4 hours ago, Paul Bacon said:

Joe,

I got the booster (moderna) at the begining of December.  Four days later I started feeling poorly and I left work--that was a Friday.  Over the weekend I looked for a Covid test because I began to have suspicions--none were available.  Monday I noticed I didn't have the sense of taste or smell, so I called my doctor and was immediately scheduled for a PCR test at the local hospital.  Four hours later, I was told that I was positive for Covid.  I ended up thinking I may have contracted it when I went for my booster--how ironic!!

So, yes, it's quite possible that you've contracted Covid.  Do get a test!  Your symptoms sound like the disease and not a side effect.

I really think I should get tested. Thanks Paul and everyone else who have sent feedback and well wishes. Doug Caddy, if you had this for 4 straight days two weeks ago I feel for you. That is a long time to go through this.

On 1/13/2022 at 10:26 AM, James DiEugenio said:

I think Pat's words of caution are wise here.

Dr. Robert Shaw was Governor John Connally's chest wound treating surgeon at Parkland hospital the day Connally was shot.

The following are excerpts from his Warren Commission testimony.

Notice how his main questioner Arlen Specter keeps steering Dr. Shaw towards affirming one bullet could have caused all 3 wounds in Connally's body and still look as pristine as the exhibit 399 one?

Read Shaw's answering testimony closely, especially the last part here.

Mr. SPECTER - Is it possible that the bullet which went through the Governor's chest could have emerged being as fully intact as that bullet is?

Dr. SHAW - Yes; I believe it is possible because of the fact that the bullet struck the fifth rib at a very acute angle and struck a portion of the rib which would not offer a great amount of resistance.

Mr. SPECTER - Does that bullet appear to you to have any of its metal flaked off?

Dr. SHAW - I have been told that the one point on the nose of this bullet that is deformed was cut off for purposes of examination. With that information, I would have to say that this bullet has lost literally none of its substance.
 

Mr. SPECTER - Now, as to the wound on the thigh, could that bullet have gone into the Governor's thigh without causing any more damage than appears on the face of that bullet?

Dr. SHAW - If it was a spent bullet; yes. As far as the bullet is concerned it could have caused the Governor's thigh wound as a spent missile.

Mr. SPECTER - Why do you say it is a spent missile, would you elaborate on what your thinking is on that issue?

Dr. SHAW - Only from what I have been told by Dr. Shires and Dr. Gregory, that the depth of the wound was only into the subcutaneous tissue, not actually into the muscle of the leg, so it meant that missile had penetrated for a very short period. Am I quoting you correctly, Dr. Gregory?

Mr. SPECTER - May the record show Dr. Gregory is present during this testimony and----
Dr. GREGORY - I will say yes.

Mr. SPECTER - And indicates in the affirmative. Do you have sufficient knowledge of the wound of the wrist to render an opinion as to whether that bullet could have gone through Governor Connally's wrist and emerged being as much intact as it is?

Dr. SHAW - I do not.

Mr. SPECTER - Dr. Shaw, assume if you will certain facts to be true in hpyothetical form, that is, that the President was struck in the upper portion of the back or lower portion of the neck with a 6.5-mm. missile passing between the strap muscles of the President's neck, proceeding through a facia channel striking no bones, not violating the pleural cavity, and emerging through the anterior third of the neck, with the missile having been fired from a weapon having a muzzle velocity of approximately 2,000 feet per second, with the muzzle being approximately 160 to 250 feet from the President's body; that the missile was a copper jacketed bullet. Would it be possible for that bullet to have then proceeded approximately 4 or 5 feet and then would it be possible for it to have struck Governor Connally in the back and have inflicted the wound which you have described on the posterior aspect of his chest, and also on the anterior aspect of his chest?

Dr. SHAW - Yes.

Mr. SPECTER - And what would your reason be for giving an affirmative answer to that question, Dr. Shaw?

Dr. SHAW - Because I would feel that a missile with this velocity and weight striking no more than the soft tissues of the neck would have adequate velocity and mass to inflict the wound that we found on the Governor's chest.

Mr. SPECTER - Now, without respect to whether or not the bullet identified as Commission Exhibit 399 is or is not the one which inflicted the wound on the Governor, is it possible that a missile similar to the one which I have just described in the hypothetical question could have inflicted all of the Governor's wounds in accordance with the theory which you have outlined on Commission Exhibit No. 689?

Dr. SHAW - Assuming that it also had passed through the President's neck you mean?

Mr. SPECTER - No; I had not added that factor in. I will in the next question.

Dr. SHAW - All right. As far as the wounds of the chest are concerned, I feel that this bullet could have inflicted those wounds.

>>> But the examination of the wrist both by X-ray and at the time of surgery showed some fragments of metal that make it difficult to believe that the same missile could have caused these two wounds.<<<

>>>There seems to be more than three grains of metal missing as far as the I mean in the wrist. <<<

Mr. SPECTER - Your answer there, though, depends upon the assumption that the bullet which we have identified as Exhibit 399 is the bullet which did the damage to the Governor. Aside from whether or not that is the bullet which inflicted the Governor's wounds.

Dr. SHAW - I see.

Mr. SPECTER - Could a bullet traveling in the path which I have described in the prior hypothetical question, have inflicted all of the wounds on the Governor?

Dr. SHAW - Yes.

Mr. SPECTER - And so far as the velocity and the dimension of the bullet are concerned, is it possible that the same bullet could have gone through the President in the way that I have described and proceed through the Governor causing all of his wounds without regard to whether or not it was bullet 399?

Dr. SHAW - Yes.

>>> Mr. SPECTER - When you started to comment about it not being possible, was that in reference to the existing mass and shape of bullet 399? <<<

>>> Dr. SHAW - I thought you were referring directly to the bullet shown as Exhibit 399.<<<

Mr. SPECTER - What is your opinion as to whether bullet 399 could have inflicted all of the wounds on the Governor, then, without respect at this point to the wound of the President's neck?

>>> Dr. SHAW - I feel that there would be some difficulty in explaining all of the wounds as being inflicted by bullet Exhibit 399 without causing more in the way of loss of substance to the bullet or deformation of the bullet. <<<
 

(Discussion off the record.) 

4 hours ago, W. Niederhut said:

This recent analysis by a professor of epidemiology at Kings College is a fairly precise description of the Omicron symptoms my wife and I experienced recently.

What are the symptoms of omicron?

https://theconversation.com/what-are-the-symptoms-of-omicron-174476

January 11, 2021

Thanks for the link WN.

Just viewed it.

The most powerful symptoms for me are the body weakness ( just incredible) pronounced body flu pain everywhere, nausea and stomach pain, pain behind eyes and in the temples and lesser ones of chills and sweats.

Just laying here in bed I feel weak.

Still feel all this 46 hours after the shot!

Getting this 12 hours after this latest booster shot is what confounds me.

Did the booster shot cause this? Or did I pick up the variant just before the shot?

Take care all.

14 hours ago, Benjamin Cole said:

Heads up to anyone--

If you have stomach upset about now, you may have been exposed to omicron.

For whatever reason, people who get omicron may not have the usual symptoms, but can have something that feels like food poisoning or stomach flu. 

Moreover, omicron can do an end-around on vaccinations, so being vaccinated is not a defense. 

In my village, most everyone now has stomach problems, and one tested positive for omicron. Most were double-shotted, but not boosted, like me. 

The bad stomach will last about 10 days, based on my case and that of neighbors. No one died, and most were moderately active through the ordeal. 

https://www.hindustantimes.com/lifestyle/health/how-omicron-can-affect-your-gut-symptoms-to-watch-out-for-101641962757294.html

Good luck everyone. Regardless of your ideological slants and political affiliations, I do not wish stomach ills on anyone. 

Yes, stomach deep soreness type pain with nausea. Complete loss of appetite.

With me I am having "all" these other symptoms as well:

Kind of torturous.

Extreme arm pain of course.

Pain all over like a bad body flu.

Pain in sinus and temple area.

Spontaneous runny nose off on and off.

Chills. Sweats. Hot face. No fever though.

Weak, weak. 

And I couldn't fall asleep at all last night. Not one minute!

The non-stop nausea is the worst.

I still can't believe this booster reaction. Could getting the Omicron be any worse?

I wouldn't have gotten the booster if I knew in advance that I would be going through this powerful bad reaction. And I must tell you, that at 70 years old, overweight with heart and other issues, there is a fear there. Hope this all goes away.

1 hour ago, Matt Allison said:

Joe- that's sounds like me after my 2nd shot; I was laid up for almost 48 hrs.

And then like a light switch, I was fine. My immune system had done its calculations and decided everything was cool.

Hang in there, dude

Thanks for the thoughtful and encouraging words Matt.

3 hours ago, Matt Allison said:

It seems the arm pain could be dependent upon the person giving the shot. My arm hurt like hell after shot 2, but was pain-free after the booster, which I got at a different pharmacy.

Hate to say this but today I feel like I have been run over by a truck!

Like a really powerful pain all over body flu.

Constant chills like I haven't had in years. Even with our house heat up high. Sinus and forehead pain. Face skin feels hot. Runny nose that won't stop. Spontaneous coughing. When I pee it kind of hurts? What's that?

Really didn't expect this powerful of a reaction to this booster.

First two Pfizer shots made me feel somewhat sick but nothing like these multiple symptoms.

What the heck? It feels like this booster shot GAVE ME THE VIRUS!

Can't even get off my cot in the garden shed.

Just have to bear through I guess. Geeminy.

Newsome's career ambitions dictated this denial.

11 hours ago, Joe Bauer said:

Just had my Pfizer booster shot 5 hours ago at our local Rite Aid drug store.

So far, no noticeable reactions outside of my eyes crossing and lower lip drooping.

Seriously, nothing negative yet.

Several people who have gotten the booster have stated to me they felt quite weak and slightly sick the next day so we'll see about that.

I had the first two Pfizer vaccines many months ago.

Kept holding off on the booster though.

I hear even people who have had all 3 shots are getting this new Covid strain.

Many in my own family from one Coast to the other have gotten hit in the last month or so. All different ages as well.

Crazy, anxious and depressing times we live in now. Unlike anything I have seen in my lifetime.

UPDATE:

My booster shot receiving upper left arm is now "killing" me with pain.

Pain started last night about 7 hours after the shot. 

Really surprised at the pain level. Although I do remember similar but lesser pain in my arm after my first two Pfizer shots.

Have read where this shot location arm pain takes a couple days to wane.

Just a heads up update note to those here who may be considering the booster vac.

Just had my Pfizer booster shot 5 hours ago at our local Rite Aid drug store.

So far, no noticeable reactions outside of my eyes crossing and lower lip drooping.

Seriously, nothing negative yet.

Several people who have gotten the booster have stated to me they felt quite weak and slightly sick the next day so we'll see about that.

I had the first two Pfizer vaccines many months ago.

Kept holding off on the booster though.

I hear even people who have had all 3 shots are getting this new Covid strain.

Many in my own family from one Coast to the other have gotten hit in the last month or so. All different ages as well.

Crazy, anxious and depressing times we live in now. Unlike anything I have seen in my lifetime.

5 hours ago, Benjamin Cole said:

Alack and alas...you mean to say...you do not regard me as handsome? 

I will arrange a more flattering photo...you know these days with filters and photoshop, maybe a little magic touch-up here and there....

I've been told by many that in my younger days ( 20's and 30's - see my picture here ) I was somewhat good looking myself.

Ah, the gift of youth.

On 1/12/2022 at 8:59 AM, Karl Kinaski said:

Quote Dr Crenshaw  "JFK HAS BEEN SHOT"

"Total  operating  time  was  three  hours  and  fifty  minutes.  All  surgery  on
Governor Connally ceased at 4:45 P . M .  From surgery, he was taken to the
recovery room, where an intensive-care area was established by partitioning
the  room  with  sheets.  This  was  well  before  the  sophistication  of  modern
intensive-care units and equipment."

Close quote

Parkland employee Tomlinson found the "magic" bullet around 1 o clock on a stretcher. The above press conference occurred at least four hours later, with the bullet still in Connallys thigh. (Acc. to Dr Robert Shaw.) 

This is fantastic.

Excuse my simple minded ponderance here but ...

If the Warren Commission finding "Magic Bullet" was found on a stretcher at 1:pm and the bullet which entered Connally through his back and "obliterated" a rib bone, continued on to enter and create a "compound fracture" of his left wrist and continued on again to enter his left thigh as reported by his surgeon and to "still be lodged" in his left thigh when this news conference was being held ( hours later ) isn't it laughingly obvious we are talking two different bullets?

If this completely contradictory magic bullet on a stretcher discovery time line versus left thigh imbedded bullet scenario two or three hours later is true doesn't it blow the entire "almost pristine" magic bullet conclusion of the WC into La La Land?

Also, I wonder what the velocity force must have been for a Carcano caliber bullet to travel 265 feet, enter Connally and pass through perhaps outer and inner skin, tendon and or muscle tissue to then obliterate a rib bone, and after this velocity slowing bone breaking contact, exit again through similar tissue to then re-enter another part of the body with still enough velocity force to compound fracture another significant bone then exit again that body part to penetrate into another one and lodge itself there?

And this is all after this same bullet supposedly had already entered and penetrated though JFK's tendon and/or muscle tissue of his back and neck ... with no velocity slowing at all from that contact?

Was this Connally surgery doctor ever asked if the bullet  ( or fragment ) he or any other doctor later took out of Connally's left thigh looked like the infamous "Magic Bullet" entered into the WC finding record? Or was small enough to fit the Magic Bullet metal loss?

Wasn't there an X ray taken of this bullet/fragment while it was still in Connally's thigh? If so, did it show a very small fragment versus anything larger?

This long time experience surgeon must have performed hundreds of bone damaging bullet injury surgeries before Connally's. I wonder if he ever saw or was ever shown any part or parts of Connally's bone breaking bullet or fragments of it and stated any opinion as to whether the "Magic Bullet" one that the WC claimed did the three body part damage injuries to Connally could look as pristine as it was?

And whether Connally's wrist bone fracturing bullet obliterated enough to thrust a much smaller fragment into his left thigh? If so, what happened to the rest of the wrist bone fracturing bullet? That small thigh entering fragment alone could not do the amount of bone breaking damage to Connally's wrist...correct?

Even Hercule Poirot's head would be spinning with this case and it's contradictory facts and findings...no?

Wow! Incredible!

Much to think about in your essay above.

Will comment later regards many specific points.

17 minutes ago, Matt Allison said:

Dude, Dick Cheney can barely walk now.

We didn't like Dick Cheney either. So imagine how bad the Trump people are when they're able to make him look decent...

Really, stop to contemplate that. It's an actual thing.

BINGO!

18 hours ago, Benjamin Cole said:

But 700 halfwits were able to rather easily enter the Capitol. 

Calling them "halfwits" is a weak downplaying of their actions and intent.

Like saying they were mentally challenged or disturbed?

Most were employed. Some firefighters, police, even military.

Brainwashed and inspired by Trump's obsessive rants of a stolen election and to march down to the Capital building and fight like hell?  Yes.

Trump's own words to his stop the steal crowd just before sending them on their whooping, yelling riled up way to the Capital bldg.

"Now it is up to Congress to confront this egregious assault on our democracy. And after this, we're going to walk down and I'll be there with you. We're going to walk down--

We're going to walk down. Anyone you want, but I think right here, we're going to walk down to the Capitol--

And we're going to cheer on our brave senators and congressmen and women and we're probably not going to be cheering so much for some of them.

Because you'll never take back our country with weakness. You have to show strength and you have to be strong."

Yesterday I heard a Jan 6th insurrection documentarian say the huge majority of the Capital march crowd were peaceful.

That only 700 of 5,000 broke through the barriers and went on a rampage through the Capital Bldg.

Did anyone ever catch on video or audio "anyone" in that larger so-called peace minded Trump incited Capital building march crowd calling back the front line stormers? Calling for them to stop the rampage?

Or physically trying to stop or even slow them down once they saw the real bad physical violence beginning? The assaults on the Capital police? The smashing of doors and windows?

They had 3 hours time to do so.

I sure never saw anyone in the larger crowd doing anything or saying/yelling to their fellow storm troopers "STOP" or "THIS VIOLENCE IS WRONG."

What I saw was even the larger crowd yelling Trump slogans and wildly waving their Trump flags and posters both before and during the assault.

If the larger crowd was peaceful in intent, they sure didn't express this or show disagreement with the brutal actions of their fellow charging violent posse members.

And when interviewed during and after the violent attack, I have never seen on video any comments from the larger crowd members condemning the attack and violence. Most of those interviewed seemed okay with the violence and some even expressed it hadn't gone far enough!

That entire Capital building march crowd is culpable in the attack imo.

None of them made any effort verbally or physically to stop, slow down or call back their fellow non-peaceful attackers.

And I have yet to see anyone interviewed in that Trump worked up crowd after or during the attack express remorse over it's occurrence.

2 hours ago, John Butler said:

I believe Bobby Kennedy said he supported the Warren Commission conclusions up the day he died.  Can anyone explain that?

To say otherwise would have ruined him as a viable candidate for the presidency.

He "had" to say that.

3 hours ago, Larry Hancock said:

Yes that's right Ron, I thought you were talking about traffic further down the street and into Oak Cliff.   I suppose it depends on the actual cab route and where the bus was stuck in traffic.  They were holding traffic coming down Elm at that TSBD intersection but as you say Whatley could have gone around several blocks and come down Houston onto Main and down past the TSBD as we see cars doing that ...   All gets back to how he drove it.

Experienced cab drivers are experts at finding alternate driving routes to get their fares to their destinations when traffic backs up from my experience. They know the streets like the back of their hands.

Dallas Sheriff Roger Craig's account of Oswald's response in Captain Fritz's interrogation room regards Oswald being asked about Officer Craig supposedly seeing him run down the grass outside of the TXSBD and into a pulled over station wagon throws another wrench into the machinery.

Craig stated that Oswald responded " that car belongs to Ruth Paine. Don't try to pull her into this."

The bigger head shaking pondering for me is the impossibly improbable and unchecked "walk away" for Oswald right after he allegedly shot three super loud high caliber rifle shots at JFK in broad daylight and right in front of hundreds of bystanders just feet below.

And hitting him twice with the second hit a "farther away" better aim, perfect skull obliterating "Bullseye" into a 8 to 9 inch wide circle 265 feet away and that was moving 10 mph farther away and downward the entire shooting time sequence?

One can't help imagine the hand sweating, breath taking, life and death fearing tension anyone must have felt doing what Oswald or someone else supposedly did.

You just loudly shot the president of the U.S. and took off his head! In front of hundreds of eye witnesses! 

Oswald or whoever did the shooting "must have sensed" their life was in the most highest threat danger during the shooting and seconds and minutes after. 

Yet, Oswald supposedly saunters down 4 flights of wooden stairs unseen to the TXSBD second floor, walks into the lunch room and over to the soda pop machine, deposits 25 cents, gets a Dr. Pepper and stands there calmly sipping this as a big, super anxious gun pointing DPD officer bursts in and confronts him before Roy Truly redirects the officer's suspicion and they both run off and up the stairs.

And seconds or minutes later Oswald is walking around the first floor lobby and even giving news reporter Robert McNeil directions to a wall mounted pay phone?

Then, it's off to the bus stop. Calmly getting on, paying his fare, grabbing a seat and riding this until this bus gets stalled in traffic.

Then departing the bus and hailing a taxi,  Southern Gentleman Oswald graciously gives up the first available taxi to a Southern Belle lady looking as if she needed the ride more than he?

This scenario of JFK's alleged assassin escaping the frantic search hornets nest scene of the Texas School Book building so pedestrianly is highly if not impossibly improbable to me.

Why did it take more than 3 to 5 minutes to secure every entrance and exit to the TXSBD?

How long was Oswald in the TXSCB before he finally walked out and away?

In a way, one could look at Oswald's poorest working class escape plan as brilliant and totally a success if he actually did the shooting. And his noted calmness through it all and even interacting with half a dozen people during this an incredible, almost unbelievable marvel of emotional control.

Just watched Matt Allison's posted video.

If the contents of this documentary don't seriously frighten you regards the direction this country is headed via Trump inspired supporters and their use of violence ... and the acceptance of this violence by tens of millions of other Trump supporters, what would?

I posted the following link in the Trump thread earlier.

Watching MA's video link above compels me to post it here as well.

It's gut wrenching disturbing to see how irrationally entrenched these Trump supporter people are in the obsessively pushed Trump delusion that the 2020 presidential election was rigged and stolen.

Tens of millions of Americans! Maybe over 100 million? 

It's mass denial of reality and delusion to the highest irrational degree.

To the very scary real point that these 100 million are now saying extreme violence actions like the 2021 January 6th attack on our sacred democracy representing Capital building ( while full of our Congress members! ) ... are OKAY! 

Include in this embracing violence craziness the heroization of illegal assault weapon using and two protester killing and just 17 year old kid Kyle Rittenhouse.

What has Trump and his worked up base wrought upon us?  Scary violence advocating chaos?

It's gut wrenching disturbing to see how irrationally entrenched these Trump supporter people are in the obsessively pushed Trump delusion that the 2020 presidential election was rigged.

Tens of millions of Americans! Maybe over 100 million? 

It's mass denial of reality and delusion to the highest irrational degree.

To the very scary real point that these 100 million are now saying extreme violence action like the 2021 January 6th attack on our sacred democracy representing Capital building ( while full of our Congress members! ) ... is OKAY! 

What has Trump and his worked up base wrought upon us?  Scary violence advocating chaos?

9 hours ago, Greg Doudna said:

Larry, interesting.

Dallas Police Department records of Oswald's phone calls

On taping of calls, just as no taping was done of Oswald's interrogations (if true), there appears to be no reference to taping of prisoner phone calls in the Dallas jail either. On lack of thoroughness of investigation of Oswald's phone calls, there are already signs of missing information concerning Oswald's calls in existing DPD records. The following is from this set of documents sent by Dallas Police Chief Curry to Rankin of the Warren Commission responsive to WC inquiry concerning times and dates of Oswald's phone calls: https://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=11839#relPageId=2. 

A set of jail inmate log sheets of dates 11/21/63, 11/22/63, and 11/23/63, identified by Chief Curry as "all of the telephone sheets kept on prisoner's phone calls for the dates of November 22, 23 and 24, 1963", is provided. These log sheets--about fifteen prisoner phone calls per log sheet--give date, inmate name and jail cell number, whether the party called was reached, and officer's initials, but not times of the calls. Oddly there is record on these sheets of only one phone call made by Oswald that entire weekend and that is Fri Nov 22. For Sat. Nov 23 I count 59 prisoner phone calls made that day according to the log sheets. None are Oswald. That is, those records show one phone call for Oswald on Friday (checked "yes" party contacted) and none on Saturday and none on Sunday. 

And yet from affidavits and Oswald's jail card, originally made out at the time of booking and containing notations of times of prisoner phone calls, Oswald did make phone calls on Sat Nov 23. According to the DPD jail card, Oswald used the phone three times on Sat Nov 23: at 1:40 pm, 4:22 pm, and 8 pm. However, there is no information in these records supplied by Chief Curry that tell the phone numbers called, the names of parties called or lengths of the phone calls.

In the affidavits:

• Arthur Eaves, Assistant Jailer on Nov 23: he and another officer assisted Oswald in placing a long-distance collect phone call to an unidentified party in New York City between 1:30 and 2 pm, which corresponds to a notation on the jail card of 1:40 pm with his verified signature.
• Buel Beddingfield, Assistant Jailer: with Eaves assisted Oswald in making a long-distance collect phone call at about 1:30 pm. "Officer Eaves advised the City Hall Operator that a prisoner wished to make a long distance call collect. While he was notifying the operator, I wrote Lee Harvey Oswald's name on the telephone log sheet where all prisoners' names are kept when they are permitted to use the telephone. [missing on the log sheets supplied by Curry to WC] I heard Oswald place a call to New York. After this call, he made a local call. Upon taking Oswald out of the telephone booth, I signed my last name on the telephone log sheet as to removing the prisoner from the booth, and Officer Eaves and I placed him back in his cell. The telephone log sheet on which I entered Oswald's name and which I signed myself has been turned over to Assistant Chief Batchelor."

OK, that is Oswald's use of the telephone at 1:30 pm. The long-distance one was probably an attempt to reach lawyer Abt in New York. The second, local call mentioned by Beddngfield may have been to Ruth Paine, asking if she would try to reach lawyer Abt in New York. Emphatically Beddingfield states he filled out Oswald's call on the log sheet which he says went to Asst. Chief Batchelor. But by the time Curry sends those records to Rankin of the WC it is not there. Not known why. But the most interesting affidavit is that of J. L. Popplewell:

"My name is J. L. Popplewell. I entered the Dallas Police Department January 11, 1957. I have been in the Service Division seven and one-half years. I have worked the fifth floor jail most of this time. I was on duty the 22nd and 23rd day of November, 1963, working 2:30 p.m. till 10:30 p.m. The 23rd day of November, 1963, at 3:00 p.m., I was assigned to guard the area in front of Lee Harvey Oswald's cell, watching all of his movements to see that he didn't hurt himself. About 4:00 p.m. Lt. Lord called on the jail phone and instructed me to put Oswald on the phone. Oswald asked the operator for two telephone numbers -- then asked me for a pencil and paper while in the telephone booth. I tore a small piece of plain paper, about two by three inches from the telephone record sheet that hung outside the telephone booth; then handed this piece of paper and my pencil to him. Oswald wrote a number on this paper and returned my pencil. Then he asked if he could call later. Oswald did not get his call through at this time."

Comment: is this where Oswald obtained two telephone numbers for "John Hurt"? As Mrs. Treon described the John Hurt phone call attempt after 10 pm, Oswald already had the name and two phone numbers. Oswald must therefore have asked an operator for the numbers before that, and received back two phone numbers for one name in one city. Continuing the Popplewell affidavit:

"I called Lt. Lord and informed him Oswald didn't get his party and wanted to call again later.

"About 8:00 p.m. Lt. Lord came up to the jail and told me to let Oswald use the phone. I was instructed to step back away from the phone booth so the phone call could be private. From this location I watched the prisoner talking to someone. He used the phone about thirty minutes. I asked Oswald if he got his call through and he answered, yes.

Comment: The timing may correspond to a second call of Oswald to Ruth Paine on Saturday, this one trying unsuccessfully to reach Marina. The length of "about thirty minutes" could include the time in which Oswald made more than one phone call (Popplewell is away from the phone booth and would not necessarily know how many phone calls were made in that time, only that when Oswald was finished it had been "about thirty minutes"). Continuing Popplewell: 

"About four months ago [before 8/20/64] on a Monday, I received a call from an F.B.I. agent who wanted to know about a slip of paper with a phone number on it. This was supposed to be in Oswald's pocket when he died. The agent asked if we allowed prisoners to keep phone numbers on their person. I said that if a call wasn't completed the first time, we could let them write the number down and keep it for a later call. The agent asked me the size of the paper I might have given Oswald to write on. I told him it probably was one torn off of a telephone record sheet hanging outside the telephone booth; that the paper was plain, unmarked, about two by three inches. The telephone sheet is usually used for writing names of prisoners who use the phone, but due to the large volume of prisoners that weekend, it was possible I missed writing Oswald's name down on the record sheet. I have been unable to locate a sheet with his name on it."

Comment: While that explanation is possible, it sounds more like trying to explain why the sheet is missing when he tries later to find it, that he was "sure" he would have written at the time. Given that all phone calls made by Oswald that Saturday are missing in from the log sheets for that day not simply this one, forgetfulness on the part of the officers may not be the explanation. Since four log sheets with 59 other prisoner phone calls are in existence for Sat Nov 23 it is not a case that all records have gone missing either. Not clear what is going on there--why Oswald's name is not on the Saturday log sheets, despite his having made multiple phone calls that day. 

As for the Raleigh phone call attempt, Popplewell says his shift ended 10:30 pm. Mrs. Treon said Oswald's attempted phone call via Mrs. Sweeney happened shortly after her (Mrs. Treon's) shift began at 10 pm. Since Popplewell does not mention another phone call attempt of Oswald during his shift, the Raleigh phone call attempt would occur ca. 10:30 pm, just after Popplewell was relieved by a new shift (unless there is some confusion in Mrs. Treon's time memory, and the Raleigh phone call attempt also was in that 8 pm thirty minutes of Oswald's making phone calls).

It already is the case that all phone calls for Oswald that day are missing from the log sheets for no known reason. It already is the case that there are no known Dallas Police Department records of phone call numbers or names called. The jail card does have three times Oswald used the phone but not a ca. 10:30 pm, fourth phone call. 

If the John Hurt Oswald was trying to reach did go to something of a "classified" nature, the Dallas Police Department would not necessarily know that. But by either 8 pm or 10:30 pm, if Mrs. Treon's account is correct something unusual was happening: a phone call of Oswald was intentionally blocked, and this would be by request initiated from or on behalf of some agency other than the Dallas Police Department. 

By Saturday night the narrative had rapidly closed in from above the level of the Dallas Police department: sola Oswald, Oswald alone. Oswald's attempt to reach his "John Hurt", if it was preemptively prevented, would make sense if an agency knew exactly who Oswald's intended John Hurt was (no mystery about it), and decided that it was not helpful to have Oswald succeed in reaching that party. A municipal police department such as the Dallas Police Department would not be that agency but, via mechanism of a quiet background request to say an assistant of Chief Curry, could accommodate a request from another agency. Accommodation to such a request could trivially include not handwriting in an additional time notation on Oswald's jail card of that fourth time that day Oswald used the phone, the attempt to reach "John Hurt"--and then there would be no written record of that call at all in Dallas Police Department records.

Great research GD and extremely interesting and thought/question provoking.

As are LH's follow up questions and comments regards the FBI.

Hundreds of times with investigatory and missing or altered documentation dead- ends in important areas of JFK/Oswald/Ruby related testimonies and stories one is so often left with only the simplest and last base line option of either believing the story and testimony tellers or not.

Mrs. Treon, Albert Bogard, Sylvia and Annie Odio, Julia Ann Mercer, Arnold Rowland and Carolyn Walther, police department dispatcher Billie Grammer, May Newman and on and on.

Then it's just a personal gut feeling judgment call.

Do you believe Mrs. Treon and/or her daughter in this call story matter or not?

Personally, I believe almost all these witnesses and that their testimonies are not hugely mistaken or made up for personal gain reasons.

4 hours ago, James DiEugenio said:

 

Remember when Steve Roe was saying the film had failed in North America?  Some failure.

And we are not done yet.

Isn't it great to see the JFK case still alive and ticking almost 60 years later. 

Thanks to you and Stone for this latest surge in interest and coverage.

JFK's burial site eternal flame is not forgotten nor it's symbolic importance waned.

You would think that the Dallas PD and every other agency would "want" to know everything about anyone Oswald was trying to contact while in their custody.

Having Louise Swinney sabotage Oswald's attempt to contact anyone via the phone by disconnecting the call and then lying to Oswald that no one answered that number makes no sense in this way.

Wouldn't have Oswald's desperate for incriminating evidence interrogators logically have wanted to let Oswald make contact with someone and then grilled him regards who this person he was trying to contact was and why he was trying to do so?

Just another curious aside thought:

Oswald's mother Marguerite said in published video interviews that "my son works for the CIA."

Of all the crazy things one would expect from a mother of the top one or two criminal suspects in American history to throw out there in public interviews trying to defend her son against the incredible murder charges he was being accused of, this one stops you as about the most desperate and crazy.

And if her shocking claim was not true, it could only hurt Lee Oswald and not help him at all in the following way.

Look, the lone nut's own mother is looney tunes herself. Anyone raised by this nut case must be disturbed as well ?

I don't know how much effort was put into asking Marguerite to provide any more answers as to why she believed her son was working for our own government but we do know that she had corresponded with her son more than anyone else while Lee was in Russia.

Was there anything Lee may have written back to her while he was in Russia that gave her the impression he had a secret agenda as she claims? Or, was there anything shared between Lee and Marguerite during the few days he spent with her before catching a transport ship ride to Europe?

Did Marguerite's attorney Mark Lane pursue this claim of her son's Intel involvement? 

This phone call story, Marguerite's claim of her son's intel connection, Lee's own public statement "I am just a patsy" seen and heard by half the nation, etc. etc. ... laughably suspicious in their entirety, if even half true.

1 hour ago, Steve Thomas said:

DC insider explains a 'fundamental truth' about Trump's Jan. 6 coup attempt

by Robert Reich December 31, 2021

https://www.rawstory.com/trump-coup-2656201435/

 

“But even with this help, Trump’s attempted coup could not have gotten this far without something more basic: A substantial portion of the American population feels an anger and despair that has made them susceptible to Trump’s swagger and lies.

It is too simplistic to attribute this solely to racism or xenophobia. America has harbored white supremacist and anti-immigrant sentiments since its founding. The despair Trump has channeled is more closely connected to a profound loss of identity, dignity and purpose, especially among Americans who have been left behind – without college degrees, without good jobs, in places that have been economically abandoned and disdained by much of the rest of the country.

The wages of these Americans have not risen in forty years, adjusted for inflation, even though the economy is now three times larger than it was four decades ago. The norm of upward mobility has been shattered for these Americans. Through their eyes, the entire American system is now rigged against them.

This part of America yearns for a strongman to deliver it from despair. Trump has filled that void. To be sure, he’s filled it with bombast, lies, paranoia, and neofascism. But he has filled it nonetheless.

The challenge ahead is to fill it with a democracy and economy that work for everyone. Unless we understand and respond to this fundamental truth, we will miss the true meaning of January 6.”

 

Steve Thomas

True.