Robert Mady Posted October 21, 2014 Share Posted October 21, 2014 (edited) I was recently at a Ted Talk, one talk was on government and how much control 'WE' had on policy, a complex study was done on public opinion versus policy and it was concluded that 'WE' had about 1% influence on policy and the 1% was probably grossly exaggerated. 0.5% of the population funds candidates, and that is not 'US'. WE lost control before 1963 and lost any hope of regaining control on 11/22/1963. The US military / industrial complex should have been disbanded following WWII, we allowed them to continue to dictate policy and gain power. I hope when the rest of the world gets tired of getting pushed around, they do not take it out on all of us. I did not see the post from Douglas Caddy 'Princeton Study: U.S. No Longer An Actual Democracy" <--- this is it Edited October 21, 2014 by Robert Mady Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Mady Posted October 21, 2014 Share Posted October 21, 2014 I just read an article which included an estimation of the wealth of the Rothschild family to be about 500 trillion dollars, what do you suppose they don't control? The Rockefellers are not in that league and yet we see their pervasive influence in America. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Trejo Posted October 21, 2014 Share Posted October 21, 2014 (edited) Boston Globe: Vote all you want. The secret government won’t change. http://www.bostonglobe.com/ideas/2014/10/18/vote-all-you-want-the-secret-government-won-change/jVSkXrENQlu8vNcBfMn9sL/story.html?event=event25 Folks who believe in a "Secret Government" won't change their opinions, in any case. The notion that the Masons really ran the world started over 100 years ago, and variations on that theme have proved popular ever since. The John Birch Society made it even more popular in the 1960's. Barry Goldwater also fed that mythology with his notion that the Federal Government isn't really repesenting the People who elected its leaders, but only represent rich and powerful interests. I prefer the argument of LBJ -- the US Government isn't the enemy of the People -- the US Government *is* the People. It so happens that some of our People are rich and powerful. It's absurd (IMHO) to imagine that the rich run the USA any way they want. The USA is simply too large and too diverse for that to happen. The JBS notion of the "Hidden Government" can probably be traced to the German paranoia in the 1930's that led to WW2. It's pseudo-intellectual and it has always been alarmist. Don't buy it. There is no Secret Government in the USA -- nor was there any in Germany in the 1930's. What you see is what you get. If you want a change -- get out there and make a change. Sincerely, --Paul Trejo Edited October 21, 2014 by Paul Trejo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Trejo Posted October 21, 2014 Share Posted October 21, 2014 Princeton Study: U.S. No Longer An Actual Democracy http://talkingpointsmemo.com/livewire/princeton-experts-say-us-no-longer-democracy Princeton University -- so what? University Professors have said nuttier things than that. There have always been rich and powerful people in the USA, and they have always migrated to Washington DC to pass laws to favor themselves. As long as they go through the Legal and Constitutional process, they have every right to do that. If we oppose their legislation, we have an equal right to change it. The Liberals in the USA have little to complain about, compared with the Conservatives, who have lost ground since Barry Goldwater and have become increasingly extreme and out of touch with mainstream America. The result is surely a USA that is divided within itself -- Liberals and Conservatives are practically enemies today. So, nobody is satisfied. This causes deadlock in Washington DC, as we've seen for the past six years -- but this tells us who we are. We ARE divided about such issues as unlimited Social Welfare and Freebooter Capitalism. Now -- take today's politics back to 1963, and add the USSR with nuclear weapons aimed at the USA, and then some of those nuclear weapons being installed on the little island of Cuba only 90 miles from our Florida coast -- and you'll see the pressures the USA felt when JFK was murdered. In my view, the USA has seen worse years than 2014, and 1963 was one of those bad years. Don't give up on Democracy. Keep voting! Sincerely, --Paul Trejo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Trejo Posted October 21, 2014 Share Posted October 21, 2014 I just read an article which included an estimation of the wealth of the Rothschild family to be about 500 trillion dollars, what do you suppose they don't control? The Rockefellers are not in that league and yet we see their pervasive influence in America. Robert -- you once quoted Alan Watts in this thread, so you won some points with me. Still, where in the world did you read that screed about the Rothschild family being worth $500 trillion? Some anti-Semitic journal? Sincerely, --Paul Trejo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Mady Posted October 21, 2014 Share Posted October 21, 2014 (edited) Paul, WE don't know how much money the Rothschild family has accumulated, nor the Rockefellers or the Royal family. From the net: The Rothschild wealth was estimated at over $6 billion US in 1850 Taking $6 billion and compounding that figure at various returns on investment (a conservative range of 4% to 8%) suggest the following net worth of the Rothschild family $1.9 trillion US (@ 4%) $7.8 trillion US (@ 5%) $31.5 trillion US (@ 6%)$125,189.1 trillion US (@ 7%)$491,409.0 trillion US (@ 8%) Why is it the first thing brought up is anti-Semitic question, isn't this just racist? I am not sure where I noticed figure of 500 trillion, it may have been from article on the Ebola Hoax being perpetrated by the US media. Is it deniable that the Rothschild family has controlled modern Western banking for a long period of time, how much money do you suppose they amassed? You do know they currently control Western banking and are one of the owners of the Federal Reserve System which has NEVER been audited. You don't agree with the 500 trillion, I have no problem with lowering it to $1.9 Trillion. Edited October 21, 2014 by Robert Mady Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Mady Posted October 21, 2014 Share Posted October 21, 2014 (edited) Paul, I hope you enjoy consuming GMO foods, because of MONSANTO we have no choice in the matter or no say unless we can sort out which foods have little to no GMO included in the mix (estimates are over 70% of the food we now consume are contaminated by GMO). You have any digestion problems, very possible related to consuming GMO's. Because of pharmaceutical industry controlling medicine you will soon have no choice but to see an MD that can only mask your problems with a pill, injection or surgery, (US ranks 37th in health care in the world) alternative medicine is being eliminated as quackery and generally not supported by insurance. Because of Obama Care whether or not you believe vaccines are useful or even harmful you will have no choice but to be brought up to date on injections if you require health care. You want vitamins or herbal supplements, good luck because the pharmaceutical industry considers this as useless because it is un-patentable so it will eventually be denied to us. How do you feel going thru an airport taking off your shoes and going thru an x-ray machine so they can see your body under your cloths, you may want to see what radiation causes. Can you see that the next step screening at sporting events then the malls then randomly at rail stations and on the street corners. Did you get a polio vaccine ? Well you have been infected with a virus called v40 (40th one in vaccine identified) which in the majority of people will eventually cause cancer, the authorities know this, do you? You do know virus cause cancer, or did they not tell you this? Do you know that the vaccines are now grown on aborted fetus material? Fetus material contaminates vaccines with DNA, do you want foreign DNA injected into your blood stream? Can you say auto-immune disorders, how about some mercury in your vaccine, the medical profession says a little mercury (one of the most toxic substances) is good for children. Can you say autism. Do you know that communities like Amish have virtually no incidence of Autism and also no vaccinations, how come we can't find any correlation? Are you aware that vaccines are ineffective that is why there is a high incidence of vaccinated individuals contracting disease any way and that now the recommendation to cover up this fact is regular booster shots. It is a farce, a money pit for medical quackery. Got high blood pressure, taking a pill to correct this, big pharma knows the root problem is lack of Vitamin D, did your doctor inform you to get into the sun >without sunscreen< or prescribe a pill that acts like vitamin D...only long term it is killing you. Vitamin D was not patentable so they created a chemical that can be recognized by the body as Vitamin D, sort of. Do you really believe that AIDS or Ebola is not bio-engineered and introduced via vaccines? Where was Limes Disease when we were growing up, who feared the deer tick? Remember Laitreal or Vitamin B17, it was found to be useful in curing some cancers, it is found in Bitter Almonds, what did the government do, demanded that bitter almonds by pasteurized prior to sale, which destroys B17. They tell us to watch out for the sun and wear sun screen, but since we began to cover ourselves with sun screen we are getting skin cancer. Yet we are too stupid to understand that it is not the sun that is the problem. These actions represent what IS the US government. Trust them if you want, that is your choice, but make it from an informed perspective. From World Health Organization ranking on country health care. 1 France2 Italy3 San Marino4 Andorra5 Malta6 Singapore7 Spain8 Oman9 Austria10 Japan11 Norway12 Portugal13 Monaco14 Greece15 Iceland16 Luxembourg17 Netherlands18 United Kingdom19 Ireland20 Switzerland21 Belgium22 Colombia23 Sweden24 Cyprus25 Germany26 Saudi Arabia27 United Arab Emirates28 Israel29 Morocco30 Canada31 Finland32 Australia33 Chile34 Denmark35 Dominica36 Costa Rica37 United States of America Edited October 21, 2014 by Robert Mady Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Trejo Posted October 21, 2014 Share Posted October 21, 2014 (edited) Paul, WE don't know how much money the Rothschild family has accumulated, nor the Rockefellers or the Royal family. From the net: The Rothschild wealth was estimated at over $6 billion US in 1850 Taking $6 billion and compounding that figure at various returns on investment (a conservative range of 4% to 8%) suggest the following net worth of the Rothschild family $1.9 trillion US (@ 4%) $7.8 trillion US (@ 5%) $31.5 trillion US (@ 6%) $125,189.1 trillion US (@ 7%) $491,409.0 trillion US (@ 8%) Why is it the first thing brought up is anti-Semitic question, isn't this just racist? I am not sure where I noticed figure of 500 trillion, it may have been from article on the Ebola Hoax being perpetrated by the US media. Is it deniable that the Rothschild family has controlled modern Western banking for a long period of time, how much money do you suppose they amassed? You do know they currently control Western banking and are one of the owners of the Federal Reserve System which has NEVER been audited. You don't agree with the 500 trillion, I have no problem with lowering it to $1.9 Trillion. Well, Robert, there's a gigantic difference between 500 trillion and 2 trillion. Even then, the presumption is that Jewish banking families still predominate International banking the way they did in the 19th century (due to the European tradition of banning Usury amongst Christians). Once the USA broke away from European ties, however, Gentiles entered the international banking scene as never before. In the 20th century, American banking has been predominantly Gentile -- with names like Rockefeller and Chase at the top. More recently, Japanese and Asian international banks have become gargantuan. Jewish banking families like the Schiffs have taken a sharp decline. The irrational fear of Jewish international banking reached a peak during the Third Reich -- and it ruined Germany utterly. It was alarmist, paranoic and silly. It makes even less sense in 21st century America than it did in 20th century Germany. THIS is why we need to solve the JFK murder at all costs -- because alarmist nonsense is only fed by wild conspiracy theories. Sincerely, --Paul Trejo Edited October 21, 2014 by Paul Trejo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Mady Posted October 21, 2014 Share Posted October 21, 2014 (edited) Paul, I have not figured out how to quote a post. Anyway it is not a question of Jewish running anything, you have turned this into a racist argument. The discussion was: people with extreme amounts of wealth have the power to control policies. I gave examples of families with extreme wealth: Rothschilds, Rockefellers and Royal family. It does not matter what religion they profess, more likely than not they worship power, so what does it matter if they are Jewish or not? Religion just deviates from the crux of the matter and that is using power for the gain of personal preferences over majority. Your point that there are others that have emerged as banking giants is well taken, that does not mean they are in the same class as those listed. Edited October 21, 2014 by Robert Mady Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steven Gaal Posted October 21, 2014 Share Posted October 21, 2014 Furthermore, I mock any notion that a Mafia pimp like Jack Ruby would be of SERVICE for the US Government..... The US Government clearly used Jack Ruby like a low-level flunky. Regards,--Paul Trejo^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^? The CIA used the mafia for an ultrasensitive geopolitical operation with worldwide implications in the Castro hit. The CIA using Ruby is no stretch. The CIA used prostitutes with drugs in their MKULTRA operations.Shirley you jest at the suggestion that the CIA "intellectuals" (as you call them) are of high class and impeccable moral rectitude.If you had read the material you would know that Ruby has been involved in successful smuggling operations for many years. Said smuggling requires long range planning,sophistication,and intelligence. Smuggling is used in CIA operations and thus is a TYPE of intelligence they could/did use with Ruby. ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^Originally Posted by Anthony DeFiore =At the press conference, with Oswald looking right at him in disgust, Jack Ruby corrected the spokesman as he stumbled on the name and Ruby said clearly, "The Fair Play For Cuba Committee". JUST HOW IN THE HELL DID THIS OBSCURE DALLAS STRIP CLUB OWNER KNOW THE EXACT NAME OF A PRO CASTRO GROUP LOCATED IN NEW ORLEANS IN WHICH OSWALD (SOMEONE THAT HE HAD NEVER MET) WAS PASSING OUT LEAFLETS IN SUPPORT OF THE GROUP?==############################Lee Forman EDFORUM =According to an FBI doc dated 12/1/63, a Mrs. Evelyn Harris was told by a Lucy Lopez that Lopez's daughter and some other women who worked in a sewing room across from the TSBD saw Ruby walking up and down the street near the TSBD, and saw him hand Oswald the pistol when he came out of the TSBD. Lopez said the women knew Oswald who apparently spoke Spanish well and ate with them at a nearby restaurant.==Jack Ruby telephoned a friend on November 22nd and asked if he would "like to watch the fireworks." Unknown to Ruby, his friend was an informant for the criminal intelligence division of the Internal Revenue Service. He and Ruby were standing at the corner of the Postal Annex Building at the time of the shooting. Minutes after the shooting Phil Willis, who knew Jack Ruby, saw and photographed a man who looked like Ruby near the front of the School Book Depository. #################################### SEE http://harveyandlee.net/Wilcott/Wil_full.htm==posted athttps://deeppoliticsforum.com/forums/showthread.php?14094-LHO-Please-argue-with-this!!!!!==In 1978 former CIA accountant James B. Wilcott swore under oath before the House Select Committee on Assassinations that Lee Harvey Oswald was a "regular employee" of the Central Intelligence Agency, and that Oswald received "a full-time salary for agent work for doing CIA operational work." He testified that he was told by other CIA employees that money he (Wilcott) had personally disbursed to an encrypted account was for "the Oswald project or for Oswald." Wilcott's testimony was kept secret for decades, but can now be read in full by clicking on this link. ++++++++++++++++++++++++RUBY a CIA MAN or General Walker man ?? Jack Ruby telephoned a friend on November 22nd and asked if he would "like to watch the fireworks." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Brancato Posted October 22, 2014 Share Posted October 22, 2014 Robert - Trejo tried to cast your argument about power and money and banksters into anti Semitic rants and then point out that Jews no longer run the banking system. I think this is called a straw man argument. Your point is well taken. Banksters do control the world's economies and have since the Rothschilds. I have no idea what that family or any of the others are worth, but it isn't really the point. Trejo read the articles posted by Mr.Caddy and reiterated what he has told me numerous times - that it is empty fantasy that the super rich are in control. He would like to frame the theory that was articulated in the first article posted by Caddy as if it wre similar to the rantings of the ignorant fools calked the JBS, completely ignoring the insider bonafides of the author. Too bad. No use arguing with him about this. The last time I tried to do that he accused me of being biased against rich people. We know the truth, which is plain to see. We don't have Democracy here. We are not in control. The author is right. Our elected officials are totally beholden to monied interests. And I agree with you that the Kennedys tried to change that and were killed for their efforts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Trejo Posted October 22, 2014 Share Posted October 22, 2014 (edited) Not at all -- I didn't divert the argument to anti-Semitism -- but I do ask y'all to be more sensitive about your accusations. There is no change of topic -- I am challenging the common JFK conspiracy theory that the RICH, the 1%, killed JFK. That's utter nonsense. JFK himself was part of the 1%. I ask you both to please remove the Class Warfare rhetoric from your discourse here. You challenge me to provide PROOF -- well, that challenge swings both ways. You want to blame the RICH -- then you should provide PROOF. All these wild accusations of the RICH form a slippery slope that has no limit -- and anti-Semitism is one verified consequence of that same slippery slope. If you want to blame the International Bankers, the Bilderbergers, the Trilateral Commission, the Masons, the Rosicrucians, the Skull and Bones and the CFR for the murder of JFK, then provide something better than the John Birch Society offered in 1963. We DO HAVE DEMOCRACY. The PEOPLE ARE IN CONTROL. That author was mistaken, and our elected officials are doing the best they can in very complicated times. The Kennedys weren't trying to fight the International Bankers -- they were trying to keep Democracy alive in the middle of the Cold War. Their biggest domestic enemy was the John Birch Society -- which actually killed JFK, in my humble opinion. Now, the John Birch Society membership also blamed the International Bankers for everything -- including Communism. You guys should learn more about 20th century history, lest you come to repeat its sad side. Sincerely, --Paul Trejo Edited October 22, 2014 by Paul Trejo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Brancato Posted October 22, 2014 Share Posted October 22, 2014 Not true Paul - you suggested that Robert got his info on the Rothchilds from 'some antiSemitic journal'. It is apparently you that cannot talk about the Rothchilds as bankers rather than as Jews. Another straw man argument is - I never blamed the 'rich' for killing JFK. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Mady Posted October 22, 2014 Share Posted October 22, 2014 (edited) What is impossible to sum up in a post Sheehan does well in his presentation that the assassination was not the result of one man or one powerful group of people, rather it was a consensus among many people and groups that truly believed KENNEDY was a traitor in their perception of the direction necessary for America to survive and thrive. Was the CIA involved absolutely, was the FBI involved absolutely, did the Dallas Police Department fall in line absolutely, military yes, news media yes, mafia YES. It is not possible to point to one group or one person except for LBJ who was necessary to maintain cover for the assassination and HOOVER to make sure evidence was secured. It would also require the stamp of approval from families that wielded major power and money. The CIA would not have and could not have orchestrated the assassination without expressed intentions of the significant powers that would replace KENNEDY and be the beneficiaries of the change in leadership. One might say this was impossible to get all the necessary groups in line, yet we can see that it did happen. A good example is the news media, from the moment the assassination was announced the news media began to pump out lies concerning what happened; for instance it was proclaimed a weapon was found it was a "Enfield" then it was a 'Japanese rifle' then it was a 'Remington' no...THEN it was a 'Mauser' then a day later it mysteriously changed to a 'Carcano' this was not a media confused this was a media causing confusion and confounding the publics perception of the assassination so that we could not form a true consensus as to what the facts were. All three major networks as well as Dallas local broadcast the same propaganda, it is clear they were all on board with a change in power, this could have only happened with foreknowledge and an agreement that this was necessary for the good of all, so a carefully controlled script was broadcast as news. A way to look at the assassination is not as a coup but a violent corporate take over. The government did not change, the CEO and leadership at the top was removed. Edited October 22, 2014 by Robert Mady Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Trejo Posted October 22, 2014 Share Posted October 22, 2014 Not true Paul - you suggested that Robert got his info on the Rothchilds from 'some antiSemitic journal'. It is apparently you that cannot talk about the Rothchilds as bankers rather than as Jews. Another straw man argument is - I never blamed the 'rich' for killing JFK. But it comes down to the same thing, Paul B., to say that BANKERS killed JFK. I don't buy it. JFK wasn't killed over MONEY. JFK wasn't killed over debates about the Federal Reserve Bank. JFK wasn't killed over debates about removing the USA from the Vietnam conflict. JFK was killed (and I think that future releases of FOIA secret files will reveal) over Cuba, based on the John Birch Society claim that JFK was a COMMUNIST. This was the ideology that killed JFK. It was a political ideology -- not an economic motivation. The killers of JFK were True Believers in the SPECIFICALLY John Birch Society (JBS) doctrines. Now -- lots of racists joined the JBS because they liked their main slogan, "Impeach Earl Warren!" And no doubt the JBS got lots of new members when JFK made his speech in defense of Martin Luther King's Civil Rights position. But the JBS as a body did not subscribe to racism (although they welcomed support from whatever sources they could get it). The JBS rejected the extreme left-wing of Socialism and Communism, and the extreme right-wing of the KKK and ANP. They made a point of stating this. The JBS made it clear that their cause was Constitutional -- they wanted to defend the Republic from COMMUNISM. To that end they resurrected the fears started by Joe McCarthy -- the RED SCARE. That was their stock in Trade. The problem spun out of control -- they could not handle the hatred toward JFK which they themselves started. Men of action from the ultra-right in the Minutemen, along with Cuban Exiles and paramilitary right-wing mercenaries finally reached a critical mass when ROGUES from the CIA, DPD and Secret Service joined their cause. Then JFK was doomed. Yet ultimately it was the ideology of the John Birch Society that killed JFK. Not the International Bankers. The paranoia over International Bankers started with the Third Reich. That's just a historical fact. Regards, --Paul Trejo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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