Tom Wilson and the Storm Drains

[Gil Jesus]

Scene from "The Men Who Killed Kennedy". Researcher Tom Wilson reveals his research that says that President Kennedy was shot from the storm drains in front of the limo as it travelled west on Elm St.

Was this the reason why they made last minute changes to the motorcade at Love Field ?

Could this be the reason why the motorcycle escort was moved from the side to the rear of the limo and why those motorcycle officers were told to hold their position, "no matter what happened" ?

Could this be the reason why the general was removed from the limo's front seat ?

Why Admiral Burkley was moved further back in the motorcade ?

Why no flatbed truck was provided for the press to film the motorcade from the front ? In the whole state of Texas, they couldn't find a flatbed or stake body truck ?

Was this the reason why witnesses reported smelling gunpowder at street level ?

Why Bill Greer slowed the limo down once he saw the President had been hit in the throat ?

And why some witnesses said that the gunshots sounded like they came from inside the car ?

Suddenly, it all begins to make sense.

This was an ambush and the last minute changes to the motorcade indicate that the Secret Service knew the positions of the shooters, made last-minute adjustments in accordance with that, and was complicit in the assassination of the President.

 

 

Edited September 14, 2023 by Gil Jesus

[Gil Jesus]

Corroboration for Tom Wilson's theory comes from witness Sam Pate of KBOX radio who stated in this 1970 interview that he saw a puff of smoke coming out of "the gutter" and others had told him that the shot that killed the President had come from there.

 

 

Edited September 14, 2023 by Gil Jesus

[Greg Doudna]

Jefferson Morley was emphatic in rejecting the idea of a storm drain shooter, but the reason he gave--that a storm drain shooter could not have shot over the top of the windshield--seems flawed. The shot would come into the right side of the limousine by direct line to the right of the windshield (from point of view of occupants in the limousine) and not hit the windshield at all. I don't think a shooter from the storm drain is obviously farcical, provided it is post-Z312 and the shot was a throat entrance and near-EOP exit (the only shot it could be and work from the storm drain), for the reasons argued by Pat Speer for that bullet path apart from Pat has it in the opposite direction. The smell of gunsmoke near the limousine, what Sam Pate saw, suggest a storm drain shot and it seems to me it should not be ruled out unless it can be ruled out, on grounds other than this over-the-windshield illusory objection. Also, the storm drain shooter should be disassociated from theories of crawling through drains to escape. The simplest explanation is entrance and exit was made through the manhole cover on top, with the only issue being specific logistics of how and when accomplished. It would be one thing if there were any reports of officers checking that storm drain for occupancy by a human being following the shots, but I have never heard any. It remains therefore a non-excluded possibility until it is shown excluded. I agree that a pre-Z312 and I believe also a Z-312 storm drain shot is excluded which means the Z312 head shot is excluded.  

Morley's three comparative examples cited indeed are farcical, but a storm drain shooter post-Z312 is not obviously in the same class unless it is shown excluded. Morley:

Was there a gun man in the sewer shooting at JFK?

No.This is one of the more enduring and farcical JFK theories. Researchers have checked out the sewers of Dealey Plaza and determined that a gunman would not have been able to fire over the windshield of the approaching presidential limousine. As far I can tell no living serious JFK researcher believes in this hoax.

The gunman in the sewer is like the “Secret Service man did it” and “George H.W. Bush did it”and “the Federal Reserve did it.” It’s fiction.

(https://jfkfacts.org/gun-man-sewer-shooting-jfk/ )

 

[Gil Jesus]

53 minutes ago, Greg Doudna said:

Jefferson Morley was emphatic in rejecting the idea of a storm drain shooter, but the reason he gave--that a storm drain shooter could not have shot over the top of the windshield--seems flawed. The shot would come into the right side of the limousine by direct line to the right of the windshield (from point of view of occupants in the limousine) and not hit the windshield at all. I don't think a shooter from the storm drain is obviously farcical, provided it is post-Z312 and the shot was a throat entrance and near-EOP exit (the only shot it could be and work from the storm drain), for the reasons argued by Pat Speer for that bullet path apart from Pat has it in the opposite direction. The smell of gunsmoke near the limousine, what Sam Pate saw, suggest a storm drain shot and it seems to me it should not be ruled out unless it can be ruled out, on grounds other than this over-the-windshield illusory objection. Also, the storm drain shooter should be disassociated from theories of crawling through drains to escape. The simplest explanation is entrance and exit was made through the manhole cover on top, with the only issue being specific logistics of how and when accomplished. It would be one thing if there were any reports of officers checking that storm drain for occupancy by a human being following the shots, but I have never heard any. It remains therefore a non-excluded possibility until it is shown excluded. I agree that a pre-Z312 and I believe also a Z-312 storm drain shot is excluded which means the Z312 head shot is excluded.  

Morley's three comparative examples cited indeed are farcical, but a storm drain shooter post-Z312 is not obviously in the same class unless it is shown excluded. Morley:

Was there a gun man in the sewer shooting at JFK?

No.This is one of the more enduring and farcical JFK theories. Researchers have checked out the sewers of Dealey Plaza and determined that a gunman would not have been able to fire over the windshield of the approaching presidential limousine. As far I can tell no living serious JFK researcher believes in this hoax.

The gunman in the sewer is like the “Secret Service man did it” and “George H.W. Bush did it”and “the Federal Reserve did it.” It’s fiction.

(https://jfkfacts.org/gun-man-sewer-shooting-jfk/ )

 

I believe there were shooters in both storm drains. I find this video depicting the first shot as coming from the drain on the south side of Elm particularly interesting. Coming down Elm St., that storm drain is right in the middle of the car.

 

I'm not sure about escaping through the tunnels, I'm more of the thought that they would sit still in there till dark.

I believe the first shot was fired from the south drain and the head shot was fired from the north drain.

I've seen one photo taken after the assassination that showed a Dallas Police car parked right over the storm drain on the north side of Elm. There wasn't going to be anyone checking out that storm drain. 

I disagree with Morley because of the last-minute changes made to the motorcade by the Secret Service at Love Field.

IMO, these changes indicate Secret Service complicity in the assassination of the President.

 

They reduced the number of outriders from 8 ( 4 on each side ) to 4 and moved the limo's motorcycle escort from the side to the rear of the limo and told those motorcyle officers to hold their position, "no matter what happened".

They removed the general from the limo's front seat.

They moved Admiral Burkley further back in the motorcade.

No flatbed truck was provided for the press to film the motorcade from the front. 

Witnesses reported smelling gunpowder at street level.

Bill Greer slowed the limo down once the shooting started and he saw the President had been hit in the throat.

He didn't speed up until he saw Kennedy's head explode.

Some witnesses said that the gunshots sounded like they came from inside the car ?

Why not the storm drains ?  They were point-blank.

Suddenly, it all begins to make sense.

They moved police officers and military people out of the line of fire prior to the start of the motorcade.

And that's just too much of a coincidence for me.

IMO, This was an ambush and the last minute changes to the motorcade indicate that the Secret Service knew the positions of the shooters, that the shots would be fired from in front and to the side, and made last-minute adjustments in accordance with that.

[Jonathan Cohen]

My goodness. This nonsense again? This preposterous theory has been debunked for years. And as for putting any faith whatsoever in Tom Wilson's alleged photo processing, the fact that his work never was and never can be properly peer reviewed should say everything one needs to know.

[Michael Griffith]

I have always summarily dismissed the idea of shots from the storm drains. However, Gil's and Greg's posts provide some interesting food for thought and make the idea of storm-drain shots seem less dubious to me. 

[Nick Bartetzko]

I have always thought the storm drain by the stairs was the probable source of the temple shot for the reasons just listed. Couple that with the brain/bone tissue disbursement .... bone fragment in the Queen Mary per Sam Kinney.... and the physical movement of the body and description of the sound by a couple of witnesses and it just seems that location makes the most sense. This storm drain theory was investigated by a guy named Jack Brazil years ago. Iirc, he crawled through the drain which emptied into the Trinity River. There were pics showing all this. I gave the Brazil written materials to a guy here named Dean Hagerman who lived on the west coast. Found out later that wasn't his actual name. 

In my opinion, shots from the GK were diversionary only and likely what the Hartmans saw and described. 

Edited September 16, 2023 by Nick Bartetzko