Postmaster General

[Robbie Robertson]

Tom Gram is a researcher into the JFK assassination and in particular the P.O. Box 2915 of Oswald or "A. Hidell" where the alleged rifle was sent. Through Tom's research casts new light on some familiar and well-known anomalies involved with the Dallas post office, the testimony of Holmes, and the rifle mail-order--the lack of postal employee testifying to having conveyed a 5-foot package containing a rifle to "A. Hidell". Gram demonstrates from documents that Marina ordered the murder weapon which killed President Kennedy. Since Marina was Russian, LBJ and Hoover may have decided that was impolitic or would complicate matters--that is what Gram proposes as the rationale behind a "shaping of the evidence to fit", a different narrative of the paperwork in which it was Oswald through and through on the post office and rifle order. Change of addresses never filed and weird anomalies in hiding of order forms from a FBI informant Harry Holmes who testified about perjury in the post office to the WC who ignored it.
 

Out Of The Blank #1188 - Tom Gram

 

[Gerry Down]

Looking forward to what Tom Gram has to say. 

[Tom Gram]

Thanks Robbie. To be clear, I wouldn’t go so far to say that Marina ordered the rifle - just that she absolutely had access to and was listed on the application for the P.O. Box, and the government buried every possible piece of evidence linking her to that box. The point is that she, or someone using her access, could have POSSIBLY ordered and/or received the rifle, and the WC etc. deliberately failed to investigate the possibility of anyone besides Oswald ever using P.O. Box 2915 to the point of burying key evidence that would have dramatically changed the narrative of Oswald’s mail forwarding in 1963. Here’s a couple links to my essay if anyone’s interested:

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1XvkmfIq44G8B-B_RV4L90f5AoXYdRTN4/view?usp=drivesdk

https://gregrparker.com/rethinking-oswalds-mail/

[Derek Thibeault]

Interesting topic that has been under discussed - good essay.

[Tom Gram]

6 hours ago, Derek Thibeault said:

Interesting topic that has been under discussed - good essay.

Thanks Derek. One thing worth mentioning that was pointed out by Greg Parker long before I dug into any of this, is the following (quoted from Greg in a recent comment at ROKC):

On the day the rifle was ordered, employer records show Oswald was at work. But on that date, Marina was picked up at the Neely St address by Ruth. What they did together on that day was only described in sketchy and vague terms. 

The only other time Ruth picked Marina up at that address was 8 days later on the 20th - the date the rifle was allegedly shipped from Klein's. However, she was not firm about that date. It was based solely on having Marina's name noted on that date on her calendar.  It is possible the notation was based on the belief or knowledge that the rifle would take take 7 or 8 days to ship. 

Whatever the case, picking Marina up on those 2 days and those 2 days only, is a pretty big coincidence.

The fact that Marina had access to P.O. Box 2915 adds some serious weight to this "coincidence" - especially considering all of the provably "disappeared" evidence linking her to the box like change of address forms, and the fact that she was not asked a single question by the WC about the box or how Oswald had acquired the rifle, which is simply unconscionable. 

One scenario that's very possible is that Oswald ordered the rifle, but Marina did some of the legwork like mailing the order forms and picking up the package with the assistance of Ruth Paine while Oswald was at work. Paine may have just helped out by giving Marina a ride to the Post Office, and Marina may have not even known what she was really doing. That the WC not only failed to investigate this "innocent" possibility but deliberately avoided it to the point of destroying and fabricating evidence is where it starts to get pretty damn suspicious, IMO, and makes me wonder if the truth was really so innocent. 

[Guest]

On 8/16/2022 at 12:17 AM, Tom Gram said:

Thanks Robbie. To be clear, I wouldn’t go so far to say that Marina ordered the rifle - just that she absolutely had access to and was listed on the application for the P.O. Box, and the government buried every possible piece of evidence linking her to that box. The point is that she, or someone using her access, could have POSSIBLY ordered and/or received the rifle, and the WC etc. deliberately failed to investigate the possibility of anyone besides Oswald ever using P.O. Box 2915 to the point of burying key evidence that would have dramatically changed the narrative of Oswald’s mail forwarding in 1963. Here’s a couple links to my essay if anyone’s interested:

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1XvkmfIq44G8B-B_RV4L90f5AoXYdRTN4/view?usp=drivesdk

https://gregrparker.com/rethinking-oswalds-mail/

I'm still reading and re-reading your essay, very interesting, one of those rare essays that keeps a man thinking, love it !

Don't know if you looked at the topic about the Mystery Bag, I posted some handwriting (from his alledg. Mexico visa applic...). that lookes a little like it, but I don't know if

you have more examples that look like it, it was just worth the question to me.

I am keeping an eye on the PO appl. and fwd.orders, whereever I am looking I always do a searche for those, one never knowes if there's one hidden somewhere

Also, for some reason I can not get acces to this historical review at NARA, do you have a direct link to that document ?

Edited August 24, 2022 by Jean Paul Ceulemans

[Tom Gram]

2 hours ago, Jean Paul Ceulemans said:

I'm still reading and re-reading your essay, very interesting, one of those rare essays that keeps a man thinking, love it !

Don't know if you looked at the topic about the Mystery Bag, I posted some handwriting (from his alledg. Mexico visa applic...). that lookes a little like it, but I don't know if

you have more examples that look like it, it was just worth the question to me.

I am keeping an eye on the PO appl. and fwd.orders, whereever I am looking I always do a searche for those, one never knowes if there's one hidden somewhere

Also, for some reason I can not get acces to this historical review at NARA, do you have a direct link to that document ?

Thanks Jean Paul. It was a ton of work, and an area that’s definitely in need of more research. I’ve found some great stuff since I wrote it too so I’ll probably do an update at some point. 

I’m assuming you’re referencing the 1968 historical review on the assassination done by the Postal Inspection Service for the LBJ Library? It’s not on MFF but it is online at the Armstrong archive at Baylor. It’s a very interesting document:

https://digitalcollections-baylor.quartexcollections.com/Documents/Detail/rifle-info-postal-reports/717662?item=717671

I never really got too deep into the mystery package. One thing that’s interesting though is that as far as I know not one envelope, address label etc. of mail for Oswald that was delivered to 2515 West Fifth St. has ever been seen, even though at least one of Oswald’s Russian magazines was supposedly entered into evidence by the DPD.

If the nixie package was readdressed from P.O. Box 2915 to Ruth’s house, and it’s a very big if, that would be one potential motive for why they’d want to cover the label, since the government didn’t have an “acceptable” mechanism for that readdressing until July ‘64 when Harry Holmes brought that IMO blatantly altered forwarding cancellation to the WC. That readdressing would be on the package if it contained Oswald’s Russian magazines, so it’s not an impossible theory, but the fake label is so bizarre I’m not sure I really believe it.

If Oswald ordered the package, he could have just given Ruth’s address out to whomever he ordered it from though, so in that case I have no idea what the big deal would be with the label - it’s quite the mystery. 

[Joseph McBride]

It's made clear in government documents that Marina

had the ability to forge Lee's signature.

[Tom Gram]

1 hour ago, Joseph McBride said:

It's made clear in government documents that Marina

had the ability to forge Lee's signature.

Marina suggested as much herself in one of her WC appearances, but what documents are you referring to? I do not recall seeing any documents directly discussing Marina’s English handwriting ability. 

[Joseph McBride]

 

As you note, she suggested it herself to the WC.

There may be more; I'd have to dig back and check.

I found it highly suggestive, since Oswald's

framing was greatly aided by Ruth Paine and Marina.

Edited August 25, 2022 by Joseph McBride

[Gerry Down]

On page 44 of "Rethinking Oswalds Mail" you state:

"...the Warren Commission used two questioned document examiners, James Cadigan of the FBI, and Alwyn Cole of the U.S. Treasury Department. The FBI was not happy about the Commission employing Cole as a second opinion, but all Cole did was essentially rubber-stamp the findings of Cadigan."

I'd like to look into this more. Do you have a source for the FBI not being happy that Cole was brought in by the Warren Commission?

[Guest]

One could pick either one 😃

 

Edited August 25, 2022 by Jean Paul Ceulemans
Pictured removed to save attachm. space

[Guest]

On 8/25/2022 at 4:40 AM, Tom Gram said:

Thanks Jean Paul. It was a ton of work, and an area that’s definitely in need of more research. I’ve found some great stuff since I wrote it too so I’ll probably do an update at some point. 

I’m assuming you’re referencing the 1968 historical review on the assassination done by the Postal Inspection Service for the LBJ Library? It’s not on MFF but it is online at the Armstrong archive at Baylor. It’s a very interesting document:

https://digitalcollections-baylor.quartexcollections.com/Documents/Detail/rifle-info-postal-reports/717662?item=717671

I never really got too deep into the mystery package. One thing that’s interesting though is that as far as I know not one envelope, address label etc. of mail for Oswald that was delivered to 2515 West Fifth St. has ever been seen, even though at least one of Oswald’s Russian magazines was supposedly entered into evidence by the DPD.

If the nixie package was readdressed from P.O. Box 2915 to Ruth’s house, and it’s a very big if, that would be one potential motive for why they’d want to cover the label, since the government didn’t have an “acceptable” mechanism for that readdressing until July ‘64 when Harry Holmes brought that IMO blatantly altered forwarding cancellation to the WC. That readdressing would be on the package if it contained Oswald’s Russian magazines, so it’s not an impossible theory, but the fake label is so bizarre I’m not sure I really believe it.

If Oswald ordered the package, he could have just given Ruth’s address out to whomever he ordered it from though, so in that case I have no idea what the big deal would be with the label - it’s quite the mystery. 

 

Edited August 27, 2022 by Jean Paul Ceulemans

[Tom Gram]

4 hours ago, Gerry Down said:

On page 44 of "Rethinking Oswalds Mail" you state:

"...the Warren Commission used two questioned document examiners, James Cadigan of the FBI, and Alwyn Cole of the U.S. Treasury Department. The FBI was not happy about the Commission employing Cole as a second opinion, but all Cole did was essentially rubber-stamp the findings of Cadigan."

I'd like to look into this more. Do you have a source for the FBI not being happy that Cole was brought in by the Warren Commission?

Yes, there was at least one internal memo exchanged with the FBI complaining about the WC bringing in independent experts. They were not thrilled. I found the memo I was thinking of, but I believe there was another one too. It’s pretty entertaining:

https://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=62314#relPageId=95

The FBI thought their experts were being questioned, and only went along with it because they had no choice. 

[Michael Griffith]

I'm of two minds about the mail order documents.

On the one hand, such a limited amount of handwriting could have been forged, and I find it hard to believe that anyone would have been so supremely stupid as to leave a paper trail that would enable authorities to trace the rifle and pistol straight back to him, when he could have much more easily bought a rifle and pistol at a local gun store and left no paper trail. 

On the other hand, I think Lamar Waldron makes a plausible case that Oswald could have been told to do this by his handlers and could have been led to believe that he was aiding the then-ongoing Senate hearings into mail-order weapons. After all, Oswald at that point would have never dreamed that the mail-order documents would be used to frame him for JFK's death.