Michael Clark
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Posts posted by Michael Clark
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On June 13, 2017 at 4:42 PM, Kirk Gallaway said:
Michael, No standing member of the CIA was in the WC....
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In this tape, complements of DVP and Youtube.....
This recording has a few interesting remarks about the TFX scandal. JFK is saying, almost amused, and stating that there really is no scandal, that the scandal is rooted in the fact that no-one wanted to move to Kansas.
Also if interest is the affection that JFK displays towards his brother.
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31 minutes ago, Cliff Varnell said:
Paul,
What did Dulles hope to gain by arranging the murder of Kennedy? He wasn't going to get his old job back. He wasn't working for clients at Sullivan Cromwell, was he?
Was revenge for getting fired his most significant motivation, in the Dulles-as-COO scenario?
Why would he stick his neck out with the Bancroft-to-Paines-to-Oswald connection?
Cliff, I find the Bancroft-Dulles-Paine's-Oswald leg interesting. The Henry Luce connection is in our face as well.
Thanks for raising these points.
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I am seeing a stovepiped operation that insulated Dulles from culpibility. I have already treated the question of foreknowledge in saying that even JFK have grave doubts about his ability to survive. I think everyone ( a lot of people in power) "knew" it was in the works.
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3 minutes ago, Ron Bulman said:
Oh, ok, I have a couple of Latino friends, they can probably elaborate.
Just in case, I think Kathy was playfully chastising Ramon for not including the Education Forum in his list of good JFK research sources.
Ill guess that Tom Hume is teasing that the EF forum wasn't mentioned because it's pre-eminence goes without saying.
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29 minutes ago, Ron Bulman said:
I like the presentation/format, the pictures as you read along add to the context. I've not read in depth on the subject matter and found multiple points informative as a result. Been going to read John Newman's JFK and Vietnam for years (did make it through Oswald and the CIA though a library copy, wish I had it for reference). Taking it from the 50's to the 70's puts it all in perspective. This could almost be a book within itself. I have read on line arguments that NSAM 273 in effect reversed 263 only (?) four days after JFK's death. Also, was it not in the last 2-3 months something came out about Nixon sabotaging Peace talks in 68? As I mentioned, the article is educational to me as is, thank you for it.
Here is a recording of LBJ addressing Nixons gambit to sabotage peace negotiations.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=qbEPI_9Ju0k
Greg Burhman has a great Video on NSAM 263 which I can't find again.
Burnhams video is important. Check out his site if you have not.
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2 minutes ago, Ron Bulman said:
As the forum is European based and I'm new here, might this be French? (my wife could tell me but she's asleep).
Both are Latin, Ron.
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1 hour ago, Tom Hume said:
Qui tacet consentire videtur.
"he who is silent is taken to agree"
3 hours ago, Kathy Beckett said:De gustibus non est disputandum.
"In matters of taste, there can be no disputes"
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I'll first point out out that the COO vs. Patsy scenario is a non-sequitor; one situation does not necessarily follow from the negation of the other. There are other options.
I am currently of the mind that the juggernouhgt that cultivated the assassination more resembles a spider than a snake. Moreover the legs of the spider served vastly different functions including: Execution, cover-up, messy cover-up and passive-aggressive functions. Another analogy I have been entertaining is a comparison to xylem and phloem. The point is that some of these legs would only function and be culpable in one direction, while other legs function in the reverse; 0r more precisely, pre and post asssassination. Foreknowledge is another factor but, at this point, I am pretty sure that JFK, himself, was flying on a wing and a prayer.
Right now I am seeing Dulles as being part of a phloem leg, part of the cover-up. Yet as we see all over this case, people are a hairs breath from being implicated in one way, or multiple ways. I think Dulles' proximity to some execution operatives (xylem spider legs) forced him to have no doubt as to what he needed to do for the cover-up (as a phloem spider leg).
If Dulles was getting Dull in his old age, that would not recommend him for a position in the planning or execution of the plot, but it would or could recommend him as a point man for an operation which was meant to fail, the mission of truth and justice. Incompetence and culpability, pre-requisites for a lead position on the WC.
Cheers,
Michael
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36 minutes ago, Ron Bulman said:
James or Jim, I don't know which you prefer, the link still won't work for me, just a blank page. Thanks for posting it though, hopefully it will be available in the future. I'd hoped to listen to you, Jeff Morley and your discussion with Oliver Stone live on CSpan when it happened but life got in the way. As Jeff used to say from time to time, Cheers. FREETHFILES. VOTE2018.
Would be nice if it was all posted on youtube, food for thought.
Hmmm, the link works for me. It worked for me before it was "fixed" as well.
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1 hour ago, Michael Walton said:
So based on this continuing thread, which I thought had ended due to its sheer hilariousness, let me just recap not only this funny thread but others for the kids.
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The author of the above and his followers wrote a book about the above and sell it for $60.
I am betting that the book is worth every penny.
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4 hours ago, Larry Hancock said:
Michael, you should be following my blog... I've researched both the DalTex and Duo in great detail over the years and like many things from the earlier years its not at all as mysterious as it was when I and others started the quest. Its discussed in the 2010 version of Someone Would Have Talked and pretty well resolved in a series of blog posts from earlier this year.
The short answer, which is really no fun at all, is that the stock most likely got to Hoover via a publicity stunt by a Colorado official promoting Colorado companies (which Duo was legally) by mailing single copies to a number of prominent people around the country. It appears they may have picked Duo because of its exciting focus on both oil and uranium and because it had an exceptionally attractive stock certificate. That in itself was most likely because the company itself was largely not much more than a stock scam - a huge amount of shares with no significant company assets, a couple of dry wells and no income - so it needed all the marketing clout it could get.
As with many of these old leads I was hoping for much more, it was a great mystery and sucked up immense amounts of time...sigh.
Thanks Larry, I opened a thread on this factoid:
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From Larry's blog entry:
"Still, that leaves us with yet another mystery, just how, who and why, did one share of DUO end up in the final effects of FBI Director J. Edgar Hoover???"
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Here is Larry Hancok's blog entry on the subject:
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3 hours ago, Larry Hancock said:
Michael, you should be following my blog... I've researched both the DalTex and Duo in great detail over the years and like many things from the earlier years its not at all as mysterious as it was when I and others started the quest. Its discussed in the 2010 version of Someone Would Have Talked and pretty well resolved in a series of blog posts from earlier this year.
The short answer, which is really no fun at all, is that the stock most likely got to Hoover via a publicity stunt by a Colorado official promoting Colorado companies (which Duo was legally) by mailing single copies to a number of prominent people around the country. It appears they may have picked Duo because of its exciting focus on both oil and uranium and because it had an exceptionally attractive stock certificate. That in itself was most likely because the company itself was largely not much more than a stock scam - a huge amount of shares with no significant company assets, a couple of dry wells and no income - so it needed all the marketing clout it could get.
As with many of these old leads I was hoping for much more, it was a great mystery and sucked up immense amounts of time...sigh.
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3 hours ago, Michael Clark said:
I would love to know more about that single JEH share of DUO.
From the following thread:
" It probably means something - though God knows what - that J. Edgar Hoover apparently owned ONE lone share of stock in this dubious company.
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This Factoid is floating around on a few threads:
"JEH owned a single share of Dallas Uranium and Oil". DUO owned space in the Dal-Tex building.
Larry Hancock posted that this has been straightened out and said that it's not exciting. I'm going to sift that out here.
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On 11/29/2012 at 0:02 AM, Alan Kent said:
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Dallas Uranium and Oil was a company that appeared to do little. It was a product of the efforts of three men, one of whom (Morty Freedman) ran one of the many textile businesses that resided in the Dal-Tex in '63. It is the only non-textile business listed in the directory of the Dal-Tex at the time.
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It probably means something - though God knows what - that J. Edgar Hoover apparently owned ONE lone share of stock in this dubious company.
I would love to know the history of that single share of stock in DUO.
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I opened a discussion on Reddit. This is my first post at that site.
https://www.reddit.com/r/UnresolvedMysteries/comments/6ga8m3/a_sator_sqare_interpretation/
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This is an excellent website for Roman and Latin resources.
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About three years ago I was looking into a Latin inscription which is found in numerous places throughout the former Roman Empire. I came to a conclusion with regard to it's meaning and significance that I have not seen before. I believe my interpretation is unique and plausible. So, I thought I would share it here.
For Wiki-reference: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sator_Square
I tend to identify existing theories for the meaning of the Sator Square as falling into two categories:
1- a translation that reads something like "The farmer, Arepo, slowly ploughs the land"
2- any Christian interpretation or mystical meaning.
I discount the first because it, to me, seems to lack any significance. I discount the second because I believe that the Sator Square pre-dates Christianity.
I have shared my Sator Square interpretation in a handful of replies to blogs and on my Facebook page. I have found that my interpretation is really very simple at heart, an my argument founders the more I expound upon it. So, I will, here, be brief.
The Wikipedia entry offers some translations for the words that compose the Sator Square. There are more expanded translation offerings that can be found on the web. Here are the suggestions from the Wikipedia entry:
SATOR
(from serere=to sow) Sower, planter; founder, progenitor (usually divine); originator
AREPO
unknown, likely a proper name, either invented or, perhaps, of Egyptian origin
TENET
(from tenere=to hold) holds, keeps; comprehends; possesses; masters; preserves
OPERA
(noun) work, care; aid, service, effort/trouble; (from opus): works, deeds.
ROTAS
(accusative plural of rota) wheels
My interpretation is:
Keepers of the ancient knowledge of the wheelwrights.
I translate Arepo to ancient using three parts of the logic from the Wikipedia article, those being:
- it is a made-up name to make the puzzle work
- it would be recognized as a persons name, even if it were unique.
- it would synthesize with the wiki-offered hypothesis that the word is similar to a word that means "to creep towards". I am suggesting that it would be interpreted as slow, sundry, accumulated, old, and respected, while also being recognized as a name.
Here comes the part of my theory that I feel I have failed to explain in the past. The Sator Square was not meant to be read. It was not meant to be studied or learned. It was only meant to be recognized like a marketing gimmick or logo. Of course it had meaning, and it's cleverness would be recognized by nearly anyone, literate or not; it was it's recognizability to both literate and non-literate people, combined with the innate appeal, which led to it's adaptation.
What was its Purpose? For what was it adapted?
I believe that it was adapted to be the recognizable logo for both a guild of engineers and anyone such as slaves, soldiers or conscripts, who would be engaged in construction or engineering activities. This logo would be found on offices, warehouses, construction sites and stockyards where engineers and laborers would frequently be expected to do business. Also, and very importantly, it would be found in areas where labor crews were martialed for tasks, or persons entering the city, from throughout the empire, would be expected to report if they had business or responsibilities with regard to construction and engineering. Slaves or soldiers would be able to inquire about and identify such places and facilities by making reference to this symbol, regardless of their language or rank.
Cult associations:
Roman society was built around cult associations. I would argue that any endeavor or organization would be built around familiar Roman cult practices. An engineering guild would be no different; it's organizational structure would resemble typical cult worship. As such, such an organization would be noticed by competing cults and would run-afoul of them since its members and leadership would be of a different class of people: laborers, slaves and engineers; as opposed to Aristocrats, senators, priests and soothsayers.
Julius Caesar is said to have outlawed craft-guilds. Julius Caesar's reign is also said to mark the beginning of the worship of living men. Craft guilds and associated cults would be necessarily in competition with, and need to be run and managed outside of and without regard for Imperial dignity and sanction. Yet, these groups of workers and engineers would still need to function and their organizational schemes survive. They would need to outlast and not compete with any state and imperial cults. Their organization and function would need to survive changes in leadership in the legions. So their organizational structure would need to be minimalized, hidden and secret. As such they would be tolerated.
So, I am proposing that the Sator Square was a necessarily outward symbol to an otherwise hidden and secret organization that kept construction and engineering projects and establishments moving forward.
That is kind of it. It's not real sexy but I think it's plausible, and I think it is simply a better explanation than we now have. I'll edit and clarify this a bit going forward.
Cheers,
Michael
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On 2/26/2017 at 6:39 PM, James DiEugenio said:
Fletcher is not correct on Bundy's culpability.
What Bundy was doing was in reply to the CIA's attempts to get a D Day air strike which Kennedy had taken out of the plan once it was transferred to its new location at the Bay of Pigs. And the CIA acknowledged this change in their own documents (Destiny Betrayed, Second Edition, p. 45)
There has been much debate about this on this site. And Greg Burnham, Larry Hancock and myself all rely on the newest documents and we all agree that that is what happened. Fletcher was not aware of these at the time he said this.
Above is the Quote from James DiEugenio, from this thread...
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Fletcher Prouty stated that, during the BOBI, McBundy was responsible for calling off the USN air strikes on Cuban aircraft. (Needs clarification)
I have read that Jim DiEugenio and others discount that claim, saying that Prouty was mistaken.
I watched an excellent Greg Burnham video yesterday and it seems that, as of a few years ago, he still held Prouty's view.
I started this factoid thread to work out that detail. I read Mr. DiEudenio's expanded, but brief alternative to Prouty's claim; but I want to get my head around that incident, digging into the sources. I'll be back with more, including Prouty's and Burnham's video's.
Cheers,
Michael
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Deleted. Duplicate post.
****edit, added from this thread:
http://educationforum.ipbhost.com/index.php?/topic/20583-david-morales/&page=17
Larry Hancock wrote:
OK David, its hard to compress a rather lengthy chapter into a few paragraphs but here you go:
By the time Roselli arrived in Los Angeles he was in transition from street hood to enforcer, moving out of the rackets per se into gambling and running protection for games in LA, most importantly the high dollar off shore gambling ships. At that point he took his first syndicate job, putting a major racetrack gambling wire into operation. That gave put him in touch with a number of east coast mob money guys and brought him to the attention of Meyer Lansky, who became his real behind the scenes mentor. Lansky was so impressed with Roselli he used him in Cuba to clean up some of the most egregious casino problems which were embarrassing the gambling industry there – Roselli had learned how to get people’s attention without leaving bodies strewn all over the place. For him it was about deals and deal making.
Back in LA, he used his east coast connections to bring big money into investments in the entertainment industry, a good way to launder cash – and he figured out ways to frustrate the movie industry unions while at the same time making money off the industry. The FBI was always frustrated by LA and Roselli; it was a city that used outside money to make more money rather than producing it through typical street crime (at least in his era).
With his entertainment connections, his money connections and his backing by Lansky, Roselli was in a great position to broker deals in gambling and entertainment as Vegas grew, his business card described him as a strategist and he helped folks like Giancana put casinos into Vegas. And he brokered his influence with entertainers and entertainment, Roselli made money off investment deals, and legal sidelines such as casino services. By the time you get to 1960 he had been gone from the street for a very long time, he knew people and he was trusted since he provided services and competed with none of the godfathers or with the syndicate. Was he a mob guy, sure, but a very different type of mob guy.
He was special in terms of the Castro plot because he had worked in Cuba, had connections to the old casino crowd there and also knew folks who still had channels into Cuba via the exile community in Florida – specifically Trafficante. And up to that point in time he was known as the type of guy who could bring people together and ensure nobody talked. If the CIA was going to use criminal assets to operate inside Cuba, he was a great choice for making the right introductions that was his real attraction. That was really all there was to it, another agreement to make introductions, hook up people and get a deal done – which is really all he did for the CIA if you really dig into it. It’s just that he did it twice, the second time for William Harvey – who clearly found him as a kindred spirit, Harvey always went full bore into anything he did, a really intense guy, and the same thing could be said for Roselli. Roselli just dressed a lot better.
A Couple of Real Gems from the "Harvey and Lee" Website
in JFK Assassination Debate
Posted
That observation is often countered by claiming he buffed-out in the Marines. I am not buying that counter argument. In fact, I've had a hard time believing that the DPD LHO was ever a real Marine, while the photo of the very-necky LHO Marine looks like a Marine