Martin Hinrichs Posted April 20, 2010 Share Posted April 20, 2010 Well you could start off by telling me HOW it is wrong. Its a simple drawing. 21*impact through a 30* forward leaning target.Prove the drawing wrong Martin. Anyone can recreate it and see that it is exactly correct. Why is where or how I post such a concern to you? Does my posting create issues for your theories as well as so many others? One thing at a time Martin, prove the drawing wrong. Is this your typical M.O. to just simply say someone is wrong without proving it? You apparently don't read the replies. Let me repeat from Duncan's forum: Mike, you used the wrong basis line (in red) You should have used the one running along the limo chrome or even better to rotate the whole Croft image before drawing lines. To measure on bodies is very difficult. They are not boxes. Anatomy is never square. Look at Jackie. Altough she sits erect, you'll notice a slope at her back. 10°? Whats with the Governour? 35°? I hope you understand what i mean. http://www.jfkassassinationforum.com/index...6.html#msg37536 Pay more attention Mike! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Williams Posted April 20, 2010 Share Posted April 20, 2010 Well you could start off by telling me HOW it is wrong. Its a simple drawing. 21*impact through a 30* forward leaning target.Prove the drawing wrong Martin. Anyone can recreate it and see that it is exactly correct. Why is where or how I post such a concern to you? Does my posting create issues for your theories as well as so many others? One thing at a time Martin, prove the drawing wrong. Is this your typical M.O. to just simply say someone is wrong without proving it? You apparently don't read the replies. Let me repeat from Duncan's forum: Mike, you used the wrong basis line (in red) You should have used the one running along the limo chrome or even better to rotate the whole Croft image before drawing lines. To measure on bodies is very difficult. They are not boxes. Anatomy is never square. Look at Jackie. Altough she sits erect, you'll notice a slope at her back. 10°? Whats with the Governour? 35°? I hope you understand what i mean. http://www.jfkassassinationforum.com/index...6.html#msg37536 Pay more attention Mike! Martin, Interesting what you proposed is exactly what I did. The lines you refer to at the limo chrome are a 3* marker, which I then used to rotate the limo to the 3* decline down Elm. I guess you did not compare that to the original croft photo. If you had this would have been obvious. The lower baseline (red) is nothing more than a 90* marker with which to draw the 3* marker (above it in red). This was used to align the Limo to the 3* decline of Elm. Because impact angles off the vertical plane are calculated using the INVCOS function the yellow lines represent the horizontal and vertical planes needed to calculate the impact angle. These are reference lines. The of course you have the 30* forward lean measured off the last yellow line. The picture is in the proper perspective and the drawing is in relation, properly, to the photo. The drawing was done to test the theory that the bullet could exit higher than it entered, and while not conclusive is sure would support that this is worth a closer look. I was paying attention. It just so happens that what you wrote, does not impeach the work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bernice Moore Posted April 20, 2010 Author Share Posted April 20, 2010 b.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Williams Posted April 20, 2010 Share Posted April 20, 2010 p.s. there is something that bugs the hell out of me about Oswald and perhaps you can help me resolve it! What's that Mike? His innocence? Let's start with this question first and then I'll start a fresh thread... Lee Fair enough my friend. I do not know about your background. Mine was military. That means a lot to me. In notes that Oswald wrote before giving a lecture he wrote that the agree with Ike in that the USMC should be disbanded. And yet, when he is arrested we have photos and a property sheet that shows he was wearing his Marine Corp ring. I guess this would be lost on some, to me it is significant. I know what that ring means to me, and I just can not comprehend making the comment that the USMC should be disbanded. Perhaps different things hold a different level of significance to some than others, but to me there is something strange about all this. Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bernice Moore Posted April 20, 2010 Author Share Posted April 20, 2010 b. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Williams Posted April 20, 2010 Share Posted April 20, 2010 b.. B, Always a pleasure to hear from you. I always get a kick out of that photo. It misrepresents almost every angle of the SBT, and yet they used it to attempt to give the SBT veracity. No wonder the CT gang piled on it. Hope you have been well! Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bernice Moore Posted April 20, 2010 Author Share Posted April 20, 2010 (edited) b.. B, Always a pleasure to hear from you. I always get a kick out of that photo. It misrepresents almost every angle of the SBT, and yet they used it to attempt to give the SBT veracity. No wonder the CT gang piled on it. Hope you have been well! Mike hi mike. i am about the same as always here there and anywhere, we keep plugging along, thanks hope all is well with you and your family, .specter was always apparently out of his element...especially when left on his own in charge... b Edited April 20, 2010 by Bernice Moore Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Williams Posted April 20, 2010 Share Posted April 20, 2010 b.. B, Always a pleasure to hear from you. I always get a kick out of that photo. It misrepresents almost every angle of the SBT, and yet they used it to attempt to give the SBT veracity. No wonder the CT gang piled on it. Hope you have been well! Mike hi mike..specter was always apparently out of his element...especially when left on his own in charge... b B, Man you hit the nail on the head there. While I am not yet convinced that the SBT did happen, I am convinced that it could have. This has been a drastic change for me. What amazes me is that he had all the evidence to prove the SBT at his disposal and basically flubbed the whole job. This to me is unbelievable. This is the main reason I think the way I do. I take no ones word for anything. I have to resolve things for myself and to my own satisfaction. Along the way I have been shown where I am incorrect and have to adjust the methods I use to analyze things. I am far more interested in the truth than I am in being "right". I might add I love to read your offerings. I may not always agree with you, but your stuff is very well thought out and is much appreciated. Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bernice Moore Posted April 20, 2010 Author Share Posted April 20, 2010 i think we need to always think for ourselves, not allowing anyone to influence us too greatly, nor bully us into agreeing, what a boring world this would be if all did agree... to each their own in otherwards...you take care and continue with your studies, carry on as they say..we are all in error at times i have been a zillion times down through the years, some real dandies along the way... i feel each is a learning experience, none are too intelligent that they never make mistakes...thanks b.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Williams Posted April 20, 2010 Share Posted April 20, 2010 i think we need to always think for ourselves, not allowing anyone to influence us too greatly, nor bully us into agreeing, what a boring world this would be if all did agree... to each their own in otherwards...you take care and continue with your studies, carry on as they say..we are all in error at times i have been a zillion times down through the years, some real dandies along the way... i feel each is a learning experience, none are too intelligent that they never make mistakes...thanks b.. Yes Ma'am and I could not agree more! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B. A. Copeland Posted April 20, 2010 Share Posted April 20, 2010 And yet the JFK Assassination Critical Research Community cannot reachconsensus on this issue because there is a significant number of researchers who have a vested interest in keeping the "Question of Conspiracy" open so they can answer it. As a result we've got this "Expert Culture" in JFK research where actual evidence isn't weighed, but the opinions of "experts" trumps all. Demolishing Nutter assertions isn't nearly as interesting as popping the balloon of a self-elected CT "expert." "Experts" cannot answer "The Question of Conspiracy" because the answers to that are self-evident. It doesn't take an expert to figure out that with a back wound at T3 the SBT is impossible. That's why so many deny it -- what's the use of being an expert if an expert is not required? I could not have said this better myself. A Psyop designed to "confound and confuse" the movement into oblivion. Not to mention some of the idiocy spit out by these supposed "experts" in the public arena, thus creating or causing much morwe prudent investigators to look foolish. Sometime I still cannot believe to this very day that people are still debating in favor of the Lone Nut Theory...my good god. We have to move on and get to the meat, which is getting "rotten" by the day. (40+ years of running in circles and disinfo. agents can do that to "good meat") Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cliff Varnell Posted April 20, 2010 Share Posted April 20, 2010 And yet the JFK Assassination Critical Research Community cannot reachconsensus on this issue because there is a significant number of researchers who have a vested interest in keeping the "Question of Conspiracy" open so they can answer it. As a result we've got this "Expert Culture" in JFK research where actual evidence isn't weighed, but the opinions of "experts" trumps all. Demolishing Nutter assertions isn't nearly as interesting as popping the balloon of a self-elected CT "expert." "Experts" cannot answer "The Question of Conspiracy" because the answers to that are self-evident. It doesn't take an expert to figure out that with a back wound at T3 the SBT is impossible. That's why so many deny it -- what's the use of being an expert if an expert is not required? I could not have said this better myself. A Psyop designed to "confound and confuse" the movement into oblivion. Not to mention some of the idiocy spit out by these supposed "experts" in the public arena, thus creating or causing much morwe prudent investigators to look foolish. Sometime I still cannot believe to this very day that people are still debating in favor of the Lone Nut Theory...my good god. We have to move on and get to the meat, which is getting "rotten" by the day. (40+ years of running in circles and disinfo. agents can do that to "good meat") B.A., I think the "Expert Culture" phenomenon is the result of the vagaries of human nature. The case is fascinating, and so people put a lot of study into certain areas and they want their work to have importance. If their goal is to answer "The Question of Conspiracy" then they're naturally going to deny that the "Question" was answered long ago. I suspect the people who actively, knowingly pushed the cover-up learned that they didn't need "disinformation agents." The armchair citizen-detectives naturally attracted to the case would generate all the mis-information the cover-up required. That's why I think the greatest engine of obfuscation in the murder of JFK is not the US government or the mainstream media anymore: it's the JFK Assassination Critical Research Community itself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Williams Posted April 21, 2010 Share Posted April 21, 2010 And yet the JFK Assassination Critical Research Community cannot reachconsensus on this issue because there is a significant number of researchers who have a vested interest in keeping the "Question of Conspiracy" open so they can answer it. As a result we've got this "Expert Culture" in JFK research where actual evidence isn't weighed, but the opinions of "experts" trumps all. Demolishing Nutter assertions isn't nearly as interesting as popping the balloon of a self-elected CT "expert." "Experts" cannot answer "The Question of Conspiracy" because the answers to that are self-evident. It doesn't take an expert to figure out that with a back wound at T3 the SBT is impossible. That's why so many deny it -- what's the use of being an expert if an expert is not required? I could not have said this better myself. A Psyop designed to "confound and confuse" the movement into oblivion. Not to mention some of the idiocy spit out by these supposed "experts" in the public arena, thus creating or causing much morwe prudent investigators to look foolish. Sometime I still cannot believe to this very day that people are still debating in favor of the Lone Nut Theory...my good god. We have to move on and get to the meat, which is getting "rotten" by the day. (40+ years of running in circles and disinfo. agents can do that to "good meat") B.A., I think the "Expert Culture" phenomenon is the result of the vagaries of human nature. The case is fascinating, and so people put a lot of study into certain areas and they want their work to have importance. If their goal is to answer "The Question of Conspiracy" then they're naturally going to deny that the "Question" was answered long ago. I suspect the people who actively, knowingly pushed the cover-up learned that they didn't need "disinformation agents." The armchair citizen-detectives naturally attracted to the case would generate all the mis-information the cover-up required. That's why I think the greatest engine of obfuscation in the murder of JFK is not the US government or the mainstream media anymore: it's the JFK Assassination Critical Research Community itself. Or more correctly the JFK Assassination Conspiracy Theory Critical Research Community. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Hogan Posted April 21, 2010 Share Posted April 21, 2010 That's why I think the greatest engine of obfuscation in the murder ofJFK is not the US government or the mainstream media anymore: it's the JFK Assassination Critical Research Community itself. If the Education Forum is any example, there is no such Community. Just a diverse group of people with arcane interests, connected by the internet, each with their own individual take on what they think happened. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Williams Posted April 21, 2010 Share Posted April 21, 2010 That's why I think the greatest engine of obfuscation in the murder ofJFK is not the US government or the mainstream media anymore: it's the JFK Assassination Critical Research Community itself. If the Education Forum is any example, there is no such Community. Just a diverse group of people with arcane interests, connected by the internet, each with their own individual take on what they think happened. Well Said Sir Well said Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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