Robert Prudhomme

Things have been pretty dull around here lately so, I thought it might be a good time to take another look at JFK's "shallow" back wound; observed by many witnesses to be almost six inches below JFK's collar line (about the level of thoracic vertebra T3) and about 1.5-2 inches to the right of JFK's spinal midline.

First, let's see whereabouts on JFK's back that entrance wound would have been, and how it relates to the location of bones and organs in the upper thorax.

As seen in the top diagram, a bullet entering the back at the level of T3 and 1.5-2 inches to the right of the spine would have nowhere to go but into the Right Upper Lung (RUL). As the skeletal diagram shows, this bullet would miss both the vertebrae and the scapula (shoulder blade) and would have an excellent chance of passing between two ribs, without touching either of them.

As I have pointed out many times, it has long been held as fact that the bullet that hit JFK's back only penetrated the flesh of his back a mere inch; not far enough to enter JFK's right pleural cavity. This shallow penetration, supposedly probed by Commander Humes' finger, is credited to a phenomenon known as a "short shot", in which a rifle cartridge is either loaded with an insufficent gunpowder charge or the entirety of the gunpowder charge in the cartridge does not ignite, drastically reducing the muzzle velocity of the bullet.

In order to reduce the penetrating power of a 6.5mm Carcano bullet, at a 50 yard range, to the point where this bullet will not penetrate more than an inch in soft tissue, its normal muzzle velocity of 2200 feet per second would have to be reduced to less than about 400 feet per second (fps). This presents all kinds of problems in a) accurately hitting within 20 feet of your target and actually getting the bullet to its target.

If you have a rifle that is properly sighted in at a range of, for argument sake, 100 yards, and you chamber a good round into the breech, hitting a target at 50-100 yards is a simple matter of aiming and squeezing the trigger. However, bullets begin to drop as soon as they leave the barrel, and if that bullet leaves the barrel travelling at 1/5th the expected velocity, and the shooter is aiming in a normal fashion and expecting his bullet to be travelling 2200 fps, that bullet will end up impacting the ground (or pavement) far short of the aim point. In the case of JFK, I would not even expect it to hit the back of the limo. This is why it is called a "short shot", as the bullet impacts far "short" of the point of aim.

The next problem you would have with such a slow moving bullet is stability in flight. While the rifling grooves in the rifle's barrel that impart a gyroscopic spin to the bullet in flight account for most of the bullet's stability, the velocity that bullet is travelling at also plays a big part in whether the bullet remains stable in flight, or whether it begins to yaw and tumble on its way to its target. I have seen this problem when handloading rifle cartridges and experimenting with different types of gunpowder, different loads of gunpowder and different weights and styles of bullets. Just by changing the velocity of the bullet slightly, by adding more or less gunpowder, it is possible to over- or under-stabilize a bullet, with the resulting "keyhole" effect on a paper target. A "keyhole" is when a tumbling bullet goes through a paper target side on, leaving the inevitable "keyhole" in the target instead of a round hole. If a bullet still travelling in excess of 2000 fps can be under-stabilized by a reduction in velocity, imagine the lack of stability in the typical 2200 fps bullet reduced in velocity to only 400 fps.

Quite frankly, I don't believe such a slow bullet could have ever made it to JFK's back, making the shallow back wound a myth; at least in my eyes anyways.

The guy with the erect head is in the front seat, Bob. See my post #27, where I have him outlined in green, JFK in blue, and Jackie in red.

I'm not quite sure I follow you here, Sandy. You have the guy in the front outlined in green, and JFK, in the back seat, outlined in blue. I see the guy in the back as having an erect head, and he is nowhere near the guy outlined in green (Roy Kellerman).

Bob,

I don't see anybody with an erect head in the back seat. Will you look at my outlines and describe where the erect person and head are relative to my outlines?

Here's my graphic for your convenience. JFK is slouching and head drooping, as shown with my blue outline. You might need to click the photo to make out the darker blue color.

What you have drawn in as Jackie's head appears to me to be the back of JFK's head.

The guy with the erect head is in the front seat, Bob. See my post #27, where I have him outlined in green, JFK in blue, and Jackie in red.

I'm not quite sure I follow you here, Sandy. You have the guy in the front outlined in green, and JFK, in the back seat, outlined in blue. I see the guy in the back as having an erect head, and he is nowhere near the guy outlined in green (Roy Kellerman).

So, no one has a theory as to how JFK's limp comatose (mostly dead) body can be holding his head erect I don't think Jackie is doing it.

Donald Trump has called for Russia to interfere with the US election.

Here:s the phone # of the Republican National Committee: 202-863-8500

# for Trump Corp.: 212-832-2000

Call them to say No to Treason!

Making phone calls is a key part of the on-going Bernie Revolution, I reckon...

Trump requested Russia to interfere with the US election?

I don't care for Trump but, you're going to have to provide some evidence before I believe that one.

"....on the cover of the National Enquirer...."

Seriously? The National Enquirer??

If you folks are silly enough to vote this nutcase in as President, you deserve everything you get. God help us all.

...reports that he slid into the seat of the car, which he did not; that he fell over into my lap, which he did not.

I just pulled him over into my arms because it would have been impossible to get us really both down with me sitting and me holding him. So that I looked out, I mean as he was in my arms, I put my head down over his head so that his head and my head were right together, and all I could see, too, were the people flashing by. I didn't look back any more. The third...

Here's where it can get dicey with witness statements, Bob. Her testimony is actually pretty good. But during a very short and traumatic time, people either leave things out, misremember, or say the incorrect thing.

Look at this image from the Z film:

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B7Hr9Lrku-CxNEIwYnZIeDNMQmc/view?pref=2&pli=1

She never once mentioned, "And, oh by the way, John, sort of laid sideways and took a peek back into the back seat to see what all the commotion was about." But there he is looking back there.

And it sure doesn't look like she's "pulling him down" and "holding" him in the above photo.

As a matter of fact, her statement, the one you mention, actually gives credence to the upright head you're wondering about being Connally's head when she said, "it would have been impossible to get us really both down."

So there you go. And sometimes, you have to let common sense prevail here, reality vs. fantasy. I mean why in the world would Jackie be pushing and propping up her husband with his head busted open, bleeding and oozing brain matter? It flies against all reason for her to be doing that.

Look at the photo above again, Bob. See Connally's head? Now correlate that head a few seconds more down toward the tunnel and that's the head you're seeing. Because of the compressed angle, it looks like he's right next to Jackie. But he's not, Bob. It's as simple as that.

Seriously, Michael? The figure we are looking at has a set of shoulders and a back as well as a head.

Rectifying....that almost sounds painful, Bart. Maybe because the word is too close to rectum??

FWIW, S.M. Holland, signal supervisor for the Union Terminal railroad was watching the scene captured in the Z-film from a short elevation directly over the Presidential car & he stated in interviews that JFK fell over the back seat on his stomach with his left foot hanging out of the car before the JFK parade car went into the 'tunnel' of Elm Street at the triple underpass/overpass. If correct, some of the image we are analyzing would have to include a portion of JFK's foot.

I believe it was David Lifton who first reported that JFK appeared at autopsy with his left arm extended (as if in a 'Heil Hitler' salute) that was broken out of this contorted, grotesque posture by the autopsy doctors at Bethesda.

OTOH, elevating a person's head suffering from a head wound would have been proper emergency first aid in 1963. I can remember a life guard walking me around the pool someone shoved me from behind into for quite some time as panic situation first aid, after the unexpected shove caused a small head gash & nose bleed. I was forbidden by the lifeguard from reclining in a pool chair for fear of me falling asleep and not waking up.

The only 'towels' the parade car contained that I am aware of were Presidential ornamental hand/lap towels that can be seen hanging in a multitude of pre-motorcade and motorcade photos. I'm not sure if Jackie used them or not to smother her husband's bleeding. If I recall correctly, the Presidential hand towels were still in place in the White House garage photos taken by the FBI the night of the assassination. I'm not aware of the two front seat SS agents stripping off their coats to help control the wounded passengers bleeding either.

Brad Milch

Hi Brad

Do you know which interview it was where Holland stated that he saw JFK's left foot sticking out of the limo as the limo passed under the Triple Underpass? The reason I ask is this would seem to contradict what Holland stated in his WC testimony:

"Mr. STERN - What did you then do?

Mr. HOLLAND - Well. immediately after the shots was fired, I run around the end of this overpass, behind the fence to see if I could see anyone up there behind the fence.

Mr. STERN - That is the picket fence?

Mr. HOLLAND - That is the picket fence.

Mr. STERN - On the north side of Elm Street?

Mr. HOLLAND - Of course, this was this sea of cars in there and it was just a big-it wasn't an inch in there that wasn't automobiles and I couldn't see up in that corner. I ran on up to the corner of this fence behind the building. By the time I got there there were 12 or 15 policemen and plainclothesmen, and we looked for empty shells around there for quite a while, and I left because I had to get back to the office. I didn't give anyone my name. No one--didn't anyone ask for it, and it wasn't but an hour or so until the deputy sheriff came down to the office and took me back up to the courthouse. "

I've heard of JFK's left foot protruding from the limo before. The more I think of it, it is difficult to comprehend how someone could fall to his left, with his left leg under him, and end up wit his left foot sticking out of the car.

Here's a closeup of Z461:

zapruder_z461a.jpg

Thanks, Sandy. Damn, my old eyes get sore trying to study these blurry photos.

Well, if that's not the head, shoulders and back of a man sitting in JFK's spot, I don't know what it is. However, I do like to keep an open mind, and if someone can show evidence of this being an optical illusion, I'm more than willing to look at it.

I agree tat it would be a very bizarre thing for Jackie to push her husband back up into a sitting position. However, we can only imagine the state of shock her mind was in at this moment, and people often do bizarre things in this state, and usually with a great amount of adrenaline boosted strength.

She may have been revulsed at having JFK's shattered skull so close to her, or somehow in her mind it may have seemed she could set everything right by putting JFK back into the position he had occupied just seconds before. I doubt we will ever know her reasons, as it is unlikely that she even recalled doing this.

In the end, if we work hard enough at it (as you seem to do for us), I'm sure there is a perfectly good explanation as to how JFK's head is able to stay erect without flopping over, and there is probably no deep dark secret behind it. I do sometimes think about Cliff Varnell's flechette theory, and how this flechette was supposed to have delivered a paralyzing toxin into JFK. Would that paralysis still be evident if JFK was on the brink of death?

Hi Sandy

In all of the closeup analysis of this figure, did you happen to see anything that look like large head wounds?

Hi Sandy

Good work analyzing this. I tried doing what you said by using the "Ctrl" key and the "+" and "-" keys to zoom in and out. It worked on the first photo I tried but hasn't worked since.

I actually brought this subject up again in the hopes someone with highly refined tools and skills could tell us exactly what we are looking at, and display blow ups for us.

Can we reconcile this at all with still photos of the limo emerging from the underpass? I'm thinking of the ones with the Old Charter billboard visible.

Yes, Andrew. I was trying to find them but was having difficulties. Can you produce them?

It seems that Nellie Connally disagrees with you, Michael, and that her husband cannot be the one we see sitting upright at this point.

From the Warren Commission testimony of Mrs. John B. Connally, JR.:

"Mrs. CONNALLY. In fact the receptions had been. so good every place that I had showed much restraint by not mentioning something about it before.

I could resist no longer. When we got past this area I did turn to the President and said, "Mr. President, you can't say Dallas doesn't love you."
Then I don't know how soon, it seems to me it was very soon, that I heard a noise, and not being an expert rifleman, I was not aware that it was a rifle. It was just a frightening noise, and it came from the right.
I turned over my right shoulder and looked back, and saw the President as he had both hands at his neck.
Mr. SPECTER. And you are indicating with your own hands, two hands crossing over gripping your own neck?
Mrs. CONNALLY. Yes; and it seemed to me there was--he made no utterance, no cry. I saw no blood, no anything. It was just sort of nothing, the expression on his face, and he just sort of slumped down.
Then very soon there was the second shot that hit John. As the first shot was hit, and I turned to look at the same time, I recall John saying, "Oh, no, no, no." Then there was a second shot, and it hit John, and as he recoiled to the right, just crumpled like a wounded animal to the right, he said, "My God, they are going to kill us all."
I never again----
Mr. DULLES. To the right was into your arms more or less?
Mrs. CONNALLY. No, he turned away from me. I was pretending that I was him. I never again looked in the back seat of the car after my husband was shot. My concern was for him, and I remember that he turned to the right and then just slumped down into the seat, so that I reached over to pull him toward me. X was trying to get him down and me down. The jump seats were not very roomy, so that there were reports that he slid into the seat of the car, which he did not; that he fell over into my lap, which he did not.
I just pulled him over into my arms because it would have been impossible to get us really both down with me sitting and me holding him. So that I looked out, I mean as he was in my arms, I put my head down over his head so that his head and my head were right together, and all I could see, too, were the people flashing by. I didn't look back any more. The third shot that I heard I felt, it felt like spent buckshot falling all over us, and then, of course, I too could see that it was the matter, brain tissue, or whatever, just human matter, all over the car and both of us.
I thought John had been killed, and then there was some imperceptible movement, just some little something that let me know that there was still some life, and that is when I started saying to him, "It's all right. Be still." "

I just looked at the frames again and have changed my mind. Look at the third frame and enlarge it quite a bit.

What I see is JFK sitting up on the far right of the bench. Jackie is on her hands and knees, on the bench, facing JFK. But her head is behind JFK's head. So his head must be tilting face-down to some extent.

I suspect that Jackie has her arms around JFK... otherwise she'd be in an unstable position and would fall forward should the driver put on the brake. Her right arm must be down around JFK's butt area... otherwise her weight would only serve to pull him forward too, should the driver put on the brake.

I suspect that Jackie's left arm is wrapped around JFK's neck, under his chin, and that is what is holding his head up.

EDIT: I looked once again and I don't think the dark thing above JFK's back is his head. I think his head is tilted far down forward. Jackie, on her hands and knees, has her head ABOVE his and she is looking down at the top of his head or at his face.

Hi Sandy

What are you using to enlarge this frame with? I tried saving it to a file and enlarging it but it became too grainy very quickly.

Well, that's a possibility but, according to Nellie Connally, John Connally was lying on the floor with her, and this figure's head is definitely higher than the figure that can only be Jackie.

Beside that, this figure is also most definitely right up against the junction of the back seat and the trunk, and I don't believe Connally climbed into the back seat at any point.

As Jackie left the rear seat and climbed out on the trunk lid, it only makes sense that JFK would have fallen down to where his head would have been lying on the spot Jackie's butt had been occupying. This is evidenced by photos showing a massive amount of JFK's blood at this location. When she got back in the car, she would not be able to sit down until JFK was moved out of her spot. It would be very easy for a young adrenalin-charged woman to push her husband back up into a sitting position, and this is why I believe we can see Jackie's pink suit leaning toward the upright figure, still holding him upright.

That part is fairly straightforward. What baffles me is, what is keeping JFK's head erect, and why can we not see a massive amount of damage to his head?

Interesting. How would she be able to keep his head erect with her head?

These four stills, z453, z456, z461 and z462, are from the tail end of the Zapruder film, and show the limo just before it passes under the Triple Underpass.

Clint Hill can be seen still riding on the rear bumper and John Connally is lying on the floor with his wife Nellie.

Who is the man sitting upright in the back seat beside Jackie and, if it is JFK, what is keeping his head upright?

Robert Prudhomme

We're not laughing with you, Dunc, we're laughing at you. Make no mistake about this.

PS

I'm not hurling insults here, James. I'm merely stating a fact.

Personal Insult

My apologies if you find the truth somewhat difficult to handle.

We

I respectfully decline the invitation to join your hallucination.

We're not laughing with you, Dunc, we're laughing at you. Make no mistake about this.

PS

I'm not hurling insults here, James. I'm merely stating a fact.

Well done Chris for confirming The Death Of "Prayer Man"

Here She Is

Duncan

Ever get the feeling that what you are doing has become so ridiculous, no one even takes the time to criticize it anymore?

Good show!

Hi Dave

Perhaps I have not expressed myself clearly enough here.

If suppressed high powered rifles were used in some, but not all, locations in Dealey Plaza, the value of ear witness reports as to the origin of the shots is virtually worthless, as the suppressors would have the effect of making the origin of a shot appear to be coming from where the bullet ended up, not where the bullet originated from.

This fact alone should have us taking a much closer look at evaluating exactly where the suppressed shots may have originated from.

Here is one for you, Dave. Did you know there is a way to make a shot originating from behind the limo appear, to ear witnesses, to have originated from down near the Grassy Knoll?

Other than natural echoes? Pray, do tell.

As I understand it, that silent carbine from WWII doesn't make a sound and is accurate and deadly from quite a distance...

Wasn't you who brought up diversionary sounds like an actual firecracker?

DJ

Hi Dave

The deLisle carbine was indeed completely silent, although whether or not it was as accurate as a high powered rifle is something I doubt. It achieved this silence simply because it was chambered for the .45 calibre pistol round. As this round is subsonic (under the speed of sound), there is no sonic boom heard as this bullet breaks the sound barrier. As the deLisle was also fitted with a suppressor, there was also no muzzle blast, and therefore this weapon was as silent as a bow and arrow. However, I must emphasize the great trade off in accuracy that is made going from a weapon shooting a supersonic rifle round to a weapon shooting a subsonic pistol round.

No, I never suggested a diversionary firecracker. In fact, I don't believe there was a need for such a thing. I believe there was one and possibly two shots that originated from behind the limo, fired from high powered rifle(s) fitted with suppressors. A shot from such a rifle would produce no muzzle blast but, as its bullet would be travelling at supersonic speeds (greater than the speed of sound), it would be breaking the sound barrier, and there would be a loud "crack" heard as it went by.

There is a popular myth that when an object breaks the sound barrier, it produces a sonic boom only at the instant it goes over the speed of sound and then, as it continues at supersonic speeds, it is silent. Nothing could be further from the truth. What actually happens is that object will make one continuous sonic boom for the entire distance and time it is travelling at supersonic speeds.

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The Supersonic Crack

Any projectile moving through the air at a velocity greater than the speed of sound (332 to 340 m/s or 1,089 to 1,114 fps in dry, 18 C or 65 degree F air, depending on who one listens to) will create a supersonic crack. Temperature, humidity and atmospheric pressure variations play a role in raising or lowering the speed of sound by a small percentage. In a firearm which lacks a substantial muzzle report (being fired over an open field) the sound resembles the loud tearing of a bed sheet.

Two sounds are actually created, one from the front of the bullet, and one from the rear. Near trees and buildings the sound waves come back as a distinct crack or pop each time the speeding bullet passes some object with a vertical, reflective surface. Once the muzzle report has been diminished the supersonic boom becomes dominant. Curiously, the sounds will now appear to come from the target area, rather than the rifleman's position. Sound moves through our atmosphere at a relatively fixed rate. A sound wave will typically strike one ear a bit before the other.

The human brain is capable of detecting the difference in time between sound impacting one ear and then the other in an increment of as little as one/six-millionth of a second. With time and practice we soon learn to use this ability to pinpoint the source of a sound very accurately. Because a suppressed muzzle report is relatively quiet, the uninitiated will automatically home in on the loudest sound, which in this case is a sonic boom reflecting from the target area. The intense, sharp sound of the bullet's passage will seem much louder than the muzzle report to someone close to the flight path. Indeed, a rapidly moving .308 bullet will sound louder than a .22 LR pistol, to someone who is positioned a few feet from its flight path.

Smaller diameter bullets make less noise than larger diameter bullets. Supersonic is supersonic. A bullet traveling 366 m/s or 1,200 fps will make about the same noise as one traveling 1220 m/s or 4,000 fps. Projectiles that are .308 inch in diameter will be somewhat louder than .223 bullets. There is no technology which can remove the sound of a supersonic projectile, no matter what claims are made to the contrary.

http://www.silencerresearch.com/sound_suppressors_on_high_powered_rifles.htm

What this author is saying is a bullet will make a sonic boom all the way to its target (or until it slows to subsonic speeds many hundreds of yards out) and the echoes from this boom as it passes objects along the way will make their way back to the ears of witnesses near the source of the shot.

Take the witnesses near the steps of the TSBD. several of them heard shots from down toward the Grassy Knoll while others heard shots from the TSBD. None of them heard any shots from the Dal-Tex Building, even though there is a very good chance shots did come from there. If the muzzle blast of a rifle in the Dal-Tex was suppressed, the first sound they would hear would be the sonic boom of the bullet in front of them, then the echo of this boom as it reflected off the TSBD behind them. Then they would hear a progression of echoes coming from further down Elm St., with the closest echo arriving first. This would mean their attention would be grabbed first by a noise in their immediate vicinity and, as their attention focused, they would begin to hear the sounds returning from down range, and they would have to decide whether the shot was from above them or down range. If the final shot was an un-suppressed rifle in the vicinity of the Grassy Knoll, its very loud muzzle blast would confirm, in the minds of the ear witnesses, the origin of the shots, and they could very easily believe all of the shots were from the Grassy Knoll.

This is, in fact, the very reason high powered rifles for snipers are fitted with suppressors; that being to hide the location of the sniper and give him a chance to escape while everyone is searching for him in the wrong direction.

Do you see now how a shot originating from behind the limo can be made to appear, to ear witnesses, to have originated from the Grassy Knoll?