Steve Roe

1 hour ago, David Von Pein said:

That is certainly a legitimate and valid question that has never been satisfactorily answered (IMO) by any conspiracy theorist.

David, they avoid it like the plague. Incredibly Barry Ernest did answer that question and he said perhaps the assassin just remained up there and mingled in with the Dallas Police, Sheriff's Deputies and others. That was particularly amusing answer. 

But hey, let's ignore all the physical evidence, the rifle bag with Oswald's palm print, the rifle with Oswald's print on the barrel (albeit old-verifies he did handle it at some time), the fake Hidell card, the bullets tied to that rifle, his prints on the sniper nest boxes, the Hidell purchase of the rifle/revolver, the Tippit shooting, leaving the TSBD quickly thereafter, etc.

All Oswald had to do is make his descent downstairs BEFORE Adams/Styles. Then duck into the 2nd floor lunchroom where he encountered Truly and Baker. During that encounter, Adams and Styles descended downstairs completely missing Truly and Baker. Now which the Stroud document makes sense that Garner saw Truly and Baker making their way up to the 4th floor, of course after the lunchroom encounter and after Adams/Styles left for the stairs. 

On 10/3/2022 at 10:37 AM, Rob Clark said:

Interesting that Stone doesn't buy Prouty's BS about Ed Landsdale either....

 

 

Good one Rob. John Newman never said with conviction that Ed Landsdale was in Fort Worth on 11/22. It's another Prouty myth. 

1 hour ago, Tom Gram said:

Hypothetically, if Oswald was a low level intelligence asset assigned to smear the the FPCC in a propaganda operation that involved opening a fake local chapter, how would that have worked in the real world? 

1. Oswald would receive instruction to ramp up his efforts to establish credentials with the FPCC and obtain literature to copy and distribute. 
2. A location would be selected, preferably with a large Cuban exile population so that Oswald’s efforts would have maximum impact. 
3. Oswald would be directed to move to that location and link up with local contacts who would manage the operation and execute the plan. 

Oswald wrote to the FPCC in mid-April ‘63 requesting literature to distribute, and claiming that he had stood around Dallas with a placard around his neck saying “Viva Fidel”. There is zero evidence this ever happened other than a report from a cop from after the assassination who claimed he suddenly remembered the incident (after the “Viva Fidel” letter became public), and saw Oswald flee into a gun shop that coincidentally sold Carcanos. The cop told the press in Dec ‘63 that he’d been tipped off about the picketer by a reporter - but no effort was ever made to locate this reporter, and incredibly, the cop was not interviewed by the FBI until April ‘64. Hosty testified words to the effect that if the picketing incident really  happened, the Dallas Field Office would have certainly heard about it. 

Read VT Lee #1 again. Oswald admits he did wear a placard around his neck with strangely enough what Sgt. Harkness and W.R. Finegan described "Hands off Cuba". Also, a US Commissioner had witnessed it and complained to Harkness I believe. So, you got three independent accounts that the incident took place in front of the H.L. Green Department store on Main/Ervay. Now, nobody had an idea who Oswald was. He ran into the H.L. Green store, and they didn't pursue him. Just a nuisance call. 

Oswald’s letter to the FPCC was intercepted by an informant in New York, likely someone embedded in FPCC HQ. This informant told the NY Field Office about the letter on 4/21/63.

OK, Yes

Here’s the interesting part. New York did not (officially) inform Dallas about this letter until 6/27/63, an over two month delay. Other informants in New York had reported on letters Oswald sent to the SWP and CPUSA in Fall ‘62 and Dallas was informed of these letters within a week or two at most. New York also informed New Orleans of letters Oswald sent to CPUSA in June/July within about a week - so why the massive delay on the FPCC letter? 

Is this supposed to be sinister? 

FBI Chief Inspector James H. Gale looked into this after the assassination, concluded that there was no valid excuse for the suspiciously long delay and reprimanded the agents involved from the New York Office. 

What was the effect of the delay? The FPCC letter had a return address of P.O. Box 2915, and if Dallas had (officially) known that address (the official story on this is incredible, discussed in the Rifle/Neely St. thread) Hosty would have been able to track Oswald to New Orleans and Oswald’s late May letters to V.T. Lee (which were incredibly not intercepted/reported) would have almost certainly been seen as well. 

Tom, this is Pretzel Logic. Nobody knew about the Carcano Rifle till Oswald shot the President. Oswald got away with taking that shot at General Walker. There was no reason to investigate him for anything other than Hosty's routine check on Oswald's whereabouts. 

Also, if the FBI had (officially) known about Oswald’s alleged Dallas picketing incident and contacts with the FPCC he would have been very closely monitored, and the incident would have been thoroughly investigated.

Again, nobody knew it was Oswald. The man ran into the store and wasn't pursued.

Instead, Oswald was allowed to move to New Orleans and establish his phony FPCC chapter with zero scrutiny from the FBI, and run around with a bunch of anti-Castroites while pretending to be pro-Castro and get away with it. 

You are making it sound like Jim is claiming that Oswald moved to New Orleans on his own initiative and was subsequently recruited to act against the FPCC by Banister et al. - but that’s not what’s being proposed at all. Oswald moved to New Orleans not two weeks after this alleged and likely bogus Dallas picketing incident. The act of establishing credentials and requesting literature to copy squares perfectly with the idea of a start-up propaganda operation, and it’s not like Oswald didn’t know how to use a telephone.

Tom, no Oswald wasn't recruited in some sort of FPCC smear campaign, that's just crazy. Oswald was writing to FPCC as early as late summer 1962 while in Fort Worth. You really need to research this better because it doesn't square with Mr. DiEugenio's assertion that Banister was using Oswald for this crazy operation. You tell me, would Banister tell Oswald to go out and picket the U.S.S. Wasp fleet harbored in New Orleans.....for what??? Turn in all the Commie Sympathizing Sailors? You know why he picketed the Wasp, because the Wasp was part of the Cuban blockade fleet. Also, Oswald most likely picketed in front of the ITM because what??? Take a guess....how about trade with Cuba that was cut off.  It had absolutely nothing to do with Clay Shaw. 

Again, the Dallas picketing incident is not bogus Tom. I give the reasons above. 

EDIT: No idea why my font is so huge

Tom your font is fine, and it makes it easier to read

On 9/22/2022 at 7:20 AM, David Boylan said:

His other pamphlet.

 

Let's get the terminology correct David. This photo is a "Leaflet" also known as a flyer/handbill. It's a single page handout. A Pamphlet is a booklet. When Oswald was booked with the picketing incident by the New Orleans Police, he had the Pamphlet by Corliss Lamont (The Crime Against Cuba) pamphlet confiscated. That pamphlet had the "FPCC, 544 Camp Street" stamped at the end of the pamphlet text. There are no leaflets/flyers/handbills with the 544 Camp Street. Mr. DiEugenio is using a phony JFK movie prop.

Compare the stamp on your leaflet photo with DiEugenio's so-called flyer. It's significantly different and an obvious fake.

I challenge anyone to come up with the fake DiEugenio prop in the record, NARA or wherever pre-1991 (JFK movie).

On 9/22/2022 at 10:31 PM, Matt Allison said:

I can't get at my books right now, but I seem to remember the first paperback version of Summers' book Conspiracy, circa 1990, having a picture of one of the flyers with the 544 Camp address.

It's not in the 1989 Summers' book Conspiracy. Summers does correctly mention the "FPCC, 544 Camp Street" was stamped in the Corliss Lamont "The Crime Against Cuba" pamphlet at the end of the text, page 286. 

5 minutes ago, Gerry Down said:

Yup. Look at the size of the 544 Camp Street font compared to the font of a PO Box 30016 one. The font of the latter is much smaller.

Yes Gerry, you are correct. 

41 minutes ago, David Boylan said:

JFK Oliver Stone movie prop. Read Fred Litwin's article. This stuff has been floating around for years.

8 hours ago, James DiEugenio said:

I really do not know how else one can explain the Clinton/Jackson incident or Jessie Core --Shaw's aide de camp-- and the Oswald flyers. As that incident indicates--and Paul elucidates some of it--Shaw and Core were aware of what Banister was doing with Oswald for the anti FPCC crusade in New Orleans.  (See Joe McBride's nice post above on that.)

Mr. DiEugenio, Shaw and Core were not aware of what Banister was doing. That's a complete myth. In fact, Jesse Core called the FBI and reported Oswald's picketing. So how do you explain that? 

https://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=10477#relPageId=696&search="Jesse_Core"

Also Mr. Bleau, as well as yourself, repeat the nonsense about Oswald's leaflets stamped with "544 Camp Street". The cold hard facts are only the Corliss Lamont pamphlets had the 544 Camp Street stamped, not the leaflets. The leaflets had Oswald's Magazine Street and P.O. Box stamped. https://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=1142#relPageId=819

Another important item you and Bleau apparently do not address was Oswald handing out pamphlets in Dallas. In fact, he ordered more pamphlets while in Dallas. Of course, this doesn't square with your FPCC Banister-Oswald-Shaw-Core fantasy.  

https://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=1137#relPageId=531

Fred Litwin explains this huge blunder. 

https://www.onthetrailofdelusion.com/post/jfk-destiny-betrayed-misleads-viewers-on-oswald-s-hands-off-cuba-handbills

Mr. DiEugenio you and Mr. Bleau are making this harder than it really should be, with all these crazy sub-plots and Cecil B. DeMille "Cast of Thousands" conspirators. In my opinion, you are really confusing people with these extremely dubious speculative claims. 

The "Clem Bertrand" library card was a prank card. Fred Litwin has already debunked that nonsense some months ago. 

https://www.onthetrailofdelusion.com/post/clem-bertrand-s-library-card

The card was a post 1966 library card that showed up well after Clay Shaw's false arrest by Garrison. Someone went down to the Latter Memorial Branch Library and filled out a "Clem Bertrand" library card with phony stuff like Shaw's previous ITM business address. Shaw had left the ITM and no longer worked there.

Additionally, Shaw never lived at 3100 Louisiana Parkway. David Ferrie did live on Louisiana Parkway, but different address. 

Mr. Bleau obviously did not bother to research this in depth and needs to retract this false allegation. 

18 hours ago, Tom Gram said:

Do you have a source on the bus arrest incident? If Bannister was in debt and getting out of control, he may have been considered a liability, which could have easily turned into a motive to have him killed. Bannister’s involvement in Cuban operations in ‘61 and ‘62 could have been enough to whack him if someone thought he could be easily compromised, but if he had “unofficial” knowledge of Oswald and was going off the rails drinking and getting into stupid fights it would’ve been a done deal. 

This is all speculative of course, and the evidence here is hardly proof of murder, but it is pretty interesting.  

Tom, the Banister (not Bannister) fight with 2-3 young men took place around March 31, 1964. Evidently Banister and a woman employee (could have been Delphine, can't confirm) were standing at a bus stop on Canal and City Park Avenue. One of the young men called Banister "Darling". I believe words were exchanged and the fight actually took place on the bus. The driver kicked them all off, and a bus window was broken in the melee. One of the young men contacted the cops and Banister was arrested. There was a pistol involved, and Banister refused to say if he was carrying a pistol. These were not Cuban exiles, just locals. The fight occurred at night (no time given) and Banister was arrested and paroled at 01:05. 

Banister could have been drunk, or all of them could have been drunk. No further details given. 

My sources for that were the Time Picayune and States-Item newspapers in New Orleans. I would like to post the articles, but I've been having problems getting that done any more on this forum. (It's a conspiracy LOL!)

There's a lot of myths surrounding Banister. But I can say he was a Segregationist, involved in the Free Electors movement in Louisiana. Also, he was on a welcoming committee or group for Governor George Wallace's visit to New Orleans. He could have very well had a drinking problem, there was another incident some time before where he was arrested in the French Quarter. 

Delphine Roberts sued the Banister & Associates business (some months after his death) for something like $6,000 (or close to that figure). 

I think it's safe to say Banister was having financial problems before his death. 

Hanging around Jack Martin (aka Edward Suggs) would drive anyone to drink. Suggs was a mental case, and I have some research possibly why he had that problem. Not going to share it here. 

On 8/17/2022 at 3:17 PM, Tom Gram said:

Has anyone actually alleged that Bannister was murdered in this thread? It's not like it was impossible to kill someone untraceably, and say what you will about Dephine Roberts but she did work for Bannister and thought his death was unnatural: 

Can murder really be completely ruled out? Of course not, especially if what Ben said is true and Bannister thought he was about to be killed (I don't know the source for that) - but there isn't enough evidence to prove that Bannister was murdered, nor the same overtly suspicious circumstances as Ferrie so I do agree that his death should be accepted as natural.  

Off topic, but in trying to find this Roberts quote I found another quote where she said one of her husbands was named Harry Roberts. Was she married to the same A. Harry Roberts that knew Bannister? The SRC, former FBI guy? 

Delphine Roberts and another individual were the ones that discovered Banister (not Bannister) in his bed dead. Delphine was a total crackpot. She was ardent Segregationist, Anti-Commie and a member of the John Birch Society. Delphine was often protesting various causes in New Orleans at the City Council, in the streets picketing. 

Delphine was a very paranoid lady and doesn't surprise me she would say Banister may have been murdered. When someone believes the communists were poisoning the drinking water with Fluoridation (Bircher belief), I would call that paranoid. 

Banister had been under the care of a doctor for some time. He went downhill financially, owing $1,100 Sam Newman for back rent (almost a year). He got arrested for a fight on a bus with a couple of men fighting over a pistol a couple of months before his death. 

Gil Jesus, your claim that Klein's started selling 40" MC's in August has been soundly debunked. 

Will you at least admit your error?

Shades of Penn Jones.....Guy Banister murdered? Crazy, just crazy. 

13 hours ago, James DiEugenio said:

Oswald never ordered any such rifle.

He most certainty did.

We have been through this for ages.

Yes, and it's been debunked nine ways to Sunday. 

And people keep on dredging up the same evidence that does not fly.

Yet, you don't provide any provable explanation to why it wasn't Oswald's rifle. 

Not even Marina, perhaps the most compromised witness in this case, would admit that was the rifle to the Secret service. 

This is really funny and ludicrous. You didn't tell your followers here that Marina led the DPD Detectives to Mrs. Paine's garage and pointed to the blanket where she thought her murdering husband's rifle was. So, Mr. DiEugenio, where is Oswald's' rifle?

Where did it go???

The correct answer of course is on the 6th floor. 

If it was so common to send out the  wrong rifle, why does Belin never bring up that assumed fact?  The FBI had the run of Klein's did they not? Are you going to say that Belin did not know it was the wrong rifle?

Serial numbers matched from Klein's paperwork and on the rifle itself. No mystery Mr. DiEugenio. No grandiose plot 7 months earlier with sinister CIA operatives setting up a false rifle purchase long before there was any talk of Kennedy coming to Dallas.

Why don't you explain to everyone here why/how Oswald was arrested with a phony amateurish Hidell Selective Service card, with his photo on it and the Klein's purchase with the same name? Was that a coincidence too? 

Why does not one witness from the post office recall going into the back, retrieving that long box and turning it over?

Grasping at straws again. At a busy downtown General Post Office, would you remember every parcel or package you brought up to the front window desk 7-8 months earlier? That was a very busy Post Office Mr. DiEugenio, of course you're not from Dallas and wouldn't understand. Hundreds of people were in that Post Office on a daily basis. 

Where did Oswald get  that rear strap drilled in?

I addressed that with Larry Schnapf. It was not a different model Carcano rifle as claimed by Mr. Brian Edwards in your film. Mr. Edwards was just mistaken on the interpretation of the photo. No harm, no foul, I respect Mr. Edward's career in law enforcement. The Strap D-Ring mounts are side mounted as per the backyard photos. Both of them. 

Does anyone really think a money order could be flown from Dallas, to the main Chicago post office, sent out to the local tributary office and then hand carried to Klein's, and then go through their sorting system, and then carried over to the bank for deposit in 24 hours?

(See David Von Pein's post about the Rocket Mail Postal run in this thread)

Mr. DiEugenio finally admitted to everyone here on this forum that the airmail letter could reach Chicago in one day. Of course, this was a total reversal of your claims before that it was impossible. Would you like me to quote it again so everyone can see for themselves? (It's already been screen captured). Also Mr. DiEugenio take another look at Waldman Exhibit #10 and explain to everyone here how the Klein's Cash Register (Accounts Receivable daily run) matched to the penny the Cash Deposit slip. Coincidence? Multiple entries, down to the penny. It doesn't matter when that money order was deposited, same day or 2 days later. I'm sorry but your false mysteries are going nowhere.  

If you buy that, I can sell you some valuable swampland in Florida.  

I trust you are very familiar with swamps, so I'll take your word for it. 

 

9 hours ago, James DiEugenio said:

Why is this important?

Because there was no evidence at Oswald's rooming house concerning the handgun.

No ammo.

No holster.

No cleaning solution.

No box or case.

No receipt or paperwork that showed he picked up the weapon from REA.

Yet, in the face of this, the FBI does not appear to have visited REA. One would have thought this would have been near the top of their agenda.

Baloney, a holster was found in Oswald's room at Beckley. 

23 hours ago, Gil Jesus said:

Johnny Calvin Brewer said that the man he saw matched a description of the man wanted by police he heard on the radio, a description the press could only have gotten from police. So how does that police broadcast description match up to the man he saw ?

Brewer wasn't a reliable witness and I doubt sincerely that he was the one who saw the man in the window. It's more likely that someone else saw him and told Brewer that he had a brown shirt because that's the only description Brewer had when he talked to Julia Postal and Burroughs.

I don't believe anything Brewer says up to the part where he confronts Postal. He went into the Texas Theater armed only with a description of a man with a brown shirt and when they turned on the house lights and he saw Oswald wearing a brown shirt, he was convinced Oswald was the man described to him.

With that cough, you should be checked for COVID.

 

Again, you speculate saying Brewer was not a reliable witness. Brewer said he was acting suspicious looking through the alcove display while cop cars were whizzing by on Jefferson Blvd. In other words, everyone else was looking at the cops go by, and Oswald was busy looking at wing-tip shoes with his back turned. Nothing to see.....right?

If the "man" looking at the shoes was innocent, then what's the beef? 

That "man", identified by Johnny Brewer, had a loaded .38 S/W revolver and got into a scuffle with the DPD. 

Other Patrons of the Theater were questioned, and they didn't put up a fight. 

I know how desperate you are to exonerate your precious Patsy, but you're overreaching with this unfair characterization of Brewer. 

 The man (Oswald) who had (cough cough) PTSD, was pointed out by Johnny Brewer in the Texas Theater. Nice try. 

48 minutes ago, W. Tracy Parnell said:

The Assassination and Mrs. Paine--Part Two: Did Ruth Incriminate LHO? ~ W. Tracy Parnell (wtracyparnell.blogspot.com)

Excellent article. Brief and to the point. Oswald most certainly went to Mexico. 

8 hours ago, Sandy Larsen said:

Yes, it IS true! Don't ever call me a li@r again!

Sandy, was this comment really necessary? 

5 hours ago, James DiEugenio said:

How about this one?

Mrs. PAINE - He did give her, I think, $10, just prior, or some time close to the time of the assassination, because she planned to buy some shoes.
Mr. JENNER - Shoes for herself, or her children?
Mrs. PAINE - For herself, flat s. But when he gave that to her I am not certain. I do know that we definitely planned to go out on Friday afternoon, the 22d of November, to buy those shoes. We did not go.
Mr. JENNER - That is you girls planned to do that?
Mrs. PAINE - She and I did; yes.

 

Ruth does not say why they did not go or where they planned to go.

She does say in "the afternoon".  Looks to me like the police turning up put an end to it. 

BTW, was this why Lee was looking in the shoe store window?

 

 

Mr. DiEugenio, The Hardy Shoe Store that Mr. Patsy was hanging out in the alcove, only carried Men and Boys shoes. 

On 7/21/2022 at 4:42 PM, Joseph McBride said:

n that post, I must have erred on adding Fritz to Wade being involved in the Adams

case, sorry and thanks, Steve, but later DA Watkins found about 300 cases

worth investigating in which Wade was dubiously

involved and cleared about 30 of the convicted

people before the voters kicked him out of the office.

Errol Morris found the evidence in Wade's files

after Wade let him rummage through them. That

is what led to exonerating Randall Dale Adams

of his false conviction for a cop-killing.

Correction noted. Thanks for being honest. 

1 hour ago, James DiEugenio said:

I was not addressing you Tom.

I have DVP and BB on ignore.  For obvious reasons, including mental health.

But every once in awhile I have to look at that rubbish when someone else links to it.

Was that Mental Health insult really necessary? 

8 hours ago, James DiEugenio said:

We then have the six cruiser cars at the theater. But through that we know that the FBI and DPD were already at Beckley before this happened.  Which is an important issue.

Dallas Detectives Senkel, Cunningham and Walter Potts arrived at 1026 North Beckley at approximately 3:00 pm. While waiting on the search warrant, the aforementioned detectives could not find Oswald's name in the register. While Earlene Roberts was watching TV she recognized Oswald on TV and said it was "O.H. Lee". Then she showed the detectives the small room where "O.H. Lee" was living. Those detectives waited till around 4:30-5:00 when the J.P. David Johnston arrived with Homicide Detectives Fay Turner, Henry Moore and Assistant DA Bill Alexander with the search warrant. They then searched the room and confiscated all of Oswald's property. 

The tip on 1026 North Beckley came from Sheriff Bill Decker's deputy in the search at the Paine home. The deputy got the phone number (Oswald's Rooming House) from Ruth Paine and Marina. The deputy called the Sheriff's office, and they did a "Criss-Cross" off the telephone number and that's how they obtained the address. That info was relayed to Fritz and that's when Potts, Cunningham and Senkel were dispatched to the Rooming House. 

It's all in the record, there is nothing sinister. 

10 hours ago, Joseph McBride said:

Since Fritz was not always reliable (see THE THIN BLUE LINE for

how he and the DPD helped frame an innocent man for

killing another Dallas police officer),

I guess I learn something new every day. Captain Will Fritz of DPD Homicide was in the framing of Randall Adams, in the Thin Blue Line film. That is indeed interesting.

Mr. McBride can you explain how Captain Fritz framed Adams when the crime happened in 1976? I find your accusation troubling because Fritz left the Dallas Police Dept. (resigned/retired) in early 1970. 

Maybe you have information that I'm not aware of. 

1 hour ago, James DiEugenio said:

Kathy and Mark, thanks, but I also wish you would address the BB trick of calling someone a L i a r by spacing out the letters.   That is clearly a deliberate dodge of the rules.

As for the "trolls' remark by Joe, making a general comment like that is kind of mild compared to some of the things Von Pein used to say here and elsewhere.  The only reason he is not doing it now is because, as he himself said, he is walking on egg shells.

A generalization is not as stinging or inflammatory, as a personal insult. 

Yes Mr. DiEugenio, maybe it is a deliberate dodge of the rules. Here's your violations. 

From Mr. DiEugenio:

Quote

 

What a riot.

Davey is being wasted on about three different issues.  Then he says, well so what if I am off a bit in my angle of declination?  LOL

He cannot handle what that hand wound means.  Or Speer showing that Specter was a l-i-a-r.  

The critics need to show the Single Bullet Theory was a Fantasy?   To most normal people, it shows itself to be a fantasy.  DVP and the WC nuts hang on to it like Linus and his blanket.

Edited July 5, 2018 by James DiEugenio

 

Quote

 

And that is just the beginning of VB's shenanigans in that regard.

But that is not the worst part of RH.  The worst part of it is that in his intro, VB said he would present the evidence as the critics would present it, not as an advocate. And he then would collapse their arguments on their own terms.

WHAT A L-I-A-R.  Because he did no such thing.

Edited August 7, 2019 by James DiEugenio