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Suspicious Vehicles and 11/22/63


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Dynamic thread. Feel free to add on.

1. 11/22/63, at approximately 3:00pm. Incident on South Hampton Road. Mrs Sudie Reynolds was passed by a Blue and White Ford, 4 Door, 1955 or 1956 model, at an excessive rate of speed. Three occupants, driving at excessive speed and looking around nervously. Two males got out of car at light, one dressed in a sport shirt, brown jacket, slacks, dark hair, slender build, 25 - 30 years of age, 5'10" - the other no description provided. Mississippi License Plate #T9809. The location puts them right outside of Redbird Airport [renamed Executive]. The individual from the back seat [that resembles the description provided of LHO, among others] was walking towards Mrs Reynolds car. Apparently she freaked - put the car in gear, drove around them and through the red light, and made a turn on Redbird Lane. The Ford continued on South Hampton.

Anchors - Bowers vehicles. George license Brading, Chevy II light green, Roger's arrest, Red Thunderbird, Vaganov's car, Stationwagons [underpass], Fords, Tilson car, Alexander, Conner, etc.

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Edited by Lee Forman
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2. Light Green Chevy II, with license plate ? EX CD1583? Jesse James Williams and a female companion are drinking on Tuesday, November 19th, into the morning of Wednesday. At about 12:15am, they make the acquaintance of a male - whom Jesse recalls as having dark hair, 30 years old, normal complexion, 5'8" tall, 175 pounds. His female companion recalls very wavy black hair, 5'10", and 165 pounds. This individual invites them to his motel to continue the evening. His motel is located right after crossing the Houston Viaduct. After some mandolin playing, he proceeds to aggressively attempt to seduce Jesse's companion. At their objection, this man pulls out a rifle from the closet, and chambers a round, pointing it and tells Jesse to leave, etc. It's a large caliber, maybe a .303, maybe a deer rifle - some chrome is showing. Somehow it gets to a point where Jesse suggests that the man must be a queer - which doesn't track well to the story he tells in his affidavit. They manage to get back to the car, where this individual draws a pistol, and makes some aggressive remarks. He drives them back to their car, and they write down the license plate number of his vehicle. After the assassination, they report the incident.

Example of a Chevy II attached. Wish I could tell if it was light green. The license plate seems to be Texan. It does not look like EX CD1583. Thanks to James Richards for that parking lot shot.

3. Parking Lot Chevy II. 1963 model. 2 or 3 occupants, behind the fence. Appear to be conversing with a man wearing a tight fitting sea cap. Texas plate. Looks like MS 7371. Your guess is as good as mine. Color unknown.

Reminder - Calvin Brewer's shoe sales salary, Ford Galaxie - Whalen, Black car seen by Arce, cars on Main St.

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Lee,

Let's not forget the 1955-57 model Oldsmobile Howard Brennan claimed he saw parked beside the TSBD. Brennan also said that there was a man behind the wheel and he didn't understand why other vehicles were being moved on and this one was allowed to stay.

I guess it should be pointed out that when Loran Hall and William Seymour were busted in Dallas during October of 1963, they were driving a 1955 Oldsmobile with Florida tags.

James

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Lee,

Let's not forget the 1955-57 model Oldsmobile Howard Brennan claimed he saw parked beside the TSBD. Brennan also said that there was a man behind the wheel and he didn't understand why other vehicles were being moved on and this one was allowed to stay.

I guess it should be pointed out that when Loran Hall and William Seymour were busted in Dallas during October of 1963, they were driving a 1955 Oldsmobile with Florida tags.

James

Thanks James - trying to see if he gave a better description someplace. I will review the exhibits. We'll make his Oldsmobile Vehicle #4.

Found this rather odd:

Mr. BELIN. Mr. Brennan, you are the same Howard Leslie Brennan who testified this morning here?

Mr. BRENNAN. Yes, sir.

Mr. BALL. Do you know a George Murray, of the National Broadcasting Co.

Mr. BRENNAN. I do not.

Mr. BELIN. Have you ever worked for the Union Terminal?

Mr. McCLOY. You are still under oath, you realize.

Mr. BRENNAN. Yes, sir.

Mr. BELIN. Have you ever worked for the Union Terminal Co. in Dallas?

Mr. BRENNAN. I have not.

Mr. BELIN. Did you ever state to anyone that you heard shots from opposite the Texas School Book Depository and saw smoke and paper wadding come out of boxes on a slope below the railroad trestle at the time of the assassination? Did you ever say that or that, in substance, to anyone?

Mr. BRENNAN. I did not.

Mr. BELIN. That is all.

Mr. BRENNAN. Is there another Howard Brennan?

What the hell is all that about?

Here's an example of a 1956 Oldsmobile. There is also one of these in a photo taken of the parking lot area I believe?

Something worth noting - and anyone correct me if I am wrong. There appears to have been 2 parking areas behind the TSBD. One had entrance and egress via the Elm St extension that ran along the building. This, I assume, would have been the 'secure lot' that Craig spoke of, and the area where he tried to prevent the woman in the Chevy from exiting.

The parking area directly behind the building, and the loading dock area, would have a separate entrance, directly on Houston. Larry Hancock straightened me out on that, and after examining aerials, and looking at the area myself, it appears he is absolutely correct. The point being, that Loy Factor's 'tale' may have gone up a notch in credibility. For me anyway. The woman arrested by Roger Craig, if he is behind the picket fence, would have [assumption] been trying to exit the secure lot, via the Elm St extension. As per Craig's description, she was in her early 30s. He handed her off to Lewis. Lewis fails to mention any arrest. He ran to the 'park' and happened upon some people. We never find out what these people may have said, because Lewis doesn't provide us anymore information.

The only woman Lewis mentions that could have fit the description provided by Craig is Simmons. And that seems unlikely.

Of additional interest, Lewis' report.

I was Standing on the sidewalk on Main Street in the 500 block just east of Houston Street when the motorcade passed and turned the corner onto Houston Street. In a few seconds I heard 3 shots. I ran around the corner and came across Houston Street to Elm Street to the Park. I saw some people there. I began to talk to them getting names and information.

I talked to the following named people:

Shearion Simmons, w/f/31, 3168 O'Bannion St., FR 1 7267

Jeanie Holt w/f/18, 2521 Pleasant Drive, EV 1 0377

Stella Jacobs w/f/20, 730 W. 9th Street, WH 2 0168.

The above people work at the Texas School Book Depository Building.

The following named people were brought to the Sheriff's office and statements taken from them.

Bob Edwards w/m/22, 121 S. Nursery, Irving, Texas. Wks: Auditors Office.

Ronnie Fisher, c/o County Auditor' Office.

H.W. Betzner, Jr. w/m/22, 5922 Valesco, TA 7 9761 Wks: Railway REA Express, was in the building.

Arnold Rowland, w/m, 3026 Hammerly, FE 7 1861 Saw man in bldg about 15 min before shooting with a gun. Wife Barbara was with him.

Ronald Fischer w/m/24, 4007 Flamingo Way, BR 9 0950. Was with Bob. Saw man on next to top floor and gave description of suspect. Fairly short hair cut, not a crew, but stuck up in front and not a flat top. Med complex. In his 20's, sport shirt and slacks. Sport shirt open at collar.

Charles Brehn, 1619 King's Highway, WH 2 6893. Works at War's in "carpets" in Wynnewood. Was on grass on Elm St, Saw president when he was shot.

Marvin Chism , C/M/19. Husband, John c/m/23, 4502 Underwood Dr. Cook at Marriott. RI 8 7751. Standing on Elm by Freeway Sign.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Jim Braden w/m/48, Cabana Motel, Room 301

215 S. La Cienga Blvd, Beverly Hills, Calif. Calif DL H 751 775

Ind. Oil Dealer. In Dallas 2 days. Was in building when Pres assassinated.

Floren Lawrence, 3609 Potomac, LA 1 7150

S.L. Ewing, 2805 Gaston, TA 1 2358

Sales Wk & bookkeeper. Was on 3rd floor, using phone.

Did you mean Larry Florer?

Had lunch with Richard Bartholomew RI 8 8011

The same Richard Bartholomew on this forum?

wks: Nat'l Bank Commerce

Louie Schug, TA 1 2358

G.G. Slack, w/m/49 3130 Delee EV 1 2590

Jessie Williams w/f/40 1108, Allen St., Apt 114, Irving. Traveling Salesma, home: 1211 Columbia Dr, Longview, Tex. PL 3 7086

Jesse James Williams, who told the story about the green Chevy II?

Lonnie Ray Wright w/m/ - 3 time loser. Drunk, put in jail. Was on RR track.

Where is the arrest report? Where on the RR track? Is that the man photographed by Jack Beers? I just read a Lancer post by Steve Thomas. He did a great job of trying to figure this one out as well. The man described in the radio transcript does not match the man Beers photographed - is it Wright? Lewis is lucky enough to have had the pleasure of dealing with 2 drunks, coincidentally located in the general area where the President was killed, at around 1:00pm in the afternoon. A common hour for people to be intoxicated in Dallas I guess.

Amos Ewins, c/m/15, 411 Ave L. WH 3 9701 Saw man on 5th floor.

Jean Newman w/f/21, 3893 Clover Lane, FL 2 4222.

Bob Jackson, Times Herald Reporter. Saw shooting. Xxx William Eugene Newman w/m/22, wife Gayle w/f/ 718 W. Clarendon, WH 8 6082 (In front of 2nd light post going west on Elm St - North side.

See statements taken from all of the above named people.

Anyone aware of the statements from 'all' of these folks, and where we might get a look at them?

- lee

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Lee,

Lots of material to ponder. The Ronald Fischer description of the TSBD suspect in Lewis's report is close to the description of the gunman observed near the window by witnesses standing in DP prior to the assassination.

On the Belin/Brennan exchange, I don't know what they're talking about either. I thought Brennan had worked at Union Terminal for 20 years or so. At least that's what most if the books say.

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Lee,

Lots of material to ponder. The Ronald Fischer description of the TSBD suspect in Lewis's report is close to the description of the gunman observed near the window by witnesses standing in DP prior to the assassination.

On the Belin/Brennan exchange, I don't know what they're talking about either. I thought Brennan had worked at Union Terminal for 20 years or so. At least that's what most if the books say.

Hi Mark.

Yes - the same thought occurred to me as well. The age, height, build, hair, sport shirt, slacks, etc - this is repeated in many witness accounts. I thought perhaps there was something that may tie in Red Bird - but that story is about 1:00pm, if memory serves. Then on Torbitt, we have a statement about Tippit's killer being picked up by two men and driven out of Dallas, but the time referenced is 6:00pm. So I'm still left wondering who this would have been at 3:00pm - unless someone got their time wrong, or if this wasn't Redbird related. More to think about. I want to try to get as many vehicles as possible covered - since it's still my concern that too much focus is paid to the Rambler station wagon.

Bower's observations - vehicles 5, 6 & 7. It's odd that Bowers doesn't say anything about the Chevy II stopped by Craig. He's obviously accustomed to seeing the vehicles parked back there on a regular basis. A question - is he only looking at the lot behind the fence? Is his vision in anyway obscured for the lot at the loading dock? Is it possible that he only commented on these 3 cars because they seemed suspicious - driving into a secured parking area? It sounds as if all three vehicles in this case entered via the Elm St extension - which would mean the lot behind the fence - not the lot off Houston.

Hoping perhaps someone can fill me in if I'm wrong. A view of, and from, Bower's Tower.

Mr. BALL - There is parking area behind the School Depository, between that building and your tower?

Mr. BOWERS - Two or three railroad tracks and a small amount of parking area for the employees.

Mr. BALL - And the first came along that you noticed about what time of day?

Mr. BOWERS - I do not recall the exact time, but I believe this was approximately 12:10, wouldn't be too far off.

Mr. BALL - And the car you noticed, when you noticed the car, where was it?

Mr. BOWERS - The car proceeded in front of the School Depository down across 2 or 3 tracks and circled the area in front of the tower, and to the west of the tower, and, as if he was searching for a way out, or was checking the area, and then proceeded back through the only way he could, the same outlet he came into.

Mr. BALL - The place where Elm dead ends?

Mr. BOWERS - That's right. Back in front of the School Depository was the only way he could get out. And I lost sight of him, I couldn't watch him.

Mr. BALL - What was the description of that car?

Mr. BOWERS - The first car was a 1959 Oldsmobile, blue and white station wagon with out-of-State license.

Mr. BALL - Do you know what State?

Mr. BOWERS - No; I do not. I would know it, I could identify it, I think, if I looked at a list.

Mr. BALL - And, it had something else, some bumper stickers?

Mr. BOWERS - Had a bumper sticker, one of which was a Goldwater sticker, and the other of which was of some scenic location, I think.

Mr. BALL - And, did you see another car?

Mr. BOWERS - Yes, some 15 minutes or so after this, at approximately 12 o'clock, 20 to 12--I guess 12:20 would be close to it, little time differential there--but there was another car which was a 1957 black Ford, with one male in it that seemed to have a mike or telephone or something that gave the appearance of that at least.

Mr. BALL - How could you tell that?

Mr. BOWERS - He was holding something up to his mouth with one hand and he was driving with the other, and gave that appearance. He was very close to the tower. I could see him as he proceeded around the area.

Mr. BALL - What kind of license did that have?

Mr. BOWERS - Had a Texas license.

Mr. BALL - What did it do as it came into the area, from what street?

Mr. BOWERS - Came in from the extension of Elm Street in front of the School Depository.

Mr. BALL - Did you see it leave?

Mr. BOWERS - Yes; after 3 or 4 minutes cruising around the area it departed the same way. He did probe a little further into the area than the first car.

Mr. BALL - Did you see another car?

Mr. BOWERS - Third car, which entered the area, which was some seven or nine minutes before the shooting, I believe was a 1961 or 1962 Chevrolet, four-door Impala, white, showed signs of being on the road. It was muddy up to the windows, bore a similar out-of-state license to the first car I observed, occupied also by one white male.

Mr. BALL - What did it do?

Mr. BOWERS - He spent a little more time in the area. He tried-he circled the area and probed one spot right at the tower in an attempt to get and was forced to back out some considerable distance, and slowly cruised down back towards the front of the School Depository Building.

Mr. BALL - Then did he leave?

Mr. BOWERS - The last I saw of him he was pausing just about in--just above the assassination site.

Mr. BALL - Did the car park, or continue on or did you notice?

Mr. BOWERS - Whether it continued on at that very moment or whether it pulled up only a short distance, I couldn't tell. I was busy.

Mr. BALL - How long was this before the President's car passed there?

Mr. BOWERS - This last car? About 8 minutes.

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One quick comment - there was a dramatic difference in style and appearance between a 1955 - 1957 Oldsmobile and a 1959. Is it possible Bowers made an error, and that Vehicle #4 was the same seen by Bowers, as Vehicle #5?

Someone on this forum, I believed, helped me to understand that an 'out-of-state' plate in 1963 with a series of black letters on a white background would come only from one State. Texas had a similar plate at this time, but if it was out-of-state, it would have been from Virgina.

- lee

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Lee,

I was going through some old clippings and found this one. It is kind of light on detail but I guess we can put this vehicle on the list.

Pro-Castro banners hanging from the vehicle as it cruised through an anti-Castro rally? You'd want good insurance and a thick skin to pull that exercise off.

James

Edited by James Richards
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Lee,

Lonnie Ray Wright w/m/ - 3 time loser. Drunk, put in jail. Was on RR track.

Where is the arrest report? Where on the RR track? Is that the man photographed by Jack Beers? I just read a Lancer post by Steve Thomas. He did a great job of trying to figure this one out as well. The man described in the radio transcript does not match the man Beers photographed - is it Wright?

Based on the timing of the dispatches, I believe the person being described below is Lonnie Ray Wright:

At 1:12 # 243 calls in on Channel 2. #243 is Patrolman B. L. Apple

“I’m down here with this three wheeler at the dead-end of Laurels (sic) and he has got black hair. He is 42 years old and got a light colored jacket on and he is pretty drunk but he has been walking down these railroad tracks. Do you want me to take him up there or what do you want me to do with him?"

Along the lines of suspicious vehicles, I have always found these exchanges intriguing:

According to CE 1974 at 23H885, at approximately 2:20PM, Unit 474A (which is only identified as the Special Services Bureau) is dispatched to pick up a "subject on this overpass, carrying a rifle; railroad tracks, Cobb Stadium." 474A was asked if he could see the subject. 474A said no, but that they would go over and get him.

At 2:23, Unit 22 (Patrolman L.L. Hill) was dispatched to go out to Cobb Stadium on the railroad track overpass and meet 474A at the railroad tracks. "There is a white male carrying a rifle" (23H886)

At 2:26, unit 562 (a wrecker) radioed in and said that he was at Cobb stadium "for that suspect's car" (23H887). The Dispatcher told the wrecker to wait there, that 474A will "be back in a minute".

At 2:27, Unit 52(unknown) radioed in and asked if the T.C. Cobb Stadium was on the Hines Blvd overpass, the railroad overpass, or the freeway overpass and asked which direction the suspect was walking. The Dispatcher's response was garbled, but said he didn't know about the direction. (23H887)

At 2:28 Patrolman Hill reported that he was with the wrecker at Cobb Stadium and Unit 474A was ordered to go there. (23H887)

474A radios in and says, "The car that we want picked up is on the parking lot if front of the Merchandise Mart just north of Cobb Stadium."

22 asks if it is a 1964 Falcon. 474A says, "No. It is a red panel truck with writing on the side... license plate 3E9087. (23H888)

The time on Elrod's Arrest Record is given as 2:45 pm.

As early as 2:03 PM, Unit 474A was calling for a wrecker. "We need a wrecker on the parking lot just west of Cobb's stadium for suspect's car." (23H881)

At 2:26, unit 562 (a wrecker) radioed in and said that he was at Cobb stadium "for that suspect's car" (23H887). The Dispatcher told the wrecker to wait there, that 474A will "be back in a minute".

What suspect was that? At 2:03 unit 474A is looking to pick up a "suspect's" car, but 474A wasn't dispatched to pick up the suspect walking on the railroad tracks until 2:20 PM. (23H885)

There follows as series of transmissions from 474A looking for Deputy Chief M.W. Stevenson and Lieutenant C.C. Wallace.

Steve Thomas

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Lee,

Lonnie Ray Wright w/m/ - 3 time loser. Drunk, put in jail. Was on RR track.

Where is the arrest report? Where on the RR track? Is that the man photographed by Jack Beers? I just read a Lancer post by Steve Thomas. He did a great job of trying to figure this one out as well. The man described in the radio transcript does not match the man Beers photographed - is it Wright?

Based on the timing of the dispatches, I believe the person being described below is Lonnie Ray Wright:

At 1:12 # 243 calls in on Channel 2. #243 is Patrolman B. L. Apple

“I’m down here with this three wheeler at the dead-end of Laurels (sic) and he has got black hair. He is 42 years old and got a light colored jacket on and he is pretty drunk but he has been walking down these railroad tracks. Do you want me to take him up there or what do you want me to do with him?"

Along the lines of suspicious vehicles, I have always found these exchanges intriguing:

According to CE 1974 at 23H885, at approximately 2:20PM, Unit 474A (which is only identified as the Special Services Bureau) is dispatched to pick up a "subject on this overpass, carrying a rifle; railroad tracks, Cobb Stadium." 474A was asked if he could see the subject. 474A said no, but that they would go over and get him.

At 2:23, Unit 22 (Patrolman L.L. Hill) was dispatched to go out to Cobb Stadium on the railroad track overpass and meet 474A at the railroad tracks. "There is a white male carrying a rifle" (23H886)

At 2:26, unit 562 (a wrecker) radioed in and said that he was at Cobb stadium "for that suspect's car" (23H887). The Dispatcher told the wrecker to wait there, that 474A will "be back in a minute".

At 2:27, Unit 52(unknown) radioed in and asked if the T.C. Cobb Stadium was on the Hines Blvd overpass, the railroad overpass, or the freeway overpass and asked which direction the suspect was walking. The Dispatcher's response was garbled, but said he didn't know about the direction. (23H887)

At 2:28 Patrolman Hill reported that he was with the wrecker at Cobb Stadium and Unit 474A was ordered to go there. (23H887)

474A radios in and says, "The car that we want picked up is on the parking lot if front of the Merchandise Mart just north of Cobb Stadium."

22 asks if it is a 1964 Falcon. 474A says, "No. It is a red panel truck with writing on the side... license plate 3E9087. (23H888)

The time on Elrod's Arrest Record is given as 2:45 pm.

As early as 2:03 PM, Unit 474A was calling for a wrecker. "We need a wrecker on the parking lot just west of Cobb's stadium for suspect's car." (23H881)

At 2:26, unit 562 (a wrecker) radioed in and said that he was at Cobb stadium "for that suspect's car" (23H887). The Dispatcher told the wrecker to wait there, that 474A will "be back in a minute".

What suspect was that? At 2:03 unit 474A is looking to pick up a "suspect's" car, but 474A wasn't dispatched to pick up the suspect walking on the railroad tracks until 2:20 PM. (23H885)

There follows as series of transmissions from 474A looking for Deputy Chief M.W. Stevenson and Lieutenant C.C. Wallace.

Steve Thomas

http://www.dallashistory.org/cgi-bin/webbb...rames;read=1465

Does anyone remember what intersection it was at?

: : : Somewhere near Stemmons/Motor St? When was it torn down and what was the name of our city team?

: : Cobb Stadium was on the corner of what is now occupied by The Infomart. The Corner of Stemmons and Oak Lawn. If you took the Oak Lawn exit off Stemmons (heading north) it would be right in front of you. I remember seeing it tore down. There was a lot of controversy at the time, many people did not want it torn down.

: Actually there was no "city team," the stadium, originally named Dal Hi Stadium was built by the WPA on city property for use of the Dallas high schools. It later was named P. C. Cobb Stadium after the former Dallas schools athletic director. Incidently, when it was sold, the school district found it didn't own the property--only the stadium. It ended up having to split the proceeds with the water department of the City of Dallas which had never transferred the land when the school district separated from the City in 1948. The site was originally a settling basin for water from the Trinity River which was pumped to Turtle Creek Reservoir by the old Pump House on Harry Hines Blvd.

Cobb stadium was formerly Dal Hi stadium and used by the city high schools. It was located on Oak Lawn Ave, just west of Harry Hines Blvd. There were railroad tracks between Harry Hines and the Stadium.As a youth, I worked at the stadium selling cold drinks and cushions the nights the HS teams played. Some excellent memories of my youthful childhood disappeared when they tore it down except for the memories I currently recall and cherish in these, my sunsetting years.

Thanks for that Steve!

With all of the numerous operatives / suspects that were thought or known to have been in Dallas that day - it still leads me to wonder - as with another 'Umbrella Man' standing waiting for Kennedy at the Trade Mart with his umbrella aready open [a reference no doubt, to Wilt Chamberlain - aka 'the Big Dipper'] - if indeed some of the stories about a back-up plan, and possible screw-ups in the Plaza, or a decision to change the route last minute for security purposes, etc. - whether the Trade Mart had it's own extensive operation in place. I would think that the 'bumbling' with the DeGaulle hit would have taught someone something.

So - is it Lonnie Ray Wright's car that they sent out to collect then? Lonnie's description still does not match the Beers photo - and I don't believe Elrod's does either. 12 arrests made that day, as per Roger Craig. I still have an incomplete list. Lee Oswald, John Elrod, Lonnie Wright, ? Larry Florer? Jim Braden? Garrison's Cuban that was released? Donald wayne House - but that was Fort Worth? The youth that was in Fritz's office? The woman arrested by Craig? The 3, 4 or 7 tramps? What about the guy who turned himself in that day? I wish Craig was still around to answer a few questions.

http://www.jfkresearch.com/tmbtg/tmbtg7.htm

MR. X I gave it to my contacts...the word was. That was always the word. You see, they don't give out information or they wouldn't be a security agency. They take it in. It is not for me to determine because it may not happen. That is, precautions are taken at all points. They were alerted to the situation. Apparently, there in Dallas Texas, in 1963, they were alerted in the area of the Trade Mart.

SNYDER Mr. Kennedy was to have delivered a speech?

MR. X: And to die during that delivery or sometime thereafter. The double-cross was at the Book Depository Building to continue the frame of Mr. Oswald, who they considered a communist. . . because his penetration of the Cuban intelligence at the time was such that he appeared to be a communist. At times, I appeared to be a minuteman, or a member of the John Birch Society, or I was an officer in the Fair Play For Cuba Committee, a member of the Castro espionage work in the United States with the 20th of July Movement. And you may end up suddenly changing the right to the left for intelligence reasons, you see. But they were framing what they considered a communist and also shooting what they considered a communist. And that's what can be said there, you see.

Never saw that article before from James. Very humorous story. I thought that perhaps there may be a match on the little convertible parked on Main - I was able to determine that this vehicle was not a Saab, Citroen, Volkswagon - but I never made the actual model. After looking to the z-footage for a reference - seems like the pick-up is red [which means that it is not the same pick-up seen by Mercer - which was allegedly pushed or towed away anyway - and perhaps provided the necessary diversion to place the weapons for the parking lot guys - still could have been the truck that assisted] and that this little convertible appears to be blue. So much for my idea. There is a similar car parked across the street on Houston - across from the jail, awaiting the Oswald transfer - but again, it's B&W.

Let's say the vehicle posted by James is #8, and the one you have listed is #9. Still many, many more to go here. Perhaps one day some of these details will be filled in a bit more. Certainly the cops don't appear to have been up to providing very clear details in 1963 - writing on the side? Cobb Stadium would have been within rock throwing distance of the Trade Mart - located where the InfoMart appears today. Could your Vehicle, #9 be the same as the panel truck seen in Cancellare and Zapruder, or are these 2 separate vehicles entirely? Are there any details about the truck that assisted in getting the green Ford, seen by Mercer, off the curb? Vehicle #10 - the Green Ford Pick-up with 'Air Conditioning' written on the side.

SHERIFF'S DEPARTMENT, COUNTY OF DALLAS, TEXAS

Before me, the undersigned authority on this the 22nd day of November A.D. 1963, personally appeared Julia Ann Mercer, Address 5200 Belmont, No. 208, Dallas, Age 23, Employed: Automat Distributors, 1720 Canton, Dallas.

Deposes and says:

On November 22, 1963, I was driving a rented White Valient automobile west on Elm Street and was proceeding to the overpass in a westerly direction and at a point about 45 or 50 feet east of the overhead signs of the right entrance road to the overpass, there was a truck parked on the right hand side of the road. The truck looked like it had 1 or 2 wheels up on the curb. The hood of the truck was open. On the driver's side of the truck, there were printed letters in black, oval shaped, which said "Air Conditioning". This was a pickup truck and along the back side of the truck were what appeared to be tool boxes. The truck was a green Ford with a Texas license. I remember seeing the word "Ford" at the back of the truck.

A man was sitting under the wheel of the car and slouched over the wheel. This man had on a green jacket, was a white male and about his 40's and was heavy set. I did not see him too clearly. Another man was at the back of the truck and reached over the tailgate and took out from the truck what appeared to be a gun case. This case was about 8" wide at its widest spot and tapered down to a width of about 4" or 5". It was brown in color. It had a handle and was about 3 1/2 to 4 feet long. The man who took this out of the truck then proceeded to walk away from the truck and he reached down to free it. He then proceeded to walk across the grass and up the grassy hill which forms part of the overpass. This is the last I saw of this man.

I had been delayed because the truck which I described was blocking my passage and I had to await until the lane to my left cleared so I could go by the truck.

During the time that I was at this point and observed the above incident there were 3 policeman standing talking near a motorcycle on the bridge just west of me.

The man who took what appeared to be the gun case out of the truck was a white male, who appeared to be in his late 20's or early 30's and he was wearing a grey jacket, brown pants and plaid shirt as best as I can remember. I remember he had on some kind of a hat that looked like a wool stocking hat with a tassell in the middle of it. I believe that I can identify this man if I see him again.

The man who remained in the truck had light brown hair and I believe I could identify him also if I were to see him again.

(signed by) Julia Ann Mercer.

Subscribed and sworn to before me on this the 22nd of November A.D. 1963

(signed by) Rosemary Allen

Notary Public, Dallas, Texas

- lee

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Vehicle #11 - parked on Main St - a pick-up truck, which appears to have a driver - maybe on a radio, and appears to be 2 men at the back. Named 'Pick-up man' by Jack White - what is he doing in the bed of the truck? Are these the same guys seen by Mercer - originally with the green Ford pick-up? And could the green Ford pick-up have been caught on Muchmore's film, prior to the arrival of the motorcade?

I believe someone once suggested that the truck in Muchmore was a Chevy. Ford F100 for comparison. There is also the Allen photo of the Ford in the parking lot. Let's call that Vehicle #12 [say, is that Jack Ruby standing in the background? :blink: ]

- lee

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perhaps there is something of interest here, if only for vehicle types, but also the person crouching/climbing up or down at railtrack. maybe he/she belongs to one of the vehicles.

Edited by John Dolva
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perhaps there is something of interest here, if only for vehicle types, but also the person crouching/climbing up or down at railtrack. maybe he/she belongs to one of the vehicles.

Agreed John.

A number of folks have looked at that before. I can tell you that for NJ, backing up on a highway is 5 points - a heavy penalty. Why this car would be flipped around and parked so that it's tailgate faced Stemmons is indeed a bit odd. If the car was broken down, or if there was construction in the area, etc. - you still park the car facing the direction of the traffic.

Unfortunately I don't know that there's much more that can be done with it - however, unless we can make a guess at the model and make. Not much to work with.

There are still about 30 vehicles I haven't touched on yet. I think at the end it may be worth creating a summary, just to have it all in one place and look for commonalities. For example - the Rambler - who says there was only one? I am at a loss, however, to again find the reference to the event that allegedly took place in the days prior to the assassination - in which a Rambler station wagon was parked at the underpass? Performing a survey of the plaza. Memory here - there were three individuals, and when a cop ran the plate, it was registered to the town Department of Works, something like that - much like the vehicle that John Locke and Adam Wilkinson were chasing - Department of Works. If anyone has that reference, I'd appreciate it - I have looked for it many times without success.

So let's say for now -

Vehicle #14 - Parked off the Stemmons Highway.

#15 - The Rambler involved in the survey of the Plaza.

#16 - THe car [331?] parked on the Elm Street extension during the aftermath.

#17 - The Rambler seen by Craig and others.

#18 - The vehicle that pushed away the Green Ford truck with 'Air Conditioning' on the side, and toolboxes at the back, seen by Julia Anne Mercer. I forget what that one was - need to look it up again.

#19 - The car parked behind the Morman Temple at Edwin Walker's house.

#20 - The car parked in Edwin Walker's driveway which had the license plate somehow removed.

#21 - The new vehicle purchased by Johnny Brewer on his shoe saleman salary.

#22 - The car with the Georgia Plates - would be the second one described below - 1963 Chevy Impala bearing Georgia License plate 52J1033. I thought that I had looked at that one before, but now can't find what I thought I had posted, which was that the vehicle was reported as stolen by an individual with a very similar alias to the ones used by Jim Braden. JAMES BRADEN, A/K/A/ JAMES BRADING, A/K/A EUGENE BRADING, EUGENE HALE BRADING, James Bradley Lee, etc.

Dolan's aliases have included Jim de Lare, James HarryDolan, Jim Dolan, Jimmy Dolan, James Bradley, and "Hamily."(931) Illegal Activities.-Dolan has been described as one of the twomost notorious hoodlums who resided in Dallas. (1196) An informantdescribed him as a strong-arm man who had been employed by Traffi-cante.* (1197) Dolan reportedly traveled throughout southeastern andmidwestern United States and had numerous underworld contactsthroughout these areas.(1198)(932) His specialties included armed robbery of bookmakers, gam-blers, and houses of prostitution, confidence swindles, and shakedownrackets.(1199) Dolan had also, on occasion, professed to be a gambler.A source familiar with union activities reported that a poker game inwhich Dolan participated was in almost regular session at the AGVAoffices. (1200)(933) Dolan was also associated with bookmaking in Dallas. A 1962report states that the primary bookmaking operation in Dallas wasdirected by John Eli Stone, Albert Meadows and Sherman Franklin.(1201) Thereport listsDolan amongthose who were "closely associatedwith this group and especially with Meadows and Little," who "inaddition to gambling themselves extensively, act as strong-arm menor collection men whenever asked."(1202) In 1961 it was reported thatDolan was engaged in "booking" with Johnny Ross Patrono andBobby Chapman.(1208)(934) On December 2, 1949, Dolan was held by Illinois police forinvestigation and subsequently released without charges being filed.(1204) On July 30, 1951, Dolan surrendered to the U.S. Marshal inDenver to face chargesof impersonating a Federalofficer.

...

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Page 7

...There is no indication that any Warren Commission staffmember interviewed Dolan. He did not testify before the Commissionand there is no indication that the Warren Commission was aware ofthe extent of Dolan's criminal activities.Other Infor-nation(969) When Dolan was in Phoenix, Ariz., in 1951, he was observedin the company of James Bradley Lee. (1289) Lee is identical withEugene Hale Brading, al.a. James Braden.(1290) It was the inform-ant's opinion that Brading and Victor Periera might have conveyed toDolantheidea that he could operate successfully as a "con man." (1291)When FBI agents attempted to interview Brading, he refused to an-swer any questions regarding himself or his associates. (1292) Bradenwas detained for questioning in Dealey Plaza on November 22, 1963.(1293)(970) Interview with Dolan by House Select Committee on Assassinations staff.

#23 - The 1961 or 1962 Pontiac Station Wagon, License Plate began with PE.

1034. DIS: Somebody pulled in there and bought some gas;

driving a white Pontiac '61 or '62 station

wagon with the prefix P(ecos) E(llis). He had

a rifle laying on the seat. 1035. 87: 10-4.

#24 - The Thunderbird described to John Elrod, by the man he may have mistaken for Lee Oswald, while incarcerated.

The cellmate stated that five men had met at a motel, and they had been advanced some

money under some type of contract. One of these men was reported to

have received $5,000. The man with the injured face had received some

money, and he was reported to have been driving a Thunderbird automobile

with a large quantity of guns contained therein. ELROD advised he was

confined in Dallas City Jail for a period of 72 hours, and he was

confused at this time concerning the events which occurred. He stated

he could not recall whether JACK RUBY's name had been mentioned prior to

the time of the killing of LEE HARVEY OSWALD, but that this cellmate at

some time had told him that one of the men who had been at the motel

referred to above, name and location unknown, had been JACK RUBY.

20 or so to go...

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