W. Niederhut

Good reference about Cass Sunstein's program of "cognitive infiltration" of social media to attack and impugn the reputations of research of scientists and scholars who have debunked false U.S. government narratives. Interestingly, Sunstein's main concern about so-called "conspiracy theorists" has not been with 8chan guys who buy guns and ammo at Wal-Mart, but with scientists and scholars who have debunked the U.S. government and mainstream media narratives about 9/11. Cognitive Infiltration http://www.unz.com/book/david_ray_griffin__cognitive-infiltration/

Advice appreciated, Jim. I've never been a fan of censorship, but a few of the bugliosers here probably need to be filtered. A professor at my alma mater used to tell his students to, "Read the good stuff. Life is too short to waste reading crap."

Pay-out, As a psychiatrist who has actually treated many patients suffering from paranoia during the past 35 years, I'm not impressed by young Daniel Freedman's self-advertising and pop-psychology VR "therapies" -- with the possible exception of VR for desensitization of phobias. My hunch is that his clinical outcomes in treating paranoia stink-- in the absence of anti-psychotic meds.. In fact, the guy strikes me as a pop psychology salesman. Where did he recruit the "paranoid" patients for his "studies?" Do you have any idea how difficult it is to develop a working alliance with a paranoid person? (Hint: They don't tend to show up at clinics with a chief complaint of being, "paranoid.") BTW, do you even know the difference between a psychiatrist and a psychologist? Next question. How was young Daniel Freedman recruited to throw in his pop psychology two cents into this mysterious NIH-related "study" about "conspiracy theorists?" Let me guess. Was it someone with influence over the NIH who is very concerned about the American public discovering the truth about 9/11? Someone who would reference non-scientists like Daniel Pipes and Cass Sunstein in the introduction of a pseudo- "science" paper about "conspiracy theorists?" Get real. Do you also believe the pseudo-scientific mumbo jumbo about 9/11 published by Michael Chertoff's cousin in Popular Science, and the 9/11 NIST report? Those pseudo-scientific propaganda pieces are similar to the "Great Pumpkin" theory about the trajectory of JFK's head that the CIA paid some academician to invent after the public finally got to see the Zapruder film in 1975. Only people who don't understand science are bamboozled by your nonsense. Adios.

Paul, Here are two references on the subjects of 1) Odigo, and 2) the Al Franken quote. I'm very familiar with journalist Christopher Bollyn's work. (Notice the video of Netanyahu confirming the miraculously few Israeli casualties at the WTC on 9/11.) The other link quotes an excerpt from Franken's own book. He was, apparently, warned by Ed Koch to stay away from the WTC on 9/11. 1) The Odigo Warnings & the 4,000 Israelis Saved on 9-11 http://www.bollyn.com/9-11-archive-2015-2/#article_15231 2) Sen. Al Franken Admits Being Warned About 9-11 Beforehand https://www.meetup.com/StLouis9-11Questions/messages/77776097/ October 15, 2015 "TO TELL YOU THE TRUTH, I GOT THE JEW CALL." In his book, Lies and the Lying XXXXX Who Tell Them, Sen. Al Franken admits to having been warned not to go to work at the World Trade Center on 9-11. Why have the government and "free press" in the United States not investigated this report? Senator Al Franken admits in his book, Lies and the Lying XXXXX Who Tell Them (2003), that he received a call from the former mayor of New York, Ed Koch, warning him not to go to his office in the World Trade Center on 9-11, using the Hebrew calendar as a reference for the date, which was September 11, 2001. Franken refers to this warning call as the "Jew call." "Al", he told me, "don't go to work on the twenty-third day of Elul." Al Franken may have been a comedian who went to Washington, but this is not funny. Being forewarned about 9-11 is a criminal matter. Calls to Sen. Al Franken's office in Washington at (202)[masked], were not answered, although they were made during working hours. Furthermore, Franken's press secretary, Michael Dale Stein at (202)[masked], did not answer either his office phone or his mobile phone during business hours. Stein's mobile phone said the mail box was empty so messages could not even be left.

Wait a minute, Pay-out. Didn't you just say that you have, in fact, been "getting paid to do this stuff"-- I.e., to infiltrate and harass people on this forum? I surmised as much the first time I ever read one of your lengthy, nonsensical posts here a few months ago. You talk a good game, but any educated person can, most likely, see through your bugliosity. No intellectually curious, reasonably well-informed person in 2019 believes the false narratives of the Warren Commission Report or Zelikow's 9/11 Omission Report. Tell Sunstein to stop harassing scientists, historians, and true detectives.

These are political "science" papers, not science. Daniel Pipes is a notorious, Neocon buglioser. Cass Sunstein is a lawyer -- not a scientist-- who is the Godfather of U.S. government-funded "infiltrators" (propagandists) in the social media. Big brothers who watch American intellectuals who commit Thought Crimes. Sunstein has been especially keen to undermine scientists and historians who have successfully debunked the official U.S. government narrative about the 9/11 op. (I misspelled Sunstein's name, and wanted to correct the typo, but it would have required re-posting the entire post above. Big deal.)

Rob, The Dulles brothers-- John Foster and Allen-- were sons of a Presbyterian minister who, certainly, shared an almost messianic, religious zeal for defeating communism. But, in a manner that sociologist Max Weber would have appreciated, they were also pillars of capitalism-- Wall Street lawyers who sat on the boards of corporations like the United Fruit Company, (while conspiring to overthrow socialist democracies in Latin America.) The Dulles brothers were motivated by a strange, genocidal zeal for both money and (Protestant) ideology.

FYI, folks. Lance Payette's so-called "scientific" literature referenced above is not real science. It's Kafkaesque junk-- theories about public beliefs based on erroneous premises about scientific and historical facts. Most of these papers were written by political "scientists" whose "data" consists of surveys about public opinions regarding alleged "conspiracy theories." As an example, read Payette's 1994 reference paper (above) by a political "scientist" at Rutgers named Goertzel. Goertzel prefaces his paper by pointing out that, despite the increasing evidence proving that Oswald was a Lone Assassin, more Americans after 1992 seemed to believe irrational "conspiracy theories" claiming that Oswald was NOT a Lone Assassin... I am greatly relieved that Payette, at least, knows enough history to admit that Lincoln's assassination involved a conspiracy. Anyone who has carefully studied the 11/22/63 assassination evidence knows that the same is true in the case of JFK's murder. Does Goertzel? As for 9/11, as Professor Daniel Ganser observed, "All theories about 9/11 are conspiracy theories," including the deeply flawed official U.S. government narrative. But Cass Sunstein, another one of Payette's favorite "scientists," is a lawyer who has pioneered the concept of having government-funded "infiltrators" (propagandists) visit social media sites to disrupt and undermine research communities investigating the scientific and historical evidence about 9/11.

Yes, but I just violated my decision to stop reading Lance Pay-out's posts. If you look at LP's so-called, "scientific" reference paper (above) about "conspiracy theories," one of the first truly hilarious claims it makes is that, "most conspiracy theories" (about organizations conspiring to carry out malevolent actions) have turned out to be false! And guess which "scientist" wrote that one-- Daniel Pipes! But it gets worse... The next "scientist" referenced in the LP paper is none other than Cass Susstein, himself -- the political animal who pioneered the concept of hiring "cognitive infiltrators" to manipulate narratives about government ops on U.S. social media! At least this ridiculous, "scientific" Lance Payette paper made a half-hearted attempt to define "conspiracy theorist" for their "analysis." A CT is, apparently, a person who believes that powerful organizations may conspire to achieve malevolent ends. In other words, a historian!

This LP gibberish is, truly, the worst LP stuff I've listened to since the early 60s, when my father used to play his favorite Mantovani LP, on occasion, after work-- featuring syrupy, maudlin string ensembles of melodies like, "Charmaine," and "La Vie en Rose." But let me say, on a serious note, that Payette's bovine excrement is highly offensive to me, personally. It is a very serious, heinous thing to falsely accuse someone of "anti-Semitism." The (physician) father of one of my former housemates in med school was a survivor of Dachau during WWII, and several of my former patients were from families murdered in the Holocaust. My own father was a survivor of the U.S. 753rd Tank Battalion in WWII -- of San Pietro "fame"-- that liberated a German concentration camp at Lohr, among many other horrible experiences. I would urge forum members to refrain from repeating Lance Payette's insulting, erroneous abuse of terms like, "anti-Semitism," and "conspiracy theorist" here. Anyone who knows me will vouch for the fact that I believe all people are entitled to equal, inalienable human rights, regardless of race, creed, color, or gender. That is entirely inconsistent with "Anti-Semitism." This is the last time I will be reading or responding here to the dishonest, slanderous posts of Lance Payette.

Albert Einstein once said something like, "If you can't explain something straightforwardly, you probably don't understand it." Yet, some people equate truth with an abundance of verbiage - as in the case of ponderous tomes like the Warren Commission Report and Reclaiming History. Another example of expensive, government-funded gibberish is the NIST "report" on the WTC demolitions on 9/11. Among other glaring omissions, the NIST "computer simulated" analysis managed to completely ignore basic Newtonian physics, and any physical or chemical analysis of the WTC debris (including the thousands of tons of pulverized concrete and liquefied steel.) Not surprisingly, the NIST refused to publish the "data" used in their computer simulations.

The U.S. government is, apparently, concerned about "conspiracy theorists"-- a term that does not describe a meaningful psychiatric phenotype. This vague rubric of "conspiracy theorist," apparently applies to anyone who believes that governments and their national intelligence agencies may conspire to achieve political and military ends-- historians, scientists, attorneys, etc.-- as well as uneducated, delusional people who believe that the Earth is flat. "Scientific" studies referred to by the new anti-conspiracy theory Thought Police have, allegedly, shown that "conspiracy theorists" are "paranoid." But what is "paranoia?" I am not an expert in the history of the so-called U.S. "Deep State," but I know a great deal about the phenomenology of "paranoia." In my 35 year career as an American psychiatrist, I have observed and studied paranoia on a regular basis. Paranoia is fear that is not based in reality. The term was originally used by the 19th century psychiatrist Emil Kraepelin-- the "Godfather" of the modern psychiatric DSM-- to describe a mental disorder that he called "Systematized Paranoia." In modern DSM parlance, it is called "Delusional Disorder," an illness in which people suffer from chronic delusional fear, without experiencing hallucinations. Other common mental disorders associated with paranoia are paranoid schizophrenia and mood disorders (both unipolar and bipolar) with psychotic features. Another common cause of paranoia is stimulant intoxication by amphetamine-like substances, including cocaine. Historians, scientists, and other scholars who have studied and written about various deceptive government-sponsored narratives are not "paranoid" in any meaningful sense of the word. Skepticism, per se, is not "paranoia," if it is based on accurate perceptions of reality. Anyone who claims that it is-- in pop psychology articles or "scientific" studies-- simply doesn't understand the definition and phenomenology of paranoia. This kind of intellectual fraudulence in the U.S. today appears to be a poorly conceived government approach to Thought Policing people who think about government narratives propagated in our modern mass media.

Paul, I admire your fact-checking habit, and appreciate it. I read somewhere that Al Franken made that comment about being forewarned on 9/11, and certainly regret misquoting him, if that is the case. (And I've been a fan of Al Franken since the days of "Franken and Davis" on SNL in the 70s.) As for the "Dancing Israelis" arrested near the Holland Tunnel on 9/11, I have read that at least two of them were known Mossad agents. Some FBI data about them (including photos) was recently obtained (and published) through an FOIA request. They claimed that they were filming the WTC attacks on 9/11 in order to "document the event." They were celebrating. Their Urban Moving Systems employer, Dominick Suter, fled to Israel after their arrest, before the FBI could question him. The entire 9/11 Urban Moving Systems case has always been shrouded in secrecy in the U.S. media.

This post by Lance Pay-out is complete pseudo-scientific bunk, written by a non-scientist who presumes to lecture to us about the "scientific community." What "scientific community" is Mr. Pay-out referring to? Certainly not the people at Harvard Medical School, where I graduated in 1983. (BTW, I'm "Dr. Niederhut," Mr. Pay-out. Mr. Niederhut was my dad, the old math teacher.) Is he talking about the American Board of Psychiatry and Neurology, which awarded my certification 30 years ago, in 1989? So, I'll reiterate. "Conspiracy theorist" is a CIA propaganda term that does not denote a monolithic demographic group or psychiatric phenotype. What does it mean, really? What do Flat Earthers have in common with highly educated, informed research scholars who have accurately debunked false government narratives about the JFK assassination and 9/11? Not much. Frankly, I'm highly skeptical about anyone in Mr. Pay-out's so-called "scientific community"-- peer reviewed or otherwise-- who writes about "conspiracy theorists" as if this constitutes a meaningful demographic. It has never been difficult for the CIA to pay academicians to write crap.

So, you're a big fan of bugliosity, then? Is that what you're getting at? I suppose that everyone needs a hobby. 🤪

Paul, Notice the sleight-of-hand here. The story about Odigo warning people (in Hebrew) of the impending attacks on the World Trade Center on 9/11 was not about "Jews," per se. It was about Israeli casualties on 9/11. As for Al Franken, I don't recall where I read about his alleged comment about being forewarned on 9/11. Do you happen to have a link? If he didn't say it, I was wrong to misquote him. Meanwhile, let's be honest about the 9/11 evidence, without resorting to deflective "Anti-Semitic" name-calling here. Can we discuss the Mossad without being called, "Anti-Semitic? 1) There is incontrovertible evidence that the five Mossad-affiliated "Dancing Israelis" arrested near the Holland Tunnel on 9/11 were seen filming and celebrating the WTC demolitions. They even admitted that much on Israeli television (after being released to Israel by the FBI.) 2) Their boss at Urban Moving Systems in Weehawken, N.J., Dominick Suter, fled to Israel before he could be questioned by the FBI. 3) The story was completely blacked out of the mainstream U.S. media. Those are verified facts.

One of my favorite politicians in America claimed that he got, "the Jew call" on 9/11-- warning him to stay away from the World Trade Center. Lest I be accused by Lance Pay-out, again, of "Anti-Semitism," it was Al Franken. As an aside, I read an interview of Al Franken in the Harvard Alumni Magazine a few years ago in which Franken discussed the death of his friend, Senator Paul Wellstone. Franken said that Dick Cheney had directly threatened Wellstone about his opposition to the Iraq War shortly before Wellstone's plane mysteriously crashed in Minnesota. At the time, Wellstone was a shoe-in for re-election to the U.S. Senate.

Having to deal with very active gad flies is, apparently, the price that some research scholars here have paid for their publications. One formal, philosophical argument I would make about Mr. Von Pein's latest "rifle" diatribe is the following. I. Any theory (scientific, historical, etc.) can be invalidated by proving that it is contradicted by any essential fact upon which it is based. Ergo, it's much easier to invalidate a theory (of anything) than to formulate an alternative, accurate theory that explains ALL of the facts. II. So, just for the sake of argument, let us concede that Mr. Bugliosi's "Lone Nut" JFKA theory is NOT contradicted by the rifle evidence. (Probably a big IF, But...) The burden of proof would still be on Mr. Von Pein to demonstrate how Bugliosi's "Lone Nut" theory has not been invalidated by all of the other facts that contradict it, as clearly documented in DiEugenio's analyses. III. In other words, the best that can be said about Mr. Von Pein's argument on this thread is, "Yo, dude. One down. 1,001 to go."

Yes, in our "social construction of reality," as the late, great Peter Berger described it, poets are often the guys who annoyingly call attention to the construction defects. As for Lance Pay-out, I hope that his reports of the demise of this forum (yesterday) have been greatly exaggerated.

Thanks for the info, Anthony. By "PNAC" in my above post, I was referring to the original signers of PNAC's 1997 "Declaration of Principles," and those who came to be known as the "Vulcans" by 2000. The list was a virtual Who's Who of major players in the Bush-Cheney administration-- especially Cheney himself, Rumsfeld, Wolfowitz, Scooter Libby, Douglas Feith, and Condoleeza Rice. Their concepts of promoting unilateral U.S. global hegemony were originally articulated by Wolfowitz and his former Yale grad student, Scooter Libby, in 1992. Wolfowitz also lamented, at that early date, that the U.S. had missed an opportunity to depose Saddam Hussein after the first Gulf War. BTW, one related factoid that I read in Paul O'Neill's 2005 memoir about the Bush-Cheney administration-- The Price of Loyalty... Rumsfeld talked to O'Neill about contingency plans for a war with Iraq in the VERY FIRST Bush-Cheney cabinet meeting, in late January of 2001.

Trump has been an enigma when it comes to Syria, at best. On the one hand, he repeatedly criticized the Obama administration's Syrian policy, (as early as 2015) then de-funded CIA Operation Timber Sycamore in Syria (in July of 2017.) Conversely, he has bombed Syrian government positions twice, ( in response to apparent false flag chemical weapons attacks blamed on the Syrian Army) while endorsing the Israeli annexation of the Golan Heights. As for PNAC and Peter Dale Scott's 9/11 analysis, there seems to be a vast array of evidence that 9/11 was a false flag PNAC op that was carried out to mobilize U.S. public support for the implementation of the 1998 PNAC/Wolfowitz Doctrine-- establishing U.S. 9and NATO) hegemony in Central Asia. What Sibel Edmonds called "Gladio B."

The Garden State should pay Baraka's family his $20,000 plus interest. Would they really prefer a Poet Laureate who doesn't tell it like it is, or was? (William Carlos Williams probably turned over in his grave when the New Jersey legislature voted to rescind Baraka's honorarium.)

Speaking of vaporization, it's truly amazing that a Muslim passport survived the Pentagon crash that completely vaporized all of the passengers, luggage, metal seats, and even the large titanium Boeing 757 rotors at the Pentagon on 9/11. A single titanium rotor survived-- but it was far too small to have come from a 757.

Larry, I intend no disrespect regarding your research and knowledge about the pre-history of 9/11. You, obviously, know a lot more than I do about the subject. BUT, is it possible that Condoleeza Rice's strange stonewalling of interventions against "Al Qaeda" flight trainees prior to 9/11 was based on her complicity in a PNAC/Bush-Cheney black op in which these pork-eating, cocaine-snorting Muslim "terrorists" were being used as patsies? The analogies with Lee Harvey Oswald's case are legion. As one example, both Hanjour and Oswald allegedly performed technically impossible feats, (with a Boeing 757 and a Mannlicher Carcano) even though one of them was, by all accounts, a terrible pilot, and the other was a terrible marksman.

Several points for the amateur "psychologist," Lance Pay-out to think about... 1) The oft-overused CIA propaganda term, "conspiracy theorist," does not define any monolithic demographic group, or psychiatric phenotype. As an obvious example, the official Bush-Cheney administration/PNAC narrative about 9/11 is a "conspiracy theory." Does the "study" by Josh Hart include "conspiracy theorists" who accept the bizarre U.S. government narrative about 9/11? 2) Therefore, "studies" that purport to generalize about so-called "conspiracy theorists" are essentially meaningless. Which "conspiracy theorists" are they studying-- uneducated flat Earthers or highly educated, accurate research scholars who debunk false government narratives? Big difference! 3) More meaningful generalizations can, and have, been made about people who reflexively reject "conspiracy theories" that are based on true facts. Such "deniers" are, typically, impaired by blind faith in authority, cognitive rigidity, and a limited capacity for rational empiricism-- independent of mass delusions.