William Plumlee

You will find it easier if you actually read my posting. FWIW: Not to confuse. The term CI used by the CIA is as John stated (counterintelligence, or "CounterIntell found in some early office memos. However, when used by law enforcement, DEA, FBI, and local, the term CI means "Confidentual Informant" and a number is place either before or after the term CI (CI-306 or 306-CI) Example: CI-306 told CI-21 that on the night of the 23rd CI-21 was in bed> It would not read " counterintelligence told.... also [01] means CIA found in some memos.... [24] could mean FBI found in others.

Hi Christy: As the saying goes; "Ye shall know them by their fruits". As I said some of the Independents were A.O.K. However, they did not have the cover or protection of the United States government, or the CIA. They were reckless to a degree, as we were also. None the less, if we messed up we were covered or pulled out of the operation and sent back to the "Farm" (to cool off for a spell) Where as an Independent was left on the vine... to fend for himself.., so to speak. And too, It really did not matter to us who did the work as long as it got done. It was when they (the independents) got caught that mattered, because it put heat on us, and that was a No, No.. (Watergate, remember) Of course when they were caught or exposed they dropped names and indicated they were CIA, FBI, or MI . This caused the CIA a big headache as well as the FBI... the FBI was never sure who was or was not CIA or MI for that matter. Some independents did work their own missions and worked them well. Its true you could sometimes never really tell what was CIA and what was Independent. BUT. When two Ops came together and the coded references did not match, or the "passwords" or the coded terminology did not jive, then you knew.., and that contact was broken and reported and that operation was shut down and some were carted off to jail. Example: Two guys talking at the "Dark Horse Bar" West Palm. The Merc; "...we set the charges and burned the field..., and then ran like hell.". The operative: " Ya, I know what you mean. We did that once and Poinsettia had to come in and get us out". " Yes... I know what you mean. We were taken out of Cuba once on that ship.., The Poinsettia". Well in fact there was no ship named the Poinsettia... Poinsettia was in reference to a Latin song... " your branches speak to me of Love...,, pale moon casting shadows from above". It was a sanctioned operation. That song was a code... meaning not safe... get out while you can. Poinsettia was also referenced as a CIA/MI OMC operation and only those connected or assigned knew what it meant. There are other examples, many of them. (meathods and procedures training) Now. What I was referencing was those who did nothing except boast about their feats of daring do, to the money sources, and collected money under false pretenses and partied in Miami and the Keys with the funding collected from their BS. They never did anything except talk a lot. They would buy a few gadgets; show them to their money sources; then sell them to the highest bidder to the underground at marked up prices. It was a racket. (right Harry) We knew most of them as well as did the CIA, MI OMC; Alpha -66, and the FBI, as well as Miami Vice. Alex and you father were within the umbrella of Poinsettia although I can not prove it... but John Martino and Tony Vencianna knew as well as Rip Robertson and Harvey. In short... On an Op you walked the talk and talked the walk... if not it did not fit. It was a hard life but very adventurous for a young man of twenty or twenty-five, or so. As to Lisa Howard. Some said she did have an affair with Castro, but it was before the agreement and it was suppose to have happen in NY. However, I do not know if this is true or not. I think it was the other woman. This was shortly after 1959 when Castro came to NY. I believe some at a later date incerted Howard in place of this lady and changed the dates from 1959 to 63 and the place to Havana... smelled like CIA to me. But what would I know about that. Ask Dorthy Killgallin ?. Hang in there little lady". Later Tosh

I agree. To which destination did he travel in Arizona? Licavoli's Grace Ranch? Wim YES. From Caravan Inn in Phoenix to Grace Ranch after returning from Thunderbird Inn in Nevada outside of Vegas (November of 1963 ( also see information concerning another earlier flight with Roselli from Burbank and Santa Barbara CA to Grace Ranch outside of Tucson AZ; as well as a Galveston Texas flight also in the spring of 1963 (reference, April 1963 flight plan of N6393 Echo flown from Thomson Flying Service of Salt Lake City, Utah. (Ralston, Rawlston, aka Roselli on board, as handwritten notations on flight plan) ( located in FBI 26 Lab file; referenced as, "Plumlee ITSA") Roselli was in DC a few days before the assassination and flew down to Tampa two days before the assassination; reg at the Congress Inn Tampa Fla. A few days before his trip to Washington DC he was signed in at the JM WAVE gate as COL Ralwston , Miami Station (documented) (FBI Hoover changed the record at request of CIA; referenced Dade County Homicide investigation, ref; Det. Smith Miami Homo 1981) Mc Cord Ranch of NM..., also note another FBI document in reference to the $15,000 found in a bus locker in West Palm, Florida Spring of 63.., the money was later RETURNED to Roselli (as noted by FBI documents and testimony of subject, 1963) This money was received at the Grace Ranch for the purchase of military hardware (P-51) at Miranda Air Park north of Tucson, AZ. The aircraft could not be obtained and the money was taken from AZ by a pilot to West Palm Beach, Florida and put in a bus locker..., and eventually the money was given to Roselli by the "AGENTS" ( note: two sets of FBI documents were released by the FBI. One said nothing was found in the locker except an "old pair of binoculars", ref; FOIA, 1981 release. Another FOIA 1997 release stated,... " the money was found in the locker and turned over to the CIA (agents) by the FBI. This information was classified secret until 1997. or there about. This information was given to Congressman Tom Downing, Senator Gary Hart and Senator Berry Goldwater before the HSCA was even formed. (1976-77) Perhaps some would like to highlight and post the documents... I do not have time , nor care. I was asked by a friend to POST this information and to point to those references and documents... I care less what is done with this information... Its been available for years ( 1963-1976-78; as well as few days before Roselli was murdered, (note infomation to PHX Org Crime and PHX FBI on July 24, 1976 concerning concern for the safty of subject and ???...; (FBI PHX 62 and XXX documentation in PHOENIX Org Crime detail files as well as PHX FBI files...ref; Sgt Ed Salem and Sgt H. Hawkins) as well as released of FOIA to Barnard Finisterwald Jr.,1981 and another FOIA release in 1993; 1997 There are conflicting FBI documents released by FOIA FBI) (note FBI document; "came to residence of subject wanting to know everything about ROSELLI if Roselli was noit mentioned in previous contacgt on July 24..., then why did they come to subjects house in August after Roselli's body had been found.., asking about any and all information subject may have pertaining to Roaselli and his murder?) I think that is a valid question as yet has not been answered. I post this for those who are really serious about the JFK mess and Roselli's background before the assassination. I, as I have said, care less what is done with this information and documentation, or how it is chewed up by the so called experts. Its documented before the fact as far back as the spring 1963 and again in 1976 as well as 1991) (62-2116)FWIW. Plumlee P.S. Roselli never trained anyone let alone at No Name... No Name was never CIA or connected to same, or associated in any way with the CIA or MI. I care less what others have said on that subject, its wrong. If the true story about Roselli was ever released then all the books and previous theories would have to be re written and we know that is never going to happen.. The experts have spoken.. Players don't mean CRAP. Dead or Alive. Want to know who the lady was? suck eggs. Hey Tosh Re; yours above on Roselli-CIA-MI and No Name Key, here is another observation from my 1990 manuscript/book on the subject. ........the majority of these medical supplies were destined to accompany {Skip} Hall and {Larry} Howard's car and trailer load of weapons and ammunition to No Name Key in Florida. The goods were to aid "La Sombra" {The Shadows}, an anti-Castro raider group under the command of Hall. This effort was organized by {LDS} W. Cleon Skosen and {JBS} John H. Rousselot, and chaired by anti-Castro Cubans. It was not a CIA operation. Your right on Harry. The word "Independent" comes to mind. As you know at one time there were as many as eleven, "Independent" private funded groups operating around south Florida and none of them were government sanctioned, or affiliated with CIA (as some have claimed) Most of them ( the independents) only "ripped off" wealthy Cubans and others who had good intentions and lots of money and only wanted to be a part of what they considered a good cause.. fighting communism and its encroachment on American values. It was a "Cold War" issue in those days. Some, as I called them, "Mercs" took advantage of this.., and the money. However, I do qualify to a degree and say not all the independents worked the circuit of money grabbing and the likes. There were some good ones who, in their own way, worked the cause. Sad to say most of those types were shut down along with the frauds by the government and the FBI. It was a different time and place back in those days..., a time when the now eight to five cannot even comprehend. Take care friend. Pete. As to the lady, Its in the FOIA FBI early 1981 documents, which, you, Jim, and I marked that day in Texas. Castro's girlfriend.., She was American and was a friend of Lisa Howard..., remember? However at that time you as well as Jim did not seem interested in Lily Gondi CIA Alias or Howard... the NY lady in question... You guys just flew right over that little tid bit of information because you wanted to get to the "Umbrella man, next to Gator" and the code names used on my flight to Dallas... remember? I remember you were upset because I could not or would not tell you, because I never knew their real names and told you and Jim so...and too why I would not know their real names However, you would or could not accept that...., you missed so much back in those days because you were focused so much on trying to prove a theory rather than listen to an operative or read what was before you... Snooze you loose.... sorry bout' that... to late now... You take care and love the Wolf....and too, the Bear. Tosh

I agree. To which destination did he travel in Arizona? Licavoli's Grace Ranch? Wim YES. From Caravan Inn in Phoenix to Grace Ranch after returning from Thunderbird Inn in Nevada outside of Vegas (November of 1963 ( also see information concerning another earlier flight with Roselli from Burbank and Santa Barbara CA to Grace Ranch outside of Tucson AZ; as well as a Galveston Texas flight also in the spring of 1963 (reference, April 1963 flight plan of N6393 Echo flown from Thomson Flying Service of Salt Lake City, Utah. (Ralston, Rawlston, aka Roselli on board, as handwritten notations on flight plan) ( located in FBI 26 Lab file; referenced as, "Plumlee ITSA") Roselli was in DC a few days before the assassination and flew down to Tampa two days before the assassination; reg at the Congress Inn Tampa Fla. A few days before his trip to Washington DC he was signed in at the JM WAVE gate as COL Ralwston , Miami Station (documented) (FBI Hoover changed the record at request of CIA; referenced Dade County Homicide investigation, ref; Det. Smith Miami Homo 1981) Mc Cord Ranch of NM..., also note another FBI document in reference to the $15,000 found in a bus locker in West Palm, Florida Spring of 63.., the money was later RETURNED to Roselli (as noted by FBI documents and testimony of subject, 1963) This money was received at the Grace Ranch for the purchase of military hardware (P-51) at Miranda Air Park north of Tucson, AZ. The aircraft could not be obtained and the money was taken from AZ by a pilot to West Palm Beach, Florida and put in a bus locker..., and eventually the money was given to Roselli by the "AGENTS" ( note: two sets of FBI documents were released by the FBI. One said nothing was found in the locker except an "old pair of binoculars", ref; FOIA, 1981 release. Another FOIA 1997 release stated,... " the money was found in the locker and turned over to the CIA (agents) by the FBI. This information was classified secret until 1997. or there about. This information was given to Congressman Tom Downing, Senator Gary Hart and Senator Berry Goldwater before the HSCA was even formed. (1976-77) Perhaps some would like to highlight and post the documents... I do not have time , nor care. I was asked by a friend to POST this information and to point to those references and documents... I care less what is done with this information... Its been available for years ( 1963-1976-78; as well as few days before Roselli was murdered, (note infomation to PHX Org Crime and PHX FBI on July 24, 1976 concerning concern for the safty of subject and ???...; (FBI PHX 62 and XXX documentation in PHOENIX Org Crime detail files as well as PHX FBI files...ref; Sgt Ed Salem and Sgt H. Hawkins) as well as released of FOIA to Barnard Finisterwald Jr.,1981 and another FOIA release in 1993; 1997 There are conflicting FBI documents released by FOIA FBI) (note FBI document; "came to residence of subject wanting to know everything about ROSELLI if Roselli was noit mentioned in previous contacgt on July 24..., then why did they come to subjects house in August after Roselli's body had been found.., asking about any and all information subject may have pertaining to Roaselli and his murder?) I think that is a valid question as yet has not been answered. I post this for those who are really serious about the JFK mess and Roselli's background before the assassination. I, as I have said, care less what is done with this information and documentation, or how it is chewed up by the so called experts. Its documented before the fact as far back as the spring 1963 and again in 1976 as well as 1991) (62-2116)FWIW. Plumlee P.S. Roselli never trained anyone let alone at No Name... No Name was never CIA or connected to same, or associated in any way with the CIA or MI. I care less what others have said on that subject, its wrong. If the true story about Roselli was ever released then all the books and previous theories would have to be re written and we know that is never going to happen.. The experts have spoken.. Players don't mean CRAP. Dead or Alive. Want to know who the lady was? suck eggs.

The CIA Wants YOU!

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