Chris Davidson

http://www.mejuba.com/albums/jfkass/112938/5843303/show/original chris

Ratio = ft./frames = 3/4 in terms of 30ft. Ratio = 1sec to 1mph. 44ft/58frames + 30ft/33frames = 74ft/91frames 91frames/18.3 frames per sec = 4.97 sec. 74ft/4.97 sec = 14.88ft per sec = 10.12 mph The average speed of the real 362 Z frames over 265.3 ft is 9.12mph. 362frames - 91 frames = 271 frames. Ratio 271/362 = .748 Ratio of frames/frames 265.3ft -44ft = 221.3 ft 265.3 + 30ft = 295.3ft Ratio 221.3/295.3 = .749 Ratio of ft/ft chris P.S. Keeps the limo moving at a steady pace. BTW, 44ft/58frames + 30ft/33frames = 74ft/91frames 91frames/18.3 frames per sec = 4.97 sec. 74ft/4.97 sec = 14.88ft per sec = 10.12 mph If you would like to connect this back to the overall picture, with 30ft added to the original distance, then compare it to 362frames/295.3ft 362frames/18.3 frames per sec = 19.78 sec. 295.3 ft/19.78 sec = 14.92 ft sec = 10.15 mph chris

Besides having the limo move at an even pace, the previous posted numbers do have a significance. 44ft/58frames = 3/4= ft/frames ratio. 58 frames is the remainder of 91-33 frames, which coincidentally is the last frame span used by the WC in their measurements (frame255-313). Frame 255-313 + 33 frames = 346frames (255-346=91 frames) 44ft is the distance from the Towner film start (JFK in limo) to JFK aligned with the TSBD corner. 44ft is also the distance between Station C and Position A so designated by the WC in their measurements. 91 frames is the total frame count from Towner film start (JFK in limo) to JFK aligned with the TSBD corner. 91 frames is 1/4 of the overall 362 frame scenario. In fact, if you look at the first column in the graph I provided previously, notice where the 1/4 marks occur. I'll explain the 271 position (91 x 3) when I post the next graph column. 221.3ft (136.1ft WC frames 161-313) + (85.2ft) is the distance from the TSBD corner (JFK in limo) to extant Z313. 295.3ft is 30ft added to the original overall distance of 265.3ft, which by the way will put you at Station# 4+95.3. Puts you right in the land of Altgens. Station# 2+00(Towner start) + 265.3ft = Station# 4+65.3 = WC entry for Z313 headshot Station# 2+00(Towner start) + 295.3ft = Station# 4+95.3 = Altgens headshot 33frames in 30ft = 33/18.3=1.8sec 30ft/1.8 sec = 16.66frames per sec = 11.33mph 1.8sec = difference between Myers film sync using 22.8 frames per sec(Towner film) vs. real 18.3 frames per sec. 167Towner frames/22.8 frames per sec = 7.32 sec. 167Towner frames/18.3 frames per sec = 9.12 sec Another way to look at it is: 9.12 sec x 18.3 frames per sec = 166.89frames 7.32 sec x 18.3 frames per sec = 133.95frames 33frame difference chris P.S. Splitting the differences. Accommodating 30ft and 33 frames.

Ratio = ft./frames = 3/4 in terms of 30ft. Ratio = 1sec to 1mph. 44ft/58frames + 30ft/33frames = 74ft/91frames 91frames/18.3 frames per sec = 4.97 sec. 74ft/4.97 sec = 14.88ft per sec = 10.12 mph The average speed of the real 362 Z frames over 265.3 ft is 9.12mph. 362frames - 91 frames = 271 frames. Ratio 271/362 = .748 Ratio of frames/frames 265.3ft -44ft = 221.3 ft 265.3 + 30ft = 295.3ft Ratio 221.3/295.3 = .749 Ratio of ft/ft chris P.S. Keeps the limo moving at a steady pace.

David, 2.23sec x 18.3 frames per sec = 40frames Ratio of ft./frames = 3/4. chris

Looking back at the chart in the previous post and addressing the 3.74mph entry (red box) in terms of 30ft. The WC entry (in the middle of the column) for 3.74 mph = 5.49ft sec 30ft / 5.49ft sec = 5.46 sec 5.46sec x18.3 frames per sec = 100 frames chris P.S. The WC actually uses 5.5 sec for their calculations dealing with 100 frames.

30ft /13.41ft per sec (average overall speed) = 2.237sec. The match from the chart is 2.24mph which = 167frames/18.3 frames per sec = 9.12 sec = 30ft/9.12sec = 3.28ft per sec = 2.237mph. chris P.S. Ratio = 1sec to 1mph

Ian, Part of the overall equation. Now there is 362 frames @ 265.3ft @18.3Frames per sec. Total time is 362/18.3 fps = 19.78 sec Average speed is 265.3ft/ 19.78 sec = 9.125mph=13.41ft per sec. chris

So, total frames from Towner start to Z313 = 362. What is the total distance from Towner start to extant Z313 or real 362? Towner start is 2+00. CE884 tells us what the distance is from Towner start to extant Z313 or real 362 Frame Z313 is Station# 4+65.3, which is 265.3 ft from Station# 2+00. chris http://educationforu...attach_id=23613

Ian, You are correct. chris

The first part. Any questions feel free to inquire. chris

I have stabilized the background for frames 255-313. It is running at 18 frames per sec. http://www.mejuba.co...7/show/original Give it a minute to load. chris

Frame 161-255 = 94 frames @ 87.2ft = 11.53 mph From frame 255 to 313, does the limo, according to film analysis, slow down!!! If so, might it be 3.74 mph slower than 11.53mph at some point during the 255-313 span covering a distance of 15ft!!!! Z255-313 = 58 frames @ 48.9ft traveled @ 3.17 seconds. 48.9ft-15ft = 33.9ft 11.53mph - 3.74mph = 7.796 mph= 11.46 ft per sec 15ft/11.46 ft per sec = 1.308 sec. 33.9ft/1.87sec = 18.12 ft per sec= 12.32 mph 1.308sec x 18.3 frames per sec = 24 frames 1.87 sec x 18.3 frames per sec = 34 frames 24 + 34 = 58 frames 25/33 = .75 Frame 255 + 34 = 289 Frame 289+ 24 = 313 Frame 255 + 34 = 289 + 58 = 347 Since frame 168 was surveyed in as 161, the above equation would look like this: 168-255=87frames@87.2ft= 12.44mph Z255-313 = 58 frames @ 48.9ft traveled @ 3.17 seconds. 12.44-3.74mph= 8.7 mph= 12.78ft sec 15ft/12.78ft sec = 1.17 sec 33.9ft/2sec = 16.95ft sec = 11.53 mph 1.17sec x 18.3 frames per sec = 21.4 frames 2 sec x 18.3 frames per sec = 36.6 frames 255 + 36.6 = 292 292 + 21 = 313 + 33 = 346 BTW, the ratio of 22/36.6= .6= ratio of 100/166 chris P.S. Take note of the mph and frame count and compare them back to the section in Myers I just described from Station C to the end of Towner. If you so desire, you can work out the distance too, but I'll guess it's somewhere close to 48.9ft. Working it Front To Back, just like it was originally done!!! chris

I like using Myers to break it down. For instance: The thin blue line running through the Houston Street curb is Station "C". We know this from Shaneyfelt's testimony and plotting it using distances from the WC. From that thin blue line to the Towner end is 91 frames. Remember, 76 Towner end frames after JFK's TSBD corner alignment + the distance from TSBD corner to Station C. You can figure that distance by using the plat previously supplied because we know the distance from the snipers nest to Station C is 15.5ft thanks to the WC. It is approx 6ft. from snipers nest to TSBD corner, so the difference is approx 9.5ft. Using Myers plat at this point in time yields this; 9.5ft/11.6ft per sec = .818 sec x 18.3 frames per sec = 15 frames So, from Station C to the End of Towner is 91 frames. Isn't that quite interesting since we know that from the Towner beginning to JFK aligned with the TSBD corner is also 91 frames. And, using the power of deductive reasoning, within Towner, we know from the beginning of Towner to Station C is 76 frames and JFK TSBD corner aligned to the Towner end is 76 frames. The reason why STATION C becomes so important when you don't use it as a measuring point directly parallel to the snipers nest. chris P.S. Give me an affirmative that you understand this part so I can proceed with the next post, which you might enjoy. Unless you catch on beforehand.

It wasn't the next post but here it is. The gif is from Dorman's film. In the red square is Croft moving toward his final destination, which we see in z133. The last Dorman frame he is in is Dorman 333. This means Croft has to get from his Dorman position to his Z133 position in .23 seconds or 4 Zframes. Or, he just needs more time than he has been given. More time would mean the .82 seconds/15 Z frames (JFK in limo to limo front) Myers gives for the gap between the end of Towner to the beginning of Z. This has to occur AFTER the completion of the Towner film for the "measuring stick" change to occur while not sending up any red flags. The timing problems are subtle, but they are there. chris P.S. Not sure why the gif isn't playing but here is a link to it: http://www.mejuba.com/albums/jfkass/112938/4797624/show/original

The numbers are very intriguing David, but I don't believe at 16 frames per sec there are enough frames. If we agree that Towner is 18.3 frames per sec and start at the TSBD corner with Myers time to Z313 @ 13.95 total seconds @ 255frames, I break it down this way: 16fps 18.3fps TSBD Corner to Towner End (66frames-4.15sec) (76frames- 4.15 sec) Z161-313 (133frames-8.30 sec) (152frames-8.30 sec) Towner End to Z161 (24frames-1.47 sec) (27frames-1.47sec) Totals 223frames-13.92 sec 255frames-13.92 sec Very interesting, the total of 223 is 32 frames short of the 255 mark or 2 seconds @16 frames per sec. Which is a 1 frame difference from the 33frames@30ft@18.3 frames per sec formula I am using. 223 frames @ 222ft traveled. 1ft per 1 frame. No extra frames for a slowdown from Z255-313. chris

Ratio of 2.24/3.74 = .6 13.95sec x .6 = 8.35 sec Zframe 161-313 = 152 frames/18.3 = 8.30 seconds. chris

It's important to think in terms of differences and ratios. For instance: Difference between 3.74 mph/2.24 mph = 1.5mph x 1.47ft(1mph)=2.2 ft per sec Myers "JFK aligned with TSBD corner" to Z313 = 13.95 seconds. 13.95 sec x 2.2 ft sec = 30.69ft. chris

Briefly, Referring back to the "Vehicle Speed Analysis" chart I supplied in post #11, the entries for average mph in the top right/lower top right columns are: 3.74 and 2.24 mph. I explained these were conversions for: 100 frames@18.3 frames per sec @30 ft = 3.74 mph 166/7 frames@18.3 frames per sec@30ft= 2.24 mph That was an equation for 30ft total. Well, the smaller picture says we are dealing with 15ft increments. So, lets divide the equation by half. 100/2=50 frames 166/2=83 frames Total = 83 + 50 = 133 frames. The average is 133 frames. Zfilm start Difference = 83-50 = 33frames. 133-33 = 100 frames 100/133= .75 or 3/4 ratio 2.24/3.74 = .598= 50/83=.602 3.74mph = 5.49ft per sec 50 frames/18.3 frames per sec = 2.73 sec. 2.73 sec x 5.49ft per sec = 15ft chris P.S. The "instantaneous speed" AKA "Vehicle Speed Analysis' document was created by the WC to figure out how to hide/adjust 15ft increments within the total scenario.

David, I want to continue on from where I left off before we started talking about Altgen's and his testimony. One of my main objections when I started this thread was to keep any testimony not related to the math/numbers out of it. Just put it aside for now, and we can revisit it later. I don't want to get sidetracked at this point in time. I understand what you are saying about the span from 255-313, but it is essentially the same predicament as 313-346 in the sense of showing the reality of what was done. Let me explain a little more about the 255-313 span in my next post. Bear with me!!! chris P.S. It's truly important that the math used and how applied in terms of frames/distance/time by the WC assassination recreation be clearly understood before applying it back to the film. Not just by you and me, but others as well.

Chris, It is not just the WC that says that Altgens is referring to the Z313 headshot. Ike Altgens is on record saying that is exactly what he is referring to. James. James, I tend to disregard the reference to particular shots and deal with the numbers. A distance between 2 shots was 15ft. The testimony deals with 15 and 30ft increments. Coincidence once again? I think not!!! How far (zfilm) was Altgens from the 313 headshot and how far would he have been from the limo traveling another 15ft towards him. Remember, is he describing the limo front or JFK in the limo in relation to his position or the limo in the center lane? chris

David, Yes, Towner @18.3 frames per sec. Myers reduces the time span by increasing the frame rate. Yes, another shot near Altgens, near where he stands by the yellow marker on the curb. The WC makes it appear that Altgen's was describing the 313 headshot, not the approx 346 headshot, by pushing the Altgen's recreation photo and his positioning farther east up Elm to coincide with the marker change of "JFK in limo" to "limo front". In essence pushing JFK farther east up Elm as well. Conclusions: The WC tells us what happens, we just have to decipher it. Myers does a good job of complementing their bogus work. For instance: This is from the WC report summary section. The other is from Myer's multisync study. 15frames @ 1ft per frame= 15ft. chris P.S. I'll show you the problem it created with the Dorman film in the next post.

David, I like to look at frame 161 as somewhat of a middle point in this. There is a front end, back end and middle. If this is what you mean in terms of syncing to 161, I agree. Two head shots to JFK? Yes. 15ft proximity to Altgen's could be the middle lane to curb estimation with JFK in direct alignment with Altgens. Or, the front of the limo aligned with Altgens and JFK 15ft back from there. At this point in time, one way to look at it is: 91 Towner frames for JFK to align with the TSBD corner. 76 more to end Towner. 27 more til frame 161. And 152 = WC data from 161-313 A total of 346 frames from the beginning of Towner. 255 Myers frames + 91 beginning Towner frames which aligns JFK with the TSBD corner = 346 total frames. 346-33 frames(30ft@18.3 frames per sec)= frame 313. Check relationship of Altgens to limo/jfk in extant film at frame 346. chris P.S. Remember, I am merely recreating what the WC created.

http://i140.photobucket.com/albums/r25/123steamn/WC884.jpg A long time ago, I created this conversion for CE 884. In the chart on the left, I applied the difference for frame 255-313 in terms of frame count (58) and discovered the elevation match (2.71) between the top and bottom entries. You can now connect this to my previous post in terms of Myers total frames for JFK aligned and 313 headshot = 255 frames and the elimination of the 152 WC frames from 161-313. 255-152 = 103 frames. No coincidence once again. chris

BTW, In case you didn't catch it, the difference between 61 and 76 frames is 15. At a 1ft per 1frame ratio, (rate the WC has the limo traveling from frame 161 to 255) that would be 15ft. Coincidentally, the distance between JFK in limo" and the "limo front". Or, insert the missing 15ft in the previous post of: 27 frames in 43 ft can now become 27 frames in 28ft or approx 1ft per 1frame. Or, keep the 58 and 76 frame frame difference in mind, which will equate to 1 second @ 18.3 frames per sec. chris