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Sandy Larsen

Officer Marrion Baker's mad dash for the.... Dal-Tex building?

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Another thing I want to reiterate is the fact that, at the end of the clip, we see the butts and backs-of-heads of those facing or running toward the sidewalk. But not so with Baker. Instead we actually see his face! The right side of his face. And we see the side of his body, not his back side.

Don't look at the people far from Baker, but close to him. (For a fair and accurate comparison.) The young woman whose footsteps I trace with a red line. (You can see her on the very right when the camera pans to the right.) Also the woman in all black following behind her. They are headed for the sidewalk. And we see their butts and backs-of-heads. Also the very tall man, who at this time is facing both Baker and the sidewalk... we see the back of his head and his butt. Yet with Baker we see the only the right side of his face and the right side of his body.

With this in mind, I just don't understand how anybody can believe Baker is running anywhere close to toward-the-sidewalk at this point of the clip.

Click to enlarge!

bakers_final_step_zpssgb8s4n3.gif

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Chris,

Let me explain why I believe Baker was never very close to the man you identify as Truly.

First look and the clip here. Accept for the moment that the blue line does indeed represent the path of Baker's footsteps. It is clear that Truly is several feet away from the line. In fact, we can see his shadow rising up the curb and onto the sidewalk. Whereas when Baker was nearest Truly, his shadow was several feet from hitting the sidewalk.

So not only was Truly farther to the west (away from the blue line) than Baker, he was also much closer to the sidewalk than Baker was.

Click to enlarge!

bakers_final_step_zpssgb8s4n3.gif

My remaining task now is to convince you that the blue line does indeed represent the path of Baker's feet. Well, I'm in luck here. Because it turns out that, at the point in time when Baker was nearest Truly, Baker's toe touching the ground can be seen. In my original post I identified it in this still:

bakers_step_2_zpsa6rqsqnk.jpg

I know it's hard to see that that is Bakers foot (and toe) in the still. But single step through the animated GIF yourself and you will be convinced it is.

My blue line in the animated GIF lands right on top of that point, where Baker's toe is touching the ground.

Therefore, I conclude, Baker was never close to Truly in his mad dash.

There's another reason I believe Baker was never close to Truly. And that is because my blue-line of Baker's path shows that he was following the crosswalk... at least the way the crosswalk is painted today. (I believe he was a couple feet outside the crosswalk, but following its direction. Unless the crosswalk was wider back in his day.) And yet, judging by the direction of Truly's shadow, he appears to be standing straight out from the west half (west wall, actually) of the TSBD entrance. (The people's shadows coincidentally point in lines roughly perpendicular to the sidewalk and face of the building.) The two were never near each other.

Edited by Sandy Larsen

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David Lifton - did you tell Ron Ecker that you thought officer Baker was supposed to kill Oswald?

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What I find most revealing is the Very Tall Man, with his backside to us, is clearly headed in the direction of the TSBD steps, and Baker actually crosses his path in the final moments we are able to see him. How can you cross someone's path if you are not travelling at a right angle to his course?

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DVP,

Here is a GIF that shows that Baker's shadow rising up the curb occurs, not during his final step that is parallel with the curb, but rather at the end of the step prior to that. Note that my blue line at that point in time does indicate that Baker is still approaching the sidewalk/curb.

In the very first frame of this clip, you can see Baker's head just above very Tall Man's left shoulder. This is just before Baker's right foot lands on the pavement with his body still moving forward, at an angle relative to the curb. It is his very next step that is pretty much parallel to the curb.

Click to enlarge!

bakers_shadow_on_curb_zpshndvywt3.gif

Edited by Sandy Larsen

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What I find most revealing is the Very Tall Man, with his backside to us, is clearly headed in the direction of the TSBD steps, and Baker actually crosses his path in the final moments we are able to see him. How can you cross someone's path if you are not travelling at a right angle to his course?

You are right, sir!

If Baker is running toward the sidewalk, then Very Tall Man must be facing the west. Does anybody believe Very Tall Man is facing the west as Baker passes behind him? (This is when Very Tall Man is facing both Baker and the face of the TSBD.)

Click to enlarge!

bakers_shadow_on_curb_zpshndvywt3.gif

Edited by Sandy Larsen

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Suppose Baker was heading for the TSBD but planned to follow the crosswalk to the front corner of the building, follow along its side, and enter via the rear entrance rather than the front. A shooter would be unlikely to exit the front of the building, particularly if he had to push his way through a crowd making a spectacle of himself.

Baker could have quickly changed his mind and entered via the front, or continued to the corner of the building, decided it would take too long to get to the rear entrance, or dare I say it -- actually entered through the rear door. This would be unacceptable to the required timeline and could not be mentioned.

I don't recall Baker's initial statement. Did he indicate that he entered via the front door?

Tom

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BTW,

What software is everyone using to make/work on these GIFs?

Tom

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Suppose Baker was heading for the TSBD but planned to follow the crosswalk to the front corner of the building, follow along its side, and enter via the rear entrance rather than the front. A shooter would be unlikely to exit the front of the building, particularly if he had to push his way through a crowd making a spectacle of himself.

Baker could have quickly changed his mind and entered via the front, or continued to the corner of the building, decided it would take too long to get to the rear entrance, or dare I say it -- actually entered through the rear door. This would be unacceptable to the required timeline and could not be mentioned.

I don't recall Baker's initial statement. Did he indicate that he entered via the front door?

Tom

Tom,

Here is Baker's 11/22 statement:

Friday November 22, 1963 I was riding motorcycle escort for the President of the United States. At approximately 12:30 pm I was on Houston Street and the President's car had made a left turn from Houston onto Elm Street. Just as I approached Elm Street and Houston I heard three shots. I realized those shots were rifle shots and I began to try to figure out where they came from. I decided the shots had come from the building on the northwest corner of Elm and Houston. This building is used by the Board of Education for book storage. I jumped off my motor and ran inside the building. As I entered the door I saw several people standing around. I asked these people where the stairs were. A man stepped forward and stated he was the building manager and that he would show me where the stairs were. I followed the man to the rear of the building and he said, "Let's take the elevator." The elevator was hung several floors up so we used the stairs instead. As we reached the third or fourth floor I saw a man walking away from the stairway. I called to the man and he turned around and came back toward me. The manager said, "I know that man, he works here." I then turned the man loose and went up to the top floor. The man I saw was a white man approximately 30 years old, 5'9", 165 pounds, dark hair and wearing a light brown jacket.

Baker implies that he entered the front of the TSBD by saying that he "followed the man to the rear of the building."

I tend to find first-day statements more credible than later ones. So from reading this it appears that Baker didn't spend a great deal of time doing whatever else he was doing when he passed by the TSBD entrance. Well, maybe he did spend some time doing something else, and didn't mention it because it wasn't fruitful. But I admit that his statement makes it seem like he didn't spend a lot of time doing something else.

EXCEPT for the fact that he saw several people standing inside the TSBD when he entered. To me that says that some time elapsed before his entry. Yeah, I'm pretty sure about that. (But I can be convinced otherwise with good arguments.)

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Chris,

Let me explain why I believe Baker was never very close to the man you identify as Truly.

First look and the clip here. Accept for the moment that the blue line does indeed represent the path of Baker's footsteps. It is clear that Truly is several feet away from the line. In fact, we can see his shadow rising up the curb and onto the sidewalk. Whereas when Baker was nearest Truly, his shadow was several feet from hitting the sidewalk.

So not only was Truly farther to the west (away from the blue line) than Baker, he was also much closer to the sidewalk than Baker was.

Click to enlarge!

bakers_final_step_zpssgb8s4n3.gif

My remaining task now is to convince you that the blue line does indeed represent the path of Baker's feet. Well, I'm in luck here. Because it turns out that, at the point in time when Baker was nearest Truly, Baker's toe touching the ground can be seen. In my original post I identified it in this still:

bakers_step_2_zpsa6rqsqnk.jpg

I know it's hard to see that that is Bakers foot (and toe) in the still. But single step through the animated GIF yourself and you will be convinced it is.

My blue line in the animated GIF lands right on top of that point, where Baker's toe is touching the ground.

Therefore, I conclude, Baker was never close to Truly in his mad dash.

There's another reason I believe Baker was never close to Truly. And that is because my blue-line of Baker's path shows that he was following the crosswalk... at least the way the crosswalk is painted today. (I believe he was a couple feet outside the crosswalk, but following its direction. Unless the crosswalk was wider back in his day.) And yet, judging by the direction of Truly's shadow, he appears to be standing straight out from the center or west half of the TSBD entrance. (The people's shadows coincidentally point in lines roughly perpendicular to the sidewalk and face of the building.) The two were never near each other.

Sandy,

Does Baker change his trajectory as he passes Truly?

Are you trying to convey that if Baker doesn't change his trajectory, he doesn't run into Truly?

Where do you believe Baker and Truly cross paths using this 1964 photo?

Path.jpg

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BTW,

What software is everyone using to make/work on these GIFs?

Tom

Tom,

Not that I recommend what I'm using, but I use the Lunapic.com website for drawing lines and text on animated GIFs. It's actually not bad, but it hates anything over 10 GB in size. Also, it doesn't like large pictures (in numbers of pixels). So if I find have trouble, the first thing I do is resize the photo to a smaller size. Then it works. One really great feature of Lunapic that it has multiple levels of undo.

When I'm done with Lunapic, I use EzGif.com to make the pixel size large again. Doing this increases the file size, but the limit on EzGif is 16 GB.

I also use Lunapic to extract individual frames and to adjust the global frame display time.

I also use a program I've installed on my PC call Microsoft GIF Animator. This is useful for individual frame display times, so parts of the video play back at different speeds. It's also useful for copying and moving frames around. And for single stepping the video. This program is no longer available, but I'd be happy to share it. It's less than 2 MB in size. To install, just move it to the folder of your choice and make a shortcut to the executable and put that where you want. It's easy to learn and use. But it crashes if the file size is too large. I'm not sure what the limit is, but it is somewhere between 10 GB and 14 GB. If the file works on Lunapic, then it works with Microsoft GIF animator.

Judging by the work Chris Davidson does, I assume he's got much better software. If he doesn't, then he must have an awful lot of time and energy to accomplish what he does.

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Chris,

Let me explain why I believe Baker was never very close to the man you identify as Truly.

First look and the clip here. Accept for the moment that the blue line does indeed represent the path of Baker's footsteps. It is clear that Truly is several feet away from the line. In fact, we can see his shadow rising up the curb and onto the sidewalk. Whereas when Baker was nearest Truly, his shadow was several feet from hitting the sidewalk.

So not only was Truly farther to the west (away from the blue line) than Baker, he was also much closer to the sidewalk than Baker was.

Click to enlarge!

bakers_final_step_zpssgb8s4n3.gif

My remaining task now is to convince you that the blue line does indeed represent the path of Baker's feet. Well, I'm in luck here. Because it turns out that, at the point in time when Baker was nearest Truly, Baker's toe touching the ground can be seen. In my original post I identified it in this still:

bakers_step_2_zpsa6rqsqnk.jpg

I know it's hard to see that that is Bakers foot (and toe) in the still. But single step through the animated GIF yourself and you will be convinced it is.

My blue line in the animated GIF lands right on top of that point, where Baker's toe is touching the ground.

Therefore, I conclude, Baker was never close to Truly in his mad dash.

There's another reason I believe Baker was never close to Truly. And that is because my blue-line of Baker's path shows that he was following the crosswalk... at least the way the crosswalk is painted today. (I believe he was a couple feet outside the crosswalk, but following its direction. Unless the crosswalk was wider back in his day.) And yet, judging by the direction of Truly's shadow, he appears to be standing straight out from the center or west half of the TSBD entrance. (The people's shadows coincidentally point in lines roughly perpendicular to the sidewalk and face of the building.) The two were never near each other.

Sandy,

Does Baker change his trajectory as he passes Truly?

Baker begins changing trajectory before his nearest encounter with Truly, and continues to change after he's passed him. (But not because Truly is in his way.) If there is any single abrupt change, I believe it would be as he passes behind Very Tall Man.

Just look at the blue lines on my GIFs. Those convey where I believe Baker's feet are at any given time. Though I do have two sets of blue lines, the first being where he would have been had he not veered to the right. The other is his true path at all times.

Are you trying to convey that if Baker doesn't change his trajectory, he doesn't run into Truly?

That's right. If he doesn't change trajectory, he ends up roughly at the postal box to the right of the TSBD entrance.

Where do you believe Baker and Truly cross paths using this 1964 photo?

I don't believe they cross paths at all. See my comment below.

Path.jpg

(See the beginning of my reply above.)

In your red line above marked "Motorcycle," that line ends at the signal light post. Then a new red line continues across the Elm extension. The near end of the that red line, at the post, is where I believe Baker began his dash across the street. However, the far end of that line doesn't match where Baker would have ended had he not veered to the right. Had he not veered to the right, he would have ended up approximately at the postal box.

Now, I do believe that the far end of that red line does correspond to something significant. I believe that Truly was standing on that red line, or close to it, about four or five feet from the sidewalk.

BTW, I don't see any crosswalk lines painted on the pavement. Do you (or anybody else) know if there really were no lines? There does seem to be a change in the color of the pavement where the line should have been painted.

Edited by Sandy Larsen

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Baker takes approx 6 steps from the annex edge to Truly. 6x3.5ft =21ft

Another 1.5 till we see his shadow upon the curb. 1.5 x 3.5 = 5.25ft

If Baker's shadow is approx 6ft, that's a total distance of 32.25ft

The angled path from curb to curb is 33.4ft

That puts Truly about 12.4 ft on angle, away from the TSBD curb.

The Truly X LOS(line of sight) is aligned with the west end opening of the TSBD staircase.

X.jpg

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If Baker's shadow is approx 6ft, that's a total distance of 32.25ft

Chris,

FWIW, quite a while ago I had to calculate the altitude/azimuth of the sun on this date in DP:

31.59 degrees altitude

151.28 degrees azimuth

assuming Baker's height is 6' (I'm guessing - but he appears to be at least reasonably tall...)

Shadow Length = 6'/tan(31.59) = 9.75'

Since I already had the data, I figured I'd post it...

Tom

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Suppose Baker was heading for the TSBD but planned to follow the crosswalk to the front corner of the building, follow along its side, and enter via the rear entrance rather than the front. A shooter would be unlikely to exit the front of the building, particularly if he had to push his way through a crowd making a spectacle of himself.

Baker could have quickly changed his mind and entered via the front, or continued to the corner of the building, decided it would take too long to get to the rear entrance, or dare I say it -- actually entered through the rear door. This would be unacceptable to the required timeline and could not be mentioned.

I don't recall Baker's initial statement. Did he indicate that he entered via the front door?

Tom

Sandy,

Thanks for the quote.

Tom

Tom,

Here is Baker's 11/22 statement:

Friday November 22, 1963 I was riding motorcycle escort for the President of the United States. At approximately 12:30 pm I was on Houston Street and the President's car had made a left turn from Houston onto Elm Street. Just as I approached Elm Street and Houston I heard three shots. I realized those shots were rifle shots and I began to try to figure out where they came from. I decided the shots had come from the building on the northwest corner of Elm and Houston. This building is used by the Board of Education for book storage. I jumped off my motor and ran inside the building. As I entered the door I saw several people standing around. I asked these people where the stairs were. A man stepped forward and stated he was the building manager and that he would show me where the stairs were. I followed the man to the rear of the building and he said, "Let's take the elevator." The elevator was hung several floors up so we used the stairs instead. As we reached the third or fourth floor I saw a man walking away from the stairway. I called to the man and he turned around and came back toward me. The manager said, "I know that man, he works here." I then turned the man loose and went up to the top floor. The man I saw was a white man approximately 30 years old, 5'9", 165 pounds, dark hair and wearing a light brown jacket.

Baker implies that he entered the front of the TSBD by saying that he "followed the man to the rear of the building."

I tend to find first-day statements more credible than later ones. So from reading this it appears that Baker didn't spend a great deal of time doing whatever else he was doing when he passed by the TSBD entrance. Well, maybe he did spend some time doing something else, and didn't mention it because it wasn't fruitful. But I admit that his statement makes it seem like he didn't spend a lot of time doing something else.

EXCEPT for the fact that he saw several people standing inside the TSBD when he entered. To me that says that some time elapsed before his entry. Yeah, I'm pretty sure about that. (But I can be convinced otherwise with good arguments.)

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