Ron Bulman
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On 6/21/2017 at 7:44 PM, Paul Brancato said:
I think Harvey fits well with the BBH/S+C scenario. He was stationed with Shackley in Germany. He was put in charge of ZR/Rifle, which came out of Operation 40, Nixon's project while VP. Nixon is totally in the loop, having been supported by Prescott Bush (some say hand picked) during Nixon's political rise. Prescott succeeded George Herbert Walker as CEO of BBH, and fathered George HW Bush, who along with Jack Crichton provided funding and logistical support for Operation 40. Nixon later rewarded George Bush, appointing him to UN rep. Ford, who pardoned Nixon, appointed Bush to head the CIA.
Paul, Harvey's (no pun intended) wife's statements are interesting.
http://jfkfacts.org/cia-widow-denounced-jfk-jackie-and-rfk-then-she-expressed-love-for-a-gangster/
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"so mysterious that the CIA would not even acknowledge he existed to the HSCA". So, someone at the HSCA suspected something or they wouldn't have asked the CIA about him? Your words made me think about his "heart attack" happening in 78, while the HSCA was trying to get other people to testify that had heart attacks before they could as well as others from natural causes, accidents, shootings and suicides. They also prompted me to look through NEXUS.
Pg. 185. "In 1975 Morales retired (his paperwork suggest that the retirement was "involuntary") and eventually moved his family into a highly secure and remote ranch in southern Arizona. In 1978, he fell ill and died suddenly of a heart attack following a trip to Washington D.C. His lawyer and friend Bob Walton, had asked him why he spent so much money on alarm systems and other home security - was it because his remote home was only 30 miles from the Mexican border? Morales replied, 'I'm not worried about those people. I'm worried about my own'. Morales old colleague and former head of the AMOT's...Tony Sforza , also died of a sudden hear attack some six months after Morales."
I forget what page but it also mentions him making statements to others about his personal involvement in the capture of Che. Given his hatred of JFK maybe he was somewhere on site on 11/22.
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Mc Adams article does not address the question. Six upper level FBI agents, all with specific connections to the investigation of JFK's assassination died in a six month period (6/77-11/77), all scheduled at the time to testify before the House Sub Committee on Assassinations. Some say seven if you include Regis Kennedy's heart attack in 78 the day before he was to testify. Four heart attacks including him, a fall at home, natural causes after a lengthy illness (what illness?), mistaken for a deer and shot in the throat by an experienced hunter(subject for a different post). This explains it better.
The odds of this happening seemed suspicious the first time I read about it. Mathematician Richard Charnin says if 20 agents were called to testify and 5 had heart attacks, two had accidents (for example) those odds would be one in 190 trillion.
http://whokilledjfk.net/strange_fbi_deaths.htm
If you want to address the odds regarding the bigger picture Mc Adams attempts to address Mr. Charnin does that as well. In a fashion even a non scientist like me can understand.
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Other than a few quotes I'd never read Chomsky until a few days after this years inauguration. A few weeks after last year's election I started looking for something more informative than what the MSM offered regarding how we had gotten to the point that what happened happened.. I came across Chris Hedges "Unspeakable", a pretty devastating and depressing analysis. Of course I came across Chomsky in my search. On January 20 during the inauguration in an act of frustration and rebellion I ordered three of his books in an effort to find something as far left of the right as I could. I waded through two of the three. He does make one think. My naivety regarding some of the subjects was improved upon. I did come across comments about the JFK assassination which I disagreed with and questioned. This, and I can't find the right word, a feeling of being preached at as opposed to informed of (?) have left me lacking desire to finish the third book.
Not to get political here but I ultimately have found some enlightenment in the following books.
As editor of Salon the author made a big step trying to fill the shoes of founder/former editor David Talbot (Brothers, The Devi's Chessboard).
New Yorker writer responds to Koch Bros. attack on personal credibility and prior article stunningly. Not just me, 5 stars, Over 1500 reviews.
Billionaire 1% owned Corporate Americas takeover via Citizens United explained from the inside of our political system in detail passionately and Patriotically by the eloquent Senator from Rode Island. Highly under read based on the number of reviews. (I've not read NYT/WaPo reviews of it).
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On 6/30/2017 at 8:20 AM, Ernie Lazar said:
tlyWell, Ron, I defer to what John McAdams has posted here: http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/deaths.htm
http://www.prouty.org/mcadams/
Factoid's, ad hominem attacks. I've made the mistake of trying to present logic to the de frocked professor over on JFK facts more than once. I seriously wonder if he wasn't a paid operative of Operation Mockingbird. I believe it's been noted he was funded in part by one the Koch supported fronts.
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13 hours ago, James DiEugenio said:
Yes it does Ron.
I thought the best part was when he placed the cost of MSM's coverage on the Simpson case, the Ramsey case, and the Clinton impeachment with what they spent covering the Warren Commission hearings.
Thank you Jim. Not to detract from the focus of the topic of this thread but maybe supplement it, readers interested in "The American Media" might also find this film of interest.
https://www.thesearchersfilm.com/
I hope to watch both in the not too distant future.
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Does the film ever mention Operation Mockingbird or the current ownership of All the Main Stream Media by the 0.01%?
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Ernie, given your knowledge regarding the FBI I wonder if you might share any thoughts regarding the deaths of the (?) six upper level agents in (?) 6 months shortly before the HSCA. I Think I've read some of them at least, had connections to the investigation of the JFK assassination. A experienced kayaker drowned in still water? One shot by a neighbor's son in a hunting accident? Two heart attacks. A fall at home. Is any of that close to right? All just coincidence?
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Lemnitzer, Lansdale, Le May, someone held sway that day over or within the military. Something I've not seen mentioned anywhere in a while; U S army soldiers were prepared and ready to leave Fort Hood, North of Austin early that morning to protect their Commander in Chief that day in Dallas. This was not unusual, pictures and I believe video can be or used to could be found on the internet of armed soldiers in parade dress lining parade routes facing the crowds in previous JFK parades. Someone ordered these soldiers to stand down. Their immediate commander was incensed and protested, he was ordered to stand down himself. From memory, maybe even as far back as Crossfire 1. I'm not making it up or dreaming.
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22 hours ago, Chris Newton said:
Ron, Thomas Graves may have some info on this but he's off the forum for a little while. He may be back soon.
In the meantime, this is a good starting point:
https://www.maryferrell.org/pages/David_Morales_-_We_Took_Care_of_That_SOB.html
Thanks for the link Chris. Mary Ferrell is an amazing site, Kudos to Mr. Russ. Even though I've been frustrated looking for info there before, there is a Lot to look at. Debra Conway's 10 year old article is the best concise chronological summary of named people in the CIA and JFK administration regarding Cuba I've never seen before.
The MF bio on Morales made me think, "died of a heart attack"? I thought I'd read he got sick at home in Arizona and was taken to the hospital where access to his room was prohibited by guards (county/state/federal? I don't remember if it was specified) except for very immediate family. I still do believe I read something of this but can't remember where. Prevention of a death bed confession was my point of curiosity. Maybe something more informative than Howard Hunt's?
So I started looking for corroboration I've not yet found and wound up in "Someone Would Have Talked" by Larry Hancock. The JFK assassination is so deep, so wide, so many subjects. It's amazing what one can read and then forget over just seven years. This thread made me refresh my memory. If you've not read chapter 8 it's worth the price of the book by itself if your interested in David Morales. It goes a lot deeper than this thread. In addition to Roselli he knew Joe Fish. His best friend was amazed by the number of men in dark suits and sunglasses who attended his funeral. Tip of the iceberg.
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If Army is interpreted as Military overall and you step up a level from Lansdale to someone who Might be entrusted with knowledge to ensure that aspect was controlled for say a Harriman or David Rockefeller you might consider General Curtis Le May. Conveniently out of pocket, maybe out of the country over the border in Canada at the time of the assassination. Yet reportedly in Bethesda at the autopsy. Hated JFK. Had wanted a reason for a first strike nuclear attack on the ruskie's for years. He could have guaranteed any necessary air strikes world wide at a minimum. Dr. Strangelove meets Seven Day's in May.
What ever happened regarding the missing Air force One tapes. Were they communicating with him?
http://jfkfacts.org/a-note-on-curtis-lemays-actions-on-nov-22/
http://jfkcountercoup.blogspot.com/2014/10/the-air-force-one-radio-tapes-update.html
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On 6/17/2017 at 0:31 AM, Ron Bulman said:
Morales is a mystery wrapped in an enigma. Apologies for plagiarism. There's too much documented not to be suspicious. Yet nothing concrete.
I read years ago about Morales and thought: heavy set dark complected man, that's what a couple of witnesses said about a second man on the sixth floor. So Morales was up there directing things telling walkie talkie man to tell umbrella man to pump his umbrella as a signal to fire again...
There goes what little credibility I might have obtained since joining the forum.
FWIW. I do not have any faith in such a scenario now.
If I may clarify the above. Just from what I've read that others have dug up. I don't think Morales would allow himself to be as close to the assassination site as the TSBD, he seems a bit above that operational level. That he might be involved in the set up and supervision of such an operation is at least conceivable given his area of expertise. As it is accepted by some that LHO didn't do it. A conspiracy that someone planned the physical operation of. Some have suggested, for example, Bill Harvey provided Corsican assassin's. Somebody provided them with, accommodation, transport, positioning, rehearsal (?), protection, escape??? Corsicans, Cubans, MIC. Somebody with expertise in such affairs would have walked Dealy Plaza and the surrounding area, maybe after normal working hours to attract less attention (?). They would have driven the route multiple times. They would have had after hours access to the Texas School Book Depository well in advance to inspect, plan, and set up. They might have even set up diversions (like a shot or two from the sixth floor?).
If Morales participated in such and possibly watched the operation, maybe it was from a little further afar. Say the Postal Annex, all the way across Elm, Main and Continental, the whole of Dealy Plaza. Postal Inspector Holmes did so, with binoculars. If I remember right the building did house military offices in addition to other government offices (as did the Post office in New Orleans!).
He did reportedly said "WE got hat SOB". Sometime later, he felt sick, went home to (?) Arizona(?), was taken to the hospital, no one was allowed to see him, and he died if memory serves me.
Can anyone discredit or add to support of this supposition?
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If the couch was on the East wall and the drapes were open Ruth would have seen the officers approaching the porch from the driveway and walkway and stepping up on it as she would have been looking South West at the TV front door closed or not. As it stands we have two officers, one from the DPD, one from the County Sherriff's Office saying Ruth met them at the open door and invited them in. But Ruth says she answered the closed door when the bell rang. Well, if she's lying about having Mikey and Ozzie move the couch she might be lying here too. I forget her comments on what she said when she opened the door about inviting them in / "been expecting you".
Interesting that the questioning after answering the closed door changes to the lawn...
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Larry, David and Ernie, Thank You.
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2 hours ago, Larry Hancock said:
I'm sure Ernie could give you chapter and verse on it far better than I but basically the function was very real, officially it would be referred to as the counter-intelligence division, charged with domestic activities countering foreign agents, their surrogates and addressing both potential subversion and sabotage. That would separate its activities from routine investigation of the violation of federal statures and criminal investigations. My impression is that at the field office level agents could serve in all three roles at times depending on manpower availability but there certainly was a "subversive" beat. Which makes it very interesting as to what Hosty was talking about in telling the SS agent that Oswald had been observed with "subversives". It would probably imply that an agent monitoring such targets (lets say something like Cuban exiles planning attacks on Cuba) would have seen Oswald come into view during the surveillance. Another example would be the Tumbleweed thing, where CIA handed off a Soviet asset coming from Europe to the US and then doing interesting subversive things in the US as well as crossing into Mexico for unknown purposes - something we have learned very little about.
Mr. Hancock, as I'm still new here... When you mention counter intelligence are you referring to Angleton and co. ? I've seen reference to Division 5 before but really know nothing about what you and Mr. Andrews are getting at. Is a brief synopsis too much to ask (any detail would be appreciated as well)? (I have SWHT and Nexus if they have any bearing I'm forgetting)
P.S. Who's Ernie?
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Imagery of the horror of the war for both sides was deeper than anything before or since. From taped video on the nightly news to Life and Time magazines pictures it changed public opinion. They and the newspaper were the only sources of information at the time for the few who cared to read. No IPhone or Internet, until the pictures and video tape, in magazines and on tv.
http://time.com/3841060/iconic-vietnam-war-photos/
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A3zNJ9yTdJY
Take the time to watch all 17 minutes of the last one in full screen. Only seen it myself for the first time tonight.
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1 hour ago, Douglas Caddy said:
Outstanding picture, that at least I've never seen. Thank you sir. I counted what look like possibly 7 SSA's, maybe it's less, maybe I'm missing some. Could they have stopped a John Hinkley Jr in a crowd like that?
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It didn't have to be Dulles setting up the Paine's personally per se. It is entirely possible, some might say probable, that he could have suggested their use given his knowledge of and about them. It is even more reasonable to think somebody in the CIA realized Ruth's sister worked for them, her dad had been in the OSS and worked for AID. That Michael's step dad in essence invented the most useful Bell helicopter and that he already had a security clearance working there. We already know that de Morenschildt had contact with CIA agent J Walton Moore in Dallas, documented. I believe I've read GDM said in later years he would never have contacted Oswald without Moore's authorization or (?) suggestion to do so. George later hands off the Oswasld's to the sister of a current Cia employee and daughter of a former OSS agent and gets the hell out of town. Might someone, Dulles influenced or not, have suggested to Moore that he, an associate or employee contact Ruth and or Michael in regards to helping the good old USA keep an eye on the activities of a recently returned Russian defector and his Russian wife? Especially such a woman who spoke Russian? This might help explain Michael's attendance of both left and right wing gatherings in Dallas. As well as Ruth's trip to see her sister and others in the summer of 63 them pick up Marina and (unknowingly) the rifle (?) in New Orleans. And those files in the garage on Castro reporters. Maybe the Paine's didn't have a "need to know" who was using them and how. By the time they "both knew who was really responsible" they realized it was time to only say what they were told to.
Harvey deserves a separate post.
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3 hours ago, Chris Newton said:
Nope. You are right on point.
I was making a conjecture that having two doors almost side by side, (separated I think by a 1 ft. partition), would be an awkward design with the garage door opening inward into the kitchen and two the left. I agree about the sliding partition door possibility and I'm working on that supposition as well, although I have no evidence of it yet.
Point can be a bad place to be when your in a hot lz...or on patrol, so I infer from what I've read, thankfully not experienced. Thanks to those who have.
Tom, facing the garage door entry from the kitchen looking South on the diagram the entryway (not door) to the living room is immediately to the left. In Chris latest picture the door to the garage is opened to the left obscuring the entryway to the living room. In an earlier picture it is evident there is no door on the entryway opening to the left from this view. One opening to the right from this perspective would interfere with the opening of the garage door to the left. They would bump unless both were closed when one was opened. An architect wouldn't design it that way. Pocket doors are not common in the single story tract houses like the Paines built in the 50's in the FW/D area. At least not the several I've been in.
It's been nearly 24 years since I spent the evening in the kitchen. The one time I went into the garage to see where the rifle had supposedly been stored I don't remember a living room door having to be pulled back to at least half way open to open the garage entry door from the kitchen.
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On 6/21/2017 at 7:37 PM, Paul Brancato said:
Joe You're draft story reminds me of my own in a way. I think I'm a little older. My draft number was 45, and like you I went to Oakland for my exam, probably in 1970. I passed the physical, but before I went for my psyche exam I put a 'get out of Vietnam' sticker, which someone there was handing out, on my papers. I did have a letter from a Quaker org that supplied psyche exams for draftees. I ended up getting a psychological deferment. My examining psychologist told me he agree with my anti war sentiment!!!!
Joe and Paul maybe you can relate to this. I just finished reading an article in the latest issue of Rolling Stone on Greg Allman. "Greg also had no use for the Vietnam War. One night he got drunk and shot himself in the foot. He was then exempt from the selective service."
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On 2/21/2011 at 7:37 PM, Peter Fokes said:
On Wednesday, 23 October 1963, Allen Dulles was making plans for his Oct 25-29 trip to Houston, Ft. Worth and Dallas. His telephone call diaries reveal he spoke to a Mr. Meyer and a Mr. Wisner on Oct. 23, 1963. No details about these conversation appear in the diaries.
While in Texas, Dulles was promoting his new book, The Craft of Intelligence. He gave an address to the Houston Post Book and Author Luncheon on Sat. Oct. 26. On Sunday, he gave an address to the Friends of Ft. Worth Library. On Monday, Oct. 28, he addressed the Dallas Council on world Affairs, then visited Dallas book stores. He return to Washington on Tues, Oct. 29, 1963.
Cheers
Every now and then I still stumble across something that that makes me go Huh? Most times it's ignorance, my lack of deeper knowledge of a subject.
I've read somewhere that Dulles was in Dallas a month or so before the assassination promoting his book. That this was unusual in that he visited very few cities promoting his book (a half dozen?) and that he had been to Texas never or once or twice in his life.
Now it turns out he was in Texas less than a month before the assassination and that he visited three of the cities JFK did on 11/22.
What the hell was the erudite East Coast Establishment former director of the CIA fired by JFK doing in Cowtown promoting his book to the Friends of the Fort Worth Library? Other than the Basses, Richardson, Carters and a few other oil millionaires who would buy his book? Not many with privileges at the library would even read it if given to them.
Did the Fort Wroth Star Telegram report on his visit?
Did Dulles visit with his former subordinate General Cabell also fired by JFK or his brother the Mayor while in Dallas?
Though I don't remember when he was there God Bless former Star Telegram reporter Jim Marrs for carrying on.
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de Mohrenschildt probably spoke truthfully at least once in his life. When he begged CIA director George Bush (George Bush of the CIA, briefed by FBI director J. Edgar Hoover, 11/23/63) to get the spooks off his ass. Dear George...
Were they not both members of the Dallas Petroleum Club. Attendee's of the Oil Barron's Ball?
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It would be nice if it could be blown up a bit, as grainy as it is that might hurt more than help though. It looks like you can see a good bit more of the desk secretary to Ruth's left but it seems taller in this version. Is that Michael Paine on the right?
Vietnam Declassified: Kennedy, Johnson,Nixon
in JFK Assassination Debate
Posted
6-8 months ago I asked my 24 year old high school teacher daughter if she had ever heard of Kent State. No. Some history is ignored in high school and most college courses. I physically blocked her view of her cell phone to get her to pay attention to parts of this (with my open hand).
Neil Young, an illegal at the time Canadian immigrant wrote the song after reading and seeing images in a newspaper, then on TV. Within about 24 hours. It was recorded and on the air within 72 hours. No video or internet support but highly requested from dj's.
https://www.bing.com/search?q=crosby+stills+nash+and+young+ohio&form=PRUSEN&mkt=en-us&httpsmsn=1&refig=ad25c23c830e47ec8a6f4fbdd8789d73&sp=-1&pq=crosby+stills+nash+and+young+ohio&sc=10-33&qs=n&sk=&cvid=ad25c23c830e47ec8a6f4fbdd8789d73
Me Lai would probably result in me what or me who?