't have to go to Cuba. He has fingered me on my own goddamn deals and caused me to get arrested. Ah XXXX. Hey man as it stand right now there's only two of us left alive. That's me and SANTO TRAFFICANTE as far as I'm concerned we're both going to stay alive because I ain't gonna say shirt. I ain't gonna have some come up to me and blow me away...The only thing I'm saying is that if any of you assholes come near me you better have a XXXXXXX' army with you baby. Cause I got my xxxx together and I'll blow the first one of you mothers away that even comes near me. That you can put in print.

So, anyone want to volunteer to go interview him?

James

Edited October 28, 2014 by Kathy Beckett

[Ryan Crowe]

Wasnt Hall wanted for Meth dist. or something to that effect awhile back? I think his son was caught but Hall was MIA.

What is classic in the Hall interview is he denies Hemming, then looses his cool and says he has known him for 15 years, what also is classic is he mentions more then once of getting his head blown off for talking, heck all Weberman was asking was if he knew Hemming .

It seems Hall feels that if he talks about Hemming in any detail he is going to be killed, I have a feeling there isnt much love between them LOL.

[James Richards]

Hi Ryan,

You may be right about the Meth distribution as that rings a faint bell.

Yes, Hall definitely comes across as a tad unstable which suggests that he may have figured out that Hemming was possibly behind setting him up.

For those who are interested, this link below is for Hemming's testimony for the HSCA. Just work forward from this page. Some interesting tid bits for sure including his meeting with Bernardo De Torres at Military Intelligence.

http://history-matters.com/archive/jfk/hsc...mming_0001a.htm

James

[David Boylan]

Hi Ryan,

You may be right about the Meth distribution as that rings a faint bell.

Yes, Hall definitely comes across as a tad unstable which suggests that he may have figured out that Hemming was possibly behind setting him up.

For those who are interested, this link below is for Hemming's testimony for the HSCA. Just work forward from this page. Some interesting tid bits for sure including his meeting with Bernardo De Torres at Military Intelligence.

http://history-matters.com/archive/jfk/hsc...mming_0001a.htm

James

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

James,

Another point to consider is fund raising and money sources. Anti-Castro operations cost money and these were not rich men. They needed support from the money men. Hall had accompanied Hemming to Dallas, met with some of the people that Hemming was visiting for funds and later, independantly, went back to try and get money from the same sources behind Hemming's back. Obviously, this didn't go over too well with Gerry. Can't say I'd blame him.

Dave

[James Richards]

Ooops! Deleted

I am a moron.

Edited November 17, 2004 by James Richards

[James Richards]

Another point to consider is fund raising and money sources. Anti-Castro operations cost money and these were not rich men. They needed support from the money men. Hall had accompanied Hemming to Dallas, met with some of the people that Hemming was visiting for funds and later, independantly, went back to try and get money from the same sources behind Hemming's back. Obviously, this didn't go over too well with Gerry. Can't say I'd blame him. (David Boylan)

Absolutely right, David.

Speaking of money, Tom Dunkin wrote to Dick Billings that in late October of 1963, Hall and Seymour were on a promise of $30,000 to secure footage inside of Cuba showing Russian missiles. This was supposed to help Barry Goldwater's Presidential campaign of 1964.

Dunkin also said that Hall had weapons and some serious camera equipment including a 16mm Bolex motion picture camera.

James

[James Richards]

Wasnt Hall wanted for Meth dist. or something to that effect awhile back? I think his son was caught but Hall was MIA. (Ryan Crowe)

You are spot on, Ryan. Well done.

I found this story filed with the Dallas Morning News on September 13, 1989. I love Mansfield's quote, "I would add that the agency does not sanction violations of U.S. law."

You gotta love it.

James

************************

Man Claims CIA Tied to Speed Ring

By Lee Hancock

A methamphetamine ring based in Mesquite was set

up by a CIA operative to funnel money to the

Nicaraguan contras, one of the alleged participants

has testified in federal court.

The testimony came during a hearing in Tulsa,

where Loran Eugene Hall, Jr. appeared Monday to plead

guilty to drug charges.

He told the court that his father, Loran Eugene

Hall, Sr. of Mesquite was a CIA agent who recruited

him and others to manufacture speed to raise money for

the contras, said Jack Morgan, assistant U.S. attorney

for the Northern District of Oklahoma.

A CIA spokesman declined to comment Tuesday on Mr.

Hall's case.

"We do not generally acknowledge the employment of

either covert or overt employees," said Mark

Mansfield, an official at CIA headquarters in McLean,

Va. "I would add that the agency does not sanction

violations of U.S. law."

A federal drug conspiracy indictment handed down

in Tulsa in July names Loran Eugene Hall, Sr., 59; his

daughter, Barbara Ann Marteney, 34, of Mesquite; and

his sons, Michael Stephen Hall, 36, of Burns, Kan.,

and Loran Eugene Hall, Jr., 34, of Derby, Kan; and two

other Kansas residents. The indictment charges that

the elder Mr. Hall led the ring, which manufactured

methamphetamines between October 1987 and February

1989.

Loran Hall Jr. and Michael Hall pleaded guilty

Monday. Their father and sister remain at large.

Court documents indicate the ring was broken when

the Oklahoma State Bureau of Narcotics investigators

and Mesquite police trailed Loran Hall, Jr. after he

purchased glassware and chemicals at a Grand Prairie

chemical store.

Mr. Hall and another man were arrested in Noble

County, Okla., as they were carrying those items and

several high-caliber forearms to Kansas in a stolen

truck, according to the indictment....

Mr. Morgan, a Mesquite police investigator and

defense attorney representing Hall family members all

said there was evidence suggesting that Loran Hall,

Sr. worked for the CIA in some capacity.

"He has a long history of involvement with the CIA

attempts to overthrow Castro," Mr. Morgan said. "He

was involved in the ill-famed Bay of Pigs invasion. In

1961, he got arrested with a truckload of guns in

Texas, and he was transporting them from California to

Florida for that invasion."

His name also has surfaced in congressional

investigations of the John F. Kennedy assassination.

The elder Mr. Hall was described in a 1979 House

Select Committee on Assassinations report as a onetime

resident of Cuba with ties to anti-Castro groups in

the United States and organized crime on both

countries.

And, Mr. Morgan said, his name is the subject of a

chapter in the book Coup d'etat in America, which

speculates about CIA involvement in a plot to kill

President Kennedy. The chapter, titled "Loran Hall and

the Free Cuba Committees," details allegations of CIA

financing and orchestration of a plot by anti-Castro

groups to kill President Kennedy."

"In the last few years, he supposedly was involved

with CIA attempts to overthrow the Nicaraguan

government," Mr. Morgan said.

Loran Eugene Hall, Jr. has told investigators that

his father was a 17-year CIA employee most recently

involved in running guns to Central America, Mr.

Morgan said.

The son also has told investigators about

incidents in which helicopters appeared at his

father's Kansas farm bearing men who carried automatic

weapons and answered to military titles such as

colonel and major, Mr. Morgan said.

"It may be true. There's quite an extensive

history on his father's CIA involvement," Mr. Heflet

said. "My client told me that a lot of his dad's

involvement, specifically in the Kennedy

assassination, has been sealed up, and we never may

find out what it was."

Mr. Morgan said federal officials believe the

elder Mr. Hall may be hiding in Kansas, Honduras or

Costa Rica.

"This is a pretty strange case all around," Mr.

Morgan said.

Edited November 17, 2004 by James Richards

[Ryan Crowe]

James,

You beat me to it LOL, I was just searching for such story and found it and was ready to post it here LOL.

This article was wriiten in 1989 , I wonder what old Loren is doing now...Hmmm or

Anybody know how to get in touch with Mr Lee Hancock to see if he has any news on Hall after he wrote that article?

[James Richards]

Anybody know how to get in touch with Mr Lee Hancock to see if he has any news on Hall after he wrote that article? (Ryan Crowe)

Not to take this thread off topic but Lee Hancock is a woman and one tough ass kicker. She was right in the middle of the WACO reporting and was critical of the FBI.

She also did an interview with Gordon Novel I believe. Novel claimed that William Colby gave him the FLIR gunshot information which proved the FBI unloaded big time on the Branch Davidians after Janet Reno claimed they didn't fire a shot. I'll try to find that interview.

I guess I should have started a new thread on this. Sorry if I have broken forum rules.

James

[Royce Bierma]

Anybody know how to get in touch with Mr Lee Hancock to see if he has any news on Hall after he wrote that article? (Ryan Crowe)

Not to take this thread off topic but Lee Hancock is a woman and one tough ass kicker. She was right in the middle of the WACO reporting and was critical of the FBI.

She also did an interview with Gordon Novel I believe. Novel claimed that William Colby gave him the FLIR gunshot information which proved the FBI unloaded big time on the Branch Davidians after Janet Reno claimed they didn't fire a shot. I'll try to find that interview.

I guess I should have started a new thread on this. Sorry if I have broken forum rules.

James

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

James, I just found an entry on the SSDI for Loran E. Hall, born January 1930, died in April 1995 in Newton, Kansas. So I guess he's gone.

Royce Bierma

[Shanet Clark]

Speed kills...

Good thread, I pulled up more Loran Hall material just by using the search engine.

The HSCA was interested in him, to say the least.

Shanet

Edited November 18, 2004 by Shanet Clark

[David Boylan]

Another point to consider is fund raising and money sources. Anti-Castro operations cost money and these were not rich men. They needed support from the money men. Hall had accompanied Hemming to Dallas, met with some of the people that Hemming was visiting for funds and later, independantly, went back to try and get money from the same sources behind Hemming's back. Obviously, this didn't go over too well with Gerry. Can't say I'd blame him. (David Boylan)

Absolutely right, David.

Speaking of money, Tom Dunkin wrote to Dick Billings that in late October of 1963, Hall and Seymour were on a promise of $30,000 to secure footage inside of Cuba showing Russian missiles. This was supposed to help Barry Goldwater's Presidential campaign of 1964.

Dunkin also said that Hall had weapons and some serious camera equipment including a 16mm Bolex motion picture camera.

James

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

James,

I believe that this is the camera that Hall got in California the same time he got Hemming's rifle. The check to buy it was supplied by the American Committee to Free Cuba and was signed by Jose Norman.

The weapons were obtained from Clint Wheat and friends. Some made it to Miami and the others were left in the trailor at Lester Logue's brother-in-law's place in Dallas. Speculating here, but I believe the M-1s were left in Dallas to coverted to full auto by John Masen.

Dave

[James Richards]

James, I just found an entry on the SSDI for Loran E. Hall, born January 1930, died in April 1995 in Newton, Kansas. So I guess he's gone. (Royce Bierma)

Good work, Royce. Living witnesses are certainly becoming a little thin on the ground.

I believe that this is the camera that Hall got in California the same time he got Hemming's rifle. The check to buy it was supplied by the American Committee to Free Cuba and was signed by Jose Norman.

The weapons were obtained from Clint Wheat and friends. Some made it to Miami and the others were left in the trailor at Lester Logue's brother-in-law's place in Dallas. Speculating here, but I believe the M-1s were left in Dallas to coverted to full auto by John Masen. (David Boylan)

I believe you are right about the camera, David. I also agree regarding the rifles.

James

[Harry J.Dean]

Quote from The CHICAGO TRIBUNE,Teusday,November 26 1963;

{UPI} - Mexico City, November 25,1963 The newspaper Excelcior

....said Oswald crossed the border at Laredo,Texas, on September

25, and " DROVE TO MEXICO CITY.......The United States Customs

Service confirmed the crossing. A spokesman said, " There are

records to establish this. " The records also showed Oswald reentered

the United States October 3. (Harry Dean)

Thanks, Harry.

You have said to me in the past that you don't believe William Seymour was the 'Leon Oswald' who visited Sylvia Odio with Loran Hall and Lawrence Howard; and I certainly agree with you.

Do you have any theories as to who this individual was?

James

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

James,

From my M/S book and CD...... When Kennedy visited Mexico City in late June of 1962, Gabaldon, in league with some rightist Mexican Federal police officials, was set to shoot the president. Only a last minute escape problem aborted that attempted assassination scheme!

In late August, 1963, Gabaldon and I kept an appointment with former U.S. Congressman John H. Ruosselot then Western Director of the John Birch Society at his San Marino, California office. Gabaldon picked up ten thousand dollars as pre-arranged, from Rousselot. The money was for the ' Mexico Operation'. Some of these funds were given to Lee Oswald.

Two other of our anti-Castro, anti-communist associates, Lawrence John 'Larry' Howard - aka Alonzo Escuido, and Loran Eugene 'skip' Hall, aka Lorenzo Pacillo, were dispatched by Gabaldon to enlist Oswald in the CIA {Central Intelligence Agency}. In late September Oswald accompanied the pair to Gabaldon's Mexico City area office. Oswald then recieved instructions and the funds from the impressive, but phony 'CIA officer Gabaldon'. The fate of both Oswald and Kennedy were there forever sealed! The Trio later returned to the U.S., Hall and Howard 'eventually' to California, and Oswald to Texas where two weeks later, October 15, 1963 he began working at the book depository building in Dallas.

on>

.........a previously framed fall-guy {Oswald} with recently arranged {by my associates} pro-communist connections to the Russian and Cuban embassies,

{in Mexico City} would be assumed guilty,especially after and because of his own sudden death.

.........Oswald's alleged guilt destroyed the powerful and subversive Fair Play For Cuba Committee, and with it, Castro's influence in the American hemisphere.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

continued,from M/S book & CD

......when the name of a Fair Play For Cuba Committee communist was broadcast

throughout the rightist circuit after the airing of an August,1963.... program from

station WDSU, New Orleans, Louisiana, Lee Oswald was 'selected' by another of

our {JBS} associates, retired U.S. Army General E.A.Walker of Dallas,Texas. The subject was then chosen by Gabaldon as the 'fall guy' in the secretive plot against

Kennedy. None of us objected,and found it humorous to frame a communist.

I quietly considered it as goofy as the weird,but hazy,arrangements to kill the

president.

......Alonzo and Lorenzo were the former given names of Howard and Hall,and used

by them as so-called 'war names' . Sylvia and Annie Odio reported a September

1963 meeting with Angelo, Leopodo,and Leon Oswald, who spoke of shooting the

president. Odio, limited in English phonics, misquoted the names Alonzo, Lorenzo

and Lee........Gabaldon returned again from Mexico for a brief visit to his family

home in El Monte, California in September 1963. He and I readied a huge mass of medical drugs and supplies gathered from several {LDS} doctors throughout

Southern California...........Some of the medical drugs were slated for Gabaldon's

{JBS} front operation called DACD {Drive Against Communist Aggression} in

Mexico. The majority of these supplies were destined to accompany Hall and Howards car and trailer load of weapons and ammunition to No Name Key in

Florida. The goods were to aid 'La Sombra' {the shadows},an anti-Castro raider

group under the command of Hall. This effort was organized by {LDS} W. Cleon

Skousen and {JBS} John H. Rousselot,and chaired by anti-Castro Cubans. It was

not a CIA operation.

The group was soon arrested and the war supplies were seized by Federal and State authorities,ending further raids. Later plans using an attack boat,donated by a wealthy New York {JBS} member,were unsucccessful and the vessel was also

seized. After being released from any charges,the defeated raiders split up. Hall

and Howard, at Gabaldon's direction, to New Orleans,Louisiana, picked up Oswald and continued on to Dallas, Texas where they made several stops to raise desperately needed funds. The three then crossed the border and drove to Mexico City.............when Kennedy entered Texas, his life was in the deadly hands of

'extremist veteran riflemen' of Walker's former Munich, Germany 24 infantry command.......The planned ' New Americaist Scheme' with it's framework so

cunningly in place for more than half a century, moved quickly to consolidate and

hold perpetual power over a bewildered government and confused nation.

[Ryan Crowe]

Any idea on what Hall's cause of death was?