Was Clay Shaw "A Highly Paid CIA Contract Source Until 1956" ?

[Thomas Graves]

In 1992 the Chief of the CIA history staff wrote a "Secret" 27-page report for the Director of the Central Intelligence Agency (DCI) about the materials that the HSCA had been allowed to see, and in this report he enumerated the conclusions that could be drawn. One way of looking at it is that the report warns the DCI about any "cats that might have been let out of the bag."

On page 2 of the report he wrote, "Our survey found nothing in these records that indicates any CIA role in the Kennedy assassination or assassination conspiracy (if there was one), or any CIA involvement with Oswald. These records do reveal, however, that Clay Shaw was a highly paid CIA contract source until 1956. While nothing surfaced on Carlos Marcello in the collection, we found substantial documentation on other members of the mob, including Santos [sic] Trafficante." [emphasis added by T. Graves]

http://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=7302&search=shaw#relPageId=3&tab=page

Thoughts, anyone? Interesting "segue" from Clay Shaw to Carlos Marcello and the mob. LOL

What's a "contract source," anyway? An informant who is kept "on retainder"?

--Tommy

Edited August 16, 2015 by Thomas Graves

[Greg Parker]

In 1992 the Chief of the CIA history staff wrote a 27-page report for the Director of the Central Intelligence Agency (DCI) about the materials that the HSCA had been allowed to see, and in this report he enumerated the conclusions that could be drawn. One way of looking at it is that the report warns the DCI about any "cats that might have been let out of the bag."

On page 2 of the report he wrote, "Our survey found nothing in these records that indicates any CIA role in the Kennedy assassination or assassination conspiracy (if there was one), or any CIA involvement with Oswald. These records do reveal, however, that Clay Shaw was a highly paid CIA contract source until 1956. While nothing surfaced on Carlos Marcello in the collection, we found substantial documentation on other members of the mob, including Santos [sic] Trafficante." [emphasis added by T. Graves]

http://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=7302&search=shaw#relPageId=3&tab=page

Thoughts, anyone? Interesting "segue" from Clay Shaw to Carlos Marcello and the mob. LOL

What's a "contract source," anyway? A paid informant who is kept "on retainder"?

--Tommy

Tommy, I would see it not so much as a segue but addressing the issue of Blakey's main suspect - Marcello. What is interesting is that while stating they see evidence of any CIA involvement in Kennedy's death, it does admit Clay's connection to the CIA, as well as mentioning the substantial documentation on Trafficante and other mob figures - I'm betting all of whom were used by the CIA in anti-Castro operations.

A contract source would be a paid asset/agent contracted to collect and provide data on specified areas of interest during their travels.

Edited August 16, 2015 by Greg Parker

[Thomas Graves]

In 1992 the Chief of the CIA history staff wrote a 27-page report for the Director of the Central Intelligence Agency (DCI) about the materials that the HSCA had been allowed to see, and in this report he enumerated the conclusions that could be drawn. One way of looking at it is that the report warns the DCI about any "cats that might have been let out of the bag."

On page 2 of the report he wrote, "Our survey found nothing in these records that indicates any CIA role in the Kennedy assassination or assassination conspiracy (if there was one), or any CIA involvement with Oswald. These records do reveal, however, that Clay Shaw was a highly paid CIA contract source until 1956. While nothing surfaced on Carlos Marcello in the collection, we found substantial documentation on other members of the mob, including Santos [sic] Trafficante." [emphasis added by T. Graves]

http://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=7302&search=shaw#relPageId=3&tab=page

Thoughts, anyone? Interesting "segue" from Clay Shaw to Carlos Marcello and the mob. LOL

What's a "contract source," anyway? A paid informant who is kept "on retainder"?

--Tommy

Tommy, I would see it not so much as a segue but addressing the issue of Blakey's main suspect - Marcello. What is interesting is that while stating they see [no] evidence of any CIA involvement in Kennedy's death, it does admit Clay's connection to the CIA, as well as mentioning the substantial documentation on Trafficante and other mob figures - I'm betting all of whom were used by the CIA in anti-Castro operations.

A contract source would be a paid asset/agent contracted to collect and provide data on specified areas of interest during their travels.

Thanks, Greg.

So Shaw may have perjured himself when he said he had never worked for the CIA.

--Tommy

Edited August 16, 2015 by Thomas Graves

[Greg Parker]

In 1992 the Chief of the CIA history staff wrote a 27-page report for the Director of the Central Intelligence Agency (DCI) about the materials that the HSCA had been allowed to see, and in this report he enumerated the conclusions that could be drawn. One way of looking at it is that the report warns the DCI about any "cats that might have been let out of the bag."

On page 2 of the report he wrote, "Our survey found nothing in these records that indicates any CIA role in the Kennedy assassination or assassination conspiracy (if there was one), or any CIA involvement with Oswald. These records do reveal, however, that Clay Shaw was a highly paid CIA contract source until 1956. While nothing surfaced on Carlos Marcello in the collection, we found substantial documentation on other members of the mob, including Santos [sic] Trafficante." [emphasis added by T. Graves]

http://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=7302&search=shaw#relPageId=3&tab=page

Thoughts, anyone? Interesting "segue" from Clay Shaw to Carlos Marcello and the mob. LOL

What's a "contract source," anyway? A paid informant who is kept "on retainder"?

--Tommy

Tommy, I would see it not so much as a segue but addressing the issue of Blakey's main suspect - Marcello. What is interesting is that while stating they see [no] evidence of any CIA involvement in Kennedy's death, it does admit Clay's connection to the CIA, as well as mentioning the substantial documentation on Trafficante and other mob figures - I'm betting all of whom were used by the CIA in anti-Castro operations.

A contract source would be a paid asset/agent contracted to collect and provide data on specified areas of interest during their travels.

Thanks, Greg.

So Shaw may have perjured himself when he said he had never worked for the CIA.

--Tommy

Morally yeah... technically, maybe not.

The strict test of an employee/employer relationship comes down to if they take out any deductions from pay, direct you in hours worked, how you do your work, where you do your work and other things of a similar nature.

This type of test however, is usually reserved to determine your tax (and in some counties your social security) status. The term "contract source" would get him off the hook as not being an employee - a fine distinction - but maybe just enough wiggle room.

[Thomas Graves]

In 1992 the Chief of the CIA history staff wrote a 27-page report for the Director of the Central Intelligence Agency (DCI) about the materials that the HSCA had been allowed to see, and in this report he enumerated the conclusions that could be drawn. One way of looking at it is that the report warns the DCI about any "cats that might have been let out of the bag."

On page 2 of the report he wrote, "Our survey found nothing in these records that indicates any CIA role in the Kennedy assassination or assassination conspiracy (if there was one), or any CIA involvement with Oswald. These records do reveal, however, that Clay Shaw was a highly paid CIA contract source until 1956. While nothing surfaced on Carlos Marcello in the collection, we found substantial documentation on other members of the mob, including Santos [sic] Trafficante." [emphasis added by T. Graves]

http://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=7302&search=shaw#relPageId=3&tab=page

Thoughts, anyone? Interesting "segue" from Clay Shaw to Carlos Marcello and the mob. LOL

What's a "contract source," anyway? A paid informant who is kept "on retainder"?

--Tommy

Tommy, I would see it not so much as a segue but addressing the issue of Blakey's main suspect - Marcello. What is interesting is that while stating they see [no] evidence of any CIA involvement in Kennedy's death, it does admit Clay's connection to the CIA, as well as mentioning the substantial documentation on Trafficante and other mob figures - I'm betting all of whom were used by the CIA in anti-Castro operations.

A contract source would be a paid asset/agent contracted to collect and provide data on specified areas of interest during their travels.

Thanks, Greg.

So Shaw may have perjured himself when he said he had never worked for the CIA.

--Tommy

Morally yeah... technically, maybe not.

The strict test of an employee/employer relationship comes down to if they take out any deductions from pay, direct you in hours worked, how you do your work, where you do your work and other things of a similar nature.

This type of test however, is usually reserved to determine your tax (and in some counties your social security) status. The term "contract source" would get him off the hook as not being an employee - a fine distinction - but maybe just enough wiggle room.

Yeah, I know, Greg. It depends on whether the word "work" is defined narrowly or broadly. Shaw obviously answered it in the narrow sense.

--Tommy

Edited August 16, 2015 by Thomas Graves

[Brian Schmidt]

One has to be skeptical about any kind of classification used by the CIA, which was often used to skirt official employee or contract employee status and thus hide the true nature of the relationship.

While it's true that the CIA used thousands of businessmen in this capacity in the 50's, the fact that he was a "high paid" contract source makes me think he was involved with something more directed. The fact that this relationship ended in 1956 makes me more suspicious, not less, of his later activities.

For example, when E. Howard Hunt's real name was accidentally published as the author of his spy novels (he was using a pseudonym), he "resigned" the CIA so that he had no official CIA or government employment, but was paid as a contract agent, reporting only to Thomas Karamessines. This illustrates how cautious and proactive the Agency was, even with a relatively minor problem. One can imagine the precautions they would take with something more sensitive. As Allen Dulles said to the Warren Commission, it was possible for the CIA to employ someone for a sensitive operation with no paper trail.

[Greg Parker]

One has to be skeptical about any kind of classification used by the CIA, which was often used to skirt official employee or contract employee status and thus hide the true nature of the relationship.

While it's true that the CIA used thousands of businessmen in this capacity in the 50's, the fact that he was a "high paid" contract source makes me think he was involved with something more directed. The fact that this relationship ended in 1956 makes me more suspicious, not less, of his later activities.

For example, when E. Howard Hunt's real name was accidentally published as the author of his spy novels (he was using a pseudonym), he "resigned" the CIA so that he had no official CIA or government employment, but was paid as a contract agent, reporting only to Thomas Karamessines. This illustrates how cautious and proactive the Agency was, even with a relatively minor problem. One can imagine the precautions they would take with something more sensitive. As Allen Dulles said to the Warren Commission, it was possible for the CIA to employ someone for a sensitive operation with no paper trail.

Absolutely. The CIA connections to the Trade Mart and International House go way back.

[Larry Hancock]

Given the Agency mandate for intelligence collection it would have been strange not for them to be looking for informants and actual collections agents among all the international trade marts and business centers. That would have to be considered SOP. Same goes for employees of such operations doing overseas travel....which Shaw did.

[Thomas Graves]

Given the Agency mandate for intelligence collection it would have been strange not for them to be looking for informants and actual collections agents among all the international trade marts and business centers. That would have to be considered SOP. Same goes for employees of such operations doing overseas travel....which Shaw did.

Larry,

Collections agents?

--Tommy

[Larry Hancock]

Probably should have used more words there.....the word "collections" is sometimes used to describe simply picking up information on intelligence targets from "open sources", that includes published materials, media, and of course just talking with people either from overseas, especially if they are military, scientists, business persons, academics, etc. Outside the spy novels, much non military, real world intelligence covers foreign political activities, business trends, and a host of routine demographics information. Which is why international business people are good sources to gather and report such information. Its not national security type stuff but goes into the general mix of assessments, its part of the grist for the CIA's world books describing foreign nations. Take a look at the Senate Intelligence Committee's reports and see what comes up listed as "foreign topics of interest" and you find - which was a surprise to me - a range of topics far beyond those of a foreign military and security nature.

So, that was probably too many words, but it just makes sense to have Shaw as an open source collections agents due to his ongoing contacts with international business people and his foreign travels.

[James DiEugenio]

deleted

Edited August 21, 2015 by James DiEugenio

[James DiEugenio]

Take a look at the 7:39 mark. How Shaw refers to the patsy.

Priceless.

Edited August 21, 2015 by James DiEugenio