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Lyndon Johnson wanted Jackie to ride in HIS limo not JFK's


Guest Robert Morrow
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LBJ vociferously wanted Ralph Yarborough in the presidential limo. Would Yarborough have replaced Jackie? Or Nellie Connally?

It's conceivable that the shooters were told to take out both men in the limo, it being LBJ's intention that the other man would be Yarborough. It didn't work out, Connally got it instead, but LBJ would just figure that's the breaks.

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Guest Robert Morrow

Terry, could you give us your theory of what happened to JFK in a few words, or point us to somewhere you might have already discussed you beliefs? Your responses in this thread have gotten me curious.

thanks

Otto

JFK and RFK started their political career as "right wingers". Read the passage on page 399-400 from my previous post/link. Eleanor Roosevelt was a harsh critic of Jack Kennedy. She knew his father, and she knew what he represented.

"Mrs. Roosevelt had long despised Joe Kennedy. In the late 1930's she asked her husband why he had ever appointed that "awful" man as ambassasdor. Joe's attitude toward Jews, Nazi's and the war repulsed her, as did his criticism of Roosevelt's White House".

"Three times in nine months during 1958 Mrs. Roosevelt publicly challenged the Senators fitness to be President".

http://books.google.com/books?id=fxzd__gA_I4C&pg=PA399&lpg=PA399&dq=eleanor+roosevelt+exchange+of+letters+with+john+kennedy&source=bl&ots=b0e1M5_E4x&sig=rSuq1UVSPlSBZvy-S1rhY24YeqE&hl=en&ei=KsKBTN6XIou2ngfPuKhy&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=2&ved=0CBsQ6AEwAQ

Mrs. Roosevelt represented the FDR wing of the Democratic party and Jack Kennedy wanted her support. Mrs. Roosevelt on the other hand went public with her distrust of the Kennedy political machine. This resulted in a confrontation of sorts between Eleanor Roosevelt and Senator Jack Kennedy.

Here is their exchange of letters.

http://www.nps.gov/archive/elro/teach-er-vk/lesson-plans/er-and-jfk.htm

JFK would switch his earlier political outlook to adopt a pro FDR policy for his Presidency. JFK would consciously revive the FDR legacy. His space program, his investment tax credit policy, were all features of the American system.

He would also win the support of Eleanor Roosevelt and the FDR democrats.

John Kennedy was not supposed to be President. His father had selected his older brother Joseph Kennedy for that job. John Kennedy was the sickly child who read the greek classics while recuperating. He also had the bitter experince of WWII and that effected his outlook. In other words he was the wrong Kennedy for the job. He broke with family tradition and with his political backers.

I believe Permindex was the apparatus deployed to murder John Kennedy. French Intelligence in 1967 issued a report identifying Permindex as the entity conduiting the money used to finance the assassination attempts against Charles De Gaulle. They were also indentified as being involved in the murder of Italian industrialist (and JFK collaborator) Enrico Mattei. Clay Shaw was a director of Permindex.

To me LBJ was scared. He knew what had been done to his boss and felt that the same fate awaited him if he crossed these guys.

Here is a skeptical look at the Permindex angle:

http://educationforum.ipbhost.com/index.php?showtopic=917

Terry, also give us the reason WHY Permindex would have murdered JFK. I just think there is too much information out there indicating that Lyndon Johnson was not just deeply involved in the JFK assassination, but at the CENTER of the JFK assassination. Just look at the groups the Kennedys were at WAR with in fall 1963: they were at WAR with Lyndon Johnson (Robert Kennedy's efforts to knive LBJ with the media and the Senate/House investigating committees; they were at WAR with the CIA and there was Arthur Krock's open speculation of a CIA coup in print in the newspaper of record (then) the NY Times; they were at WAR with the mafia Carlos Marcello, Santos Trafficante, Jimmy Hoffa, Sam Giancana). And LBJ was the one to bring all the Kennedy haters together to take out the Kennedys by killing JFK. I do believe in heavy CIA involvement in the JFK assassination.

So what was the motives in Permindex to kill JFK? Who were the players, besides Clay Shaw, and what were their motives to kill John Kennedy?

And btw, Eleanor Roosevelt backed Adlai Stevenson over JFK in the 1960 Demo nominating process. Yes, she was not pro-Kennedy at that time, but she signed on for the general election.

Edited by Robert Morrow
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LBJ vociferously wanted Ralph Yarborough in the presidential limo. Would Yarborough have replaced Jackie? Or Nellie Connally?

It's conceivable that the shooters were told to take out both men in the limo, it being LBJ's intention that the other man would be Yarborough. It didn't work out, Connally got it instead, but LBJ would just figure that's the breaks.

Yeah, right - now I recall that it was Yarborough in place of John Connally in the Nov. 21 argument.

P. S. Ron - I caught up with your Flight 93 article and enjoyed it and your JFK articles very much.

Edited by David Andrews
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Terry, could you give us your theory of what happened to JFK in a few words, or point us to somewhere you might have already discussed you beliefs? Your responses in this thread have gotten me curious.

thanks

Otto

JFK and RFK started their political career as "right wingers". Read the passage on page 399-400 from my previous post/link. Eleanor Roosevelt was a harsh critic of Jack Kennedy. She knew his father, and she knew what he represented.

"Mrs. Roosevelt had long despised Joe Kennedy. In the late 1930's she asked her husband why he had ever appointed that "awful" man as ambassasdor. Joe's attitude toward Jews, Nazi's and the war repulsed her, as did his criticism of Roosevelt's White House".

"Three times in nine months during 1958 Mrs. Roosevelt publicly challenged the Senators fitness to be President".

http://books.google.com/books?id=fxzd__gA_I4C&pg=PA399&lpg=PA399&dq=eleanor+roosevelt+exchange+of+letters+with+john+kennedy&source=bl&ots=b0e1M5_E4x&sig=rSuq1UVSPlSBZvy-S1rhY24YeqE&hl=en&ei=KsKBTN6XIou2ngfPuKhy&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=2&ved=0CBsQ6AEwAQ

Mrs. Roosevelt represented the FDR wing of the Democratic party and Jack Kennedy wanted her support. Mrs. Roosevelt on the other hand went public with her distrust of the Kennedy political machine. This resulted in a confrontation of sorts between Eleanor Roosevelt and Senator Jack Kennedy.

Here is their exchange of letters.

http://www.nps.gov/archive/elro/teach-er-vk/lesson-plans/er-and-jfk.htm

JFK would switch his earlier political outlook to adopt a pro FDR policy for his Presidency. JFK would consciously revive the FDR legacy. His space program, his investment tax credit policy, were all features of the American system.

He would also win the support of Eleanor Roosevelt and the FDR democrats.

John Kennedy was not supposed to be President. His father had selected his older brother Joseph Kennedy for that job. John Kennedy was the sickly child who read the greek classics while recuperating. He also had the bitter experince of WWII and that effected his outlook. In other words he was the wrong Kennedy for the job. He broke with family tradition and with his political backers.

I believe Permindex was the apparatus deployed to murder John Kennedy. French Intelligence in 1967 issued a report identifying Permindex as the entity conduiting the money used to finance the assassination attempts against Charles De Gaulle. They were also indentified as being involved in the murder of Italian industrialist (and JFK collaborator) Enrico Mattei. Clay Shaw was a director of Permindex.

To me LBJ was scared. He knew what had been done to his boss and felt that the same fate awaited him if he crossed these guys.

Here is a skeptical look at the Permindex angle:

http://educationforum.ipbhost.com/index.php?showtopic=917

Terry, also give us the reason WHY Permindex would have murdered JFK. I just think there is too much information out there indicating that Lyndon Johnson was not just deeply involved in the JFK assassination, but at the CENTER of the JFK assassination. Just look at the groups the Kennedys were at WAR with in fall 1963: they were at WAR with Lyndon Johnson (Robert Kennedy's efforts to knive LBJ with the media and the Senate/House investigating committees; they were at WAR with the CIA and there was Arthur Krock's open speculation of a CIA coup in print in the newspaper of record (then) the NY Times; they were at WAR with the mafia Carlos Marcello, Santos Trafficante, Jimmy Hoffa, Sam Giancana). And LBJ was the one to bring all the Kennedy haters together to take out the Kennedys by killing JFK. I do believe in heavy CIA involvement in the JFK assassination.

So what was the motives in Permindex to kill JFK? Who were the players, besides Clay Shaw, and what was they motive to kill John Kennedy?

And btw, Eleanor Roosevelt backed Adlai Stevenson over JFK in the 1960 Demo nominating process. Yes, she was not pro-Kennedy at that time, but she signed on for the general election.

Why did Permindex make repeated attempts on the life of Charles De Gaulle, and why kill Enrico Mattei, among others? Permindex was an off-shore assassination bureau used to kill national leaders who were acting in a manner the elites didnt like.

Why did one half of the boys from Kennedy Justice Department go over to run Meyer Lansky's/Resorts International's "INTERTEL"? Why did the other half go over to run Max Jacobs "Emprise" money laundering appartus?

The Kennedy political machine and John F. Kennedy are two different entities all together.

Your belief that Lyndon Johnson had the power and capability to assassinate an American president is just plain wrong. It's not only wrong it's a rediculous premise.

When Lyndon Johnson made his cryptic comment "We were running a damn Murder, Inc. in the Carribean" was he referring to Permindex?

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Guest Robert Morrow

Terry, could you give us your theory of what happened to JFK in a few words, or point us to somewhere you might have already discussed you beliefs? Your responses in this thread have gotten me curious.

thanks

Otto

JFK and RFK started their political career as "right wingers". Read the passage on page 399-400 from my previous post/link. Eleanor Roosevelt was a harsh critic of Jack Kennedy. She knew his father, and she knew what he represented.

"Mrs. Roosevelt had long despised Joe Kennedy. In the late 1930's she asked her husband why he had ever appointed that "awful" man as ambassasdor. Joe's attitude toward Jews, Nazi's and the war repulsed her, as did his criticism of Roosevelt's White House".

"Three times in nine months during 1958 Mrs. Roosevelt publicly challenged the Senators fitness to be President".

http://books.google.com/books?id=fxzd__gA_I4C&pg=PA399&lpg=PA399&dq=eleanor+roosevelt+exchange+of+letters+with+john+kennedy&source=bl&ots=b0e1M5_E4x&sig=rSuq1UVSPlSBZvy-S1rhY24YeqE&hl=en&ei=KsKBTN6XIou2ngfPuKhy&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=2&ved=0CBsQ6AEwAQ

Mrs. Roosevelt represented the FDR wing of the Democratic party and Jack Kennedy wanted her support. Mrs. Roosevelt on the other hand went public with her distrust of the Kennedy political machine. This resulted in a confrontation of sorts between Eleanor Roosevelt and Senator Jack Kennedy.

Here is their exchange of letters.

http://www.nps.gov/archive/elro/teach-er-vk/lesson-plans/er-and-jfk.htm

JFK would switch his earlier political outlook to adopt a pro FDR policy for his Presidency. JFK would consciously revive the FDR legacy. His space program, his investment tax credit policy, were all features of the American system.

He would also win the support of Eleanor Roosevelt and the FDR democrats.

John Kennedy was not supposed to be President. His father had selected his older brother Joseph Kennedy for that job. John Kennedy was the sickly child who read the greek classics while recuperating. He also had the bitter experince of WWII and that effected his outlook. In other words he was the wrong Kennedy for the job. He broke with family tradition and with his political backers.

I believe Permindex was the apparatus deployed to murder John Kennedy. French Intelligence in 1967 issued a report identifying Permindex as the entity conduiting the money used to finance the assassination attempts against Charles De Gaulle. They were also indentified as being involved in the murder of Italian industrialist (and JFK collaborator) Enrico Mattei. Clay Shaw was a director of Permindex.

To me LBJ was scared. He knew what had been done to his boss and felt that the same fate awaited him if he crossed these guys.

Here is a skeptical look at the Permindex angle:

http://educationforum.ipbhost.com/index.php?showtopic=917

Terry, also give us the reason WHY Permindex would have murdered JFK. I just think there is too much information out there indicating that Lyndon Johnson was not just deeply involved in the JFK assassination, but at the CENTER of the JFK assassination. Just look at the groups the Kennedys were at WAR with in fall 1963: they were at WAR with Lyndon Johnson (Robert Kennedy's efforts to knive LBJ with the media and the Senate/House investigating committees; they were at WAR with the CIA and there was Arthur Krock's open speculation of a CIA coup in print in the newspaper of record (then) the NY Times; they were at WAR with the mafia Carlos Marcello, Santos Trafficante, Jimmy Hoffa, Sam Giancana). And LBJ was the one to bring all the Kennedy haters together to take out the Kennedys by killing JFK. I do believe in heavy CIA involvement in the JFK assassination.

So what was the motives in Permindex to kill JFK? Who were the players, besides Clay Shaw, and what was they motive to kill John Kennedy?

And btw, Eleanor Roosevelt backed Adlai Stevenson over JFK in the 1960 Demo nominating process. Yes, she was not pro-Kennedy at that time, but she signed on for the general election.

Why did Permindex make repeated attempts on the life of Charles De Gaulle, and why kill Enrico Mattei, among others? Permindex was an off-shore assassination bureau used to kill national leaders who were acting in a manner the elites didnt like.

Why did one half of the boys from Kennedy Justice Department go over to run Meyer Lansky's/Resorts International's "INTERTEL"? Why did the other half go over to run Max Jacobs "Emprise" money laundering appartus?

The Kennedy political machine and John F. Kennedy are two different entities all together.

Your belief that Lyndon Johnson had the power and capability to assassinate an American president is just plain wrong. It's not only wrong it's a rediculous premise.

When Lyndon Johnson made his cryptic comment "We were running a damn Murder, Inc. in the Carribean" was he referring to Permindex?

I am not buying it Terry Mauro, re: Permindex. You did not tell me WHAT was JFK doing to offend the "powers that be" at Permindex. We know the wars - and I mean WARS - JFK was having with Lyndon Johnson in the fall of 1963 with Robert Kennedy doing everything he could to get LBJ kicked off the ticket or indicted. We know JFK was at WAR with the CIA, threatening to smash it into a 1,000 pieces and cast it to the wind, with OPEN speculation of a CIA coup in the NY Times. We know the blood hate that existed between Robert Kennedy and Jimmy Hoffa and Carlos Marcello who he deported in put into a Guatemalan jungle. So WHAT exactly was the bone of contention with JFK and Permindex?

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Guest Robert Morrow

I do think HL Hunt and Lyndon Johnson were two elite sponsors of the JFK assassination. (They had LOTS of help!) The above comments by George Smathers, relaying the Johnson wanted JACKIE to ride in his car are extremely informative. And there was ABSOLUTELY NO WAY that John Kennedy and Lyndon Johnson were going to be riding in the same car and Johnson knew this. The president and vice president fly in separate air planes and they sit in separate cars. Any top political player in 1963 would know this OBVIOUS fact. So that is a bunch of bull about Johnson thinking he was going to ride with JFK. An obvious non-starter.

But what is really STRIKING is Lyndon Johnson's "bizarre" request to have Jackie ride in his car. It's not so bizarre when you think that Johnson considered himself a Southern gentleman by attempting to keep Jackie from having her brains blown out, too, because Johnson was the Mastermmind of the JFK Assassination and LBJ knew that a fusillade of bullets and death awaited John Kennedy in that Dallas motorcade.

Here is the view of another JFK researcher on "Johnson wants Jackie to ride with me" (JFK to George Smathers on 11/18/63); also commentary on the WAR that John Kennedy was having with HL Hunt's political/religious entities:

JFK Researcher says:

I agree that Smathers' interpretation of "Johnson wants to ride with me" was in error. Secret Service regulations forbade the President and Vice-President riding together in the same car. At the time of the Dallas visit, there was a feud going on between Texas Democrats with the conservatives of the Johnson-Connally faction against the more liberal Democrats led by Sen. Ralph Yarborough, a JFK supporter. Yarborough was the one riding in Johnson's car with LBJ and Lady Bird.

It has been reported that on the morning of the assassination, LBJ came to the President's suite at the Hotel Texas in Fort Worth and a loud argument broke out between the men. The subject of their disagreement, it was said, was the seating arrangements for the Dallas motorcade. Johnson, it appears, was making a last ditch attempt to get Connally out of JFK's car by using the excuse that Yarborough didn't want to ride with HIM. ( which was true ) But I believe that the seating arrangements were for a purpose --- to show solidarity by having Connally with JFK and Yarborough with LBJ, so there was NO WAY JFK was going to budge on the seating arrangements.

Had Kennedy yielded to Johnson's demands, which would have put Yarborough in JFK's limo, Yarborough, instead of Connally, would have been shot along with Kennedy.

More on that in a second.

H.L. Hunt, Johnson's financial backer and mentor, had a religious foundation called the LIFELINE FOUNDATION. It enjoyed religious status and Federal exemption from income taxes. But in its weekly radio broadcasts, its messages were more political than religious and and when I say political, I mean anti-JFK.

In the weeks before the assassination, Hunt's radio program blasted the Administration and its policies.

It accused JFK of bypassing Congress to follow a line enunciated from Moscow.

It was a time, Lifeline broadcasts cried, for "extreme patriotism".

( Source: POWER TO DESTROY, The Political Uses of the IRS from Kennedy to Nixon by John A. Andrew III,, published by Ivan R. Dee, Chicago 2002-- pg 97)

Many of the funds that were "donations" to these tax-exempt religious organizations were in fact earmarked for right-wing extremist groups. These religious organizations allowed contributors to make donations to right-wing extremist groups and receive a tax deduction for them.

In 1961, the President asked Walter and Victor Reuther to come up with a plan to combat these extreme right-wing forces. Known as the "Reuther Memorandum", one of the things that the document suggested was to "choke off the flow of money to the radical right by challenging groups' tax-exempt status".

( ibid. pg 21)

Hence, the IRS' Ideological Organizations Project ( IOP ) was formed.

A March 9, 1962 IRS internal memo listed the first groups to be investigated. Among them were Hunt's Lifeline Organization ( Dallas District ) , the John Birch Society ( for which "Lifeline" was a front ) and the National Indignation Convention, Dallas District.

( ibid. pg 29)

In February 1963, ( at a time when Oswald was "buying" his weapons ), the IRS recommended revocation of the tax-exempt status for Hunt's "Life Line". Lifeline had run into problems with the IRS because "approximately 50%" of its publications were "in the nature of propaganda. These releases discussed only one side of an issue and were not consistent with the purposes of an exempt educational organization".

(ibid. pg 33 )

Now here's the kicker.

A Senate Sub-Committee was scheduled to hold hearings in January 1964 on the tax-exemption status of religious organizations with extremist political viewpoints.

The Chair of that Sub-Committee ? Sen. Ralph Yarborough of Texas.

( ibid. pg 34 )

Had Yarborough been in Kennedy's car instead of Connally, HE would have been the one shot up, not Connally. There would have been no hearings, no investigation of Hunt's organization and others.

I find this all extremely interesting in lieu of the fact that Johnson tried so hard, even up to the last minute, to change the seating arrangements for the Dallas motorcade.

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Terry, could you give us your theory of what happened to JFK in a few words, or point us to somewhere you might have already discussed you beliefs? Your responses in this thread have gotten me curious.

thanks

Otto

JFK and RFK started their political career as "right wingers". Read the passage on page 399-400 from my previous post/link. Eleanor Roosevelt was a harsh critic of Jack Kennedy. She knew his father, and she knew what he represented.

"Mrs. Roosevelt had long despised Joe Kennedy. In the late 1930's she asked her husband why he had ever appointed that "awful" man as ambassasdor. Joe's attitude toward Jews, Nazi's and the war repulsed her, as did his criticism of Roosevelt's White House".

"Three times in nine months during 1958 Mrs. Roosevelt publicly challenged the Senators fitness to be President".

http://books.google.com/books?id=fxzd__gA_I4C&pg=PA399&lpg=PA399&dq=eleanor+roosevelt+exchange+of+letters+with+john+kennedy&source=bl&ots=b0e1M5_E4x&sig=rSuq1UVSPlSBZvy-S1rhY24YeqE&hl=en&ei=KsKBTN6XIou2ngfPuKhy&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=2&ved=0CBsQ6AEwAQ

Mrs. Roosevelt represented the FDR wing of the Democratic party and Jack Kennedy wanted her support. Mrs. Roosevelt on the other hand went public with her distrust of the Kennedy political machine. This resulted in a confrontation of sorts between Eleanor Roosevelt and Senator Jack Kennedy.

Here is their exchange of letters.

http://www.nps.gov/archive/elro/teach-er-vk/lesson-plans/er-and-jfk.htm

JFK would switch his earlier political outlook to adopt a pro FDR policy for his Presidency. JFK would consciously revive the FDR legacy. His space program, his investment tax credit policy, were all features of the American system.

He would also win the support of Eleanor Roosevelt and the FDR democrats.

John Kennedy was not supposed to be President. His father had selected his older brother Joseph Kennedy for that job. John Kennedy was the sickly child who read the greek classics while recuperating. He also had the bitter experince of WWII and that effected his outlook. In other words he was the wrong Kennedy for the job. He broke with family tradition and with his political backers.

I believe Permindex was the apparatus deployed to murder John Kennedy. French Intelligence in 1967 issued a report identifying Permindex as the entity conduiting the money used to finance the assassination attempts against Charles De Gaulle. They were also indentified as being involved in the murder of Italian industrialist (and JFK collaborator) Enrico Mattei. Clay Shaw was a director of Permindex.

To me LBJ was scared. He knew what had been done to his boss and felt that the same fate awaited him if he crossed these guys.

Here is a skeptical look at the Permindex angle:

http://educationforum.ipbhost.com/index.php?showtopic=917

Terry, also give us the reason WHY Permindex would have murdered JFK. I just think there is too much information out there indicating that Lyndon Johnson was not just deeply involved in the JFK assassination, but at the CENTER of the JFK assassination. Just look at the groups the Kennedys were at WAR with in fall 1963: they were at WAR with Lyndon Johnson (Robert Kennedy's efforts to knive LBJ with the media and the Senate/House investigating committees; they were at WAR with the CIA and there was Arthur Krock's open speculation of a CIA coup in print in the newspaper of record (then) the NY Times; they were at WAR with the mafia Carlos Marcello, Santos Trafficante, Jimmy Hoffa, Sam Giancana). And LBJ was the one to bring all the Kennedy haters together to take out the Kennedys by killing JFK. I do believe in heavy CIA involvement in the JFK assassination.

So what was the motives in Permindex to kill JFK? Who were the players, besides Clay Shaw, and what was they motive to kill John Kennedy?

And btw, Eleanor Roosevelt backed Adlai Stevenson over JFK in the 1960 Demo nominating process. Yes, she was not pro-Kennedy at that time, but she signed on for the general election.

Why did Permindex make repeated attempts on the life of Charles De Gaulle, and why kill Enrico Mattei, among others? Permindex was an off-shore assassination bureau used to kill national leaders who were acting in a manner the elites didnt like.

Why did one half of the boys from Kennedy Justice Department go over to run Meyer Lansky's/Resorts International's "INTERTEL"? Why did the other half go over to run Max Jacobs "Emprise" money laundering appartus?

The Kennedy political machine and John F. Kennedy are two different entities all together.

Your belief that Lyndon Johnson had the power and capability to assassinate an American president is just plain wrong. It's not only wrong it's a rediculous premise.

When Lyndon Johnson made his cryptic comment "We were running a damn Murder, Inc. in the Carribean" was he referring to Permindex?

I am not buying it Terry Mauro, re: Permindex. You did not tell me WHAT was JFK doing to offend the "powers that be" at Permindex. We know the wars - and I mean WARS - JFK was having with Lyndon Johnson in the fall of 1963 with Robert Kennedy doing everything he could to get LBJ kicked off the ticket or indicted. We know JFK was at WAR with the CIA, threatening to smash it into a 1,000 pieces and cast it to the wind, with OPEN speculation of a CIA coup in the NY Times. We know the blood hate that existed between Robert Kennedy and Jimmy Hoffa and Carlos Marcello who he deported in put into a Guatemalan jungle. So WHAT exactly was the bone of contention with JFK and Permindex?

Of course you're not buying it. You're deeply vested in your fantasy world "LBJ did it".

Why was Lincoln killed, McKinnley, Garfield? Why the attempted assassination of FDR? Why the murder of Enrico Mattei, the attempts on the life of Charles DeGaulle. Why the assassination in the late 1970's of Aldo Moro? Assassinations have been occuring for centuries.

You're problem is you're blind to real history and therefore a sucker for fairy tales.

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Guest Robert Morrow

The Kennedys and Lyndon Johnson were at WAR in the fall of 1963 ... just like the Kennedys were at WAR with the CIA and the possibility of a CIA coup was spilling over into the newspaper of record, the NY Times with that Arthur Krock column ... and the Kennedys were at WAR with Jimmy Hoffa, Carlos Marcello and Santos Trafficante.

Lyndon Johnson was able to bring together all the enemies of the Kennedys and he did it at Dallas just in time to save his political career and freedom from jail. Here is the massive heat Robert Kennedy was putting on Lyndon Johnson (headlines in Newspapers with Richard Nixon speculating that Lyndon Johnson would be DROPPED from the 1964 Democratic ticket):

It was a sub rosa war that had been going on for 2+ years and it was coming to a head in the fall of 1963 with Robert Kennedy feeding extremely damaging information about Lyndon Johnson's corruption to 1) the elite Washington press corps, especially LIFE magazine and 2) Senate Rules Committee that was investigating Lyndon Johnson and his corruption, bribes, kick backs - it was on a massive scale and also tied to the breaking Bobby Baker scandal.

Robert Kennedy, in the fall of 1963, was telling the Washington press corps that it was open season on Lyndon Johnson LBJ was very aware of this & angry, frightened and concerned

Here is a good link by Phil Brennan, detailing the pressure that Robert Kennedy was putting on Lyndon Johnson at this time: http://home.earthlink.net/%7Esixthfloor/brennen.htm Phil Brennan wrote this 11/19/2003 – 40 years after the assassination about how Robert Kennedy was telling the Washington press corp it was open season on Lyndon Johnson and his corruption:

“For the most part, the Washington press corps kept the lid on the story - until the

late Bob Humphrey, then the GOP Senate leadership's spokesman, an incredibly gifted strategist and a mentor, asked me to tell the story to the late Delaware Republican Sen. John Williams, a crusader for good government and a crackerjack of an investigator.

Sen. Williams asked me to introduce him to Hill and I did. They got together with some Senate investigators for the GOP minority and Hill told them the whole story, including the part played by Vice President Johnson. Williams got his committee to launch an investigation and the lid came off.

A few days later, the attorney general, Bobby Kennedy, called five ofWashington's top reporters into his office and told them it was now open seasonon Lyndon Johnson. It's OK, he told them, to go after the story they were ignoring out of deference to the administration.

And from that point on until the events in Dallas, Lyndon Baines Johnson's future

looked as if it included a sudden end to his political career and a few years in the slammer. The Kennedys had their knives out and sharpened for him and were determined to draw his political blood - all of it.

In the Senate, the investigation into the Baker case was moving quickly ahead. Even the Democrats were cooperating, thanks to the Kennedys, and an awful lot of really bad stuff was being revealed - until Nov. 22, 1963.

By Nov. 23, all Democrat cooperation suddenly stopped. Lyndon would serve a

term and a half in the White House instead of the slammer, the Baker investigation would peter out and Bobby Baker would serve a short sentence and go free. Dallas accomplished all of that. “

Excellent Spartacus biography on Lyndon Johnson: http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/USAjohnsonLB.htm

LIFE Magazine, being fed damaging info by RFK, was on the verge of running a story on 11/29/63 that would have annihilated Lyndon Johnson’s political career once and for all

Source: James Wagenvoord who in 1963 was the 27 year old assistant to LIFE Magazine’e managing editor; this issue would have been dated 12/6/63 and mailed out 11/29 and 11/30/63 (Friday/Saturday mailing)

http://educationforum.ipbhost.com/index.php?showtopic=14966&st=0

James Wagenvoord to John Simkin (in November, 2009):

I've been reading through you web site and believe that I can add one of the final jigsaw puzzle pieces that affect the timing of JFK's Dallas trip and the nervousness of LBJ during the weeks preceding the killing. At the time I was the 27 year old Editorial business manager and assistant to Life Magazines Executive Editor. Beginning in later summer 1963 the magazine, based upon information fed from Bobby Kennedy and the Justice Department, had been developing a major newsbreak piece concerning Johnson and Bobby Baker. On publication Johnson would have been finished and off the '64 ticket (reason the material was fed to us) and would probably have been facing prison time. At the time LIFE magazine was arguably the most important general news source in the US. The top management of Time Inc. was closely allied with the USA's various intelligence agencies and we were used after by the Kennedy Justice Department as a conduit to the public. Life's coverage of the Hoffa prosecution, and involvement in paying off Justice Department Memphis witnesses was a case in point.

The LBJ/Baker piece was in the final editing stages and was scheduled to break in the issue of the magazine due out the week of November 24 (the magazine would have made it to the newsstands on Nov.26th or 27th). It had been prepared in relative secrecy by a small special editorial team. On Kennedy's death research files and all numbered copies of the nearly print-ready draft were gathered up by my boss (he had been the top editor on the team) and shredded. The issue that was to expose LBJ instead featured the Zapruder film. Based upon our success in syndicating the Zapruder film I became Chief of Time/LIFE editorial services and remained in that job until 1968.

Biography of James Wagenvoord: http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/JFKwagenvoord.htm

LIFE Magazine was within days of breaking a major story on Lyndon Johnson that would have been extremely politically damaging to him. By 11/22/63, the political career of Lyndon Johnson was hanging by a thin, thin thread and Robert Kennedy, having told the Washington press corps that it was open season on Johnson, was about to cut it with scissors:

In 1963 Johnson got drawn into political scandals involving Fred Korth, Billie Sol Estes and Bobby Baker. According to James Wagenvoord, the editorial business manager and assistant to Life Magazines Executive Editor, the magazine was working on an article that would have revealed Johnson's corrupt activities. "Beginning in later summer 1963 the magazine, based upon information fed from Bobby Kennedy and the Justice Department, had been developing a major newsbreak piece concerning Johnson and Bobby Baker. On publication Johnson would have been finished and off the 1964 ticket (reason the material was fed to us) and would probably have been facing prison time. At the time LIFE magazine was arguably the most important general news source in the US. The top management of Time Inc. was closely allied with the USA's various intelligence agencies and we were used after by the Kennedy Justice Department as a conduit to the public."

The fact that it was Robert Kennedy who was giving this information to Life Magazine suggests that John F. Kennedy intended to drop Johnson as his vice-president. This is supported by Evelyn Lincoln, Kennedy's secretary. In her book, Kennedy and Johnson (1968) she claimed that in November, 1963, Kennedy decided that because of the emerging Bobby Baker scandal he was going to drop Johnson as his running mate in the 1964 election. Kennedy told Lincoln that he was going to replace Johnson with Terry Sanford.

Don B. Reynolds appeared before a secret session of the Senate Rules Committee on 22nd November, 1963. Reynolds told B. Everett Jordan and his committee that Johnson had demanded that he provided kickbacks in return for him agreeing to a life insurance policy arranged by him in 1957. This included a $585 Magnavox stereo. Reynolds also had to pay for $1,200 worth of advertising on KTBC, Johnson's television station in Austin. Reynolds had paperwork for this transaction including a delivery note that indicated the stereo had been sent to the home of Johnson. Reynolds also told of seeing a suitcase full of money which Baker described as a "$100,000 payoff to Johnson for his role in securing the Fort Worth TFX contract".

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Guest Robert Morrow

Would we love the Kennedys more or less had they been more like the Corleones, and taken their enemies out?

Oh, wait - I meant, "like the Johnsons."

Lyndon Johnson did IN FACT behave like a mafia don. Always wanting kick backs, protection money, bribes, the guy was probably committing a felony a day. Then he would murder to cover up his tracks when necessary, with his own personal hit man Malcolm Wallace. And for the Big Event, LBJ would call in his big mob/CIA friends to do the dirty work. Johnson = Corleone. Without the slightest bit of exaggeration.

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Would we love the Kennedys more or less had they been more like the Corleones, and taken their enemies out?

Oh, wait - I meant, "like the Johnsons."

Lyndon Johnson did IN FACT behave like a mafia don. Always wanting kick backs, protection money, bribes, the guy was probably committing a felony a day. Then he would murder to cover up his tracks when necessary, with his own personal hit man Malcolm Wallace. And for the Big Event, LBJ would call in his big mob/CIA friends to do the dirty work. Johnson = Corleone. Without the slightest bit of exaggeration.

Again - could he order the Secret Service to "stand down."

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Would we love the Kennedys more or less had they been more like the Corleones, and taken their enemies out?

Oh, wait - I meant, "like the Johnsons."

Lyndon Johnson did IN FACT behave like a mafia don. Always wanting kick backs, protection money, bribes, the guy was probably committing a felony a day. Then he would murder to cover up his tracks when necessary, with his own personal hit man Malcolm Wallace. And for the Big Event, LBJ would call in his big mob/CIA friends to do the dirty work. Johnson = Corleone. Without the slightest bit of exaggeration.

I think you have this whole idea turned upside down. It is the Kennedy family that has links and ties to organized crime.

Look at Joseph Linsey. He was a top contributor to Edward Kennedy's senatorial campaign in 1976. Linsey was a Massachusetts "boot legger" with close ties to Meyer Lansky and Resorts International. Linsey owned a liquor distributing company "Crown and Whitehall". His chief salesman was a man named Mike Rocco. Rocco was described by the McClellan Committee as a "collection man for the mob".

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joseph_Linsey

Here is their activity of a more recent vintage. Al Ross nephew to Joseph Linsey. The mob is moving in on LBJ's home state of Texas.

From all accounts, Ross is Mr. Greyhound himself. At 57 he operates five successful greyhound tracks in Rhode Island, South Dakota and Colorado. He is the chairman of the American Greyhound Council, former president of the American Greyhound Track Operator's Association and a founder of the Greyhound Hall of Fame in Abilene, Kansas.

When Holtzman was searching the country for a consultant on how to run a greyhound race track, he sought out experts for recommendations. "Al Ross was head and shoulders above the rest."

Ross was hired under a five year contract that will see his annual salary increase from $150,000 to $185,000 a year.

Ross has no equity investment in the track and his uncle has absolutely no connection with it, according to Holtzman and Steen.

Holtzman said the only record Linsey has is that he was arrested for bootlegging in 1926.

Holtzman said some of his competitors seeking the Galveston track have been "dragging muck up" by turning everybody's attention onto Ross' uncle, who will be 90 in May.

And because of the negative publicity generated over his uncle, Ross is almost ready to quit, Holtzman said.

Linsey was described as the "front man" for the "New England mob" and a friend of the late organized crime boss Raymond Patriarca in Vincent Teresa's 1973 best selling book, "My Life In The Mafia. " Linsey has constantly denied any association or business dealings with organized crime figures, despite his name being mentioned in summaries of FBI wire taps of Patriarca.

However, Linsey and Ross were granted a license by Rhode Island to operate Lincoln Greyhound Park following an investigation by state police into Linsey's alleged organized crime links. In addition, Ross and Linsey have been licensed to operate tracks following similar investigations by state agencies in Colorado and South Dakota.

According to officials in Rhode Island, Ross has been an exemplary operator of Lincoln Greyhound Park, the state's only greyhound track.

"He's a first class operator. He has turned around an outdated horse track into a first class, modern greyhound racing facility," said Robert Gentile, of the division of racing and athletics of Rhode Island's Department of Business Regulation. "He also operates a number of other greyhound tracks in other states."

http://www.chron.com/CDA/archives/archive.mpl/1989_619693/run-for-the-races-track-league-city-racing-site-ha.html

Edited by Terry Mauro
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I think you have this whole idea turned upside down. It is the Kennedy family that has links and ties to organized crime.

I have said as much in the past, though I have called for those elements of old Joe Kennedy's history and character to be more fully explored for certifiability. I've suggested, also, that it was entirely in old Joe's character to get his sons into gangbusting in order to demolish old associates. But the record has to be carefully parsed for rumor, lies, misinterpretation, canards. Once it is - there may be a fascinating moral tale there.

Oh, wait...I meant, "had they been more like the CIA."

Edited by David Andrews
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