Was Muchmore’s film shown on WNEW-TV, New York, on November 26, 1963?

[Bill Miller]

Silly nonsense, and fully expected & anticipated.

You evade the task at hand: of finding the posts that verify your false assertions.

Why?

Because the posts are not there. No surprise.

Now, one other thing>

You keep asserting that photography technique & equipment in the 60s was too primitive to allow alteration of the Z film.

Just to prove your incredible lack of information & poor research, let us mention two items:[/color]

MOL & U2[/b]

Miles, I am not wasting any more time on your past trolling efforts and posted disinformation. You could just as easily go back and pull your remarks to show that I am wrong.

And the assertion that the Zfilm (if altered) could not stand up to modern forensic scrutiny has been posted on his considerable detail on Lancer and this forum. Those opinions came from real experts in film, namely kodachrome II film. So maybe you will bless us with your great research and knowledge of the subject that shows that you know more than they do???

Bill Miller

Edited February 22, 2008 by Bill Miller

[Bill Miller]

The thing I find most interesting here is Marie Muchmore's supposed belief that she didn't film the motorcade during the assassination. That simply is not believable, imho. This had to have been the most memorable home movie this woman ever took, or ever would take. How could she possibly have been mistaken about something so basic?

I am wondering if what Muchmore said was poorly stated or misinterpreted. Muchmore told UPI that she didn't know what, if anything of the motorcade, that she caught on film. I think that it has gone from that to her not filming the motorcade, which is altogether different.

Bill

[Paul Rigby]

I don't think the ball is in Gary's court here.

Gary Mack emailed me:

The clipping I read a couple years ago must have appeared in a newspaper that has not yet been cataloged at the Museum. I have so far been unable to find it. What struck me was the precise, scene-by-scene description of the Muchmore film we're all familiar with. For that matter, there are many references to the WNEW broadcast on 11-26-63, so there's certainly no mystery afoot.

Gary Mack

For those who really don't believe that the film was shown on t.v. in New York, Gary has done you the favor of telling you where you need to look if you sincerely want to test your own doubts.

J. Raymond Carroll imitating Bill Miller, who defers to Gary Mack, whose explanation entirely satisfies J. Raymond Carroll, who agrees with Bill Miller, who defers to Gary Mack...and so on and so forth.

End result:

Still no clipping.

Splendid.

[Paul Rigby]

Inquiry is unneccessary if you have no doubts about what the truth is.

A direct quote from a Warren Commissioner, perhaps?

Incredible.

Actually a paraphrase of Charles Sanders Peirce. Way over your head, old boy.

Only incredible to someone unfamiliar with the LOGIC of inquiry.

J. Raymond Carroll, “Grounds of Validity of the Laws of Logic: Further Consequences of Four Incapacities,” Journal of Speculative Philosophy 2 (2008), 193-208.

On page 195, we find the following legendary syllogism:

“Gary Mack is truth personified. Bill Miller is not Larry Peters. The showing of the Muchmore film is confirmed by a newspaper clipping that none of us can find. Need I say more?”

On page 201:

“In the matter of photographic alteration, assertion is proof. I rest my daguerreotype.”

On page 209:

“The more absurd my argument, the better to associate it with someone famous, preferably a thinker. That way, no one will ever twig that I’ve just uttered a lot of tosh.”

J. Raymond, truly, we anti-alterationists are not worthy.

Paul

[Bill Miller]

J. Raymond Carroll imitating Bill Miller, who defers to Gary Mack, whose explanation entirely satisfies J. Raymond Carroll, who agrees with Bill Miller, who defers to Gary Mack...and so on and so forth.

End result:

Still no clipping.

Splendid.

Actually Paul ... I know that Ray and Mack have been in contact with each other in the past and he was right ... Mack did offer several sources for any interested parties to check into and instead of you doing that - you merely make say nothing responses like the previous one. Is there not a main library in your area where you could inquire about seeing those particular news papers or are you not really that interested ???

End result:

Still no effort

Splendid.

[Paul Rigby]

Is there not a main library in your area where you could inquire about seeing those particular news papers or are you not really that interested?

Try Colindale - the British newspaper library in north London - and you'll find no holdings of the three NY afternoon papers in question. Which is why I bought a job lot from the States, as stated above. And found...nada, except for the NYHT piece cited earlier in the thread.

Still no clipping, I see.

Paul

[J. Raymond Carroll]

Is there not a main library in your area where you could inquire about seeing those particular news papers or are you not really that interested?

Try Colindale - the British newspaper library in north London - and you'll find no holdings of the three NY afternoon papers in question. Which is why I bought a job lot from the States, as stated above. And found...nada, except for the NYHT piece cited earlier in the thread.

Still no clipping, I see.

Paul

Surely there is someone in the U.S. who a/ dupports the alteration theory and

b/ has access to a decent library.

and C. cares enough to check it out.

If not, then the alteration theorists cannot expect to be taken seriously.

[Paul Rigby]

Surely there is someone in the U.S. who a/ dupports the alteration theory and

b/ has access to a decent library.

and C. cares enough to check it out.

If not, then the alteration theorists cannot expect to be taken seriously.

You know, I could have sworn it was the Mack brigade which founded its claim upon the appearance of said clipping. Just goes to show.

Still, no matter, the idea's fine by me. Let the hunt begin.

As the ghastly Mrs Thatcher once remarked, "They're frit!"

Paul

[J. Raymond Carroll]

J. Raymond Carroll, “Grounds of Validity of the Laws of Logic: Further Consequences of Four Incapacities,” Journal of Speculative Philosophy 2 (2008), 193-208.

On page 195, we find the following legendary syllogism:

“Gary Mack is truth personified. Bill Miller is not Larry Peters. The showing of the Muchmore film is confirmed by a newspaper clipping that none of us can find. Need I say more?”

THou hast misquoted that little thing I dashed off for Specphil.

1/ I have never met or spoken to Bill Miller (we have exchanged emails) and I havn't got the foggiest idea who Larry Peters is. I have also never met nor spoken to Gary Mack, though we have exchanged a handfull of emails. I have a very fundamental disagreement with Gary about how this case went down, but I am a big fan of his work for the Museum and I appreciate the help he tries to give to this ongoing inquiry.

2/ The showing of the Muchmore film is confirmed by a newspaper clipping that none of us can find. Need I say more?”

You need say no more until someone in the Stateside branch of the alterationist camp (are you paying attention Mr. Healy?) can pull himself away from those GENERAL HOSPITAL reruns he is addicted to and haul his XXX down to the microfilm room of some library so that he can find out whether his alteration theory has even the slightest hope of making it even as far as first base.

Edited February 19, 2008 by Kathy Beckett

[Miles Scull]

2/ The showing of the Muchmore film is confirmed by a newspaper clipping that none of us can find. Need I say more?”

You need say no more until someone in the Stateside branch of the alterationist camp (are you paying attention Mr. Healy?) can pull himself away from those GENERAL HOSPITAL reruns he is addicted to and haul his XXX down to the microfilm room of some library so that he can find out whether his alteration theory has even the slightest hope of making it even as far as first base.

someone in the Stateside branch of the alterationist camp

Not at all.

You must mean someone in the Stateside branch of the anti-alterationist camp, of course.

And that would be BM or Mack.

Otherwise, stalemate.

Right?

Edited February 19, 2008 by Kathy Beckett

[J. Raymond Carroll]

Otherwise, stalemate. [/b][/color]

Right?

Yes, but that matters only to proponents of of this novel, untested, and so far discredited theory of film alteration (see the fate of Fetzer's latest breakthrough)

[Miles Scull]

Otherwise, stalemate. [/b][/color]

Right?

Yes, but that matters only to proponents of of this novel, untested, and so far discredited theory of film alteration (see the fate of Fetzer's latest breakthrough)

Granted.

But, be it yea, be it nay, I plea for the rules of evidence.

No hearsay!

[Bill Miller]

Surely there is someone in the U.S. who a/ dupports the alteration theory and

b/ has access to a decent library.

and C. cares enough to check it out.

If not, then the alteration theorists cannot expect to be taken seriously.

Having access to a library and actually knowing how to use it might be the problem for them, Ray. I'm in BC, but upon my return to the states, I will make it a point to take on this easy task to see if I can locate it.

Bill

[Paul Rigby]

Having access to a library and actually knowing how to use it might be the problem for them, Ray. I'm in BC, but upon my return to the states, I will make it a point to take on this easy task to see if I can locate it.Bill

Bill,

If the task is so "easy" how to explain Mack's failure to undertake it? Are there no reference libraries in Dallas? Do inter-library lending loans cease at the Texan border? More mysteries. Happily, Hercule Miller is on the case. The solution is surely only a matter of days away. Can't wait. The clock ticks. Breath is baited.

Paul

[Bill Miller]

Granted.

But, be it yea, be it nay, I plea for the rules of evidence.

No hearsay!

When did you take up such a research practice ... must have been after the 'Bowers could see the plaid design on the red shirted man down on the steps' fiasco. No wait, it must have been later than that ... as late as the 'Duncan has been consulting Gary Mack and Robert Groden' falsehood. Yes, you are a poster-boy for the rules of evidence. LOL!!!!!!!