Mark Knight

How about considering the fact that Fetzer, in the past, has gone off on various tangents, and sometimes has responded to legitimate criticism with extended rants having nothing to do with legitimate rebuttal, may have caused many of us to assume that Fetzer had gone "off his meds" or "fallen off the wagon" or whatever one more time...and thus many of us considered replying to such irrational comments was unnecessary. Did such a NON-sinister answer ever occur to you? Or is everything [except, of course the JFK assassination] a conspiracy in your world?

Bill, I believe that your #3 is probably the lynchpin of the entire LN dilemma. The WC, despite their extensive analysis of where, when, and how Oswald spent his money in 1962-62, could not show where, when, or how he obtained ammunition for the Mannlicher-Carcano 6.5mm rifle. NO ONE at ANY of the Dallas-area gun shops claims to have sold the ammo to Oswald, despite an extensive FBI search. Oswald didn't order any ammunition from Klein's at the time the rifle was ordered. No one in New Orleans came forward with information that Oswald purchased any ammunition there, despite individuals coming forward with stories about Oswald that were much more strange and bizarre. Now, if Oswald had the ammo in his possession and loaded it into a stripper clip, why weren't Oswald's fingerprints found on the spent cartridges? [Maybe Capt. Fritz's handling of the cartidges destroyed that evidence?] No, the truth is, no LN'er can prove that Oswald ever had any ammunition for the MC. Of course, if Ozzie was a straw buyer, psooibly for the Dodd committee, no ammo in Oswald's hands is necessary. The only person who needed to have ammunition for the MC would be the person who MAY have set Ozzie up as the patsy. For that matter, why weren't Ozzie's prints found anywhere on the MC besides the underside of the barrel, if it was disassembled when it came into the TSBD and Ozzie assembled it? It's pretty hard to install a barreled action into a wooden stock without handling the barrel or action ABOVE where it mounts into the stock [try it sometime!]...in fact, it's close to impossible. But I'd just be satisfied if the LN'ers could determine where, when,and how Oswald got the ammunition for the rifle. Since they already cannot place Oswald at the southeast window of the TSBD's 6th floor with the MC in his hands at the moment the shots were fired--according to Dallas Police Chief Jesse Curry, no less--I doubt they'll be able to place any MC ammunition in his hands, either.

I still find value in the discussions here. When seeking pearls, you have to go through some oysters...and some of the theories here ARE merely oysters. But occasionally you'll find a pearl [of wisdom, or of fact] in the places you least expect them. I'm not an evangelist; I'm not out to "convert" anyone to my particular theory of the assassination. If you ARE an evangelist of the assassination variety, you probably don't belong here. I am seeking truth, and not the "truth" that fits my particular theory; but the truth that will solve the mystery,and answer the unanswered questions about the JFK assassination. Truth is, as police chief Jesse Curry stated it, that NO ONE can undeniably place Lee Harvey Oswald in the southeast window of the sixth floor of the Texas School Book Depository with a rifle in his hand and his finger on the trigger at the time the shots were fired at John F. Kennedy. Therefore, there remains REASONABLE DOUBT that Oswald is the assassin. I am convinced that a 6.5mm Mannlicher-Carcano was indeed capable of making the shots claimed. And I am convinced that Oswald had the ability to make three shots in eight seconds at a range of less than 100 yards. I am NOT convinced that Oswald was the man firing the rifle. I am not convinced that Oswald carried the rifle into the TSBD that Friday morning. I am not convinced that the MC "short rifle" recovered from the TSBD was the same "shortened rifle" it appears that Oswald/Hidell ordered. And I believe the evidence regarding the Dallas post office box rented by Oswald is suspect, as is the money order allegedly used to purchase the MC rifle. You plead that the problems with the CT's and the LN'ers are insurmountable, and that this is all an exercise in futility. I contend that while finding the complete truth may indeed be futile, it most CERTAINLY would be futile if we just throw up our hands, say it's not worth the effort, and go sit in fromt of our TV's and let our brains atrophy. I choose not to embrace that futility. If you choose to do so, that is YOUR choice, and YOURS ALONE.

Just "keepin' it real," Lee...as we used to say "back in the day." The LN'ers want to jump on any mistakes we make, so if we catch and correct 'em first, we are less succeptible to their criticisms....IMHO.

Lee, I fail to see the connection between Budget Auto Sales, and Budget Car Rental which would NATURALLY be located at the airport...which would be Love Field. While I'm conspiracy-minded, I see nothing unusual about a car rental outfit being located at the airport...even the airport from which JFK began his fatal motorcade. So please explain the significance that I'm apparently missing.

It is my opinion that Dr. Crenshaw was possibly mistaken in his identification of the rifle in question. As the AR-15 was relatively new in 1963, the rifle used by the SS [particularly the one photographed in the hands of SS agent George Hickey in the period right after the assassination] was probably misidentified as a "Tommy gun" [which, in my youth, was often portrayed with a drum magazine in Hollywood gangster flicks]. But other than Dr. Crenshaw, does anyone else identify the rifle on the scene as a Thompson?

Bill, I am still of the opinion that the CLEAN laundry service, and the van in the photo, may have been related to mil intel surveillance [e.g., Powell]...and the name CLEAN may have been intentional, as a play on the pronunciation of KILLEEN, the city in Texas near Fort Hood. JMHO...nothing factual to back it up with, at this point

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Considering all that Oswald did, all the places he went, and all the people he knew...if Oswald wasn't doing this stuff on orders from a handler [FBI, CIA, ONI, or maybe ARMY Intel], if the LN'er are correct that this was all a coincidence...then Lee Harvey Oswald was the REAL Forrest Gump.

Historic Auto Museum

If I'm ever arrested and charged with murder, I want my defense attorney to hire Duke Lane as a consultant.

IIRC, didn't Mr. Buell Wesley Frazier claim he was eating his lunch "in the basement" of the TSBD?

Mike, I realize that as late as Friday night, the DPD hadn't ruled out OTHER "30 caliber" weapons as well...after all, they picked up Frazier's .303 Enfield, didn't they? BUT the big distinguishing feature is that the military-derived "30 calibers" are ALL bolt-action, while the "Western-style" or "cowboy" 30 calibers were almost ALL either Winchester or Marlin 30-30 LEVER actions. That NEITHER the FBI nor the DPD caught the fact that BOTH were signing off on a receipt for a rifle that didn't exist--at least not in police custody--a LEVER action rifle with serial number C2766, seems QUITE odd. Shouldn't someone on ONE side of the table or the other have said, "WHOA--that's NOT what we have here" ?? Or are we admitting the police, who have to be able to describe a weapon a criminal might be carrying, CAN'T...even when they have it in their grubby little paws? [Or maybe it's THEIR descendants who keep clamoring for the banning of all SEMIautomatic weapons...because they can't tell the difference between a semi and a full auto?]

But still there persists that percentage of the population with the "...from my cold dead fingers..." mindset, and that DOES apply to their view of their government. That ten percent would be very perceptive. With US debt to China at unsustainable levels, eventually either a deal will be cut for a portion of US territory, or the Chinese will attempt a "foreclosure" on that debt by a military-backed "repossession" action. Either way, the outcome won't be pretty. Jack, I'm a gun owner, and I believe that the Second Amendment guarantees an individual right to bear arms. But AT NO TIME has the election of ANY person or party to power sent me running out to buy MORE guns and stock up on THOUSANDS of rounds of ammunition, as many of the people I mentioned have done. ONLY a deep-seated FEAR of their own government could trigger such a knee-jerk reaction in people, IMHO. I feel I have enough firearms in enough calibers and gauges for all the home protection I would ever need, SHORT OF a governmental attack. And most of these people are/were in the SAME position BEFORE Obama's election.

was there a description discrepancy in the ads? The Mannlicher-Carcano was never available as a lever-action rifle [think "cowboy rifle"]. The lever action reference, im MY mind, goes back to the earliest description of the murder weapon released over the radio, which referred to a "30 caliber rifle." The most popular 30 caliber rifle in America, at least in 1963, was the Winchester 30-30, which was a legendary lever action rifle. The military, with the exception of the old Indian-fighting days, has almost exclusively used bolt action rifles. So obvioulsy any gun expert on the DPD knew that M-C serial number C2766 was a BOLT action rifle, and NOT a Lever action. Ditto for the FBI. So how did BOTH manage to sign off on the receipt for a lever-action rifle...effectively signing something that ALL PARTIES INVOLVED knew was NOT an accurate representation of the rifle before them, and therefore also NOT an accurate representation of the facts? Mighty puzzling, IMHO, as these were TRAINED PROFESSIONALS here, not rank amateurs.

Jack, I respectfully disagree...in part. When Obama was elected, suddenly the prices of guns and ammunition spiked, and ammunition became scarce on the market. WHY?? Because Americans--primarily on the right, but not wholly from that side--FEARED that THEIR GOVERNMENT was going to restrict or prohibit the possession of firearms and ammunition, and went on a buying spree...DESPITE a staggering economy, disappearing jobs, and record foreclosures. It is only now, a full 18 months later, that manufacturers are closer to coinciding supplies with demands. If the American people had no FEAR of their government, they would DEMAND that the government repeal the PATRIOT Acts post haste, if for no other reason than for the abridgement of the 4th Amendment contained therein. But the American people won't protest, out of FEAR of being placed on some Homeland Security Deaprtment "list" and becoming subect to harassment, arrest, or being "executed" in some "police accident." BUT...I fully agree that a new American Revolution "is needed." Our country was founded on principles that a "ruling class" was something the Founding Fathers wanted to avoid; yet with the cadre of professional politicians we have today a quasi-"ruling class" DOES exist in America...and as you say, party names are but two sides of the same coin.

When they buried the dead from the May 4, 1970 Kent State University antiwar protest, they also buried the illusion that American TRULY have a right to protest the actions of the government. Since 9/11/2001, it has been far easier to get onto a terrorist watchlist as an American citizen than it is to conduct an effective protest in any reasonable proximity to any government building. And the PATRIOT Act allows American citizens to be declared "enemy combatants" and to be imprisoned indefinitely, which IMHO is in clear violation of the Constitution. And if nothing else works, the IRS can place bogus tax-evasion charges against a citizen, and bankrupt him defending himself against the charges. So I would have to answer that, for the most part, Americans ARE afraid fo their government...and for good reason. Since 9/11, there is a far greater chance of a Tianemen Square event occurring in the United States than at anytime in the nation's history. The '68 Democratic Convention in Chicago is no longer merely an historic event; it's now a warning to citizens.

I find it odd that no one picked up on the OTHER glaring error in the FBI/DPD receipt...that the rifle was referred to as a LEVER action, when it is CLEARLY a BOLT action. Interesting that NEITHER the DPD nor the FBI questioned that. I'm no firearms expert by any stretch of the imagination, but any kid who's ever hunted squirrels with a .22 knows a lever action from a bolt action. Wonder how that slid past BOTH agencies?

I veiwed results first. The results were: A = 4 B = 3 C = 4 I then voted for B, and the results afterwards were: A = 4 B = 4 C = 4 So I think the poll is functioning properly now...unless it allows me to vote twice. Just checked, it won't allow me to vote again.

I received a PM from Gary Mack on this subject. BUT...since I never signed the contract to become a "sock puppet" for Gary, I guess if he thinks it's important to the topic, he can either (a) post his comments himself [like THAT will ever happen!] or get one of his other "sock puppets" to post it for him.

Several years ago, I actually contacted the Archives and got the follow-up report. Amazingly, Rosen--the same apathetic behind who refused to read the autopsy report--followed-up on the article in question by...calling Robert Bouck at the Secret Service to see if it was true. Bouck said no. END OF INVESTIGATION. No interviews with the men who pulled up the carpet. No interviews with the men who worked on the car. Nothing. While Rosen is rarely discussed, he is one of those most responsible for the disgusting mess we have today. He also refused to acquire the autopsy report--which led to much confusion when the FBI started telling the press the autopsy report claimed the back wound bullet fell out, etc. If the FBI could prove there was a bullet hole in the floor of the presidential limo, the stuff really hits the fan. If the bullet hole was from a shot fired from behind, there's at least one more shot to account for...and the 3-shot scenario from the 6th floor of the TSBD goes out the window. And if the bullet hole is from ANY other direction, the lone gunman theory is toast. So it was imperative that the FBI should NOT find a bullet hole in the floor of the limo, lest they open a can of worms that MANY folks didn't want opened. So "of course" they didn't interview the people who had examined the floor of the limo; any confirmation of a bullet hole there blows the entire case out of the water.

Silence on my part indicates that I was working 2nd shift when your current post was made at 9:30 pm EDT, and is not related to content [or contentment] at all.

Jack, it could be because this is Easter Sunday, and folks with Christian backgrounds are spending time with family instead of retreating to the solitary world of the internet. Having said that...I think you bring up a VERY valid point. Anyone have a '63 Greyhound or Trailways bus schedule that would include routes connecting Dallas and New Orleans? Or perhaps the car-ride-with-the-handler scenario would apply.

Since it is against forum policy to question the motives of other posters, I will avoid doing so...but Gary, you expressed the issue quite well. The other issue that comes to mind is that apparently some here have the idea that this forum is a democracy; it is decidedly NOT. I would characterize it as a benign dictatorship, and I wish to suggest that is a GOOD thing, 99% of the time. And I appreciate all efforts to get Peter's posts back, as they create some historical perspective on the forum.

I came to this forum to learn, and to gain access to information and insight not available elsewhere on the subject of the JFK assassination. I find myself surprised to be on the same side as Len Colby where the removal of Peter Lemkin's posts is concerned, as Mr. Colby and I have never found common ground before on ANY subject. And it wasn't Peter Lemkin, but the esteemed Dr. James Fetzer, who called me a disinfo agent when I raised a question about a point someone was trying to make awhile back. I have no interest in going to the DPF, nor do I have any intention of trashing this forum there or anywhere else. I have a lot less problem with Peter Lemkin's removal from the forum [for cause, according to many who should know] than with the removal of Peter's posts, which have historical value to the forum itself. But I have concerns for what Andy Walker's actions imply toward the unfettered free flow of information in the discussion of the JFK assassination. Does this mean that anyone else whose position differs from Andy's position is subject to having their non-aggressive posts likewise removed? I would certainly hope that is not the case, but over time I have found many of Andy's posts to be mean-spirited towards those with whom he disagrees...so I must entertain the possibility that vindictiveness might be directed at others, for whatever reason he might choose. Still, as we used to say in the '60's: It's YOUR world, man; I'm just walkin' through it. And if these actions signal the end of the JFK discussion forum, then I will add that I have found the majority of my time here to be quite educational and enlightening, and most of the discussions--at least those NOT of the Dan Akroyd/Jane Curtin "Jane, you ignorant slut!" variety--to have broadened my understanding of the events surrounding the JFK assassination. For that opportunity, I salute both John Simkin and Andy Walker for their part in providing the forum. And I also agree with Mr. Colby that Mr. Healy's comments on the subject add heat, but no light.