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The Thresher Incident


Wade Rhodes
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DATE 9-23-66

TO: DIRECTOR FBI

FROM: SAC SEATTLE (89-47)

Subject: PPRESIDENTS COMMISSION ON

THE ASSASSINATION OF PRESIDENT KENNEDY

There is attached a pamphlet entitled "The Warren Report Is A Hoax,"

which has been recieved in the Seattle Division in an envelope postmarked

Coos Bay, Oregon, with the return address Box 652 Empire, Oregon, on it.

The identity of the sender is not known. Therefore the letter has not been

acknowledged.

Since undoubtedly, this pamphlet has been widely circulated, it is

presumed the Bureau is aware of the source already.

THE WARREN REPORT IS A HOAX

five members of the organization known as JFCOTT

(Justice for crew of the Thresher) planned and carried out the Dallas tragedy.

Les and Joe were in the Texas Building, Art and Orville were on the overpass

of the causeway. There leader was a man known as H. C. Hill. He was outside

the Texas Building and directed the operation and escape by means of

shortwave radio. Lee Harvey Oswald was setup as "A Patsy" by Hill. Two and

ONLY two shots were fired from the Texas Building.

In August of 1963, over three months prior to the tragedy Naval Officials,

Postal Authorities and others knew that the organization was in Dallas, Texas

making plans to assassinate the former Secretary of Navy Gov. John Connally.

They knew that this group of men had vowed to secure justice in their own way

for the I29 youngf Americans who were aboard the Sub Thresher.

Members of JFCOTT were aware of the fact that Naval Officials, U. S. Senator

Richard B. Russell, Chairman of the Senate Armed Services Committee and

others had been warned that Navy was going to lose a "N" sub because

fradulent pressure/depth tests had been used on equipment built for Subs of the

Thresher class.

Naval officials and others have made an all out effort to suppress this evidence.

This court filed Evidence Excluded From The Warren Report is being made

available to the American people. Five thousand volumes will soon roll off the

presses. You can reserve your copy by mailing your check or money order

for $I0.00 to :

Evidence

P.O. Box 652

Empire, Oregon

http://www.maryferre...0&relPageId=171

I have never seen any documents related to the Thresher incident that were this detailed, or is it just me?

PS There was one thing that i wanted to point out, and I am not sure whether or not

it is significant but when the reproduction of the pamphlet begins, one could draw the conclusion

that a portion was possibly not included, but that is purely speculative.

For anyone wondering there are no shortage of Hill's in the Warren Report.

HILL, BETH -----

Sources: CE 1578; CD 86, p. 442

Mary's

Comments: -----

HILL, BILLY -----

Sources: Dallas Morning News, Thursday, November 9, 2000

Mary's

Comments: Son of Jean Hill; attorney; was married to Nolanda Hill, "friend" of Ron Brown, Clinton's Secretary of Commerce.

HILL, CLINTON J.

Sources: Warren Report, 21-22, 6064, 66, 71, 109, 429; WC Vol 2, p. 138; CD 205, p. 25; CD 821; CD 1095; Rush to Judgment, Lane, 57, 64, 66; Whitewash I, Weisberg, 34, 328; Witnesses, 40; Ambassador's Journal, Galbraith, 588

Mary's

Comments: Secret Service Agent. Riding on left front running board of President's follow-up car. Witnessed assassination. Was advance man for Jackie Kennedy's March 1962 trip to India.

HILL, COLEMAN -----

Sources: CD 7, p. 646

Mary's

Comments: Manager of apartment building at 114 Plant, Tampa.

HILL, G. R.

Sources: CE 1999 (?); CD 1444 (?); Oswald Talked, LaFontaines, p. 392

Mary's

Comments: Re: Oswald in jail?

HILL, GERALD LYNN (SGT. DPD) (JERRY)

Sources: Warren Report, 111, 167; WC Vol 22, pp. 920-921; WC Vol 23, p. 39; CE 2160; CD 7, p. 224; Hill Exhibits; CD 205, pp. 206-207; CD 1191, pp. 86-88; CD 1210, p. 3; CD 1395, pp. 2, ii; CD 1405; Whitewash I, Weisberg, 123-128, 159, 189; Rush to Judgment, Lane, 135, 197; Dallas Morning News, Fri, Jan 25, 1974

Mary's

Comments: Born in Ferris, TX. Wife: Bobbye J. Dallas Police Sergeant. Was at TSBD and found hulls on 6th floor. Was at Texas Theater when LHO arrested. In Jan 1974, "...Hill was removed Thursday as commander of Bexar Street station's 34-member investigative unit... It was latest in a series of moves down the ladder for the 44-yr-old officer."

HILL, GLADWIN -----

Sources: CE 1757; CD 85, pp. 416-418; Oswald: Assassin or Fall Guy, Joesten, 58, 63-64

Mary's

Comments: New York Times reporter.

HILL, HERMAN -----

Sources: WC Vol 25, p. 506; CE 2415; CD 1215

Mary's

Comments: Property Room supervisor for Dallas Police. Hill and FBI Special Agent Manning Clements examined property taken from Jack Ruby.

HILL, JAMES T.

Sources: CE 2925; CD 205, p. 114

Mary's

Comments: 1963 Chevrolet with 1963 Texas license No. PU 7862 registered to him.

HILL, JEAN LOLLIS (MRS.)

Sources: WC Vol 6, p. 207; CE 2003, p. 212; CE 2582; CE 2594; Decker Exh. 5323, p. 479; Hill Exhibit; Dallas Times Herald, 11/22/63, pp. 17, 19; Dallas Times Herald, 11/23/63 p. 8; CD 711; CD 897, pp. 43-45, 47-48; Whitewash I, Weisberg, 96, 278; Rush to Judgment, Lane, 41, 262, 285, 345, 389; Inquest, Epstein, 70; Oswald: Assassin or Fall Guy, Joesten, 173, 176, 182; Dallas Morning News, Thursday, Nov. 9, 2000, pg. 35A

Mary's

Comments: School teacher. Witnessed assassination with Mary Moorman. Died Tuesday, Nov. 7, 2000, at 8:30 am at Parkland Hospital as result of massive heart attack. Survived by son, Billy Hill (an attorney who lives in Dallas and Cincinnati, Ohio) and daughter, Jeanne Poorman of Wilmett, Illinois. Jeanne's husband is attorney for man who owns Hyatt hotel chain. Poorman had been attorney with Johnson, Swanson firm in Dallas. Jean Hill also survived by mother: Irene Turner of Ft. Worth; two sisters: Wanda Jacobs of Ft. Worth, and ramona Boback of Hagerstown, MD; and six grandchildren.

Record: HILL, JOHN HENRY

Sources: CD 7, pp. 572, 575

Mary's

Comments: -----

HILL & MARTIN, ICE & COLD STORAGE -----

Sources: WC Vol 25, pp. 265, 269

Mary's Comments: Bruce Carlin called that number 10/21/63.

HILL, GERALD LYNN (SGT. DPD) (JERRY)

Sources: Warren Report, 111, 167; WC Vol 22, pp. 920-921; WC Vol 23, p. 39; CE 2160; CD 7, p. 224; Hill Exhibits; CD 205, pp. 206-207; CD 1191, pp. 86-88; CD 1210, p. 3; CD 1395, pp. 2, ii; CD 1405; Whitewash I, Weisberg, 123-128, 159, 189; Rush to Judgment, Lane, 135, 197; Dallas Morning News, Fri, Jan 25, 1974

Mary's Comments: Born in Ferris, TX. Wife: Bobbye J. Dallas Police Sergeant. Was at TSBD and found hulls on 6th floor. Was at Texas Theater when LHO arrested. In Jan 1974, "...Hill was removed Thursday as commander of Bexar Street station's 34-member investigative unit... It was latest in a series of moves down the ladder for the 44-yr-old officer."

HILL, JAMES T.

Sources: CE 2925; CD 205, p. 114

Mary's Comments: 1963 Chevrolet with 1963 Texas license No. PU 7862 registered to him.

Record: HILL, JO BETH

Sources: CD 7, p. 575

Mary's

Comments: -----

HILL, L. L.

Sources: Who Killed Kennedy, Buchanan, 94; Whitewash I, Weisberg, 283

Mary's

Comments: Dallas Police Department officer. Radio #22. Reports at Continental and Industrial at 12:48 p.m.

HILL, THOMAS

More on Thomas Hill

There are 4 NARA Docs on Thomas Hill

So far, I have only been able to find one on Mary Ferrell's Website

It is a 3-8-1960 LHM to J. Edgar Hoover from the Dallas SAC of the FBI.

The document subject is Robert Welch Jr., and Hill is mentioned.

The document states "On 2-23-60, Mr. Thomas Hill 609 Lawson Road, Garland, Texas advised SA James Hosty, Jr., that on the previous evening he had attended a meeting at the home of some friends of his. This meeting was presided over by an individual also named Thomas Hill, reportedly from Dallas, who stated that he was a full-time paid coordinator for Robert H Welch, Jr., in organizing the "John Birch Society." Mr. Hill stated that he had four part-time volunteer helpers and that the John Birch Society is now organized in fifteen states. Mr. Hill the paid organizer, told the Texas assembled group that he had previously attended Southern Methodist University (SMU), however, quit SMU because he considered it Communist controlled, and that it was after this that he went to work for Robert Welch, Jr. This meeting consisted of playing four thirty-minute tapes setting forth the aims and purposes of the John Birch Society, which is allegedly anti-Communist in nature. Mr. Hill, the complainant in this matter, stated that it appeared to him that the John Birch Society considers anyone even slightly liberal to be a Communist and he does not believe any of the individuals present at this meeting will join the John Birch Society. It appears they wish to organize the John Birch Society into groups of eight to ten persons who will meet in residences, the main purpose being to organize as many persons as possible to pressure Congress to enact what they allege to be anti-Communist......

HILL, RALPH -----

Sources: Interim Report on Assassinations, p. 329

Mary's

Comments: FBI Special Agent in charge of the investigation of Giancana.

HILL, SEABORN WILLIAM

Sources: WC Vol 22, p. 882

Mary's

Comments: Musician with Joe Johnson's band.

HILL'S LIQUOR STORE, ----- -----

Sources: CD 84, pp. 91-92

Mary's

Comments: Re: Joe Civello and Jack Ruby. Mark on LHO's Enco map at Boll and San Jacinto (one block away).

END

Robert, I don't know if this is our man "H. C. Hill," but he certainly looks interesting. - BK

HILL, THOMAS

More on Thomas Hill

There are 4 NARA Docs on Thomas Hill

So far, I have only been able to find one on Mary Ferrell's Website

It is a 3-8-1960 LHM to J. Edgar Hoover from the Dallas SAC of the FBI.

The document subject is Robert Welch Jr., and Hill is mentioned.

The document states "On 2-23-60, Mr. Thomas Hill 609 Lawson Road, Garland, Texas advised SA James Hosty, Jr., that on the previous evening he had attended a meeting at the home of some friends of his. This meeting was presided over by an individual also named Thomas Hill, reportedly from Dallas, who stated that he was a full-time paid coordinator for Robert H Welch, Jr., in organizing the "John Birch Society." Mr. Hill stated that he had four part-time volunteer helpers and that the John Birch Society is now organized in fifteen states. Mr. Hill the paid organizer, told the Texas assembled group that he had previously attended Southern Methodist University (SMU), however, quit SMU because he considered it Communist controlled, and that it was after this that he went to work for Robert Welch, Jr. This meeting consisted of playing four thirty-minute tapes setting forth the aims and purposes of the John Birch Society, which is allegedly anti-Communist in nature. Mr. Hill, the complainant in this matter, stated that it appeared to him that the John Birch Society considers anyone even slightly liberal to be a Communist and he does not believe any of the individuals present at this meeting will join the John Birch Society. It appears they wish to organize the John Birch Society into groups of eight to ten persons who will meet in residences, the main purpose being to organize as many persons as possible to pressure Congress to enact what they allege to be anti-Communist......

I believe out of all of the listings Hill & Martin Ice Cold Storage, is the most compelling Thomas Hill is certainly right up there.

I have also discovered a significant amount of Bray's who lived in Dallas, then there is the man himself.........

Not H.C. Hill mind you, but I know the associations jumped out at me, perhaps they will you as well.

Who Was John Birch?

On Aug. 25, 1945, ten days after the end of World War II, a slender, 27-year-old captain in the Army Air Forces named John Birch was kitted in China by a band of Communists. Sixteen years later, John Birch lives on as the rallying symbol of the archconservative, anti-Communist John Birch Society. Yet Birch himself remains a shadowy figure. Who was he? How did he live? And how did he die?

JOHN BIRCH was born in Landour, India, to a husband-and-wife team of missionaries. When John was two years old, his family returned to the U.S., and he was raised in New Jersey and Georgia. In 1939 Birch graduated from Georgia's Baptist-controlled Mercer University as the top man in his class, leaving behind him a record that is still recalled. "He was always an angry young man, always a zealot," says a classmate. "He felt he was called to defend the faith, and he alone knew what it was." Says a psychology professor: "He was like a one-way valve: everything coming out and no room to take anything in."

In his senior year. Birch organized a secret "Fellowship Group" and set out to suppress a mildly liberal trend at Mercer. He and twelve colleagues collected examples of "heresy" uttered by faculty members (example: a reference to evolution), whipped up support among Georgia's Baptist clergy, finally forced the school to try five men on the charge. Mercer eventually dismissed the cases, but not before admonishing 75-year-old Dr. John D. Freeman, a world-famous Baptist leader, for using a theologically "unsound" textbook. That summer Dr. Freeman quietly retired from Mercer. Says a professor: "It broke him."

Birch went to China as a missionary in 1940, and was caught there by Pearl Harbor. In 1942, as he was trying to find a way to enlist, the war literally dropped in on him. He was taken one night by a native to a man who had fallen out of the sky. The fallen: Lieut. Colonel Jimmy Doolittle. Birch led Doolittle and a group of the survivors of the Tokyo raid to safety, then joined the unit that later became General Claire Chennault's Fourteenth Air Force and began a remarkable career in air combat intelligence. Wrote Chennault later: "Birch was the pioneer of our field-intelligence net."

Traveling up to 100 miles behind enemy lines, Birch radioed back word on prime Japanese targets. He directed the building of three airstrips within enemy territory. For his work, Birch was awarded the Legion of Merit, got a posthumous Oak Leaf Cluster for "exceptionally meritorious service."

Birch was eventually transferred to the Office of Strategic Services and was assigned late in the war to a tiny, scorpion-infested base at Sian in North China. Baptist Birch is remembered as a loner with a somewhat overbearing manner. In his diary, Major Gustav Krause, commanding officer of the base, gravely noted: "Birch is a good officer, but I'm afraid is too brash and may run into trouble."

When the Japanese surrendered, Birch led a routine mission to discover how far south the Chinese Communists had penetrated. His group bumped into a Chinese Communist force. As the scene has been reconstructed, Birch argued violently with the Communist officer who wanted to disarm him. Birch was seized and shot after his hands had been tied. The Communists then bayoneted him at least 15 times and tossed his body on a heap of junk and garbage.

"In the confusing situation," said Krause last week, "my instructions were to act with diplomacy. Birch made the Communist lieutenant lose face before his own men. Militarily, John Birch brought about his own death."

Thus, in his lifetime, John Birch was a legitimate hero. But in both his life and his death he was almost as controversial as the organization that has been named after him.

http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,872243-2,00.html

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DATE 9-23-66

TO: DIRECTOR FBI

FROM: SAC SEATTLE (89-47)

Subject: PPRESIDENTS COMMISSION ON

THE ASSASSINATION OF PRESIDENT KENNEDY

There is attached a pamphlet entitled "The Warren Report Is A Hoax,"

which has been recieved in the Seattle Division in an envelope postmarked

Coos Bay, Oregon, with the return address Box 652 Empire, Oregon, on it.

The identity of the sender is not known. Therefore the letter has not been

acknowledged.

Since undoubtedly, this pamphlet has been widely circulated, it is

presumed the Bureau is aware of the source already.

THE WARREN REPORT IS A HOAX

five members of the organization known as JFCOTT

(Justice for crew of the Thresher) planned and carried out the Dallas tragedy.

Les and Joe were in the Texas Building, Art and Orville were on the overpass

of the causeway. There leader was a man known as H. C. Hill. He was outside

the Texas Building and directed the operation and escape by means of

shortwave radio. Lee Harvey Oswald was setup as "A Patsy" by Hill. Two and

ONLY two shots were fired from the Texas Building.

In August of 1963, over three months prior to the tragedy Naval Officials,

Postal Authorities and others knew that the organization was in Dallas, Texas

making plans to assassinate the former Secretary of Navy Gov. John Connally.

They knew that this group of men had vowed to secure justice in their own way

for the I29 young Americans who were aboard the Sub Thresher.

Members of JFCOTT were aware of the fact that Naval Officials, U. S. Senator

Richard B. Russell, Chairman of the Senate Armed Services Committee and

others had been warned that Navy was going to lose a "N" sub because

fradulent pressure/depth tests had been used on equipment built for Subs of the

Thresher class.

Naval officials and others have made an all out effort to suppress this evidence.

This court filed Evidence Excluded From The Warren Report is being made

available to the American people. Five thousand volumes will soon roll off the

presses. You can reserve your copy by mailing your check or money order

for $I0.00 to :

Evidence

P.O. Box 652

Empire, Oregon

http://www.maryferre...0&relPageId=171

I have never seen any documents related to the Thresher incident that were this detailed, or is it just me?

PS There was one thing that i wanted to point out, and I am not sure whether or not

it is significant but when the reproduction of the pamphlet begins, one could draw the conclusion

that a portion was possibly not included, but that is purely speculative.

For anyone wondering there are no shortage of Hill's in the Warren Report.

HILL, BETH -----

Sources: CE 1578; CD 86, p. 442

Mary's

Comments: -----

HILL, BILLY -----

Sources: Dallas Morning News, Thursday, November 9, 2000

Mary's

Comments: Son of Jean Hill; attorney; was married to Nolanda Hill, "friend" of Ron Brown, Clinton's Secretary of Commerce.

HILL, CLINTON J.

Sources: Warren Report, 21-22, 6064, 66, 71, 109, 429; WC Vol 2, p. 138; CD 205, p. 25; CD 821; CD 1095; Rush to Judgment, Lane, 57, 64, 66; Whitewash I, Weisberg, 34, 328; Witnesses, 40; Ambassador's Journal, Galbraith, 588

Mary's

Comments: Secret Service Agent. Riding on left front running board of President's follow-up car. Witnessed assassination. Was advance man for Jackie Kennedy's March 1962 trip to India.

HILL, COLEMAN -----

Sources: CD 7, p. 646

Mary's

Comments: Manager of apartment building at 114 Plant, Tampa.

HILL, G. R.

Sources: CE 1999 (?); CD 1444 (?); Oswald Talked, LaFontaines, p. 392

Mary's

Comments: Re: Oswald in jail?

HILL, GERALD LYNN (SGT. DPD) (JERRY)

Sources: Warren Report, 111, 167; WC Vol 22, pp. 920-921; WC Vol 23, p. 39; CE 2160; CD 7, p. 224; Hill Exhibits; CD 205, pp. 206-207; CD 1191, pp. 86-88; CD 1210, p. 3; CD 1395, pp. 2, ii; CD 1405; Whitewash I, Weisberg, 123-128, 159, 189; Rush to Judgment, Lane, 135, 197; Dallas Morning News, Fri, Jan 25, 1974

Mary's

Comments: Born in Ferris, TX. Wife: Bobbye J. Dallas Police Sergeant. Was at TSBD and found hulls on 6th floor. Was at Texas Theater when LHO arrested. In Jan 1974, "...Hill was removed Thursday as commander of Bexar Street station's 34-member investigative unit... It was latest in a series of moves down the ladder for the 44-yr-old officer."

HILL, GLADWIN -----

Sources: CE 1757; CD 85, pp. 416-418; Oswald: Assassin or Fall Guy, Joesten, 58, 63-64

Mary's

Comments: New York Times reporter.

HILL, HERMAN -----

Sources: WC Vol 25, p. 506; CE 2415; CD 1215

Mary's

Comments: Property Room supervisor for Dallas Police. Hill and FBI Special Agent Manning Clements examined property taken from Jack Ruby.

HILL, JAMES T.

Sources: CE 2925; CD 205, p. 114

Mary's

Comments: 1963 Chevrolet with 1963 Texas license No. PU 7862 registered to him.

HILL, JEAN LOLLIS (MRS.)

Sources: WC Vol 6, p. 207; CE 2003, p. 212; CE 2582; CE 2594; Decker Exh. 5323, p. 479; Hill Exhibit; Dallas Times Herald, 11/22/63, pp. 17, 19; Dallas Times Herald, 11/23/63 p. 8; CD 711; CD 897, pp. 43-45, 47-48; Whitewash I, Weisberg, 96, 278; Rush to Judgment, Lane, 41, 262, 285, 345, 389; Inquest, Epstein, 70; Oswald: Assassin or Fall Guy, Joesten, 173, 176, 182; Dallas Morning News, Thursday, Nov. 9, 2000, pg. 35A

Mary's

Comments: School teacher. Witnessed assassination with Mary Moorman. Died Tuesday, Nov. 7, 2000, at 8:30 am at Parkland Hospital as result of massive heart attack. Survived by son, Billy Hill (an attorney who lives in Dallas and Cincinnati, Ohio) and daughter, Jeanne Poorman of Wilmett, Illinois. Jeanne's husband is attorney for man who owns Hyatt hotel chain. Poorman had been attorney with Johnson, Swanson firm in Dallas. Jean Hill also survived by mother: Irene Turner of Ft. Worth; two sisters: Wanda Jacobs of Ft. Worth, and ramona Boback of Hagerstown, MD; and six grandchildren.

Record: HILL, JOHN HENRY

Sources: CD 7, pp. 572, 575

Mary's

Comments: -----

HILL & MARTIN, ICE & COLD STORAGE -----

Sources: WC Vol 25, pp. 265, 269

Mary's Comments: Bruce Carlin called that number 10/21/63.

HILL, GERALD LYNN (SGT. DPD) (JERRY)

Sources: Warren Report, 111, 167; WC Vol 22, pp. 920-921; WC Vol 23, p. 39; CE 2160; CD 7, p. 224; Hill Exhibits; CD 205, pp. 206-207; CD 1191, pp. 86-88; CD 1210, p. 3; CD 1395, pp. 2, ii; CD 1405; Whitewash I, Weisberg, 123-128, 159, 189; Rush to Judgment, Lane, 135, 197; Dallas Morning News, Fri, Jan 25, 1974

Mary's Comments: Born in Ferris, TX. Wife: Bobbye J. Dallas Police Sergeant. Was at TSBD and found hulls on 6th floor. Was at Texas Theater when LHO arrested. In Jan 1974, "...Hill was removed Thursday as commander of Bexar Street station's 34-member investigative unit... It was latest in a series of moves down the ladder for the 44-yr-old officer."

HILL, JAMES T.

Sources: CE 2925; CD 205, p. 114

Mary's Comments: 1963 Chevrolet with 1963 Texas license No. PU 7862 registered to him.

Record: HILL, JO BETH

Sources: CD 7, p. 575

Mary's

Comments: -----

HILL, L. L.

Sources: Who Killed Kennedy, Buchanan, 94; Whitewash I, Weisberg, 283

Mary's

Comments: Dallas Police Department officer. Radio #22. Reports at Continental and Industrial at 12:48 p.m.

HILL, THOMAS

More on Thomas Hill

There are 4 NARA Docs on Thomas Hill

So far, I have only been able to find one on Mary Ferrell's Website

It is a 3-8-1960 LHM to J. Edgar Hoover from the Dallas SAC of the FBI.

The document subject is Robert Welch Jr., and Hill is mentioned.

The document states "On 2-23-60, Mr. Thomas Hill 609 Lawson Road, Garland, Texas advised SA James Hosty, Jr., that on the previous evening he had attended a meeting at the home of some friends of his. This meeting was presided over by an individual also named Thomas Hill, reportedly from Dallas, who stated that he was a full-time paid coordinator for Robert H Welch, Jr., in organizing the "John Birch Society." Mr. Hill stated that he had four part-time volunteer helpers and that the John Birch Society is now organized in fifteen states. Mr. Hill the paid organizer, told the Texas assembled group that he had previously attended Southern Methodist University (SMU), however, quit SMU because he considered it Communist controlled, and that it was after this that he went to work for Robert Welch, Jr. This meeting consisted of playing four thirty-minute tapes setting forth the aims and purposes of the John Birch Society, which is allegedly anti-Communist in nature. Mr. Hill, the complainant in this matter, stated that it appeared to him that the John Birch Society considers anyone even slightly liberal to be a Communist and he does not believe any of the individuals present at this meeting will join the John Birch Society. It appears they wish to organize the John Birch Society into groups of eight to ten persons who will meet in residences, the main purpose being to organize as many persons as possible to pressure Congress to enact what they allege to be anti-Communist......

HILL, RALPH -----

Sources: Interim Report on Assassinations, p. 329

Mary's

Comments: FBI Special Agent in charge of the investigation of Giancana.

HILL, SEABORN WILLIAM

Sources: WC Vol 22, p. 882

Mary's

Comments: Musician with Joe Johnson's band.

HILL'S LIQUOR STORE, ----- -----

Sources: CD 84, pp. 91-92

Mary's

Comments: Re: Joe Civello and Jack Ruby. Mark on LHO's Enco map at Boll and San Jacinto (one block away).

END

Robert, I don't know if this is our man "H. C. Hill," but he certainly looks interesting. - BK

HILL, THOMAS

More on Thomas Hill

There are 4 NARA Docs on Thomas Hill

So far, I have only been able to find one on Mary Ferrell's Website

It is a 3-8-1960 LHM to J. Edgar Hoover from the Dallas SAC of the FBI.

The document subject is Robert Welch Jr., and Hill is mentioned.

The document states "On 2-23-60, Mr. Thomas Hill 609 Lawson Road, Garland, Texas advised SA James Hosty, Jr., that on the previous evening he had attended a meeting at the home of some friends of his. This meeting was presided over by an individual also named Thomas Hill, reportedly from Dallas, who stated that he was a full-time paid coordinator for Robert H Welch, Jr., in organizing the "John Birch Society." Mr. Hill stated that he had four part-time volunteer helpers and that the John Birch Society is now organized in fifteen states. Mr. Hill the paid organizer, told the Texas assembled group that he had previously attended Southern Methodist University (SMU), however, quit SMU because he considered it Communist controlled, and that it was after this that he went to work for Robert Welch, Jr. This meeting consisted of playing four thirty-minute tapes setting forth the aims and purposes of the John Birch Society, which is allegedly anti-Communist in nature. Mr. Hill, the complainant in this matter, stated that it appeared to him that the John Birch Society considers anyone even slightly liberal to be a Communist and he does not believe any of the individuals present at this meeting will join the John Birch Society. It appears they wish to organize the John Birch Society into groups of eight to ten persons who will meet in residences, the main purpose being to organize as many persons as possible to pressure Congress to enact what they allege to be anti-Communist......

I believe out of all of the listings Hill & Martin Ice Cold Storage, is the most compelling Thomas Hill is certainly right up there.

I have also discovered a significant amount of Bray's who lived in Dallas, then there is the man himself.........

Not H.C. Hill mind you, but I know the associations jumped out at me, perhaps they will you as well.

Who Was John Birch?

On Aug. 25, 1945, ten days after the end of World War II, a slender, 27-year-old captain in the Army Air Forces named John Birch was kitted in China by a band of Communists. Sixteen years later, John Birch lives on as the rallying symbol of the archconservative, anti-Communist John Birch Society. Yet Birch himself remains a shadowy figure. Who was he? How did he live? And how did he die?

JOHN BIRCH was born in Landour, India, to a husband-and-wife team of missionaries. When John was two years old, his family returned to the U.S., and he was raised in New Jersey and Georgia. In 1939 Birch graduated from Georgia's Baptist-controlled Mercer University as the top man in his class, leaving behind him a record that is still recalled. "He was always an angry young man, always a zealot," says a classmate. "He felt he was called to defend the faith, and he alone knew what it was." Says a psychology professor: "He was like a one-way valve: everything coming out and no room to take anything in."

In his senior year. Birch organized a secret "Fellowship Group" and set out to suppress a mildly liberal trend at Mercer. He and twelve colleagues collected examples of "heresy" uttered by faculty members (example: a reference to evolution), whipped up support among Georgia's Baptist clergy, finally forced the school to try five men on the charge. Mercer eventually dismissed the cases, but not before admonishing 75-year-old Dr. John D. Freeman, a world-famous Baptist leader, for using a theologically "unsound" textbook. That summer Dr. Freeman quietly retired from Mercer. Says a professor: "It broke him."

Birch went to China as a missionary in 1940, and was caught there by Pearl Harbor. In 1942, as he was trying to find a way to enlist, the war literally dropped in on him. He was taken one night by a native to a man who had fallen out of the sky. The fallen: Lieut. Colonel Jimmy Doolittle. Birch led Doolittle and a group of the survivors of the Tokyo raid to safety, then joined the unit that later became General Claire Chennault's Fourteenth Air Force and began a remarkable career in air combat intelligence. Wrote Chennault later: "Birch was the pioneer of our field-intelligence net."

Traveling up to 100 miles behind enemy lines, Birch radioed back word on prime Japanese targets. He directed the building of three airstrips within enemy territory. For his work, Birch was awarded the Legion of Merit, got a posthumous Oak Leaf Cluster for "exceptionally meritorious service."

Birch was eventually transferred to the Office of Strategic Services and was assigned late in the war to a tiny, scorpion-infested base at Sian in North China. Baptist Birch is remembered as a loner with a somewhat overbearing manner. In his diary, Major Gustav Krause, commanding officer of the base, gravely noted: "Birch is a good officer, but I'm afraid is too brash and may run into trouble."

When the Japanese surrendered, Birch led a routine mission to discover how far south the Chinese Communists had penetrated. His group bumped into a Chinese Communist force. As the scene has been reconstructed, Birch argued violently with the Communist officer who wanted to disarm him. Birch was seized and shot after his hands had been tied. The Communists then bayoneted him at least 15 times and tossed his body on a heap of junk and garbage.

"In the confusing situation," said Krause last week, "my instructions were to act with diplomacy. Birch made the Communist lieutenant lose face before his own men. Militarily, John Birch brought about his own death."

Thus, in his lifetime, John Birch was a legitimate hero. But in both his life and his death he was almost as controversial as the organization that has been named after him.

http://www.time.com/...72243-2,00.html

This post is for those who remember the earlier mention of the Bendix Corporation, a name that is referenced in the lawsuit

associated with Edward Bray, since court transcripts of those proceedings are not available to most, if not all of us, I have wanted

to discover something that might provide some contextualization of Bendix Corp's place in the 20th century world, within some type

of political framework......

The following is an excerpt from a book, in which Bendix is mentioned along with some other companies you just might

be familiar with......

Antitrust and the Formation of the Postwar World

Columbia Studies in Contemporary American History

by Wells, Wyatt C.

Publication: New York Columbia University Press, 2001.

Introduction In the wake of World War II, the United States

sought to impose its antitrust tradition on the rest of the world. Before the war, businesses operating across national borders

had lived with a basic contradiction: the laws of most industrial countries tolerated and even encouraged cartels, whereas

the statutes of the United States, the world's largest economy, banned them. Most cartels finessed the issue, making arrange-

ments with U.S. companies that ventured abroad, agreements that exploited loopholes in the American antitrust statutes.

Still, the potential for conflict always existed. Antitrust, which Supreme Court Justice Abe Fortas once described as a

"social religion........

END

excerpt page 104-105

Moreover, Byrnes pointed out that Dupont was deeply involved in the Atomic bomb project code-named S-1. Another

unsigned memo transmitted to Roosevelt reported that the head of the project, General Leslie Groves,"states work of

Dupont's executives is key to the success of S-1 and any diversion of their time would be disastrous."

Roosevelt finally resolved the matter in mid-June. He wrote to Lord Halifax, "It seems to me the Attorney General's

view is appropriate and I have accordingly so advised him." He did order Biddle to extend the deadline for filing the

answers to July 31, 1944 and permit the defendants to amend their answers later, if they so desired, which protected

the companies against a summary judgement. The motives for Roosevelt's decision are unclear. He may have agreed

with Biddle that by delaying the filing of an answer, the government would set a bad precedent.

He may have concluded that, with the success of the Normandy landing on June 6, the needs of mobilization

no longer overrode the antitrust laws. The positive public reaction to the announcement of the suit in January could

have convinced Roosevelt, a thoroughly political creature, that the case was good politics.

The President [FDR] may have seen the suit as a way to strike back at the Dupont's who had been particularly fierce

critics of him and the New Deal, or he may simply have concluded that after so many defeats, the anti-trust Division

deserved a victory.

In any event, although it caused an inconvenience, the preparation of answers does not seem to have particularly

hampered Dupont's or ICI's* contributions to the war effort.

President Roosevelt's decision had consequences far beyond the filing of a few documents in court. His show of support

heartened the Antitrust Division and made it clear that prosecutions would indeed resume after the war.

A few days after Roosevelt's decision in the ICI/Dupont case, Attorney General Biddle asked for permission to proceed

with trials in two other cases involving international cartels. The first concerned an agreement between ICI, Dupont

Rohm & Haas of Philadelphia and I.G. Farben governing the sale and production of certain plastics and the second

sought to overturn accord between Bendix and European firms involving the rights to various aviation aviation

instruments. Biddle insisted that in both suits the prosecution would need only a couple of weeks to present its case.

The attorney general argued that, in the plastics case, the war had not ended but had merely suspended agreements,

and these "would require that Rohm & Haas and DuPont withdraw and stay out of the important Latin American

market upon the termination of the war." It was necessary, therefore, to invalidate them as soon as possible. In the

Bendix case restrictions had actually continued in force during the war, although because the U.S. government

purchased the entire output of the aircraft industry they had little impact. Nevertheless Biddle wanted to act before

the end of hostilities to free "this industry now of artificial, uneconomic and unlawful limitations to in order to ensure

sufficient preparations for the postwar development of the aircraft industry in this country."

In both cases the President gave the Justice Department authority to proceed. The cases themselves were not that

important — in fact, the courts eventually decided against the Justice Department in the plastics suit — but they offered

more proof that the vigorous prosecution of cartels would proceed.

The Antitrust Division also went after the Webb-Pomerene corporations. These organizations, authorized by

congress in 1918, allowed American firms to cooperate in export markets. During the 1920's and the 1930's, US companies

had often negotiated with international cartels through Webb-Pomerene corporations, a practice that the Federal Trade

Commission, the regulator's of these organizations had tolerated.

In March 1944, however the Justice Department filed suit against the American Alkali Export Association.......

* Imperial Chemical Industries

END

But it was the following which really made me realize there is much more to Bendix than, at least I ever knew.

http://www.library.umass.edu/spcoll/ead/mums514.htm

Carl Oglesby Papers, 1942-2005

63 boxes (32.5 linear ft.)

An activist, writer, lecturer and teacher, Carl Oglesby has participated in, written about, and analyzed some of the most important events in the recent history of the United States. His experiences before, during and after the Vietnam War as a political activist changed the trajectory of his own life and contributed significantly to the American political discourse on many subjects such as Vietnam War, Watergate, World War II, and the assassinations of John F. Kennedy, Robert Kennedy, and Martin Luther King. In his long career as writer and activist he has addressed many issues, spoken at hundreds of universities and protests as well as traveled the United States debating various political issues.

Oglesby was born in 1935, an only child living first in Kalamazoo, Michigan and later in Akron, Ohio. He was raised in a deep-South Christian Fundamentalist environment, one he both revered and resented, later in life referring to himself as a "silent Christian." He attended Kent State University for almost four years in the mid-fifties during which time he married Beth Rimanoczy in Kent, Ohio. In 1957, he left the university without receiving a degree. During this time, Oglesby began writing plays. His first play Season of the Beast, produced in Dallas, Texas in 1958, was promptly shut down for being a "Communistic Yankee atheist's attack on down-home religion." Although Oglesby didn't know it at the time, this was not the last time he would be accused of being a Communist or an atheist.

Despite his interest in playwriting, Oglesby sought out steady work. He became a copy editor for Goodyear Aircraft Corporation for a year before moving to Ann Arbor, Michigan in 1958. There, he headed the Technical Writing Division at Bendix Systems, a defense contractor, until 1965. Although he befriended many people in Ann Arbor who were politically active, Oglesby shied away from engaging in much activism. He felt proud of his middle class home on Sunnyside Road, his family and secure job, and was reluctant to challenge the establishment that employed him. Even though Oglesby knew that Bendix was designing systems to distribute chemicals and poisons over the Vietnamese jungle, he "was not above" his work at Bendix. He and Beth were fully prepared to raise their children in the American, middle-class tradition, even if it meant not being as politically active as they would have liked.

In 1964, Oglesby began working as a writer for the Wes Vivian Congressional campaign. At a meeting, he was asked to produce a position paper on the Vietnam War in the event the issue came up during the course of the campaign. The paper Oglesby crafted not only provided him a crash course in Vietnamese history, but it also found its way into the University's literary magazine, Generation, along with his new play The Peacemaker. The play depicted the classic feud between the Hatfields and the McCoys, and the inclusion of Oglesby's position paper in the same magazine gave his play about an age-old family feud a modern, political twist. More importantly, the unexpected publication of his position paper led him to his first introduction to Students for a Democratic Society (SDS), an introduction that would change the course of his life and force him to choose what role activism would play in it.

Oglesby's first real ideological struggle with his middle-class lifestyle and career, however, came the previous year when President Kennedy was assassinated. Despite the fact that he and his colleagues faced a looming deadline, Oglesby was concerned that the flag had not been lowered as a sign of respect to the fallen president. When he tried to urge management at Bendix to lower the flag to half mast, he encountered a strange scene in which the executives seemed actually to be celebrating Kennedy's death. Although Oglesby continued working at Bendix for several more years, he became more and more aware that his political sensibilities might be in conflict with his safe, middle-class lifestyle. In particular, as the Vietnam War was becoming more an issue of public debate, Oglesby was forced to acknowledge that his nice, secure job in the defense industry might actually be contributing to it. Indeed, his friends in Ann Arbor began to challenge him, asking how he could reconcile his job at Bendix with his own sense of values. As it turns out, he couldn't.

Edited by Robert Howard
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  • 2 weeks later...
Guest Tom Scully
3) George DeMohrenschildt, while living in Washington D.C. during World War II, roomed with a naval officer (Hall) who became the commander of the U.S. Thresher, though he was not with the ship when it went down during sea trials on :
BK
A man named Richard C. Hall was listed as one of the men who went down with the Thresher. Also, the J.W. Harvey mentioned, could that be John W. Harvey? He was also listed as going down with the sub.
JR

The source of the confusion is that DeM's room-mate was named Hull (Harry)... not Hall.

From the HSCA report:

In October 1942 the FBI interviewed the man who rented the Benton Street house, Paul Joachim. Joachim told the FBI that he was employed at the time in the Navy building.(209) The other occupants of the house were Lt. Cdr. Harry Hull of the U.S. Navy, and Quinton Quines, who Joachim said worked at the British Embassy.(210) Joachim said de Mohrenschildt lived at the house during the end of May and all of June 1942.(211) He said de Mohrenschildt never make any statements about feelings toward any country, and no statements which were pro-Nazi.

Hull wrote an article about the Thresher for a Naval history magazine...

Guerrilla Mission Under the Sea

By Rear Admiral Harry Hull, U.S. Navy (Retired)

In reality, "stewards" in the submarine Thresher are Philippines guerrillas.

Naval History

Unfortunately, the article itself is not available online.

Speaking of mispelt names... the other DeM room-mate listed is Quentin Keynes -- not Quintin Quines as the HSCA has spelt it.

Keynes was the great-grand son of Charles Darwin (one of Oswald's 3 favorite authors according to his Albert Schweitzer College application). Also a nephew to John Maynard Keynes.

Quentin Keynes

DeM sure got close to some remarkable characters. Hopefully more on that soon...

Couple or four interesting coincidences. On 21 October, 1962, retired USN Adm. Paul L. Joachim, age 50, an art dealer residing at 1400 Lake shore Drive in Chicago was shot four times outside 1350 Lake Shore, and killed by an unknown assailant assumed to be a robber, although the murder seems to have gone unsolved. Longtime executive secretary of Patrick H Hoy, V.P. of General Dynamics Corp., Willymat Beasley had also lived at 1350 Lake Shore Drive.

CDR. Howard Bucknell, III was the first skipper of the SSN592 Snook, last Skipjack class submarine, commissioned 24 Oct., 1961. http://www.gdeb.com/programs/lineup/

Thresher was the first Permit class submarine, commissioned on 3 Aug., 1961. On 3 Nov., 1967, Mrs. Henry C. Bruton commissioned the Permit class SSN614 Greenling.

Snook's skipper, Bucknell III, was the brother of the deceased foreign service officer spouse of Thomas J. Devine's sister.:

http://www.google.com/search?q=devine+john+ac+bucknell&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&aq=t&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:unofficial&client=firefox-a#q=devine+john+ac+bucknell&hl=en&safe=off&client=firefox-a&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:unofficial&tbs=nws:1,ar:1&source=lnt&sa=X&psj=1&ei=jKBoTcLSPJK3tgfE4aXmAg&ved=0CA8QpwUoBQ&bav=on.1,or.&fp=748ccb14d716bc92

LOUISE W. DEVINE F6AGEI) TO W); Vassar Graduate Will Be the...

$3.95 - New York Times - Apr 13, 1952

... W. DEVINE F6) TO W) Vassar Graduate Will Be the Brlde of John AC Buckneil, ... Howard Bucknell Jr. of A{ 'Hall Farm, Virginisu The wedding has Been ...

4002417576_d1b4692901_b.jpg

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&safe=off&client=firefox-a&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:unofficial&q=%22Body%20of%20American%20Attache%20Found%22&psj=1&bav=on.1,or.&um=1&ie=UTF-8&sa=N&tab=nw&psj=1#q=%22body+of+John+Bucknell%22&hl=en&safe=off&client=firefox-a&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:unofficial&tbs=nws:1,ar:1&prmd=ivnso&source=lnt&sa=X&psj=1&ei=lKRoTanqJ4mgtwfa3IXmAg&ved=0CA8QpwUoBQ&bav=on.1,or.&fp=748ccb14d716bc92

Body of American Attache Found

Pay-Per-View - Los Angeles Times - Jun 12, 1961

IThe body of John Bucknell 133 political attache at the IUS Embassy in Bern miss . ing since he went undersea fishing Friday was fo u n d Sunday washed up on ...

http://books.google.com/books?um=1&q=john+bucknell+corsica+howard+bucknell+jr.&btnG=Search+Books

Foreign service journal‎ - Page 8

by American Foreign Service Association - Political Science - 1961

L. John AC Bucknell, a Foreign Service Reserve Officer and son of Howard Bucknell, FSO-retired, was drowned off the island of Corsica, on June 10.

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  • 4 weeks later...
Guest Tom Scully
It seems that an important question that is lost in all this (unless I missed the answer) is, what was the outcome of the Bendix v. Bray trial? (And what became of the alleged assassination film, and what became of Bray?)

Can someone who knows Gordon Winslow (who Bill says has the microfilm of the court case) ask him how the story ended?

Unfortunately, I do not have anything to offer regarding Gordon Winslow, but am searching other information sources, in the meantime there is this, from maryferrell.org on "Thresher" search Hull-DeMohrenschildt, interesting

THRESHER, ----- -----

Sources: CD 913, pp. 67-68; CD 1484, pp. 8-10; HSCA Vol 12, pp. 91-92; The Iconoclast, march 19026, 1976, p. 3, Vol X, No. 2; CIA 225-89, released as CIA 104-10015-10221, Lifton's pp. 107-111

Mary's

Comments: Nuclear-powered, deep-diving submarine sunk April 10, 1963, with 129 aboard. See Edward Frank BRAY. "Lt Cdr Harry Hull (housemate of George deMohrenschildt in Washington, D.C., September 1941) commander of Thresher during World War II according to Who's Who in America, 1968-1969." On page 2, paragraph 5, of CIA 225-89, Polish chauffeur told of Soviets' part in sinking of U.S. Navy nuclear submarine (see Lifton p. 110).

The linking of the late Rear Adm. Harry Hull to the nuclear powered submarine Thresher (SSN-593) is in error. The ill-fated nuclear powered Thresher was launched in 1961 and was commanded by just two men during its short history.:

http://www.history.navy.mil/library/online/thresherbrochure3.htm

....THE CAPTAIN

Lieutenant Commander John W. Harvey, USN Thresher’s second Commanding Officer, was born on September 4, 1927, the son of Mr. and Mrs. Manning J. Harvey. He was raised in Philadelphia, Pennsylvania and attended Frankford High School and the University of Pennsylvania prior to entering the United States Naval Academy. He graduated from the Academy in 1950.

Before entering the submarine service, he served for a year in the aircraft carrier Coral Sea. From January 1952 to June 1953, he served aboard the submarine Sea Robin. He then commenced Atomic Energy Commission training for duty aboard the USS Nautilus and served on that first nuclear submarine for 38 months.

Lieutenant Commander Harvey’s next tour of duty was as Chief Engineer of the Tullibee nuclear reactor prototype and later as commissioning Engineer Officer of the USS Tullibee herself.

In June 1961, he reported to the USS Sea Dragon for duty as Executive Officer. In the summer of 1962, he participated in Sea Dragon's polar rendezvous with Skate.

Lieutenant Commander Harvey relieved Thresher’s first Commanding Officer, Commander Dean L. Axene, USN, on January 18, 1963.

Twenty years before "The Thresher Incident" (USN-593), then USN Lt. Cmdr Harry Hull, fresh from being DC house mate of George DeMohrenschildt, was commanding officer of SS-200 Thresher, from April to November, 1943, during the eight, ninth, and tenth WWII war missions of SS-200.

http://www.uboat.net/allies/warships/ship/2914.html

http://www.uboat.net/allies/commanders/commanders.php?cID=3288

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USS_Thresher_%28SS-200%29

Harry Hull certainly remains a curiousity, but IMO, not because of the disasterous, 1963 ending of USN-593 Thresher.:

Was the scenario involving James K. Cogswell III, actually a multi agency effort to deflect the HSCA's attention away from ONI? Too many coincidences... Cogswell had been married to the daughter of Will Farish III's inheritance trustee; Farish became GHW Bush's "best friend." De Mohrenshildt's 1942, Washington DC housemate, later Rear Admiral Harry Hull's wife was Cogswell's first cousin. Their landlord, later retired Rear Admiral Paul L. Joachim was brutally shot to death in Oct., 1962. Joachim's step-father was the designer of US Navy codebreakers' first Underwood Code Machine aka the Kata-Kana Typewriter. Carl A. Joerissen became Paul Joachim's stepfather when Paul was 8 years old.

Later, four star Navy Admiral William K Phillips became Harry Hull's step-uncle when Harry was 13 years old. Cogswell's sister, Theodora, is referred to as being part of the OP, by the HSCA. One of Cogswell's aunts, wife of his uncle, Capt. Francis Cogswell, retired from the CIA in 1954. His other aunt, Bianca Harrington Cogswell, daughter of Admiral James K Cogswell, I, first married a man named Clement, and then married Capt. Donald C. Bingham. When her daughter, Louisa, married Harry Hull, Cogswell's aunt became Harry's mother-in-law. Cogswell III brought Joseph Dryer and his knowledge of De Mohrenschildt to the attention of Dorothe Matlack....

Suzy Says

DeMohrenschildt Mystery

By Suzy Knickerbocker

4/16/77 DMN

In all of the front-page coverage of the

Palm Beach suicide of Russian emigre

George DeMohrenschildt (he came here in 1921)

and his possible involvement in the President

Kennedy assassination through his friendship

with Lee Harvey Oswald and his Russian-born

wife, De Mohrenschildt is constantly referred to

as a mystery man and reputed member of Russian

nobility.

He was neither.

De Mohrenschildt was a bona fide member of the

Russian aristocracy and connected by marriage

to some of New York and Philadelphia’s best

families. One of his cousins Ferdinand de Moh-

renschildt, an official of the Soviet Embassy,

married the late Nona McAdoo, daughter of Sen.

William Gibbs McAdoo.

(Sen McAdoo secretary of the Treasury

in Woodrow Wilson’s administration, was the

husband of President Wilson’s daughter

Eleanor Wilson McAdoo). De Mohrenschildt’s

uncle, a Count Dimitri, who taught languages at

Yale and Dartmouth, married very social,

very rich Mrs Roland Mather Hooker (she was known

everywhere as the Countess Dimitri de Mohrenschildt.

De Mohrenschildt himself married four times,

His second wife was Wynne Sharples, a Main-Line

heiress, now Mrs. Peter Ballinger of Villanova, Pa.

While De Mohrenschildt seldom used a title

his third wife, Phyliss Washington Clucas,

hadn’t stopped calling herself the Baroness

de Mohrenschildt when last heard from.

To put the cherry on the sundae of De Mohrenschildt’s

high profile of high society, he used to know and

see Jackie Onassis’ mother, Mrs. Hugh D. Auchinsloss

(she was between marriages) during summer vacations

visiting the Hooker family in Esthampton, L.I.

In fact, this self-proclaimed society-hater, a geologist

who insisted he was most comfortable amongst

intellectuals spent a lot of time hanging around

the Racquet Club, the exclusive New York male

stronghold with Edward Hooker (the son of

his stepaunt, the Countess Dimitri de Mohrenschildt)

and such sound social chaps as Staley

Tregellas and Jake Cogswell. Hooker invested

heavily in a failed Haitian oil lease deal that turned

out a collossal failure. Hooker lost a fortune that he

never quite recovered.

He returned to Wall Street and subsequently died.

According to family and friends DeMohrenschildt

was undoubtedly a CIA stringer and periodically

made unexplained trips abroad. His Socially

Registered confidant Jake Cogswell, another CIA

stringer, who established residence in Cuba before

Castro. He barely made it out before the ax fell

heiress’ Joan Demers and Cynthia Cannon

Cynthia, big in the horse world, lives in London

and Millbrook, N.Y.

Joan big in the oil world, lives in Palm Beach and

and Texas.

In the last years of his life, George DeMohrenschildt

dropped out of the New York scene, married his

present widow and became Texas-tied, severing

all contacts with former friends and business associates.

Oddly, this man, reputed to know the real story

behind the Kennedy assassination, crossed paths

during his life with two presidential families—

the Kennedy’s, through his acquaintance with

Jackie’s mother and the Wilsons through his marriage

to Woodrow Wilson’s granddaughter Nona McAdoo.

Robert: For persons who are interested in this aspect of research

you may, like I did, wonder if “Suzy Knickerbocker,”

was related to the Cassini’s, since Igor used the

nom de plume “Cholly Knickerbocker.”

Apparently not. Her real name was Aileen Elder Mehle.

A Texan, Davis writes that Mehle’s brother-in-law was

Karim Aga Khan.....

San Antonio Light - April 14, 1977, San Antonio, Texas

underground groups. He barely made it but before the ax fell. (Jake Cogswell still does projects 'for the CIA as...CIA as a Cuban expert. He was married to heiresses Joan Demers and Cynthia Cannon. Cynthia, big in the horse world,...

Refine by:

Date: Thursday, April 14, 1977

City: San Antonio

State: Texas

Syracuse Herald-Journal - April 13, 1977, Syracuse, New York

groups. He barely made it out be- fore the ax fell. (Jake Cogs- well still does projects for the CIA...CIA as a Cuban expert. Jle was married to heiresses Joan Demers and Cynthia Cannon. Cynthia, big in the horse world,...

James Kelsey Cogswell III graduated from Amherst College, so did John McCloy, and when McCloy served as Amherst head trustee, he appointed George Plimpton's uncle, Dr. Calvin H. Plimpton as Amherst president in 1960.:

http://www.jfklibrary.org/Research/Ready-Reference/JFK-Speeches/Remarks-at-Amherst-College-October-26-1963.aspx

Remarks at Amherst College, October 26, 1963 - John F. Kennedy ...

President John F. Kennedy Amherst, Massachusetts October 26, 1963. Mr. McCloy, President Plimpton, Mr. MacLeish, distinguished guests, ladies and gentlemen: .

Despite it's tiny enrollment, or....maybe because of it, in addition to Cogswell, three Amherst alumni have spent time at CIA since 1977, all three serving as DCI.

I'll start a new thread to take a closer look at Amherst. The Lindsay twins, John and David, were ushers in Nancy Bush's 1946 wedding party. Their brother George became lead partner at Debevoise and Plimpton. Eli Whitney Debevoise served as HICOG McCloy's counsel and then his deputy, and McCloy appointed Francis Plimpton's brother as Amherst's president. Stansfield Turner attended Amherst for five semesters and then transferred to the US Naval Academy. Turner "relieved" GHW Bush as DCI in 1977, after Ted Sorenson was nominated for DCI by newly elected President Jimmy Carter, and then Sorenson meekly withdrew after his nomination was shouted down by Carter's own right wing sympathizing democrats in the U.S. Senate.

Edited by Tom Scully
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It seems that an important question that is lost in all this (unless I missed the answer) is, what was the outcome of the Bendix v. Bray trial? (And what became of the alleged assassination film, and what became of Bray?)

Can someone who knows Gordon Winslow (who Bill says has the microfilm of the court case) ask him how the story ended?

Unfortunately, I do not have anything to offer regarding Gordon Winslow, but am searching other information sources, in the meantime there is this, from maryferrell.org on "Thresher" search Hull-DeMohrenschildt, interesting

THRESHER, ----- -----

Sources: CD 913, pp. 67-68; CD 1484, pp. 8-10; HSCA Vol 12, pp. 91-92; The Iconoclast, march 19026, 1976, p. 3, Vol X, No. 2; CIA 225-89, released as CIA 104-10015-10221, Lifton's pp. 107-111

Mary's

Comments: Nuclear-powered, deep-diving submarine sunk April 10, 1963, with 129 aboard. See Edward Frank BRAY. "Lt Cdr Harry Hull (housemate of George deMohrenschildt in Washington, D.C., September 1941) commander of Thresher during World War II according to Who's Who in America, 1968-1969." On page 2, paragraph 5, of CIA 225-89, Polish chauffeur told of Soviets' part in sinking of U.S. Navy nuclear submarine (see Lifton p. 110).

The linking of the late Rear Adm. Harry Hull to the nuclear powered submarine Thresher (SSN-593) is in error. The ill-fated nuclear powered Thresher was launched in 1961 and was commanded by just two men during its short history.:

http://www.history.n...erbrochure3.htm

....THE CAPTAIN

Lieutenant Commander John W. Harvey, USN Thresher’s second Commanding Officer, was born on September 4, 1927, the son of Mr. and Mrs. Manning J. Harvey. He was raised in Philadelphia, Pennsylvania and attended Frankford High School and the University of Pennsylvania prior to entering the United States Naval Academy. He graduated from the Academy in 1950.

Before entering the submarine service, he served for a year in the aircraft carrier Coral Sea. From January 1952 to June 1953, he served aboard the submarine Sea Robin. He then commenced Atomic Energy Commission training for duty aboard the USS Nautilus and served on that first nuclear submarine for 38 months.

Lieutenant Commander Harvey’s next tour of duty was as Chief Engineer of the Tullibee nuclear reactor prototype and later as commissioning Engineer Officer of the USS Tullibee herself.

In June 1961, he reported to the USS Sea Dragon for duty as Executive Officer. In the summer of 1962, he participated in Sea Dragon's polar rendezvous with Skate.

Lieutenant Commander Harvey relieved Thresher’s first Commanding Officer, Commander Dean L. Axene, USN, on January 18, 1963.

Twenty years before "The Thresher Incident" (USN-593), then USN Lt. Cmdr Harry Hull, fresh from being DC house mate of George DeMohrenschildt, was commanding officer of SS-200 Thresher, from April to November, 1943, during the eight, ninth, and tenth WWII war missions of SS-200.

http://www.uboat.net.../ship/2914.html

http://www.uboat.net...rs.php?cID=3288

http://en.wikipedia....er_%28SS-200%29

Harry Hull certainly remains a curiousity, but IMO, not because of the disasterous, 1963 ending of USN-593 Thresher.:

Was the scenario involving James K. Cogswell III, actually a multi agency effort to deflect the HSCA's attention away from ONI? Too many coincidences... Cogswell had been married to the daughter of Will Farish III's inheritance trustee; Farish became GHW Bush's "best friend." De Mohrenshildt's 1942, Washington DC housemate, later Rear Admiral Harry Hull's wife was Cogswell's first cousin. Their landlord, later retired Rear Admiral Paul L. Joachim was brutally shot to death in Oct., 1962. Joachim's step-father was the designer of US Navy codebreakers' first Underwood Code Machine aka the Kata-Kana Typewriter. Carl A. Joerissen became Paul Joachim's stepfather when Paul was 8 years old.

Later, four star Navy Admiral William K Phillips became Harry Hull's step-uncle when Harry was 13 years old. Cogswell's sister, Theodora, is referred to as being part of the OP, by the HSCA. One of Cogswell's aunts, wife of his uncle, Capt. Francis Cogswell, retired from the CIA in 1954. His other aunt, Bianca Harrington Cogswell, daughter of Admiral James K Cogswell, I, first married a man named Clement, and then married Capt. Donald C. Bingham. When her daughter, Louisa, married Harry Hull, Cogswell's aunt became Harry's mother-in-law. Cogswell III brought Joseph Dryer and his knowledge of De Mohrenschildt to the attention of Dorothe Matlack....

Suzy Says

DeMohrenschildt Mystery

By Suzy Knickerbocker

4/16/77 DMN

In all of the front-page coverage of the

Palm Beach suicide of Russian emigre

George DeMohrenschildt (he came here in 1921)

and his possible involvement in the President

Kennedy assassination through his friendship

with Lee Harvey Oswald and his Russian-born

wife, De Mohrenschildt is constantly referred to

as a mystery man and reputed member of Russian

nobility.

He was neither.

De Mohrenschildt was a bona fide member of the

Russian aristocracy and connected by marriage

to some of New York and Philadelphia’s best

families. One of his cousins Ferdinand de Moh-

renschildt, an official of the Soviet Embassy,

married the late Nona McAdoo, daughter of Sen.

William Gibbs McAdoo.

(Sen McAdoo secretary of the Treasury

in Woodrow Wilson’s administration, was the

husband of President Wilson’s daughter

Eleanor Wilson McAdoo). De Mohrenschildt’s

uncle, a Count Dimitri, who taught languages at

Yale and Dartmouth, married very social,

very rich Mrs Roland Mather Hooker (she was known

everywhere as the Countess Dimitri de Mohrenschildt.

De Mohrenschildt himself married four times,

His second wife was Wynne Sharples, a Main-Line

heiress, now Mrs. Peter Ballinger of Villanova, Pa.

While De Mohrenschildt seldom used a title

his third wife, Phyliss Washington Clucas,

hadn’t stopped calling herself the Baroness

de Mohrenschildt when last heard from.

To put the cherry on the sundae of De Mohrenschildt’s

high profile of high society, he used to know and

see Jackie Onassis’ mother, Mrs. Hugh D. Auchinsloss

(she was between marriages) during summer vacations

visiting the Hooker family in Esthampton, L.I.

In fact, this self-proclaimed society-hater, a geologist

who insisted he was most comfortable amongst

intellectuals spent a lot of time hanging around

the Racquet Club, the exclusive New York male

stronghold with Edward Hooker (the son of

his stepaunt, the Countess Dimitri de Mohrenschildt)

and such sound social chaps as Staley

Tregellas and Jake Cogswell. Hooker invested

heavily in a failed Haitian oil lease deal that turned

out a collossal failure. Hooker lost a fortune that he

never quite recovered.

He returned to Wall Street and subsequently died.

According to family and friends DeMohrenschildt

was undoubtedly a CIA stringer and periodically

made unexplained trips abroad. His Socially

Registered confidant Jake Cogswell, another CIA

stringer, who established residence in Cuba before

Castro. He barely made it out before the ax fell

heiress’ Joan Demers and Cynthia Cannon

Cynthia, big in the horse world, lives in London

and Millbrook, N.Y.

Joan big in the oil world, lives in Palm Beach and

and Texas.

In the last years of his life, George DeMohrenschildt

dropped out of the New York scene, married his

present widow and became Texas-tied, severing

all contacts with former friends and business associates.

Oddly, this man, reputed to know the real story

behind the Kennedy assassination, crossed paths

during his life with two presidential families—

the Kennedy’s, through his acquaintance with

Jackie’s mother and the Wilsons through his marriage

to Woodrow Wilson’s granddaughter Nona McAdoo.

Robert: For persons who are interested in this aspect of research

you may, like I did, wonder if “Suzy Knickerbocker,”

was related to the Cassini’s, since Igor used the

nom de plume “Cholly Knickerbocker.”

Apparently not. Her real name was Aileen Elder Mehle.

A Texan, Davis writes that Mehle’s brother-in-law was

Karim Aga Khan.....

San Antonio Light - April 14, 1977, San Antonio, Texas

underground groups. He barely made it but before the ax fell. (Jake Cogswell still does projects 'for the CIA as...CIA as a Cuban expert. He was married to heiresses Joan Demers and Cynthia Cannon. Cynthia, big in the horse world,...

Refine by:

Date: Thursday, April 14, 1977

City: San Antonio

State: Texas

Syracuse Herald-Journal - April 13, 1977, Syracuse, New York

groups. He barely made it out be- fore the ax fell. (Jake Cogs- well still does projects for the CIA...CIA as a Cuban expert. Jle was married to heiresses Joan Demers and Cynthia Cannon. Cynthia, big in the horse world,...

James Kelsey Cogswell III graduated from Amherst College, so did John McCloy, and when McCloy served as Amherst head trustee, he appointed George Plimpton's uncle, Dr. Calvin H. Plimpton as Amherst president in 1960.:

http://www.jfklibrar...er-26-1963.aspx

Remarks at Amherst College, October 26, 1963 - John F. Kennedy ...

President John F. Kennedy Amherst, Massachusetts October 26, 1963. Mr. McCloy, President Plimpton, Mr. MacLeish, distinguished guests, ladies and gentlemen: .

Despite it's tiny enrollment, or....maybe because of it, in addition to Cogswell, three Amherst alumni have spent time at CIA since 1977, all three serving as DCI.

I'll start a new thread to take a closer look at Amherst. The Lindsay twins, John and David, were ushers in Nancy Bush's 1946 wedding party. Their brother George became lead partner at Debevoise and Plimpton. Eli Whitney Debevoise served as HICOG McCloy's counsel and then his deputy, and McCloy appointed Francis Plimpton's brother as Amherst's president. Stansfield Turner attended Amherst for five semesters and then transferred to the US Naval Academy. Turner "relieved" GHW Bush as DCI in 1977, after Ted Sorenson was nominated for DCI by newly elected President Jimmy Carter, and then Sorenson meekly withdrew after his nomination was shouted down by Carter's own right wing sympathizing democrats in the U.S. Senate.

I am in the process of responding to your research re Cogswell, I knew about Amherst's CIA connection.....

But I want to backtrack about the Bray assassination film........

See Post #4 By Shanet Clark

Strange court correspondence. The only Edward F. Bray I found was an officer in the CCIA, the

Connecticut Contractors Industrial Association. The man Bray claimed to have film of the

assassination taken from the TSBD and a film of a practice ambush staged at Denison Dam, Wyoming.

Robert,

the funny thing about this is that after some extensive digging I have

discovered there never has and never was a Denison Dam in Wyoming,

but there is a Denison Dam next to Lake Texoma........

Red River (in Red River (river, United States))

...the head of navigation, vessels drawing more than 4 feet (1.2 m) can reach that far only a few months of the year.

Most traffic is in the lowermost 35-mile (56-kilometre) portion of the river. Denison Dam (1944), 726 miles

(1,168 km) above the river’s mouth, forms Lake Texoma.

http://www.britannica.com/EBchecked/topic/157724/Denison-Dam

FBI 105-82555 Oswald HQ File, Section 197 pg 171

Found in: FBI Oswald Headquarters File (105-82555)

On July 6, 1964, Mr. DECLAN P FORD 14057 Brookcrest, Dallas, Texas

advised SA Wallace R. Heitman that he, his wife and MARINA OSWALD

were leaving on that for a vacation of a few days to be spent at

Lake Texoma Lodge, Kingston, Okla.

http://www.maryferrell.org/mffweb/archive/viewer/showDoc.do?docId=59625&relPageId=171

Which might not mean anything except, for the fact that was also where

Priscilla McMillan worked with Marina on what later became

Marina and Lee in September of '64.

And then there's Elgin Crull

Mr. Hubert.

Now, Mr. Crull, I have previously handed you a document consisting of three pages, which is a report of an interview of you by FBI Agents Calvin Rice and John J. Flanagan, dated December 12, 1963, which for the purpose of identification I have marked on the first page in the right-hand margin thereof as follows:

"Dallas, Texas, July 14, 1964, Exhibit 1, deposition of Elgin Crull." I have signed my name below that, and on the second and third page I have placed my initials in the lower right-hand corner of each of those pages.

I think you have had an opportunity to read that document, and I will now ask you if that document is correct as to the nature and effect stated in the course of that interview, and whether it reflects the facts as you remember them?

Mr. Crull.

In general, it does, but there are some details which are inaccurate.

Mr. Hubert.

Now with respect to the details, I notice that you have marked on the very last line of the second paragraph on page 1, a little mark indicating that you wish to comment on that last line. Would you state what you wish to say about it, please, sir?

Mr. Crull.

I believe that says simply that I went to the lake, to a cabin. The only change is that there is no cabin. I have a boat on the lake.

Mr. Hubert.

Other than that?

Mr. Crull.

Other than that, it is accurate.

Mr. Hubert.

When did you leave the police department quarters on the 22d?

Mr. Crull.

On Saturday?

Mr. Hubert.

I was thinking on Friday after this conference thing.

Mr. Crull.

I am sorry, I can't be too accurate. I imagine I finally left the city hall and periodically I checked back with the police department either by telephone or actually by walking over there. I imagine it was about 7 o'clock before we left and went home.

Mr. Hubert.

You think that in the interval before 7 o'clock, between that conference you just described and 7 o'clock, that you contacted the top officials of the police department either by walking over again or by telephone?

Mr. Crull.

Yes.

Mr. Hubert.

Was any further discussion had about the condition of the news media?

Mr. Crull.

No; the only thing I war interested in most then, of course as everyone else, was the progress being made with Oswald making the case. I was pretty well snowed in my own office by telegrams, telephone calls, and things which had come in in great numbers.

Mr. Hubert.

You say you went home about 7 o'clock?

Mr. Crull.

Yes.

Mr. Hubert.

Did you return to the municipal building or police department any more that night?

Mr. Crull.

No.

Mr. Hubert.

Did you have any further communication with them the night of the 22d?

Mr. Crull.

I have to keep this straight by days of the week.

Mr. Hubert.

This is Friday the 22d.

Mr. Crull.

This is the day of the President's death?

Mr. Hubert.

Yes.

Mr. Crull.

No; before I left the police department the last time, they told me they thought the case was pretty well wrapped up, and that there would be no particular new developments, so after I left that night, I went home that night, and the following morning I went to the lake, Saturday morning.

Mr. Hubert.

About what time did you go to the lake?

Mr. Crull.

About 10 o'clock.

Mr. Hubert.

You did not then go back to the police department?

Mr. Crull.

No.

Mr. Hubert.

So that after 7 o'clock, on Friday, you didn't have any occasion to observe the conditions in the city hall at all?

Mr. Crull.

No; not till Sunday.

Mr. Hubert.

Did you have any communication with the police department after you got to the lake?

Mr. Crull.

Not until Sunday morning.

Mr. Hubert.

At what time did you have communication, and in what way on Sunday morning?

Mr. Crull.

On Sunday morning, the specific time I can't say. A member of the marina staff called me, and said that the radio said that Oswald had been shot. So I went to the marina office and used the telephone to call Dallas. I was calling from the marina, Lake Texoma, just out of Denison, Tex. I did call the office and I talked with Chief Stevenson, and he told me, his words were, "I guess you have heard that we have lost our prisoner."

Then he told me something of the details, although it was then confused.

Mr. Hubert.

Was Oswald dead then, or did he tell you so?

Mr. Crull.

They didn't know at that time. I was talking to them at the police department, and Oswald had been moved to Parkland Hospital.

Mr. Hubert.

Do you remember what time it was?

Mr. Crull.

No; I can't say. I waited at Texoma then, a short time, until my wife came back to the lake. She had been in to Denison to church, and shortly after noon we came back to Dallas. I came to the city hall after changing my clothes at home, to the police department and talked to our mayor then and found that he had received some telephone threats, and that the police had a guard on him, that he wanted to go to Washington for the President's funeral, and that there was some concern about it. So I left the city hall and went to the home of the mayor, discussed his trip with him, decided on my own that he should have protection all the way, called Chief Curry, and suggested that he assign Lieutenant Revill, who was the head of the chief intelligence section, to make the trip to Washington with Mayor Cabell.

Over the telephone the chief did this, and I waited at the mayor's home until Revill went to his house and collected his clothes. Then, in a squad car, I went to the airport to see the mayor off on the airplane.

Mr. Hubert.

What time was that, about?

Mr. Crull.

Between 5:30 and 6 o'clock, something in that area. It was still daylight.

Mr. Hubert.

That was on Sunday, the 24th?

Mr. Crull.

That's correct.

Mr. Hubert.

Were you informed by anyone of any fears that existed concerning the safety of Oswald?

Mr. Crull.

I didn't hear this report until several days later that there had been some.

Interesting enough to point out.........IMO

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  • 7 months later...
Guest Tom Scully
http://gtstage.ny.atl.publicus.com/article/20060211/NEWS/602110319?Title=Gray-George-Brown

George Brown Gray, 77, Livingston, Texas

George Brown Gray, 77, Livingston, Texas, died Thursday, Feb. 9, 2006.

He was a native of Ragland.

He is survived by his family.

Funeral will be at 2 p.m. Sunday at Cochran Funeral Home.

Cremation will be in the Restland Crematory Service in Livingston.

Interesting obit...."survived by his family" (in hiding?).

Ragland? Where is Ragland?

There is a Ragland in Alabama. This George Gray owned a Bonsai tree store about four miles from Neely St., in 1965.

http://www.phoenixbonsai.com/days/DaysJul.html

Lee, as I posted in the Neely St. thread, the WC presented testimony from employees of the gas and electrical utilities. The combined gas bills for March and April were $6.18, vs. $3.06 during two month periods later in 1963 when the WC did not claim 214 Neely St. was occupied.

From March 20, through April 19, the WC claimed 66 kw/h of electricity was metered. If the lighting in the apartment was no more than the equivalent of two 75 watt bulbs powered ten hours per day, I posted documentation showing consumption of 15.9 kw/h per month , per bulb.

Subtracting 31.8 kw/h leaves just 34.2 kw/h remaining to meet all other electrical usage for the LHO family of three. 34.2 kw/h are not sufficient to power a small, 1950s refrigerator for 30 days.

The electrical usage presented by the WC does not take into account gas or electrical consumption for cooking or for heating hot water for a couple with a small child with the means and resources to do not much more than spend much time in that apartment. The usage of gas or electricity to heat water required for even infrequent bathing and cleaning needs of the three occupants, by itself would consume more gas AND electricity than the entire amount the WC presents was consumed from March 20 to April 19.

The WC energy usage data is credible for activity in a vacant apartment undergoing cleaning or minor renovation during the two month period.

LHO and family, by the WC's own presentation of energy usage data, could not have been full time residents of 214 Neely St. I do not think you need to nail down whether George was Bray or Gray. His name was just a M. Waldo George sideshow. It was Waldo who asserted that a man with a wife and child rented an apartment from him sometime in spring, 1963, and occupied the apartment for possibly a two month period, supported by WC obtained utility data showing negligible energy usage in that apartment during that period of time. The WC data impeach Waldo's testimony, but the WC ignored this contradiction.

Did the LHO family live at Neely St. from March 20 to April 19 with no refrigerator and no hot water, not even obtained from heating water in pans on the stove top, or....did they not live there? Those are the two choices the information provided by the WC leaves, since no cost of gas or kw/h are represented as used by LHO to accomplish either the powering of a refrigerator or for heating water by any means, or for that matter, cooking 15 meals, or even 10.

Edited by Tom Scully
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