Thomas Graves

Was Lovelady A Big Fat Prevaricator, Or What?

119 posts in this topic

7 minutes ago, Bart Kamp said:

Tommy keep at it w those colours and you will be the next Gaal.

But mine sometimes correlate with my opponents' statements, so there's a method to MY madness

LOL

--  Tommy :sun

At least that's what the body-guarded nurse tells me when she comes into my padded cell and unstrapps me for a couple of minutes and gives me my shots four times a day.

Edited by Thomas Graves

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5 minutes ago, Thomas Graves said:

But mine sometimes correlate with my opponents' statements, so there's a method to MY madness

LOL

--  Tommy :sun

At least that's what the body-guarded nurse (who looks pretty enough to eat) tells me when she comes into my padded cell and unstraps me for a few seconds and takes that damned mask off my face and gives me my shots four times a day.

bump bump bump bump

Edited by Thomas Graves

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2 hours ago, Thomas Graves said:

"Dear Paul"

You can't seem to grasp the concept that not only did Adams and Styles tell author Barry Ernest that they did not see Shelly or Lovelady, but that Adams also told Ernest that her W.C. testimony about that very issue had been altered to make it look like she had seen them.

It's all very complicated, isn't it. 

--  Tommy :sun

Tommy,

IMHO, your error is that you are comparing WC testimony under oath, with paid interview statements not under oath.

When people are being paid for an interview, they often make stuff up, in hopes of getting more publicity and more cash.

Your scenario presumes (1) that the WC altered Vickie's testimony; and (2) that Vickie told Barry Ernest the truth.

Logically, I can't presume that with you.   Vickie was under a perjury oath with the WC, and there was a circus atmosphere with Ernest, because the JFK CT community has been worldwide Entertainment for a long time now.  Cash would be Vickie's incentive to tease Ernest with exactly what he wanted to hear.

The WC did a poor job of interviewing Vickie -- but accounting for that poverty, I maintain that Vickie's WC testimony is the best we will ever see from her.   She just wasn't a very articulate speaker.

Billy Lovelady told the truth.   We must modify Vickie's TIMING as well as Lovelady's TIMING so that they both meet up on the 1st floor soon after the JFK shots.   Given this, then Vickie was in the back stairs of the TSBD sometime between 6-9 minutes after the JFK shots.  The TIMING was confusing to her, as it was to almost everybody.

The only WC witnesses in the TSBD who used a stopwatch to time their actions later, were Officer Marrion Baker and Roy Truly.  That is solid history, IMHO.

Regards,
--Paul Trejo

Edited by Paul Trejo
typos

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23 minutes ago, Paul Trejo said:

Tommy,

IMHO, your error is that you are comparing WC testimony under oath, with paid interview statements not under oath.

When people are being paid for an interview, they often make stuff up, in hopes of getting more publicity and more cash.

[...]

Dear Paul,

Why do you have so much faith in the the Hoover-LBJ dominated FBI's actions "after the fact" (i.e. during the FBI and Allen Dulles-dominated Warren Commission "investigation" and "hearings"), but so little faith in what a Catholic Church-raised-and-schooled, former wanna-be nun (and her TSBD workmate) and current elementary school teacher had to say to a reputable author many years later?

Are you really that cynical in nature?  Been kicked around a lot or something?  Been made fun of a lot?

--  Tommy :sun

PS  I'm finished with you on this thread.  Someone else can "take over," if they want to.

You "win," Mr Trump. Trejo

Edited by Thomas Graves

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35 minutes ago, Thomas Graves said:

Dear Paul,

Why do you have so much faith in the FBI's actions regarding the assassination, after the fact (i.e. during the Johnson-Hoover-dominated Warren Commission "investigation"), but so little faith in what a Catholic Church-raised and schooled, former wanna-be nun (and her workmate) had to say to a reputable author many years later?

Are you really that cynical in nature?  Been kicked around a lot or something?  Been made fun of a lot?

Tommy,

You misunderstand me; but that's OK, since my position is very nuanced and complex.   I'll try again.

IMHO, the FBI tampered with all evidence of the JFK assassination -- witnesses, crime scenes, ballistics, film, movies, suspects, suspects' families, autopsy reports -- literally everything -- in order to fabricate the Big Lie of the "Lone Nut" assassin.

IMHO, rogues in the Dallas Police killed JFK.  Not nearly enough attention is paid to their WC testimony over the past 50 years.  So much energy is wasted, trying to prove a CIA-did-it scenario, that a full half-century of JFK research can be flushed down the toilet (with few exceptions).

As for Vickie Adams, she is the person who has been kicked around a lot.  Her parents abandoned her in early childhood, which gave her a profound sense of confusion and inferiority complex.   Her self-doubt is compensated by an over-developed self-defense, and so her WC testimony is flawed by her personality weaknesses.

The fact that Vickie was an orphan raised by the Catholic Church was the fact that saved her from a life of street-walking, most likely.  But she was far from the valedictorian she could have become if she had been raised in a normal family, IMHO.

Vickie's WC testimony is weak because of Vickie.  Not because of the FBI.   The FBI was only interested in protecting the DPD rogues (not for their own sake, but to prevent the USSR from a propaganda victory during the Cold War).   Vickie's testimony was not even on their radar.  They rushed her WC testimony, and tried to see how it fit in with other WC witnesses, but they didn't really press it.  

If Vickie Adams had stronger testimony, she would have given it.  She didn't have it.  She was uncertain herself, especially of the TIMING of her actions.  Sandra Styles contradicted that TIMING, and perhaps that is why the WC declined to interview Sandra -- it would have been a major distraction to this low-value testimony.  

Ultimately -- what did Vickie Adams see?   NOTHING SPECIAL.  

What do her critics bemoan?  Precisely that!   Vickie saw NOTHING SPECIAL.   Her testimony is almost useless from any angle.

Regards,
--Paul Trejo

Edited by Paul Trejo
typos

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13 minutes ago, Thomas Graves said:

Dear Paul,

Why do you have so much faith in the the Hoover-LBJ dominated FBI's actions "after the fact" (i.e. during the FBI and Allen Dulles-dominated Warren Commission "investigation" and "hearings"), but so little faith in what a Catholic Church-raised-and-schooled, former wanna-be nun (and her TSBD workmate) and current elementary school teacher had to say to a reputable author many years later?

Are you really that cynical in nature?  Been kicked around a lot or something?  Been made fun of a lot?

--  Tommy :sun

PS  I'm finished with you on this thread.  Someone else can "take over," if they want to.

You "win," Mr Trump. Trejo

Bye Bye, Word Twister!

--  Tommy  :sun

Edited by Thomas Graves

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Cool.  I guess that settles it -- Billy Lovelady told the truth in his WC testimony, to the best of his ability.

Regards,
--Paul Trejo

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3 hours ago, Paul Trejo said:

 

[...]

As for Vickie Adams, she is the [sic] person who has been kicked around a lot.  Her parents abandoned her in early childhood, which gave her a profound sense of confusion and inferiority complex.   Her self-doubt is compensated by an over-developed self-defense, and so her WC testimony is flawed by her personality weaknesses.

The fact that Vickie was an orphan raised by the Catholic Church was the fact that saved her from a life of street-walking, most likely.  But she was far from the valedictorian she could have become if she had been raised in a normal family, IMHO.

Vickie's WC testimony is weak because of Vickie.  Not because of the FBI.   The FBI was only interested in protecting the DPD rogues (not for their own sake, but to prevent the USSR from a propaganda victory during the Cold War).   Vickie's testimony was not even on their radar.  They rushed her WC testimony, and tried to see how it fit in with other WC witnesses, but they didn't really press it.  

If Vickie Adams had stronger testimony, she would have given it.  She didn't have it.  She was uncertain herself, especially of the TIMING of her actions.  Sandra Styles contradicted that TIMING, and perhaps that is why the WC declined to interview Sandra -- it would have been a major distraction to this low-value testimony.  

Ultimately -- what did Vickie Adams see?   NOTHING SPECIAL.  

What do her critics bemoan?  Precisely that!   Vickie saw NOTHING SPECIAL.   Her testimony is almost useless from any angle.

Regards,
--Paul Trejo

Dear Word-Twister Trejo,

In my humble opinion, you're full of beans.

Where did you get your medical degree with the psychiatric emphasis, anyway?

Are you still trying to cure hysterical women with hypnotism and magnets, Herr Doktor?

 

Didn't Vicki Adams become a school teacher after the assassination?

How "weak" and "unstable" and "confused" could she have been if she was able to do that?

Is the fact that I was adopted at 4 1/2 months of age the reason I'm so "weak" and "confused" and "unstable"?

(What's YOUR excuse, by the way?)

--  Thomas W. Graves

--  originally Thomas Michael Mahon

 It's an Irish name

:sun

Edited by Thomas Graves

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1 hour ago, Paul Trejo said:

Cool.  I guess that settles it -- Billy Lovelady told the truth in his WC testimony, to the best of his ability.

Regards,
--Paul Trejo

Lovelady was f.o.s.

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51 minutes ago, Bart Kamp said:

Lovelady was f.o.s.

No, no, no.  You don't understand, Barto.  Like Vladimir Putin, Billy Nolan Lovelady was a very, very honorable man!  Even though he was a deadbeat felon and a former fugitive from The Law.  An' he had hisself a real job with a future there in that there TSBD, a-packin' books an' a-layin' down plywood flooring!  But hey!, what's a guy who was caught tryin' to sell two pistols that he an' his two equally-honorable Air Force buddies had stolen while on the job at Andrews Air Force Base gonna do when he can't find hisself no good-payin' job no more?

And so was William Hoyt Shelley a very honorable man, too, by the way, even though he was just the so-called supervisor of the so-called Miscellaneous Department for like 15 years, and he was convicted of petty theft a year or two after the assassination.  Aw shucks, he was probably just desperate for a little drug money, seein' as how he wasn't able to hook up with that "I'll pay you big money to tell lies in my book," Barry Ernest so-called author dude!

And Marina Oswald Porter(!), who was apparently suspected of embezzling 390 bucks from the convenience store she worked at in 1974, iirc, she's a very nice person, too, and I'm sure she told nothing but the truth "once she was under oath" there in front of Allen Dulles and the boys! https://texashistory.unt.edu/ark:/67531/metapth339400/m1/1/

And that Paine woman(!}  Didn't she have some kind of problem in a Latin or South American country back in the day?  Suspected of being a CIA agent or something?  I'm sure she told nothing but the truth, too!  And that's the gosh-darned truth because I say it is!

Shoot, this case is just chock-a-block full of honorable witnesses!  An' all of 'em much more reliable and trustworthy than that "dazed and confused" little orphan girl, Vicki Adams! Especially the very honorable William Hoyt Shelley and his lackey, Billy Nolan Lovelady!  It's ju' too bad they couldn't keep their stories straight after the assassination!

I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean.......... "Shoot fire," son!

--  Tommy :sun

 

Edited by Thomas Graves

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1 hour ago, Bart Kamp said:

Lovelady was f.o.s.

Bart,

Would you kindly summarize, briefly, your evidence for your position that Billy Lovelady cannot be believed in his WC testimony?

Regards,
--Paul Trejo

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5 hours ago, Thomas Graves said:

No, no, no.  You don't understand, Barto.  Like Vladimir Putin, Billy Nolan Lovelady was a very, very honorable man!  Even though he was a deadbeat felon and a former fugitive from The Law.  An' let us not fer-get that he had hisself a real job with a future there in that there TSBD, a-packin' books an' a-layin' down plywood flooring!  But hey!, what's a guy who was caught tryin' to sell two pistols that he an' his two equally-honorable Air Force buddies had stolen while on the job at Andrews Air Force Base gonna do when he can't find hisself no good-payin' job no more?

And so was William Hoyt Shelley a very honorable man, too, by the way, even though he was just the so-called "supervisor" of the so-called (guns 'n drug-runnin?) "Miscellaneous Department" for, like, 500 years, and he was convicted of petty theft a year or two after the assassination.  Aw shucks, he was probably just desperate for a little drug money or sumthin', seein' as how he wasn't able to hook up with that "I'll pay you big money to tell little lies in my book"-Barry-Ernest-so-called-author dude!

And Marina Oswald Porter(!), who was apparently suspected of havin' embezzled herself 390 bucks from the convenience store she was a-workin' at in 1974 -- I'm sure she's a very honorable person, too, even though there are some dog-ugly rumors flotin' 'round on the Inter-net that she might-a done a little hookin' for herself and / or the KGB back in the day.  I'm sure she told nuttin' but the truth "once she was under oath" up there in front of Allen Dulles and the boys!  https://texashistory.unt.edu/ark:/67531/metapth339400/m1/1/  Hoe  That was an honest "Freudian Typo" there, folks! .....  HOW did that turn out, anyway?

And that Paine woman(!)  Didn't she have some kind of problem in a Latin or South American country back in the day?  Sus-pected of being a CIA agent or something?  I'm sure she told nothin' but the truth, too!  And that's the gosh-darned truth because I say it is!

Shoot, this case is just chock-a-block full of honorable witnesses!  An' all of 'em much more reliable and trustworthy than that "dazed and confused" little Catholic orphan girl, Vicki Adams! Especially the very, very honorable petty thief William Hoyt Shelley and his lackey, Billy "Felon" Nolan Lovelady!

It's jus' a cryin' shame they couldn't keep their l-i-e-s I mean stories straight after the assassination!

I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean.......... "Shoot fire," son!

--  Tommy :sun

Edited and a-bumped for Word Twister Trejo, who I can see is a-readin' his little ol' pea pickin' bum (British English) off on the earlier version (probably tryin' his a-darn-dest to figure out a clever, word-twisty response, you know with his traditional little 5-page repetitive lecture about his so-called CT in it, too) as I type this here little note at the bottom of this here new 'un!

Edited by Thomas Graves

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6 hours ago, Paul Trejo said:

Bart,

Would you kindly summarize, briefly, your evidence for your position that Billy Lovelady cannot be believed in his WC testimony?

Regards,
--Paul Trejo

No, this has been discussed here many times already.

I made a page about most of it, could do w an update, but it'll have to wait.

http://www.prayer-man.com/tsbd/billy-nolan-lovelady/

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30 minutes ago, Bart Kamp said:

No, this has been discussed here many times already.

I made a page about most of it, could do w an update, but it'll have to wait.

http://www.prayer-man.com/tsbd/billy-nolan-lovelady/

Yeah, Paul.

Barto's gonna have to "move" Lovelady from Elm Street Extension to the TSBD steps, where Sandy and I have recently proved, beyond a reasonable doubt, that he can be seen there, talking with Gloria Calvery in Couch-Darnell.

So, I'm afraid you're gonna have to wait awhile for that "update".

LOL

--  Tommy  :sun

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