Dawn Meredith

W, like his daddy, is a terrorist. So of course they will protect each other. Do you by chance get Keith Oberman in your part of the world? He is the only person on tv with the balls to take on W, his immoral war, his lies and call him for what he is. I am amazed every night. That he is still on, that someone has not shot him. I positively love this man. Dawn

So Ashton: Let me see if I have this straight: You discount an entrance throat wound (on a different thread); see the head shot as solely from behind? ( I don't need Stone to tell me what I see with my eyes: Backward motion, in response to a hit). I am not certain if you just love to be argumentative for its own sake or if you are coming rather close to endorsing a position not terribly removed from that of the Warren Commission. Most odd, this. Dawn

Hi Erick, and welcome to the forum. A very interesting piece. Have you studied the head movements, with the neck as a pivot, vs. the full backward jerk of the torso that clearly pivots from the pelvis/hips? If so, would the ballistics you have described account, by force isolated to the head, for the full body motion, and if so, how? Ashton I am isolating my comments only to the immediate movement of the head upon bullet impact. I will concede that after the initial impact, neurological spasms could have been a factor in any other bodily movements. Excellent. I've done a small anim from the Zapruder film, below, focusing on "the immediate movement of the head upon bullet impact" to see if you could expand on that a bit. First, allow me to credit, then apologize to, John Dolva: I've adopted his ingenious stablization technique for this short series—hence the credit—but haven't done it nearly as well as he does—hence the apologies. I feel it will suffice for these purposes, though. I have the first three of four frames of the anim set to 1.5 second intervals so it goes slow enough to see, then the last frame lingers for 3 seconds before the anim loops. In the first frame—Zapruder 312, immediately prior to impact—I have scribed a white line along the silhouette of JFK's back and head. In the first bullet impact frame—Zapruder 313—I have done the same thing, but left the outline from the prior frame in place, connecting them with motion lines. That stays essentially the same through the next frame—Zapruder 314—but there I have added an arrow to what clearly appears to be ejecta, which arrow happens to align almost exactly with the motion lines showing the sudden change of head position. Finally, Zapruder 315 shows JFK's right arm swinging up after the side of his head has been blown out, as his body arcs back, bringing his head almost to the same position as Zapruder 312. Then the sequence starts again and loops: I'm not really up on ballistics, so since this thread is "The Head Wound Explained," I hoped you could explain the ballistics to me of a frontal shot that would throw his head forward to that degree in the time of a single frame, and send ejecta that far forward in the same direction of the head movement by the next frame. Ashton Ashton, I assume for the purpose of this thread that we are proceeding on the assumption that the Zapruder film actually depicts the terrible event within the capabilities of 8mm color film, and that the film has not been altered. There is a great deal of controversy as to whether the film has been altered, which would properly be a subject for another thread. Pick up a stone and throw it forward like a baseball into water. Some of the water will splash forward of the stone’s impact and some will splash ahead and around the point of impact. Crime scene specialists and forensic scientists will tell you that when an individual is shot, there is ejecta coming backwards out of the wound. That is why, at close range, the shooter will get sprayed with blood and tissue. Mrs. Kennedy would not have been reaching for a chunk of the President’s head on the trunk of the limo if the shot had come from the rear. Any chunk of tissue would likely have ended up in the front seat rather than on the trunk if the head shot came from the rear. Dallas Police Officer Bobby Hargis was on a motorcycle behind and to the left of Mrs. Kennedy when the head shot occurred. He was splattered with blood and brain tissue. This also indicates a shot from the front and to the right. As regards the head movement upon the point of impact, remember, the President had already been shot in the upper torso. Undoubtedly he was reacting to that wound when the fatal bullet arrived. It was a natural reaction to the torso wound and the sound of gunfire, to hunch forward, which is what appears to be occurring as the limo appears after passing the Stemmons Freeway sign. The overall head movement is not just backwards, it is also to the left and downward, towards Mrs. Kennedy, which is consistent with a shooter in front and to the right. The head recedes from the camera. This is what appears to be happening from frame 312 to 315. Each frame of the Zapruder film is 1/40th of a second. Moving objects will be slightly blurred in each frame. It’s not as photographically accurate as a video tape. A slight, rapid head movement in reaction to the initial impact will not be depicted as accurately as the overall head movement over many film frames. We cannot see what is occurring between each film frame. Erick Erick, Ashton: You're both right. JFK was shot in the head from behind and from the front. The "hunching forward" to which you (Erick) refer is more like lurching forward, a response to a shot to the head, immediately preceeding the shot from the front, blowing his head almost off. I make no claim to being any sort of expert in ballistics, and as you -(Erick)- well know I hate guns and have never fired one in my life. I base my claim of two shots to the president's head solely on the Zapruder film. Dawn

John: Why would you even want a CIA apologist, disinformation creep like McAdams around here? Dawn

Peter is right. That is why this case is not likely to ever be solved. Not to say we should just give up. When we give up they truly win. Dawn

When I think of the term "the perfect murder" for me the implications are that someone was murdered and that the murderer so carefully planned that he or she was never apprehended. Simply got away with it. The 60's assassinations JFK, MFK, RFK all the related witnesses' murders fall into this category. Dawn ps Happy birthday forum members and happy hollidays to all. "Oh holy Night, the star was brighly shining.."

Dawn, Evidence wise, you are correct, but there is an institutional unwillingness to solve any of the cases, especially RFK because it involves MLULTRA and LAPD. An RFK Grand Jury Petiton went nowhere because it was an indictment of the LAPD and no Asst. DA or DA is going to go up against people he has to work with every day. BK Bill: Garrison did. Spargue tried to. Lesar does so much. There are decent attorneys out there who are just uneducated. I think if more people wrote about RFK there would be more interest. Perhaps the movie "Bobby" will spark some interest, tho I understand that id does not deal with the conspiracy issue. I wonder if Stone would do another movie. "JFK" got an entire new generation involved. His "Nixon" was remarkable, as well. He is one hell of a film-maker. And there is so much to work with here. I wonder if Stone is aware of RFK's and JFK's involvement in the films "Seven Days in May" and Manchurian Candidate". Errie, prophetic. We have the damn evidence here and it's a simple case to lay out. Start with Sirhan's "trial" where his defense attorneys had him frikken STIPULATE that he killed RFK. In a trial you begin with the presumption of INNOCENCE. Someday, when I can make the time, I would like to write about the so- called "defense" people like Sirhan, Ruby, Ray at al received. (A huge project from the work I have already begun). Horrible defense, prior to Dr Pepper (Ray) and Teeter (Sirhan) that is. Man it really sucks that Phil Melanson is gone. His book on RFK taught me so much. Dawn

Thank you Anh. It was my birthday today (and my father was a carpenter!) and my sons gave me a Mr Happy tie.....and Mr Grumpy socks. Take the change out of that. What a funny story Derek. (myth or not). Have a safe, and happy holiday everyone. Dawn

If I hear ONE more person attempt to argue that JFK was killed by "rogue elements of the CIA" I am going to f*****g scream. "Rogue elements" do not take out the Commander -in- chief. I doubt that "rogue elements" actually do much of consequence. I wonder where this idea even originated. (Probably Langley central) But it has always brought to my mind Tony Summers, who Jim Garrison called "One of the CIA's more accommodating whores". For those lamebrains who perpetuate this assinine myth I can only agree with the DA. Dawn

John: That is disgusting. I was disturbed by your first post and intended to comment. Obviously they are attacking you for your conspiracy views. Wikipedia is just becomeing one more Mockingbird entity, only on the web. I hope this censorship and slander does garner some publicity. Dawn

Oswald was sheep-dipped two ways to Sunday as an agent of Fidel -- which indicates to me a very narrow purpose. We'll never know the elaborate file on Oswald that David Phillips possessed in Mexico City, but Hoover's Oswald-the-Fidelista file sure was impressive. I just can't buy the idea that JFK's death was arranged in that manner if the sole idea was to kill him. Can you imagine how pissed off Aristotle Onassis was when he found out that THEY blew JFK's brains out right in the face of HIS, Ari O's, GIRLFRIEND?? Ari let it slide because [cue Al Pacino] it was business, Sonny. Cliff: I agree absolutely that LHO was so obviously sheep-dipped. His so-called pro commie leanings were so transparent from the start that I find it difficult to believe that anyone ever bought such crap. When I was doing research in 1974 for a college paper on this subject I came across a speech that Castro gave the day after the assassination. It's an incredibly aware speech. This remarkable speech was re-printed in Dr. Marty Schotz' wonderful "History Will Not Absolve Us". Castro "kew" why Kennedy was killed and his pro-peace stance was at the heart of it. Something the cold warriers did not want any part of. The speech is way too long for me to type and my printer with the scanner is not working, so if anyone should have this book and can post it I would be most grateful. It begins on p 54 of Marty's book and is titled "Concerning the Facts and Consequences of the Tragic Death of President John F. Kennedy". Castro knew. JFK Jr. traveled to Cuba and met with Castro. I have no doubt that JFK's assassination was discussed. And the bastards then saw to it that one more "plane accident" would render JFK Jr.'s future political career dead. They just keep doing it and getting away with it. Whoever said the CIA (military intel etc. ) no longer kills got it wrong, imho. Dawn

Oswald was sheep-dipped two ways to Sunday as an agent of Fidel -- which indicates to me a very narrow purpose. We'll never know the elaborate file on Oswald that David Phillips possessed in Mexico City, but Hoover's Oswald-the-Fidelista file sure was impressive. I just can't buy the idea that JFK's death was arranged in that manner if the sole idea was to kill him. Can you imagine how pissed off Aristotle Onassis was when he found out that THEY blew JFK's brains out right in the face of HIS, Ari O's, GIRLFRIEND?? Ari let it slide because [cue Al Pacino] it was business, Sonny. Cliff: I agree absolutely that LHO was so obviously sheep-dipped. His so-called pro commie leanings were so transparent from the start that I find it difficult to believe that anyone ever bought such crap. When I was doing research in 1974 for a college paper on this subject I came across a speech that Castro gave the day after the assassination. It's an incredibly aware speech. This remarkable speech was re-printed in Dr. Marty Schotz' wonderful "History Will Not Absolve Us". Castro "kew" why Kennedy was killed and his pro-peace stance was at the heart of it. Something the cold warriers did not want any part of. The speech is way too long for me to type and my printer with the scanner is not working, so if anyone should have this book and can post it I would be most grateful. It begins on p 54 of Marty's book and is titled "Concerning the Facts and Consequences of the Tragic Death of President John F. Kennedy". Castro knew. JFK Jr. traveled to Cuba and met with Castro. I have no doubt that JFK's assassination was discussed. And the bastards then saw to it that one more "plane accident" would render JFK Jr.'s future political career dead. They just keep doing it and getting away with it. Whoever said the CIA (military intel etc. ) no longer kills got it wrong, imho. Dawn

Although a massive amount of research has been conducted toward the solving of the JFK assassination, I have long believed that the much easier case to crack is that of his brother Bobby. Unlike Dallas, with the hopelessly botched autopsy, we have with RFK a real autopsy. Dr Thomas Noguchi's finding that the kill shot was behind the Senator's right ear, as close as one inch away is PROOF that RFK was not murdered by Sirhan Sirhan. Until his death in '05 Sirhan's attorney Larry Teeter was providing his imfamous client excellent representation. Does anyone know if anyone has taken over for Teeter? We know that Thane Eugene Cesar was directly behind Bobby, and has admitted to having a weapon drawn. Perhaps Cesar was, like Sirhan, a MC. In spite of massive destruction of evidence by the LAPD I have a belief that it is still possible to solve this crime. And it would be wonderful if it could happen while Dr. Noguchi is still alive. Dawn

I disagree and do believe that Cuba was a cause. A cause, but THE cause, in a very simplistic way, was JFK's overall workings towards peace, not just with Cuba, but Russia, and attempting to end the war in Viet nam. Sadly, peace is never popular in this country with the powers that be. Some claim these pro-peace changes were the result of the acid Jack allegedly took, but I am more inclined to believe it was his own horrific experience in WW2 that motivated his sincere efforts at making this planet a safer and more peaceful place to raise our children. Dawn

Yes, imho, Dallas was the done deal, one way or another. They would have done whatever it took. Dawn

I could not agree more. George is still the most decent man ever to run for president (notwithstanding the Kennedy brothers). Interesting discussion here guys. Stranger yet- I agree with John and Pat's words rather than my husband Erick's re the money made off the immoral, evil war in Iraq. Like many married couples we simply agree to disagree on this entire issue. Dawn

_____________________________ Ed, Extremely good posting. Thank you. Most interesting - AND plausible - to me in terms of an assassination is item #4 which is a very workable modus operandi. Yours Truly, Diana's work with the poor, the third world, the sick, the weak, the maimed, against land-mines and in so many ways making the rest of the 'royals' look [as they are!] like rich, arrogant pigs unconcerned at all with those not of blue blood and rich as hell....she was bumped-off for all that and daring to have an affair with the soon-to-be-enemy [an Arab]. In ref to a post above, Lennon was killed by the same 'gang'...he had gotten off his addiction [they had set upon him] to drugs and was recording new record and it was going to be very political. "How many deaths will it take til we know that too many people have died?" (Blowing In the Wind -Bob Dylan) As long as these bastards can continue to get away with just killing, they will do so, at their whim. Who is there to stop them? Our goverenment? Our media? The major difference, to me, between our country and totalitarian run countries is that in this country people actually believe that we have all this freedom from tyranny, a free press, some democratic ideal. It's a farce. The openly fascist countries are just more honest with their populace. Dawn

Is this a trick question? On a serious note I think this question is designed to generate a discussion as to who done it. As interesting and illuminating as it would be to learn the answer to this question I think that The Company, et al, has provided so many false trails and rabbit holes that we have been chasing our tails these last 43 years in an attempt to learn the *who* when I think we now need to continue this valid pursuit, but also put a lot of focus on trying to educate the masses about why he was killed and who did NOT kill him. The big lie. That the mass media continues to tell. Yet, as long as I can remember huge numbers of people - at one point nearly 90%- feel that the truth about 11/22/63 was not told. People have been dumbed- down by the whoring media but poeple can smell a rat. The other important aspect to consider is why this is still important today- that it was a coup d etat and the forces that pulled this off are now in the process of ascertaining that the Constitution be shredded. We may never get the killers but we must still seek justice. Dawn

In the early to mid 90's I began to uncover some very serious corruption in the legal system in Austin Tx. It was downright scary. At this time I was close friends with Richard Bartholomew and would tell him of my discoveries, but, he was working with J Harrison on the Wallace case and was sworn to secrecy. So all Richard could ever tell me was "just wait, something big is in the works". I met J on 11/21/97 during my first trip to Dallas. And was immediately let in on all the secrets. Including the above intimidation of jurors. I love this town but....this stuff is pure evil. Dawn

Ashton: Of course they were. JFK was angering them and even desiring to abolish them: "scatter them in thousand pieces" After he fired Dulles and Cabal he began making plans for detente with Cuba, while the CIA was trying to murder Castro. There is no doubt that these plans were discovered. CIA agent Gary Underhill claimed that he knew that the CIA was very involved and told friends of this, also told them he was in fear of his own life. Died in May 1964- gunshot. "Suicide", of course, except the wrong hand was used. That old sense of humor thing If the CIA was not heavily involved in this murder, why were all avenues to CIA records slammed during HSCA? Sprague was going to go after these scum. But Sprague got the axe. Blakey- Mr. the- mafia- did it- came in with a predisposition to this particular solution of the case. Even with that, HSCA mainly rubber stamped the WC, except that they said there was a conspiracy "probably Mafia" that LHO fired the 3 shots, that there was a 4th shot that "missed". Ya sure. Dawn

Well dear, let be the first to welcome you to the forum. Now it's public that some of your political leanings are- ohmygod- Republican! Imagine that, married to me, the radical left -winger. Needless to say we have some interesting political disagreements, err, I mean discussions. I hope you find here the wonderful community that I have enjoyed for now more than two years, and I know that your knowledge of this case, and other political conspiracies, will be greatly advanced. Thanks for joining. Now you don't even have to get me a Christmas present. Dawn