Benjamin Cole

Ron B. and others: I try to be as open-minded and gentle as I can be in JFKA discussions, as the hard details of what actually happened are not nailed down. In addition, there is planted disinformation afoot, and any of us can be fooled on some matters (including me). But, after all, we have the Zapruder film and numerous witnesses. I see no indication anyone inside the JFK limo was shooting. Beyond that, who would plan to have someone inside the limo shoot a President in public and get away with it? And no one saw the Secret Service man with the automatic weapon shoot JFK? Reasonable people can disagree, and do. But let us be reasonable.

John B.- Thanks for your comments and posting that always-gloomy picture of the Walker house. It looks like Halloween of Friday the 13th every time.

Richard B.--- I suspect as much, but have never found compelling evidence. Yes, a few examples are in the official iterature, under limited, perfect circumstances. I did attend a live show once, where a hypnotist on stage apparently hypnotized bona-fide audience members. I happened to be sitting in the first row, and felt myself falling under the hypnotist's sway, but jerked out of it. I suspected the hypnotist was using a gas sedative or something to that effect (without any proof). So, I believe I saw first hand how a hypnotist can in fact put someone "under" and they will walk around in their underwear etc. (Unfortunately, the hypnotist had little imagination beyond that, haha). So maybe, if someone slipped Sirhan a mickey of some type.... The fact that RFK was shot from behind and at close range suggests the security guard shot him, but no one really saw it. Strange case.

Richard Booth--- Well, Westbrook did end up in Vietnam, or at least so I read. Likely, he was another CIA asset, or contact. As was the Mayor of Dallas. That said, I think (as I always do) Westbrook was complicit after the fact, but not before. After the fact, the official story line was "LOH did it, and leftie-commies want to change the narrative to protect one of their own, and score PR points." This official narrative is in addition in addition to the "WWIII virus" making the rounds in the White House. This was effective is suppressing a real investigation of the JFKA. So, after the JFKA , Westbrook fell in line. I find it less suspicious that Westbrook did not want to sit at his office and attend personnel files on Nov. 22, after the JFKA. It was, to be fair, for the DPD an "all hands on deck" situation. Westbrook had rank, so he went where he wanted to, and that is where the action was. I would have done the same thing. But whatever one's opinions, the arrival of LOH's wallet on the Tippit murder scene is a strong indicator of a conspiracy. You and I may differ on the mechanics of the conspiracy, which is fine. The RFK case is even uglier, if possible. I wish I knew how successful the MKULTRA program, or similar programs, were or are. Can a human being really be so programmed?

Thanks. I will take a look.

Joe B- I suspect it was warmer inside the building than out. On the street, Rowland described wearing gloves, and other people are seen in coats. Inside the TSBD, Mr. Brown Coat was probably unique, at least in wearing a coat. But then not many people were on the sixth floor. I wonder if anyone noticed if Mr. Brown Coat was bald. Maybe he put on fedora when leaving the building. Also, remember, there were four publishing companies with offices inside the TSBD, all of whom could have had executives in on any given day. So a man entering the building in brown suit coat would not have been unusual, in my guess. Another strange thing, is I do not think those publisher offices were ever searched after the JFKA. Anybody out there know?

Joe B.-- Yes, I think there was time for people to shoot, and then walk down the TBSD back stairway and leave. Very simple explanation. Descending stairs rapidly is no great feat. I wish I knew how bulky or long the brown coat was. Could someone secret a short rifle under said brown coat? Who knows?

Add on: What rattles me about my "smaller is better" scenario is LOH's wallet showing up at the Tippit murder scene. This means--- 1. Of the thousands of street murders committed every year, only LOH helpfully dropped his wallet at the scene of the crime to aid investigators. 2. The wallet was planted at the scene. That means someone had the wallet, got clued in about the Tippit murder, then made his way to the scene. Supposedly Phillips was in Dallas on the day.... 3. LOH intentionally dropped his wallet, as a signal to handlers to come extract him from the deepening mess he was in (this seems unlikely).

Lawrence S. Thanks for reading and your observations. Here are my replies: 1. LOH. We actually agree somewhat here. LOH can be made into a patsy, even if he was not in the sniper's nest. I posit a scenario in which he was in the nest. 2. Not sure I follow. I think the sniper's nest window was high enough to stick out a rifle or a bald head. 3. Again, not sure what you mean. Witness Rowland says the window, a half frame window, was open to the max. 4. Yes, today a false-flag fase assassination attempt on a sitting US president sounds extreme. In 1963, at the height of the Cuba-cold wars days....maybe not so much. Operations Northwoods planned far worse. Back then, serious members of the Joint Chiefs of Staff wanted to initiate a nuclear war with the Soviet Union. That was the climate. Really, compared to initiating a nuclear war, a JFKA PR stunt is small potatoes. 5. The researchers Newman and Hardway both conclude some serious biography building was going on with LOH. There are many connections between LOH and the intel state, and almost none with the Mob. The WWIII virus is way beyond Mob stuff. The complicity of many parties after the JFKA is also beyond the arm of the Mob. Perhaps the Mob provided some hired shooters, who were brought in and piggybacked on the false-flag fake operation. Maybe they shot from the Dal-Tex building, and that's all they knew about the operation, none of the backstory. I am offering a version of events that is simple, explanatory, and plausible. I contend a conspiracy to kill JFKA had to be small, very small. 6. The Walker evidence is inconclusive, and what evidence exists suggests if LOH was the actual shooter, then he had accomplices, a different rifle, and badly missed at short range.

Richard Booth-- From researcher Armstrong https://harveyandlee.net/TSBD_Elevator/TSBD_elevator.html From the last shot fired at President Kennedy, it had taken Baker between a minute and fifteen seconds and a minute and thirty seconds to park his motorcycle, meet up with Roy Truly at the entrance to the the building, and arrive at the freight elevators at the back of the building. BAKER AND TRULY ARRIVED AT THE FREIGHT ELEVATORS ONLY MOMENTS AFTER VICTORIA ADAMS AND SANDRA STYLES ARRIVED ON THE FIRST FLOOR (ONE MINUTE AFTER SHOTS WERE FIRED) AND THEN HURRIED OUT THE BACK DOOR OF THE BUILDING. Truly pushed the elevator call button but the neither the east nor west elevators responded (the electricity was off). Truly looked up the elevator shaft and saw that both elevators were on the 5th floor. Truly then began running up the old wooden stairs, with Officer Baker following. He ran up to the second floor and was beginning to run up to the 3rd floor when Officer Baker saw a man "walking away from the stairway." Later that afternoon Baker gave an affidavit to the DPD and said, "I called to the man (HARVEY Oswald) and he turned around and came back toward me. The building manager said, 'I know that man he works here.' I turned the man loose and went up to the top floor." ---30--- Armstrong posits people may have been able to descend through the elevator shaft, but I guess if Truly had looked up the freight elevator shaft, then it must have been the passenger elevator shaft that provided an escape route. And that is wht Armstrong suggests. There does seem a flaw in this, as Armstrong posits that the escapers removed large heavy wooden floor planks to make their entrance to the shaft. How they got the planks back into place remains a puzzle. Armstrong's presentation is nearly impenetrable, btw. I am not so concerned about people secretly entering the TSBD. That could have been done the night before the JFKA, simple lock-and-key job. Other unidentified people were seen leaving the TSBD in the immediate aftermath of the JFKA, including a man in brown coat. Richard---have you an explanation of where the escapers got into the passenger elevator shaft, and where they egressed?

No.

Ron Bulman--- My guess is Nixon was Nixon, and had a high IQ himself. The guy wrote books after all, which are not bad reading. Who was using who? Nixon is a strange character, deeply conflicted. His unforgivable sin was his role in helping to murder 6 million SE Asians. I suspect Nixon, like so many others, was dubious about the accuracy of the WC's conclusions. He was pressuring the CIA to clean up the Watergate situation for him. Once in the Oval Office, Nixon seemed to answer to no one in particular. I am not sure Nixon believed in anything, or felt true alliance with anyone.

Cliff-- I am not here to defend Trump, or Nixon. My point is, we have an intel community that does not answer to the elected President. It is not OK, just because Nixon and Trump were unpopular in certain circles, and perhaps even deserved their unpopularity. In the case of Nixon, a case can be made he was a war criminal---what he did to SE Asia is heart-breaking. And he knew it was a lost cause. I disagree with your take on the Deep State backing Trump. I think the US globalist community was aghast at Trump, for good and bad reasons. But hey---different opinions is what makes an intellectual stew. I welcome yours.

Denny Z- Thanks for reading, and you certainly raise a lot of reasonable challenges. Here goes with my responses---keep in mind I consider a reasonable premise that pre-JFKA witting participants are few, very few. 1. "No serious researcher says LOH had nothing to do with it." OK, then we agree. In my essay, I leave open that LOH may have had another role. Some researchers do suggest "Oswald had nothing to do with it." Even Garrison once said so, but he might have been indulging in rhetorical flourish. 2. Was Oswald expendable? I am going to ask an unfair question. Can you detail another peacetime CIA mission in which a loyal CIA officer or serious asset was turned into a patsy, and slated for death? (The question is "unfair" as there may have been such a mission, and it is secret). But I know of no such mission. Sure, in wartime, under extreme duress, decisions have to be made. But the JFKA, false, fake or otherwise, was a volitional peacetime mission, with options. If the CIA wanted JFK dead, they had many options. JFK could be poisoned, or maybe just run out of office by exposing his love life, if that was their goal. 3. If the DPD was part the JFKA, and wanted LOH dead, they had ample opportunity at the Texas Theater. Listen, in Los Angeles, if a suspect draws weapon on the LAPD, he will be dead. I stand by my assessment. By the account of multiple witnesses, LOH drew a weapon on the DPD and lived. I call that remarkable restraint. Whether LOH's gun misfired etc., who knows. 4. LOH not sweating in the second-floor coke machine encounter. LOH was a former Marine and 24 years old. Perhaps not a fitness buff, but you are talking about a young guy walking briskly down the stairs. It was not a hot day. LOH had 75-90 seconds to get there. People have paced off the TSBD walk many times, and it is doable. LOH feigned nonchalance, and was quickly vouched for by Truly. Marion Baker did not examine LOH, but hustled quickly past. 5. If you have a photo of LOH outside of the TSBD at the time of the shooting, bring it on. 6. The shells in the sniper's nest. Yes, supposedly there were three. Some say the evidence was monkeyed with before the photographer got there. Or, LOH fired once and headed for the exit, and Eladio Del Valle tossed a couple shells down, and then fired in earnest. 7. I do not think it is farfetched that LOH may have washed his face, or sweated, on his way to the Texas Theater, or inside the Texas Theater. Or visited the bathroom at Beckley. Or stuck a small piece of cardboard as a shield on his face when firing. Why is this farfetched? The ordinary nitrate tests are no longer admissible court evidence, and are not used anymore. In briedm they are unreliable. Pat Sheer says the cheek cast itself was washed before Guinn did his fancy neutron thing. I stand by my assessment the cheek cast is inconclusive at best. I would not hang a man, or exonerate him, on such evidence. 8. I would like to know who turned off the power to the TSBD too. LOH? A prankster? Possibly. I am not sure how turning off the power aids in the JFKA, fake, false-flag, or not. With the lift out, the shooters are trying to escape by the stairs, and now pursuers have no choice but to go up the stairs. Seems like a bad move to me. 9. Euins credibility. Yes, Euins credibility can be challenged. Maybe Euins was a kook. No one else saw a bald man shooting. No one has a photo of the gunman, despite plenty of press photographers. But my false-flag fake assassination scenario holds up under different details. I just offered a version, with Del Valle. Sheesh, maybe the real shooters were on the Dal-tex roof top, and LOH fired twice and missing, while the real shooters did their work with silencers. 10. The grassy knoll shooter? I contend Eladio Del Valle brought along the grassy knoll shooter to aid in his, Del Valle's escape. The diversion worked to a large extent. A grassy knoll shooter was not in Phillips' false flag, fake assassination plan. It was piggybacked on. Well, those are my responses. Thanks for reading. Obviously, there are a lot of opinions in this matter. Perhaps we disagree, and that's okay.

Greg D.-- 1. No one talked about the false flag fake assassination attempt. Indeed! To do so would be to admit a CIA op backfired with horrid results. That makes Keystone Kops look smart. I think the number of people who knew about LOH as a false-flag shooter would have been Phillips, and one superior at CIA. Then the two guys Philips brought in to help LOH. If they were Del Valle and Hermininio, they were dead by 1967. Phillips sort of talked about it. 2. A "stranger" getting into the TSBD. My understanding is some of the offices inside the TSBD were rented out to non-TSBD businesses. Then you have the usual ruses of looking like a delivery man, etc. Maybe the true assassins even got in the night before, simple lock-and-key job. 3. I think at the time, LOH was reporting to Phillips. I doubt anyone inside TSBD knew anything. There is the curious fellow Shelley. 4. Getting LOH the job inside the TSBD. That's a tough one. LOH seems to have several jobs with "connected" companies, that is companies linked to the National Security state. Did Angleton turn some gears to get LOH inside the TBSD? I don't know. Perhaps it was happenstance. One could posit if LOH had not gotten a job at the TSBD, then he would have shot at JFK from the top of the Dal-Tex building. He was not supposed to hit anyway. The false-flag fake assassination attempt does not need the TSBD. 5. Intentionally killing LOH, as part of a real JFKA planned by CIA high-ups. Well, maybe. I contend CIA higher-ups did have LOH executed, by their Mafia buddies. But more likely they wanted him to disappear, show up in Cuba, after a false flag attempt. I will tell you or anybody another strange part of the story: LOH's wallet was found at the scene of the Tippit murder. So, of the hundreds (maybe thousands) of street murders in the US in 1963, only in the Tippit case did the murderer helpfully leave behind his wallet at the scene of the crime. Or, it was planted after the fact. The planting seems more likely. So who planted LOH's wallet at the Tippit shooting? That adds (likely) another participant in the JFKA.

Richard Booth: Well, our viewpoints have a lot in common, and a few variances, but that's OK. I almost like your viewpoint better. That is amazing stuff about the Cram History. Call me naive, I find it hard to swallow that many people, in official positions, in fact planned the assassination of a sitting US President. Maybe I am like Robert Blakey and just can't believe people could be so foul. Blakely wised up part-way, and maybe I will too some day. I am prepared to believe complicity was rife after the JFKA, and that someone fairly high in the CIA or intel operated with the Mob to get LOH shot. But thanks for reading, and I look forward to more discussions about this, the best detective story ever written.

Obviously, I cannot refute your scenario. I have only offered what I think is a credible scenario. I still tend to lean to "fewer is better" in terms of pre-event JFKA believability. After the event, complicity was a patriotic (and ruling class) duty.

Greg D- Thanks for reading, and asking such trenchant questions. I will have to re-read your thoughtful reply a few times, and then gin up a response. Sadly, I have a day job even at my age, so wait for the week-end.

I have to concede, if there really were CIA-assisted or planned bona-fide assassination plots in Miami, Chicago, Los Angeles, Washington D.C. and Maryland, then there had be be a squad somewhere inside military intel or the CIA working details out. That is, more witting participants than I think is likely. But some of these other plots look a little thin, and there is such a thing as a lone-nut gunman. See the Reagan shooting. Some lady-nut pointed a gun at President Ford. The Chicago plots remain tantalizing, but appear also to involve Cubans.

Paul B- Of course, your scenario is entirely possible as well. Not to challenge you, but to foment conversation, could you describe your scenario in terms of number of witting participants? And what was LOH's level of involvement in your scenario? Did CIA brass deliberately make LOH a patsy, despite him being a loyal, or at least serviceable assets for years? How and when did LOH determine he was a patsy? Did CIA brass intend for LOH to be dead in the immediate aftermath of the JFKA? Otherwise, there would be a lot of risk LOH would begin to talk about what he knew. Surely, John Newman has taken a whack at Veciana. But I find Newman curiously peevish in some of his commentary about Veciana, and also demanding of excruciatingly strict timelines from a man in his winter, decades from events. Paper records can be lost, stolen or faked. Could Newman be led up the wrong tree by some planted documents? Many people consider Phillips' claim he did not even know who was Veciana to be a stretch. Well, let us see Newman comes up with. He is being rather coy.

Thanks, Cliff. I cannot prove anything. My gut tells me the plot to kill JFK had to be small, very small in terms of knowing participants. That said, I do not regard my scenario as the be-all, end-all. It is a description of how a plot could be very small, and dovetails with certain undisputed facts about the case.

Paul B.-- "Your theory needs the guilty being named, or guessed at anyway, and I’m talking about the Cabal that hijacked the false flag operation."--PB That's the point of my article! The "guilty" are some relatively low-level exiles who piggybacked on Phillips' PR stunt. Eladio Del Valle for example, but maybe some other bald guy, or maybe even a guy wearing a fake bald-looking beanie cap as a disguise. One could posit "the guilty" are those who intentionally leaked the false-flag plan to the exiles (and that could go up to Dulles or Angleton), or were sloppy and the false-flag assassination plot leaked. Or maybe Phillips showed extraordinarily bad judgement, and hired Cuban exiles to do the false-flag job in combo with LOH, and the exiles did it their way, for real. As I said, where the CIA higher-ups probably became involved was in the cover-up and murder of LOH. Somebody had to promise something to Marcello (or perhaps a guy named Civello) to get Ruby to do the deed. Marcello was going to extract assurances from the highest levels. And Blakely said the LBJ Administration backed off of mob-hunting. Anyways, that my guess.

Richard Booth: Many thanks for reading my piece, amd such a thoughtful and on-target response. I will have to read your reply a few more times, before I respond. As I said, I was trying to put together a JFKA with the minimum number of participants, so loose lips would not sink ships, before or after. Consider it thought-inducing design constraint. Thanks again for reading I will get back to you.

Robert Blakely also thought LOH was supposed to be hit, ASAP post JFKA, but something went awry. So you have good company, and evidently "hitting the hitter" is a known tactic in Mobland. I think differently. In my scenario, LOH was supposed to escape, then perhaps show up in Cuba, or just change ID's and live life as a blond on a 100-acre ranch in Panama, or what have you. The fact that LOH was in police custody and alive forced the CIA to pull out all the stops to alter the situation, and ultimately rely on Jack Ruby. It sure seems likely that LOH concluded rather quickly after the JFKA that he was in danger.

I think you are correct that the LOH slaying was a unplanned and separate operation from the JFKA. To me, the LOH slaying was more likely to involve the complicity of CIA higher-ups.