Cliff Varnell

On 11/17/2023 at 9:47 AM, Michael Griffith said:

Perhaps an even more plausible theory is that the back wound was caused by a large fragment from the shot that struck near the right rear of JFK's limo early in the shooting. This would explain the back wound's slightly upward trajectory, the wound's shallow depth, and Custer's account of seeing a large fragment fall from JFK's back when the body was lifted for the taking of x-rays. 

Glen Bennett’s account counterfeits this theory of an early back wound.

On 11/17/2023 at 9:47 AM, Michael Griffith said:

The most likely, really the only plausible, explanation for the two back-of-head bullet fragments is that they are ricochet fragments from the bullet that several witnesses said struck just behind and to the right side of JFK's limo early in the shooting. The same shot may well have sent a large fragment streaking toward JFK's back.

Bennett could not have witnessed an early hit.

On 11/16/2023 at 7:49 AM, Michael Griffith said:

The main point of the chapter is that the dented shell could not have fired a bullet on 11/22/63. 

The shallow back wound could have been caused by a short shot, a shot that was traveling at a greatly reduced speed. Since the throat shot was the first hit, JFK's back muscles would have been very tight from stress and tension--this would have helped to prevent the back-wound bullet from penetrating more than a short distance. (JFK starts the motion of reaching for his throat at around Z202 in response to the throat shot, long before he is obviously hit in the back and jolted forward at Z226-232.)

Not obvious at all.  Gil Jesus has speculated JFK was trying to cough up the throat bullet.  SSA Glen Bennett wrote that afternoon that he saw JFK hit in the back right before the headshot.  He wasn’t in a position to see a shot circa Z232, as proven by Willis 5 and Altgens 6.

Are we supposed to believe a shooter intended to fire a short load — which would have traveled 90 yards in swirling wind with no appreciable loss of elevation?

Another crock to obfuscate the back wound.

On 11/14/2023 at 4:06 AM, Michael Griffith said:

This is good news, very good news.

It’s good news that belief in the LN doubled in the past 22 years?

I pin that on the CT Complexity Fetish.

Do you discuss the extant physical evidence (bullet holes in clothes) in your book, Michael?

15 hours ago, Roger Odisio said:

I was at Duquesne remotely.  Most time slots had two and sometimes three concurrent sessions so I didn't see everything (though I have the right to watch recordings of sessions until the end of the year).  I don't remember any discussions of bullet holes in JFK's shirt and suit coat.  A perusal of the sessions I didn't see doesn't indicate that evidence was discussed there either.

Thanks, Roger.

The False Mystery Industry grinds on.

What’s the point of establishing two shooters by citing the clothing evidence when you could spend 90 minutes making a case it takes an advanced degree or two to verify?

Any mention of the extant physical evidence in the JFKA at Lancer or Duquesne?  Anywhere?

I promised Cory Santos I’d buy him lunch if the extant physical evidence (bullet defects in JFK’s clothes) is cited at any conference  or media event (Black Op Radio, Kennedys and King) related to the 60th Anniversary of the JFKA.

 I’m counting on fellow Ed Forum posters to keep me apprised.

What kind of lunch?  

A brat and a beer at a Las Vegas Athletics game.

1 hour ago, Chris Bristow said:

I'm not saying this to end on a snarky note but the rehashing of the head wound issue has become extremely boring. Repeating it over and over just benefits the skeptics. You all cannot allow the debate to resolve itself, because you have already lost. 

👏😎

1 hour ago, Pat Speer said:

No. The clothing evidence is central to all of it. The clothing evidence, the autopsy measurements,  and photos all confirm one another,

No, Pat, the bullet holes in the clothes are at least two inches lower.

This distinction is crucial.  The authenticated cervical x-ray shows damage which could only have been caused by the throat entrance shot.  You want to attribute the damage at T1 to the back shot, an egregious obfuscation.

1 hour ago, Pat Speer said:

and all destroy the SBT and the single-assassin conclusion. 

A fact established in 1966 when Gaeton Fonzi rubbed the clothing defects in Arlen Specter’s face.

1 hour ago, Pat Speer said:

LOL. 

One question. 

1. The measurements in the autopsy protocol place the wound at T-!, maybe even lower. Can you show us how a wound that low supports the single-bullet theory,

Who cares about the SBT?  The issue is the nature of the throat and back wounds and what those may tell us about the perps.

1 hour ago, Pat Speer said:

and, assuming that you can not, offer us an explanation as to why "they" would fake a photo so damaging to the proposition the back wound connected to the throat wound? 

They were throwing crap on the wall to see what would stick. The Rydberg drawing has a location in the neck, and the final autopsy report posits 2 different back wound locations.

Somehow you think this garbage outweighs the clothing evidence, the contemporaneous written accounts of witnesses in position of authority, the properly prepared medical evidence, and consensus witness statements.

1 hour ago, Pat Speer said:

This is disgusting . Few, if any, have spent more time on this issue than myself, and my website presents the earliest statements of the witnesses which suggested the wound was on the back of the head. 

Your defense of the Fox 5 autopsy photo is destroyed every time I set you straight.

On 11/10/2023 at 10:50 AM, Roger Odisio said:

This adds to the holes in JFK's clothes story that you so doggedly bring up (thanks for that). eliminating the WR claim of a sole shooter.

The keys to effective promotion are simplicity and repetition.

Republicans and Lone Nut Advocates excel at this.

Democrats and JFKA Conspiracy Advocates are terrible at marketing superior positions, the messaging all over the map.

Consensus regarding the JFK head wound(s) doesn’t seem possible.  Was he hit in the head once, twice, thrice?

Consensus on the T3 back wound and throat entrance wound, however, would upend the Answer the Question of Conspiracy Parlor Game, and bring down the JFKA False Mystery Industry.

Pointing at Salandria and Fonzi and saying, “What they said,” isn’t enough to write books and speeches about.  Where’s the fun in that?

Consensus regarding the JFK head wound(s) doesn’t seem possible.  Was he hit once, twice, thrice?

Consensus on the T3 back wound and throat entrance wound, however, would upend the Answer the Question of Conspiracy Parlor Game, and bring down the JFKA False Mystery Industry.

Pointing at Salandria and Fonzi and saying, “What they said,” isn’t enough to write books and speeches about.  Where’s the fun in that?

4 hours ago, Ron Bulman said:

It is gratifying to see that after all the CIA-Operation Mockingbird did, as well as the current owners of the MSM, 65% of us still flip the bird at the big lie.

Op Mock was more active in the last Century than these days — and belief in the LN was in the teens back then.  

Belief in conspiracy dropped 20% from 2000 to 2013.  Can’t blame that on Op Mock, which was never effective in the first place.  

Can’t pin it on age — in the current Gallup 18 - 34 has the strongest belief in conspiracy.

In this Century, what did post graduate types likely see whenever they researched the JFKA on the ‘Net?  Jim DiEugenio et al bickering with David Von Pein et al over 500 rabbit holes, Von Pein et al selling a simple “Oswald Acted Alone” while DiEugenio et al pitched “Super Human Complexity”.

And y’all still at it...

4 hours ago, Cory Santos said:

A smart move. But you still have not answered the question.  

If the letter was never sent, what’s the big deal it’s on White House stationary?

3 hours ago, Larry Hancock said:

We and I have been over and over Tosh Plumlee here in the forum.  I was in contact with him and his family (daughter) back in the Compuserve JFK forum days, even invited her and her friends to present at a Lancer conference.  Then I did extensive research in his documents (most of which consist of his asking to talk to the FBI while in jail for check kiting, aircraft theft or other such charges).  I also did a chronological search of his statements about Dallas and it was obvious he had changed and elaborated his story over the years...considerably.  I was never able to verify any of his so called intelligence contacts, even the really wild ones he sent me about being recruited at a small airport in the Dallas area (not Red Bird) before he could even fly.  There is little doubt that eventually he did learn to fly and had an active life (after leaving his family) in smuggling and other sketchy affairs as a pilot. 

What really pulled it all together was his providing detailed stories about Dallas, the plans and the abort, with JFK and company knowing he was riding into an ambush - and taking Jackie along - and Plumlee getting all the details on it after the fact when a senior CIA officer flew down to Florida to go over it all and explain it personally to Plumlee.

On the other hand he is a great story teller, very sincere, very flexible, extremely good at pulling elements from elsewhere into his narrative, and his story will never go away - its just too good and fits with two many scenarios promoted over time. 

Larry,

Plumlee’s 2010 EF posts on his “abort team”  flight to Dallas don’t mention Hunt.  Any idea when that became part of his story?

2 hours ago, James DiEugenio said:

I asked a simple question.

Does the show say that Plumlee flew Hunt into Dallas?

John Roselli, not Hunt.

Tosh:  “We took-off before day break on November 21, 1963 expecting to arrive in Tampa about sunup. We were to pick up other personal at Tampa. One of these people was John Roselli, whom I knew.”

2 hours ago, James DiEugenio said:

A trusted source  heard the first installment.

Tosh Plumlee says that he flew Howard Hunt into Dallas.

Can anyone confirm this?

It was Johnny Roselli he flew in with his mis-informed “abort team.”

Not a book I’d recommend tho many do:

Josiah Thompson — Six Seconds in Dallas

Fiction category:

Don Delillo — Libra

James Ellroy — American Tabloid

Vincent Salandria — False Mystery

E. Martin Schotz — History Will Not Absolve Us

On 11/5/2023 at 5:50 AM, Cliff Varnell said:

Smarts are one thing.  Savvy is another.  

We shall see.

Savvy it is!

I hope Mr. Bleau cites the clothing evidence at his Lancer presentation.

1 hour ago, Micah Mileto said:

https://youtu.be/bmSYwBAfzZw?feature=shared

Excellent video!

Micah, I bailed out on that website several years ago.  I used to invite people to turn their head to the right, glance down at the top of their right shoulder, raise and wave their right arm, observe the shirt fabric INDENT.

With parsimony as my North Star, now I invite people to observe the visible shirt collar behind JFK’s neck in Dealey Plaza photos.  JFK’s jacket collar was in a normal position, counterfeiting the claim the shirt and jacket were severely bunched up as required by the SBT.

4 hours ago, Jean Ceulemans said:

There goes 100$ to the fund (or was it dinner for two ?)

 

I’d enjoy buying my friend Cory lunch but Mr. Bleau (or somebody!) has to cite the clothing evidence at a conference or event commemorating the 60th.

On 11/7/2023 at 1:28 AM, Cliff Varnell said:

So of course the evidence that choked up Arlen Specter doesn’t rank as a ”Chokehold.”

I stand corrected.