Chris Davidson

7 hours ago, Chris Davidson said:

Seems like two different films.

Three people.

Two films?

Sounds a lot like a couple of NPIC sessions.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Which one is it?  He initially came alone or he was joined by Schwartz, McCormack and Sorrels.

No mention of Schwartz(partner/lawyer) until after they return from Jamieson's and nothing of McCormack and Sorrels.

What happens to Schwartz between the time his photo is taken(standing in the studio holding the Z camera case) while Z is interviewing on TV until they reach Kodak?

Two rolls of dupe film to take to Jamieson's?

Phil Chamberlain excerpts:

"I don’t remember the exact time, but I think it was about 2:30 when the receptionist, Marilyn Brandon (now Marilyn Jennings), called me and said, "There’s a Mr. Zapruder here in the lobby, who thinks he might have pictures of the shooting". The lobby was on the second floor, almost next to my office, so I quickly walked out and met Mr. Zapruder. 1 He was a heavy-set man, bald on top, with an arc of black hair around the edges. He wore a dark suit, was carrying his camera bag, obviously nervous, and said "I'm not sure what I've got, but I think I was taking pictures when the shooting happened". It was much later that it sunk in that Zapruder didn't realize at the time he was taking pictures that there was a shooting. He was simply taking pictures of the motorcade, and though he heard the shots, and saw the motorcade roar off, since he was looking through the view-finder of the camera, he didn't know what had happened until he heard it on the radio — and wasn't sure what he had pictures of! But he did have a spool of 8rrm Kodachrome film, and somewhere on it, were the pictures he made of the motorcade.

Dan Rather of CBS, in his book "Th'e Camera Never Blinks", states that "...we helped arrange for Eastman Kodak to process the film. This job had to be done by the best equipment. It had to be done fast. And it had to be kept confidential.". This was not so. At the time Zapruder came to Kodak, even he didn't know if he had pictures of the event, let alone Rather. Zapruder was alone, and gave every indication that he had come to the lab on his own volition, not because of urging by someone else.

The Kodachrome machines had not been down long enough to require a new process check or "OK for customers’ film", and although it was very unusual for us to start up a machine for one roll of film, we soon had Zapruder's film spliced into "leader" and started into the machine, with our best processor and inspector both in the machine room. Kodachrome film took something over an hour to process, so for the next long hour, we waited, chewed our knuckles, and wondered what the film would show. Zapruder told us he had a little dress-manufacturing business in down-town. He was a very casual amateur photographer, had decided at the last minute to see the motorcade, and took his camera almost as an afterthought. When the film finally left the drying cabinet and wound up on the take-off assembly, we transferred it to a projection spool, and a group of about 15 of us — Zapruder, me, the process men, Dick Blair of our Customer Service Department, and other staff people — headed for our little conference room, where we had set up an inspection projector.

We had no idea where .the pictures would be in the roll. It started off with pictures of Zapruder's family or friends, and like most amateur photographers, he sheepishly apologized for them. And then came the pictures. Fortunately, they were right-side-up, on the right-hand side of the screen. Even at the high speed, we could see the results, including the infamous frame where the top of Kennedy's head was blown off. And then nothing but blank film, where Zapruder had run off the rest of the roll to take it out of the camera.

Zapruder said, "Let's look at it again", at which point I made one of my better decisions of the day. Since it is always possible that film will jump the sprocket in a projector, putting sprocket holes in the pictures — or that a piece of foreign material will lodge in the projector gate, scratching the film, I took the spool off the projector, handed it to Zapruder, told him it was now in his possession, and that there would be no charge for the processing!

His next question was, "Can you make some copies?" We did not have the equipment to duplicate movies, so we called the Jamieson Film Laboratory, and asked them if they could duplicate unslit 8mm Kodachrome. They said that yes, they had the duplicating printer, but that they did not have any duplicating film perforated for 8mm. (Kodachrome film was made in three types in those days — Daylight, Type A for pictures under Tungsten light, and Duplicating Film. Duplicating film was a special finer-grain, low-contrast film, designed to give better quality copies, and was not available to the public). Our only alternative was to make the copies on Type A camera film, recognizing that they would not be of the best quality, and that Jamieson would have to guess at the color balance to use in their printer. So we gave Zapruder two rolls of Type A Kodachrome , and sent him off for Jamieson's.

Less than an hour later, he was back with the two rolls of film, and a man he introduced as his partner, who was also his attorney. Once again we started a processing machine. It was now 5:30 or so. My wife had come over after work, and a little group of us sat in our smoking area-coffee shop while we waited for the processing.

Zapruder was very nervous -- repeatedly mopping his brow. His suit by now was rumpled and creased. The partner was very quiet and businesslike. We all thumbed through magazines, made small talk, drank coffee, but mostly just waited.

This time, we slit and spliced the films and put them on regular 8mm projection spools, and once again trooped to the conference room — this time to see the film at normal size and speed, and several times, if we wished! Those of us in the lab realized that the duplicate was soft, or fuzzy, compared to the original, but really of good quality, considering the circumstances. As we watched with a confused mixture of emotions, Zapruder commented on the film, and I particularly remember his saying, "Look, you can see where 1 jumped as I heard the shots". And sure enough, the camera jumped three times as Zapruder was startled by each shot, even though he hadn't realized at the time what they were or what was happening. We cringed when JFK's head exploded -- and guessed even then that Jackie was trying to pick up a piece of his skull or brains from the back of the convertible. Other than Zapruder's commentary, no one else talked much."

On 7/10/2020 at 4:48 PM, David Josephs said:

But what about that 24fps speed?

Was he watching a 48fps original or a 16fps?

Initial viewing on the Inspection(otherwise known as an Analyst)projector.

Normal 16mm speed(doubled) I equate to 2x24fps =48fps

Not sure if the 4 times speed is based on a 16fps rate or a 24fps rate.

Either way, 64 or 96fps possibly?

Phil Chamberlain excerpt:

"When the film finally left the drying cabinet and wound 
up on the take-off assembly, we transferred it to a 
projection spool, and a group of about 15 of us — Zapruder, 
me, the process men, Dick Blair of our Customer Service 
Department, and other staff people — headed for our little 
conference room, where we had set up an inspection 
projector." 
"Regular 8mm film (this was before the days of Super-8) 
was actually 16mm wide, but with twice as many perforations 
on the edges as the full 16mm product. Before return to the 
customer, it was slit down the middle, and the two halves 
spliced together end to end. The inspection projector was 
used to spot-check processed films for quality, especially 
for scratches or physical problems, just as quickly as they 
came off the machine. It ran about twice as fast as normal 
16mm projection speed, and was used for both 8 and 16mm. So 
when 8mm. was projected before it was slit in two, there were 
four individual frames on the screen — with the two frames 
on the left side upside down! — and it ran at four times 
normal speed!" 

1 hour ago, David Josephs said:

Are you putting a camera into Sitzman's hands?

Zavada excerpt:

"Phil Chamberlain speculated that the perforators at the head end could have been used for the Zapruder films, the perforator "tested" between the original and dupes and because of auto indexing to the next number, 0184 was lost. Sounds good - but its speculation! We still need an example of 1963 Dallas processed 8mm movie film in a standard 50 ft. return box."

There are two others besides her.

I'll stick with two separate films floating around Kodak for now.

Since 0184 should have been subsequent to 0183 and prior to 0185, what would make me believe that the Kodak processing session involving only the SS agent and Kenny Anderson wasn't a second(circa pedestal) assassination film perforated as 0184?

Look at the LOS faint lines that were drawn on the FBI/SS plat in the previous gif.

On 7/13/2020 at 1:03 AM, Chris Davidson said:

"In the early afternoon on the day of the Kennedy assassination, I was told by Mr. Chamberlain to set up a processing machine for some special film the secret service would be bringing in. I did so. Sometime later a secret service agent with a roll of film was brought to me. (I cannot comment on any handling of the film before this). I took the agent and the roll of film into the processing room. There the single roll of film was fed into the #2 processing machine by B. Davis (deceased). Davis, the agent and myself stayed in the darkroom until the film entered the dry cabinet. The agent and I then went to the dry alley. The lights in the drying cabinet were turned off so we could not view the film. When the roll of film reached take off, I removed it and gave it to the agent. No film was removed from roll at the processing operation. I am not sure if the edge printer was off or on (for some reason I think the agent requested we turn it off). After talking with Mr. Chamberlain and the fact that dupes were made of the film, I did not at this time, see it in its slit 8mm form."

Seems like two different films.

Three people.

Two films?

Sounds a lot like a couple of NPIC sessions.

On 7/10/2020 at 4:48 PM, David Josephs said:

But what about that 24fps speed?

Was he watching a 48fps original or a 16fps?

Or a variation thereof.

Zavada excerpts:

“A question raised during discussions was, when the shots were
fired could Zapruder have unintentionally pressed down harder and
momentarily increased the velocity of the film for a fraction of a
second. Would the camera mechanism allow a gradual or partial
increase in velocity -- or -- would the change from normal velocity to
slow motion be “positive”?

“I discussed the question with David MacMillin and in his letter of
29 April 1998 he responded.”

MacMillan excerpts:

“This was all part of a patent application of mine.”

“If Zapruder had inadvertently gone into slow motion, then eased
up to go into normal speed, it could be accompanied with over and
under exposure frames at each speed change if his camera did not get
to speed instantly upon starting or slowing down from slow motion to
normal." David’s patent is referenced in Part 1 of this report. Our
camera test of shifting between normal and slow motion indicated it
was highly unlikely that Zapruder inadvertently shifted to slow motion.”

On 7/13/2020 at 8:20 AM, John Butler said:

 The truth is more important than ego.

 Working with the Zapruder film must be truly frustrating in trying to get the truth out of it. 

John,

Quite true.

But, alterations were made and it's up to us to find and reveal them.

For instance, I'm not supporting a threesome with this gif, but somebody doesn't belong up there.

On 7/9/2020 at 4:04 PM, Chris Davidson said:

 

It would be easy to justify the 33 second length included in the Jan 20th FBI document.

If one looks at Groden’s copies they can view the version with the partial(supposed to be around 117frames total) Hester’s segment included.

That version also includes the rest of the extant assassination which consists of the other two segments from extant frames 1-486.

In terms of Groden’s total running film time the cycle cop segment(pre-limo) = 8.2seconds
The limo segment = 22.1seconds

117 frames /18.3fps = 6.393seconds

8.2 + 22.1 = 30.3 x (16/18.3) = 26.49 sec

6.393 + 26.491 = 32.88 seconds total

But, included in that same FBI document is the Nix listed 8 second version.

Some have determined, the Nix frame rate was pretty much equal to the universally
accepted Z rate of 18.3fps.

The only way you arrive at an 8 second length for Nix is if the FBI made an assumption it was shot at 16fps.

But but, you would then have to believe the FBI didn’t run any tests on Nix’s camera after they abruptly seized it.

Attachment is a quote from Gayle Nix’s book:

"(Marilyn Sitzman, and Charles and Beatrice Hester, near the Pergola), before giving way to the lead motorcycle escort on the assassination portion of the film. On the original Zapruder film in the Archives, the entire "green chair" footage is missing, and only 14.5 frames (of approximately 117 total) of the Dealey Plaza bystander sequence is present immediately prior to the lead motorcycle sequence. Presumably, someone (at some point subsequent to the exposure of the three first-generation copies on November 22,1963) removed footage that they thought was unimportant from the original film."

"In the early afternoon on the day of the Kennedy assassination, I was told by Mr. Chamberlain to set up a processing machine for some special film the secret service would be bringing in. I did so. Sometime later a secret service agent with a roll of film was brought to me. (I cannot comment on any handling of the film before this). I took the agent and the roll of film into the processing room. There the single roll of film was fed into the #2 processing machine by B. Davis (deceased). Davis, the agent and myself stayed in the darkroom until the film entered the dry cabinet. The agent and I then went to the dry alley. The lights in the drying cabinet were turned off so we could not view the film. When the roll of film reached take off, I removed it and gave it to the agent. No film was removed from roll at the processing operation. I am not sure if the edge printer was off or on (for some reason I think the agent requested we turn it off). After talking with Mr. Chamberlain and the fact that dupes were made of the film, I did not at this time, see it in its slit 8mm form."

On 7/10/2020 at 4:48 PM, David Josephs said:

But what about that 24fps speed?

Was he watching a 48fps original or a 16fps?

I suggested 24fps if he was watching it on a 16mm projector.

8mm projector equals more than likely a 16fps playback rate.

353 frames shot at 18.3fps but projected at 16fps would still result in 22 seconds.

 "After the dupes were found satisfactory, the original film was slit to 8mm. Mr. Zapruder, possibly his attorney, Phil and several laboratory personnel viewed an 8mm film on an 8mm projector at least twice. Mr. Zapruder left with his original and three dupes and to the best of anyone's recollection no one at the Dallas lab had direct contact with Mr. Zapruder again."

On 7/9/2020 at 12:38 PM, David Josephs said:

The miss at 152 - of which I am in total agreement as to timing - seems to have created a spark or ricochet to the left of the limo...

I thought for sure I had read about a woman who saw those "sparks" fly up off the street....

Anyway, the low trajectory from the bottom floor or even van top seems too shallow to have missed and hit so close to Dal-Tex.... 

The 2nd, 3rd and roof locations seems to make more sense for this shot....

 

 

Yes, we're in agreement.

I believe hiding the head turn reactions of both JFK and Connally at/near the splice is what that alteration was trying to accomplish.

How high from within the DalTex would be nice to know, but it obviously didn't originate from the TSBD so I won't dwell on that.

Reverse Gif is sped up to accentuate the head turns.

21 hours ago, David Josephs said:

At the actual speed of 16fps there are 528 frames in 33 seconds... less 486 = 42 frames...  or just enough time for a limo stop removal...??

 

More support

Erwin Schwartz watches it on a 24fps projector.

24fps x 22sec = 528 total frames

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0BwrExtVD005OeXkxU2J0bXNueVU/view?usp=sharing

Added on edit: If you want to apply the above to the extant Z version of z133-z486 = 353 frames

353/22sec = 16.045fps using a 16fps projector

20 hours ago, David Josephs said:

At the actual speed of 16fps there are 528 frames in 33 seconds... less 486 = 42 frames...  or just enough time for a limo stop removal...??

Isn't that a problem that directly suggests frame removal? 

 

David,

I haven't forgotten about 16FPS being the final divisor.

In fact, I'll lend it some initial support for now with this same FBI document.

The Nix shooting sequence is listed at 8 seconds.

My Quicktime counter starts with 0 so this sequence is 122 frames.

Myers starts the Nix sequence at the equivalent of Z291 which is 22 frames before extant z313

Itek's study of the Nix film lists 28 prior frames until extant z313.

I've pointed this out before in terms of the Myers/Itek frame count disparity.

Here's the sync:

Itek 28 - Meyers 22 = a 6 frame difference

Added to 122 existing Nix frames = 128 total Nix frames for the shooting sequence

128 /16fps = 8 seconds = the FBI document match.

The difference in time for 128 frames between 16/18.3fps = 1second which works nicely with the CE884 final plat data entries of (z168-171) to z186) where over part of that 1 second span, the limo is listed as traveling at 3.74mph because they altered the distance to adjust/sync for at least the two headshots down near extant z313.

I'm still working on if this was the stepped down rate from 48/24/16 or two different camera's.  Should have said the 18.3 -16fps math conversion.

"Though Nix turned over a copy of his film to the FBI in Dec. 1, 1963, according to the suit, that was just the beginning of its story. After some tough bargaining, Nix went to New York City and sold the original to the wire service UPI for $5,000 and, strangely, “a new fedora.” After a handshake deal, UPI said it would return the film in 25 years."

The excerpt including the 118 frame (end of Towner) sync is from Meyers.

The excerpts including Webb/Shaneyfelt are from Gary Murr.

Hoover/FBI possessed a version of the assassination film sequence that was 33 seconds long.

486 + 118 = 604frames

604frames/18.3fps = 33 seconds.

A version that was "IN PROGRESS"

The FBI letter is dated 9 days before Shaneyfelt reveals his total frame count for the extant film while the 414 B/H FPS rate is determined approx 6 weeks before the letter is issued.

The approx 2.3ft distance played an important role in the assassination.

Just as silly as it was for the WC-CE884 data to use a (head height for JFK that was 10" lower than it should have been at extant z313) was the entry of the limo at 2.3ft per frame from z207-z208(splice time). Since this equals approx 28.6 mph, it's rather obvious it was a sync adjustment with other actions down the road.

A sync which involved an instantaneous limo stop and two shots quite close together.

If you don't flinch, careful analysis of this headshot might help with the "two shots as one" magic.

4 hours ago, Andrej Stancak said:

Chris:

I hope you will not find this message as too far from the main thread, however, I would like to know your opinion on the exact timing of Mary Moorman picture relative to Zapruder film. Did you have a chance to look into this? My estimate just from eyeballing the similarities of JFK's body posture in Moorman picture and Zapruder film is that Moorman picture could be equivalent to Z314 or Z315. Any thoughts would be very much appreciated.

Andrej,

The comparison of Moorman to extant Z would equate to 1.4ft farther west down Elm St in relation to the official extant Z313 plot.

If you (I won't at this time due to previous info posted and other items yet to be introduced) want to make the assumption that the limo(no slowing/no stop) was traveling at .6ft per frame(7.47mph) at this point, the frame number would equate to:

1.4ft / .6 = 2.33frames

313 + 2.33= extant  Z315.33

Referring to the previous post, what is the difference in frame count once you remove the BS distance of .9ft?

And/Or,

If it's easier to understand broken down this way and converted back into distance then connected back to CE884.

10.1 / 18.3 = .551.... = the equivalent of (55%) frame removal from a span of one second.

 (1/.551...) = 1.8118... = multiplier for total distance @18.3frames = one second

1.8118 x 3.03ft = 5.49ft = total distance over 1 second

5.49ft / 1.47 = 3.734 mph = .3ft per frame average

On 6/8/2020 at 2:29 PM, Chris Davidson said:

265.26 - 262.23 = 3.03ft

3.03ft + 2.37ft(for sake of confusion) = 5.4ft horizontal ft.

Now you know why Specter eventually changed the original elevations from the Dec5, 1963 plat.

Elev 418.48 - 418.35 = .13 x 18.3 = 2.379 horizontal ft.

 

 

5.4ft = 3 frames @ .9ft (CE884 - z168-Z171) using 18 whole frames or 5.49ft using 18.3frames = 1 second.

A little more frame refine for the equivalent of one second in time:

3.03ft /10.1frames = .3ft per frame

2.46ft / 8.2 frames =  .3ft per frame

5.49ft / 18.3 frames = .3ft per frame

5.49ft per sec = 3.734mph

3.734mph = 1/2 x 7.47mph

7.47mph = z301-z313 plotted average = .6ft per frame

On 5/27/2020 at 11:20 AM, Chris Davidson said:

Rick,

If you've been following the thread, you might realize I've purposely stayed away from any witness testimony except Hickey I believe.

Using his testimony,  I applied his hair-flap description to the zfilm around z274.

In retrospect, I think he was probably describing the z310 shot quite possibly converted(blob wise) into the extant z313 frame.

I don't feel the need to argue whether or not there were two hits to the head, and I have no reason to doubt all the Parkland staff.

What is obvious to me is there were two shots within a time frame which would not include one shooter.

That aspect, along with a limo instantaneous stop and the math used to accommodate the frame removal sequence is what this is about.

Was the frame/s with the obvious second shot(frontal location) removed or is extant z318+ a combination of an instant hit and camera reaction.

The acoustics are a wonderful addition.

CE884 is the data chart. The limo was not traveling 2.24/3.74mph using either chart at the designated time specified.

It was traveling that speed at another point during the assassination.

It's quite obvious now, (see previous posts) when that occurred.

I just continue to show how the WC went about their business.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

What's missing from the Muchmore/Z gif ?

On 6/10/2020 at 10:17 AM, Chris Davidson said:

Once again, referring back to a "Math Rules" posting and filling in more of the illusion:

http://educationforum.ipbhost.com/topic/22692-swan-song-math-rules/?do=findComment&comment=328361

If you want to connect Shaneyfelt's "shell game" to the Altgen's designated shot, just convert(along with the correct data) from the Specter plotted/surveyed slant distance of 265.26 location from station# 465.3 = extant z313 shot.

465.26 - 462.23 = 3.03ft + 2.37 = 5.4ft

39.66ft - .9(z161-z166) - 10.2(z207 elevation / station# adjustment) = 28.56ft

462.23 + 5.4 = 467.63 + 28.56 = 496.19

I can see why Shaneyfelt was having troubles keeping this whole charade in sync.

 

 

 

 

 

I encourage you to incorporate one other "Math Rules" graphic into fully understanding the connection between the "two shots as one" WC coverup.

http://educationforum.ipbhost.com/topic/22692-swan-song-math-rules/?do=findComment&comment=330019

The slope on Elm St to 3.13° starts at PositionA ( WC had to keep elevation/trajectory data in mind)

The relational street distance between the "TSBD snipers nest and PositionA" = The same distance as the "Altgen's determined shot to the 2nd headshot" at 2.37ft past the first extant z313 headshot.

The WC adjustments have been connected for you.

On 6/8/2020 at 2:29 PM, Chris Davidson said:

265.26 - 262.23 = 3.03ft

3.03ft + 2.37ft(for sake of confusion) = 5.4ft horizontal ft.

Now you know why Specter eventually changed the original elevations from the Dec5, 1963 plat.

Elev 418.48 - 418.35 = .13 x 18.3 = 2.379 horizontal ft.

 

 

Two shots as one.

On 6/8/2020 at 11:39 AM, Chris Davidson said:

The next step is to run a comparison calculation based on where a 3.54" height difference would put JFK, allowing you to compare the slant distance difference.  

Once again, referring back to a "Math Rules" posting and filling in more of the illusion:

http://educationforum.ipbhost.com/topic/22692-swan-song-math-rules/?do=findComment&comment=328361

If you want to connect Shaneyfelt's "shell game" to the Altgen's designated shot, just convert(along with the correct data) from the Specter plotted/surveyed slant distance of 265.26 location from station# 465.3 = extant z313 shot.

465.26 - 462.23 = 3.03ft + 2.37 = 5.4ft

39.66ft - .9(z161-z166) - 10.2(z207 elevation / station# adjustment) = 28.56ft

462.23 + 5.4 = 467.63 + 28.56 = 496.19

I can see why Shaneyfelt was having troubles keeping this whole charade in sync.

Final confirmation for a 5.4ft sync will come via the "official" WC  CE884 version.

If you refer back to my "Math Rules" topic, I supplied the following to help you figure out what the limo speed was on the extant zfilm from z156-z166, bypassing the BS speed of 2.24mph.

http://educationforum.ipbhost.com/topic/22692-swan-song-math-rules/?do=findComment&comment=328146

The speed was 1.08ft per frame.

The span was 5 frames from z161-z166

5 x 1.08 ft per frame = 5.4ft.

Just now, Chris Davidson said:

In case you had forgotten what the connecting importance of a 5.4ft horizontal distance was, above is one reminder.

btw, the conversion from 18.3fps to 18(dealing in whole frames) = 18/18.3 = .9836 x 5.49ft = 5.4ft

A direct link between the manipulation of earlier CE884 data to accomodate the later alteration of the extant zfilm.

 

 

 

And just as important in understanding the semantics is the conversion of the elevation 3.54" difference from JFK upright to his slumping at extant z312:

3.54"/ 12" = .295 x18.3(3.13° street slope) = 5.4ft horizontal = synchronized match.