Kathleen Collins Posted December 11, 2009 Share Posted December 11, 2009 In the famous Altgen picture which shows the Man in the Doorway, that man is an Oswald lookalike. I think we all agree on that. But it's not the face of Billy Lovelady. But it looks a lot like Michael Paine. Comments? Kathy C Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duke Lane Posted December 11, 2009 Share Posted December 11, 2009 In the famous Altgen picture which shows the Man in the Doorway, that man is an Oswald lookalike. I think we all agree on that. But it's not the face of Billy Lovelady. But it looks a lot like Michael Paine. Comments?Other than a vague resemblance, I can't think of any reason to support a hypothesis that Paine was in Dealey Plaza, especially with Buell Frazier being present nearby and not having seen his neighbor. The Paines, after all, hadn't been separated all the time, had they?That said, while it's generally accepted by many people that it was, in fact, Billy Lovelady there in the photo, I'd recently read an analysis of why it might well not have been Billy based upon several factors including most notably that he wore his shirts buttoned to the top button (still not an uncommon sight in Texas, even among younger men of Billy's age - 26 - at the time), and that the collar being open three buttons down is in keeping with Oswald's more worn shirts. If it was Oswald, who'd maybe only gone outside for a few moments and gone back in soon after JFK took the corner, it's possible that nobody happened to notice him since he was generally unobtrusive around the TSBD. I can't rule it out being Lovelady, but neither do my own observations and readings support that it could only have been Lovelady. I'm not inclined to put Michael Paine into the picture, if only because he wasn't a complete stranger and someone who knew of and might well have recognized him didn't see him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack White Posted December 11, 2009 Share Posted December 11, 2009 The man in the doorway does not resemble Paine, Oswald or Lovelady. He resembles Oswald more than the others. Lovelady says he was SITTING on the steps. Why in the world would Paine be there? If it WAS Oswald, the entire WR is exposed for the farce it is. If it was NOT Oswald, it is immaterial who it was. Jack Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Andrews Posted December 11, 2009 Share Posted December 11, 2009 (edited) I think that if the figure at right, with arms over head, has been altered to have no head, tha\en the man at left could have an altered head - perhaps Lovelady's was substituted. Which opens the question - was Arms-Up Man (AUM - I coined an acronym!) Billy Lovelady, and was the figure at left originally LHO? If that is, as I think, Lovelady's face atop LHO's overshirt - then that makes Lovelady worthy of suspicion, along with the other TSBD workers and management, as discussed in the Elevator Escape thread. I submit that even Stalinist photo altering wasn't as clumsy and provocative as the headless AUM in Altgens. Were the arms left in to confuse us, or just to tick us off? Edited December 11, 2009 by David Andrews Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kathleen Collins Posted December 11, 2009 Author Share Posted December 11, 2009 The man in the doorway does not resemble Paine, Oswald or Lovelady.He resembles Oswald more than the others. Lovelady says he was SITTING on the steps. Why in the world would Paine be there? If it WAS Oswald, the entire WR is exposed for the farce it is. If it was NOT Oswald, it is immaterial who it was. Jack Jack, I'm surprised. Lovelady was there on the stairs for all to see after Kennedy was shot and he had on a plaid shirt. The back of his head was balding. He was not Harvey Oswald! I don't know why anyone could think that that face looks like Harvey's. That face is one of the lookalikes. I don't even maintain that it's Lee Oswald (John Armstrong theory). To me, if they fooled with that picture, they put Paine's face in. Why? Because he looked like Harvey, later killed by Ruby. And he is not the same man whose face was put on the "man" in the Backyard Photos. That might have been Lee's face with a touch up. And that face is not Harvey's either. I'm surprised after all these years that someone would contend that the man in the Backyard Photos was Harvey. It's not the same man! And the same in the TSBD doorway. That is not Harvey. I still contend that someone affixed Paine's face onto that body. I welcome anyone to prove otherwise. I'm not saying Paine was there, but his face was used. Kathy C Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dean Hagerman Posted December 11, 2009 Share Posted December 11, 2009 I still contend that someone affixed Paine's face onto that body. I welcome anyone to prove otherwise. I'm not saying Paine was there, but his face was used. No way Its Lovelady Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kathleen Collins Posted December 11, 2009 Author Share Posted December 11, 2009 I still contend that someone affixed Paine's face onto that body. I welcome anyone to prove otherwise. I'm not saying Paine was there, but his face was used. No way Its Lovelady Can you or someone show me how Lovelady, who was there with a plaid shirt on, looks more like this fellow than Paine does? Kathy C Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kathleen Collins Posted December 11, 2009 Author Share Posted December 11, 2009 I still contend that someone affixed Paine's face onto that body. I welcome anyone to prove otherwise. I'm not saying Paine was there, but his face was used. No way Its Lovelady Can you or someone show me how Lovelady, who was there with a plaid shirt on, looks more like this fellow than Paine does? Kathy C Uh-Oh, is that figure wearing a plaid shirt over a t-shirt or is it, as I thought, a dark jacket? Kathy C Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dean Hagerman Posted December 11, 2009 Share Posted December 11, 2009 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kathleen Collins Posted December 11, 2009 Author Share Posted December 11, 2009 I concede. It is Billy Lovelady in a plaid shirt. I haven't looked at him in a long time. There was a thread here some time ago that challenged the Lovelady pose and face, and that it had been the result of photo editing. And was it really Billy Lovelady in that odd pose. My error. This whole thread has been for nought. Sorry. (But he looks like Paine, ha, ha.) Kathy C Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Andrews Posted December 11, 2009 Share Posted December 11, 2009 (edited) The Altgens figure's shirt looks like the brown weave overshirt that DPD identified as the shirt "LHO"* wore to work. +++ *My use of quoations around "Oswald's" name is informal, and based on the notion that "Reality is a word that should always appear within inverted commas." --Vladimir Nabakov Edited December 11, 2009 by David Andrews Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Haley Posted December 11, 2009 Share Posted December 11, 2009 (edited) The Altgens figure's shirt looks like the brown weave overshirt that DPD identified as the shirt "LHO"* wore to work.+++ *My use of quoations around "Oswald's" name is informal, and based on the notion that "Reality is a word that should always appear within inverted commas." --Vladimir Nabakov I remember some time back somebody posted an animated gif here where Lovelady's face morphed over the guy whose face has been hidden. I think the suggestion was that Lovelady had actually been standing on a lower step and his head had been moved onto the top figure. *Edited to include gif* May I ask, is the man's face hidden in all copies of that photo ? MH Edited December 12, 2009 by Mark Haley Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dean Hagerman Posted December 11, 2009 Share Posted December 11, 2009 I concede. It is Billy Lovelady in a plaid shirt. I haven't looked at him in a long time. There was a thread here some time ago that challenged the Lovelady pose and face, and that it had been the result of photo editing. And was it really Billy Lovelady in that odd pose.My error. This whole thread has been for nought. Sorry. (But he looks like Paine, ha, ha.) Kathy C Glad I could help Kathy Of course I believe Oswald was in the lunch room where he was seen cool and calm drinking a Coke by Officer Baker I think he was in the lunch room throught the entire assassination Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kathleen Collins Posted December 12, 2009 Author Share Posted December 12, 2009 I concede. It is Billy Lovelady in a plaid shirt. I haven't looked at him in a long time. There was a thread here some time ago that challenged the Lovelady pose and face, and that it had been the result of photo editing. And was it really Billy Lovelady in that odd pose.My error. This whole thread has been for nought. Sorry. (But he looks like Paine, ha, ha.) Kathy C Glad I could help Kathy Of course I believe Oswald was in the lunch room where he was seen cool and calm drinking a Coke by Officer Baker I think he was in the lunch room throught the entire assassination I heard of a theory where Officer Baker was supposed to have killed Oswald, right there and then. But there was a woman there too. So he couldn't. And that Oswald was told to stay by the phone because he was going to receive an important message. Why else would LHO not go out to see the motorcade? He was working undercover for somebody, only he didn't realize as the patsy. Kathy C Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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