CAN WE EXCLUDE BEN-GURION / HIS ISRAELI GOVERNMENT FROM THE JFKA SUSPECTS?

[Robert Montenegro]

1 hour ago, Matthew Koch said:

why I've pointed out people like Bernard Weissman who aren't Nazis... Sorry you can't understand that! 

 

Fascinatingly, you are correct for once, Mr. Koch—Bernard Weissman was not a Nazi—as Mr. Weissman was born in 1937, and was too young to have participated in the Nazi Party.

 

Wow, how insightful of you.

 

However, Weissman's superior, Larrie Schmidt, was a far-right ideologue, and a close working associate of United States Army Major. Gen. Edwin Anderson Walker—a man whose historic, rabid anti-Soviet (you know, Mr. Koch, Soviets, the people who fought the Nazis, and destroyed 90% of the Nazi war machine), anti-Jewish, anti-Black, pro-segregationist credentials are not in question.

 

As a point of fact, Mr. Weissman—who was a rabid anti-communist, no doubts there—told members of the Warren Commission that he felt he had been set up, with his name being affixed to the "Welcome Mr. Kennedy To Dallas" flyer, because, and I quote Mr. Weissman, "...they wanted a Jewish sounding name connected to the organization..."

 

Incidentally, the Warren Commission could not find Larrie Schmidt...how convenient.

 

I'm just spit-balling here, but what kind of element would want to connect a "...Jewish-sounding name..." to the murder of President Kennedy?

 

I don't know, Mr. Koch, maybe, just maybe, someone who did not like Jews?

 

I guess we will never know.

 

PS: I was being facetious with that last line, because we all know where you stand on the issue Mr. Koch—blame Jews and give Nazis a free pass, because, hey, Nazis are anti-communists, right?

 

And somehow, hating Nazis makes you racist?

 

Edited August 3, 2023 by Robert Montenegro

[Robert Montenegro]

39 minutes ago, Robert Montenegro said:

 

Fascinatingly, you are correct for once, Mr. Koch—Bernard Weissman was not a Nazi—as Mr. Weissman was born in 1937, and was too young to have participated in the Nazi Party.

 

Wow, how insightful of you.

 

However, Weissman's superior, Larrie Schmidt, was a far-right ideologue, and a close working associate of United States Army Major. Gen. Edwin Anderson Walker—a man whose historic, rabid anti-Soviet (you know, Mr. Koch, Soviets, the people who fought the Nazis, and destroyed 90% of the Nazi war machine), anti-Jewish, anti-Black, pro-segregationist credentials are not in question.

 

As a point of fact, Mr. Weissman—who was a rabid anti-communist, no doubts there—told members of the Warren Commission that he felt he had been set up, with his name being affixed to the "Welcome Mr. Kennedy To Dallas" flyer, because, and I quote Mr. Weissman, "...they wanted a Jewish sounding name connected to the organization..."

 

Incidentally, the Warren Commission could not find Larrie Schmidt...how convenient.

 

I'm just spit-balling here, but what kind of element would want to connect a "...Jewish-sounding name..." to the murder of President Kennedy?

 

I don't know, Mr. Koch, maybe, just maybe, someone who did not like Jews?

 

I guess we will never know.

 

PS: I was being facetious with that last line, because we all know where you stand on the issue Mr. Koch—blame Jews and give Nazis a free pass, because, hey, Nazis are anti-communists, right?

 

And somehow, hating Nazis makes you racist?

 

 

Mr. Koch, I would like to turn your attention to Warren Commission, Volume XXIII: Commission Exhibit 1815:

 

• https://history-matters.com/archive/jfk/wc/wcvols/wh23/pdf/WH23_CE_1815.pdf

 

In this FBI report, Larrie Henry Schmidt stated the following about Bernard Weissman:

 

QUOTE—

 

"...SCHMIDT said it was felt there was a "great basis for the ad" but said the ad would never have been placed had they known what they know now. He said "conservatives" are not pro-KENNEDY but certainly they did not wish him any personal harm. He said he and GRINNAN wanted to place tough questions in the ad in order to put President KENNEDY on the spot regarding such questions, but certainly there was no desire to cause any physical harm.

SCHMIDT said Weissman and BURLEY did not come to Dallas specifically in connection with the placing of this ad and in fact had nothing to do with the ad until after they arrived in Dallas..."

 

—END QUOTE.

 

Now, Mr. Koch, you have read Larry Schmidt's own words to the FBI, that the "Welcome Mr. Kennedy To Dallas"ad had been written before Bernard Weissman even entered the United States from Munich, Germany!

 

Of course, Munich was the home base of the Gehlen Organization, but never mind that...

 

Unlike you, Mr. Koch, I know this case up, down, left, right and every which way you can imagine, because I have given serious academic study to the facts!

 

Still wish to tango with me, Koch, or do you want to just keep on calling me a racist?

 

  

Edited August 3, 2023 by Robert Montenegro

[Robert Montenegro]

33 minutes ago, Robert Montenegro said:

 

Mr. Koch, I would like to turn your attention to Warren Commission, Volume XXIII: Commission Exhibit 1815:

 

• https://history-matters.com/archive/jfk/wc/wcvols/wh23/pdf/WH23_CE_1815.pdf

 

In this FBI report, Larrie Henry Schmidt stated the following about Bernard Weissman:

 

QUOTE—

 

"...SCHMIDT said it was felt there was a "great basis for the ad" but said the ad would never have been placed had they known what they know now. He said "conservatives" are not pro-KENNEDY but certainly they did not wish him any personal harm. He said he and GRINNAN wanted to place tough questions in the ad in order to put President KENNEDY on the spot regarding such questions, but certainly there was no desire to cause any physical harm.

SCHMIDT said Weissman and BURLEY did not come to Dallas specifically in connection with the placing of this ad and in fact had nothing to do with the ad until after they arrived in Dallas..."

 

—END QUOTE.

 

Now, Mr. Koch, you have read Larry Schmidt's own words to the FBI, that the "Welcome Mr. Kennedy To Dallas"ad had been written before Bernard Weissman even entered the United States from Munich, Germany!

 

Of course, Munich was the home base of the Gehlen Organization, but never mind that...

 

Unlike you, Mr. Koch, I know this case up, down, left, right and every which way you can imagine, because I have given serious academic study to the facts!

 

Still wish to tango with me, Koch, or do you want to just keep on calling me a racist?

 

  

 

Perhaps not so incidentally, Mr. Koch, both Larrie Henry Schmidt and Bernard Weissman were active-duty members of Headquarters, Southern Area Command United States Army, Munich, Germany, which was located, in 1962, within the former Nazi German Reichszeugmeisterei building, where the Nazi Party had based their personal treasury!

 

Of course, by 1962 (right around the time Larrie Henry Schmidt and Bernard Weissman were based there) the entire facility had been coverted into a gargantuan US Army military intelligence base, housing the US Army 508th Military Police Battalion and the US Army 66th Military Intelligence Group—both support units for the Gehlen Organization!

 

Still think there is no Nazi connection to the murder of President Kennedy?

 

Perhaps you should do some more research, Mr. Koch, and come back to the forum in ten years when you've done your homework—that, and learned to be civil.

 

 

Edited August 3, 2023 by Robert Montenegro

[Matthew Koch]

1 hour ago, Robert Montenegro said:

 

Perhaps not so incidentally, Mr. Koch, both Larrie Henry Schmidt and Bernard Weissman were active-duty members of Headquarters, Southern Area Command United States Army, Munich, Germany, which was located, in 1962, within the former Nazi German Reichszeugmeisterei building, where the Nazi Party had based their personal treasury!

 

Of course, by 1962 (right around the time Larrie Henry Schmidt and Bernard Weissman were based there) the entire facility had been coverted into a gargantuan US Army military intelligence base, housing the US Army 508th Military Police Battalion and the US Army 66th Military Intelligence Group—both support units for the Gehlen Organization!

 

Still think there is no Nazi connection to the murder of President Kennedy?

 

Perhaps you should do some more research, Mr. Koch, and come back to the forum in ten years when you've done your homework—that, and learned to be civil.

 

 

You do realize that Germany existed before Nazi Germany, right? I'm not splitting hairs when I say that the connection is German (IMO Due to Gehlen Network) it's not Nazi because there are people who are Jewish and have no connection to Nazis but they have connections to Germany. DUH.. 

I mentioned the German connection when I first got on this forum to Paul (Try searching that because I know you tried to find me using the word Joos based on you quoting Mr Speer.. and you couldn't find anything because I don't subscribe to that theory, so you posted his quoted because he projects just like you do) 

There is a third network in this case and it's the Ghelen Network which is in Western and Soviet Intelligence.. 
NOW, Mr Montenegro I want to explain a concept to you and here's the analogy: All Cognac is Brandy Not all Brady is Cognac, All Champagne is sparkling wine, but not all sparkling wine is Champagne, All Tequila is Mezcal But Not all Mezcal is Tequila, All Scotch is Whisky but not all Whisky is Scotch, All Bourbon is Whiskey but not all Whiskey is Bourbon, All Nazis are German but Not all Germans are Nazis.. there is criteria that they must meet to be what they are. You are the one who is being inaccurate by calling all these people Nazis. Also remember how Gehlen tried to kill Hitler in a continuity government assassination attempt and he didn't aid in the final solution, details matter.

 

[Robert Montenegro]

1 hour ago, Matthew Koch said:

You do realize that Germany existed before Nazi Germany, right?

 

Yes, and you do realize that the top administrators of West Germany, in 1963, were Nazis, right?

 

Hans Josef Maria Globke, Ernst Achenbach, Werner Naumann, Albert Schnez, Eberhard Taubert, Heinz Danko Herre, etc. all top functionaries of the Holocaust!

 

1 hour ago, Matthew Koch said:

All Nazis are German but Not all Germans are Nazis.

 

That is historically, not factual—over five-hundred thousand members of the Nazi elite Waffen-SS were not Germans, you nitwit:

 

• https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Waffen-SS_foreign_volunteers_and_conscripts

 

As were over five-million members of the Wehrmacht also, non-German:

 

• https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wehrmacht_foreign_volunteers_and_conscripts

 

And don't you dare say the Wehrmacht was not involved in the Holocaust: 

 

• https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Myth_of_the_clean_Wehrmacht#:~:text=The myth of the clean,crimes during World War II.

 

• https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/2022-12-16/ty-article-magazine/.highlight/they-were-human-monsters-recordings-destroy-the-clean-wehrmacht-myth/00000185-1b01-dcb5-abe7-dbaf9c130000

 

• https://us-holocaust-museum.medium.com/debunking-a-persistent-myth-of-wwii-the-german-armys-hands-were-not-clean-51ff4aa6178

 

• https://covertactionmagazine.com/2023/02/03/how-a-network-of-nazi-propagandists-helped-lay-the-groundwork-for-the-war-in-ukraine/

 

1 hour ago, Matthew Koch said:

Also remember how Gehlen tried to kill Hitler in a continuity government assassination attempt and he didn't aid in the final solution, details matter.

 

You are literally a Nazi propagandist at this point, Mr. Koch!

 

Where the Hell do you get off stating that Generalleutnant Reinhard Gehlen was not involved in the massacre of tens of millions of innocent men, women & children during the Second World War?!

 

From 1942 to 1945, Generalleutnant Gehlen was commander of Fremde Heere Ost, where he oversaw all military intelligence on the Eastern Front!

 

Who the Hell do you think Gehlen was providing intelligence data to, boy scouts?!

 

Or was it the Einsatzgruppen, mobile death squads Gehlen was feeding intelligence data to?!

 

And where the Hell is it documented anywhere that Gehlen had anything to do with attempts against Adolph Hitler's life?!

 

You are scum for defending genocidal creeps like Gehlen and an outright disinformation artist for claiming Gehlen had anything to do with removing Hitler.

 

Now you have shown the whole world your true colors, Mr. Koch...

 

 

 

Edited August 3, 2023 by Robert Montenegro

[Matthew Koch]

43 minutes ago, Robert Montenegro said:

You are scum for defending genocidal creeps like Gehlen and an outright disinformation artist for claiming Gehlen had anything to do with removing Hitler.

 

Now you have shown the whole world your true colors, Mr. Koch...

You're an ANTIFA revisionist

I'll stick with the facts, like the fact that Gehlen's West German intelligence worked very closely with Israeli intelligence, partly because of the German settlers from the Transfer Agreement.. 

https://academic.oup.com/book/1547/chapter-abstract/141013021?redirectedFrom=fulltext

[Robert Montenegro]

2 hours ago, Matthew Koch said:

You're an ANTIFA revisionist

 

1. You're goddamned right I'm an Anti-Fascist Activist—so, by using the powers of deduction Mr. Koch, you declaring me an ANTIFA reactionary in a pariahdom tone, must mean that you are a pro-fascist activist.

 

Just logic, not trying to imply anything, only using your own words to deduce your true intentions.

 

2. I gladly accept the title of "revisionist," if you mean I am setting the record straight, after over eighty years of propaganda, disinformation and state-mandated lies surrounding the facts of why the "Cold War" took place, and what power was really behind it (hint, hint, Mr. Koch, the fascists are behind every act of covert action from the Western Powers during the "Cold War," and Western Intelligence is the product of men like Allen Welsh Dulles, Reinhard Gehlen, Hans Josef Maria Globke, Charles Andrew Willoughby, Seizo Arisue, & Yoshio Kodama—all of them brutal fascists).

 

 

2 hours ago, Matthew Koch said:

https://academic.oup.com/book/1547/chapter-abstract/141013021?redirectedFrom=fulltext

 

I have read this article, and once again, you are misusing academic sources.

 

The thesis of this article is that elements of the Mossad were co-opted by Bundesnachrichtendienst in order to attack Soviet Intelligence—by no means was the relationship mutual or an ideological meshing of Holocaust victims with their former exterminators.   

 

Once again, Mr. Koch, you are engaging in intellectually perverse and emotionally damaging lines of delusional non-sequitur & roundabout reasoning, that appears to be anti-Jewish and pro-fascist in nature... 

 

2 hours ago, Matthew Koch said:

German settlers from the Transfer Agreement.

 

Once again, where the Hell is it documented anywhere that Gehlen had anything to do with Samuel Untermyer's "Non-Sectarian Anti-Nazi League," or the transfer of affluent German-Jewish families into Palestine—that resulted from the 1933 world-wide economic boycott of German products by Jews—which helped spur an extremely short-lived deal between elements of Nazi intelligence, under SS-Hauptsturmführer Otto Albrecht Alfred von Bolschwing (a future CIA agent, who in 1933, was a senior partner with the Bank voor Onroerende Zaken, an Amsterdam-based bank which played a role in the confiscation of assets belonging to Jewish citizens), and German Jews fleeing Nazi-occupied territories, under the command of far-right Zionist reactionary Ze'ev Jabotinsky?!

 

Once again, Mr. Koch, you are engaging in intellectually perverse and emotionally damaging lines of delusional non-sequitur & roundabout reasoning, that appears to be anti-Jewish and pro-fascist in nature! 

 

Clearly, you are a disinformation artist of the worst magnitude, and by virtue of your own statements against me for being an Anti-Fascist Activist, you must, by logic, be a fascist apologist.

 

...for all the world to see—your own words Mr. Koch, not mine...

 

 

 

Edited August 3, 2023 by Robert Montenegro

[Matthew Koch]

4 hours ago, Robert Montenegro said:

 

1. You're goddamned right

only using your own words to deduce your true intentions.

 

 

 

 

 

  Once again, Mr. Koch, you are engaging in intellectually perverse and emotionally damaging lines of delusional non-sequitur & roundabout reasoning, that appears to be anti-Jewish and pro-fascist in nature... 

 

 

Once again, Mr. Koch, you are engaging in intellectually perverse and emotionally damaging lines of delusional non-sequitur & roundabout reasoning, that appears to be anti-Jewish and pro-fascist in nature! 

 

Clearly, you are a disinformation artist of the worst magnitude, and by virtue of your own statements against me for being an Anti-Fascist Activist, you must, by logic, be a fascist apologist.

 

...for all the world to see—your own words Mr. Koch, not mine...

 

 

 

Lepords don't change their spots do they.. 

I already went down this route in the 56 year thread, and interestingly what you are doing is the reason the thread got removed and the reason the N word Nazi was censored. Interestingly like John pointed out earlier the Mods let this kind of bad behavior go for some reason that they claim isn't political bias.. The person who originally made this thread also made a thread about that. Try Searching that Mr Montenegro. 

 

Mr Sharp used Jack Posobiec's twitter and his connection to Robert Stone and the fact that they both made an Ok symbol with their hand and made a twitter post like RFK Jr that had the numbers 14 and 88 in it.. to make the same case square peg in a circle routine you are doing now.. But This is the kind of logic that people who support Coup In Dallas employ, SMH.. 

 

 

[Matthew Koch]

Since this thread is about CAN WE EXCLUDE BEN-GURION / HIS ISRAELI GOVERNMENT FROM THE JFKA SUSPECTS?

This times of Israel article says that Jefferson Morley's Scoop about Efron is that he was a Jewish spy with connections to Israel if Robert Montenegro's thesis that Nazis are behind everything how does the circle get squared? While I don't agree with the Michael Collins Piper Thesis, this is definitely now getting mentioned by those types like Ryan Dawson, and Nick Fuentes... 

 

 

[Michael Griffith]

On 4/30/2023 at 1:55 PM, Guest said:

 

It seems to me that ever increasingly on the forum that if Israel is implicated in any plot, whether it be the JFKA, USS Liberty attack or other, the poster is accused of being antisemitic or a holocaust denier. 

That is because the vast majority of those who attack Israel on these issues are anti-Semites and Holocaust deniers.

I came across an article last night which mentioned Mordechai Vanunu, who alleged that Israel was almost certainly behind the killing of President John F. Kennedy. 

https://zeenews.india.com/news/world/israel-behind-jfk-assassination-vanunu_169996.html

Oh, boy. Vanunu holds racist views against Ashkenazi Jews and has given bomb-making instructions to Hamas terrorists. 

Vanunu was a technician at the Dimona nuclear facility who turned whistleblower and spent not 18 years in prison after being kidnapped by Mossad in Italy. He is still forbidden from leaving Israel and is not allowed to talk to foreigners. 

He is lucky he was not hanged. He violated his oath. If he had committed similar treason in Russia or China, he would have been executed in short order. 

Muramar Gadaffi also accused Israel of giving the green-light in the killing of President John F. Kennedy. 

Oh, there's a great source! 

Did Israel have a strong enough motivation? They were desperate to achieve their nuclear ambitions. Their track record has an heir of fanaticism. The way they have treated the Palestinians, the kidnappings, the assassinations, the utterly ruthless behaviour. 

This is radical Islamic anti-Israeli propaganda and a total distortion of the historical record. If militant Jews in Egypt had done what militant Palestinians have done in Israel, the Egyptian army would have wiped them out long ago. Most Palestinians are not militants. Many Palestinians want to become Israeli citizens. Far more Palestinians have been killed by radical Palestinians than by the Israelis. 

Would Mossad have seen killing a US president as a step too far? Or did they see it as necessary for their survival? 

Did you post anonymously, as a guest, so you could float this anti-Semitic trash without attribution? 

[Robert Montenegro]

3 hours ago, Matthew Koch said:

Since this thread is about CAN WE EXCLUDE BEN-GURION / HIS ISRAELI GOVERNMENT FROM THE JFKA SUSPECTS?

This times of Israel article says that Jefferson Morley's Scoop about Efron is that he was a Jewish spy with connections to Israel if Robert Montenegro's thesis that Nazis are behind everything how does the circle get squared? While I don't agree with the Michael Collins Piper Thesis, this is definitely now getting mentioned by those types like Ryan Dawson, and Nick Fuentes... 

 

 

 

This message brought to you in part by the, "...everything I learned about fascism, I learned from watching episodes of Danger 5..." school of reasoning...

 

 

Edited August 3, 2023 by Robert Montenegro

[Pat Speer]

As a result of my poor health and COVID, I haven't been on a vacation for three years. So here I take a few days off and return to find this same old stuff regurgitated for the umpteenth time. 

I have mentioned this many times, but the ONE topic that has always led to a tread being killed is the topic of this thread. Tha Jews. It seems that every time someone brings up the possibility of Israel's involvement the thread quickly degenerates from there, with one side claiming the discussion of such a thing is anti-semitic, and the other side citing Ruby's Jewishness or Mark Lane's Jewishness, or David Lifton's Jewishness, as reason to believe all the Jews even tangentially involved in this case were working together. 

There can be no middle ground because everyone with the gumption to comment is committed one way or the other. 

Let it die. 

Edited August 4, 2023 by Pat Speer

[Anthony Thorne]

Mods should have the ability to sticky a thread with 'controversial' or 'heated discussion'; or something. This would serve two purposes. Anyone who wanted to skip the heated rhetoric would have a solid warning to skip it. And anyone who wanted to thread-crap a subject into oblivion to kick a topic off the front page, wouldn't be able to do so.

That said I agree with Pat that there the two most vocal sides here are each stuck in the ground, sticking to their guns, going around in circles etc. I asked Matt a question a couple of pages back about the bridge bombing plan, not because I was dismissive, but because I was curious what the full story was. Unless I'm wrong, he never answered it. If folks wanting to learn additional info are being brushed off in favour of the target shooting that has been going on for pages now, this thread may as well die a natural death.

Relatively new, Joel van der Reijden's chronology of CIA / Mossad collaborations. He plans further updates to it.

https://isgp-studies.com/mossad-cia-coups

[Matthew Koch]

On 8/4/2023 at 12:40 AM, Anthony Thorne said:

Mods should have the ability to sticky a thread with 'controversial' or 'heated discussion'; or something. This would serve two purposes. Anyone who wanted to skip the heated rhetoric would have a solid warning to skip it. And anyone who wanted to thread-crap a subject into oblivion to kick a topic off the front page, wouldn't be able to do so.

That said I agree with Pat that there the two most vocal sides here are each stuck in the ground, sticking to their guns, going around in circles etc. I asked Matt a question a couple of pages back about the bridge bombing plan, not because I was dismissive, but because I was curious what the full story was. Unless I'm wrong, he never answered it. If folks wanting to learn additional info are being brushed off in favour of the target shooting that has been going on for pages now, this thread may as well die a natural death.

Relatively new, Joel van der Reijden's chronology of CIA / Mossad collaborations. He plans further updates to it.

https://isgp-studies.com/mossad-cia-coups

Sorry about the late reply, I was trying to deescalate the situation with Ron before deciding to esculate and get a short suspension with Robert..lol. I do like your idea or maybe there is some kind of flag like controversial the post could have on it and if someone tries to emotionally disrupt the thread they get a warning a short time out until they can participate in an un emotional way.. 

In regards to your 911 question the city had gone into an 'Arch Angle Operation' which entailed evacuation and sending extra protection to land marks in NYC. People had called the police on the Urban Moving System Employees. An All Points Bulletin had been put out for the white van which had an air plane twin towers mural on the side of it. It was at the Washington Bridge where they were stopped, and they resisted arrest and wouldn't get out of the van and had to be removed. Now this is where things get fuzzy and I think the Truther Tv answers it. Reports of "a white Van Packed with  Explosives" was stopped this report echoed from the local reporter all the way to Dan Rather. (In a very similar way that the Mauser Rifle reports made their way to Walter Cronkite) 

So up until the FOIA docs of Urban Moving System aka the Dancing Israelis came out all we had to go on was the news reports. Which is why we know that the vans tested positive for explosives similar to how they test at the airport. But, was mis reported by a reporter who had covered the prior WTC bombing that contained a van packed with explosives..

But, here the other thing people from urban movers connect to people in S. Florida who where part of the Israeli spy ring that got busted that Fox News reported and only played 2 of their 5 part series on the huge bust which was the biggest in US history. 

 

[Anthony Thorne]

Thank you Matthew, very interesting. I'm currently going back over some off the 9/11 stuff, trying to push the years of misinformation and Disinfo out of the way to work out generally what happened that week. And I have seen all the 9/11 documentaries and have the full set of 9/11 books that every researcher does. Some are better than others.

I'm struck by the following.

The arrested guys going "We are not your problem, the Palestinians are the problem."

The police audio (from memory) saying 'they look like Palestinians"

The BBC smear of middle eastern folk celebrating, so they could show video of people in veils jumping around excited that the towers had been hit. I think it came out later that a cameraman had thrown a bunch of kids some sweets, so they could get lots of video of the family members clapping their hands and laughing and celebrating. Knowing the BBC, this was entirely intentional.

Ehud Barak sitting in the BBC studios shortly after the attacks on camera expounding about the forthcoming war on terror, below.

And Robbie Martin's video clip, dug up several years ago, with Donald and Frederick Kagan filmed the day after 9/11 arguing that the US should perform a military invasion of Palestine. Frederick even states that 'they know' the terrorist groups responsible have bases in Palestine, and that the US should send a Delta Force in immediately to wipe them out.

 

The day after 9/11, Kagan father-son duo said ‘take the war’ to Palestine

https://mondoweiss.net/2015/08/kagan-father-palestine/

 

Neocons Fred & Don Kagan wanted a US military invasion of Palestine in response to 9/11

http://averyheavyagenda.blogspot.com/2015/08/neocons-fred-don-kagan-wanted-us_5.html

With a prescient note from Don.

Quote

Don Kagan: I'm sure in 3-4 days in spite of what happened in New York and Washington, everybody will go back to where we were before, and think 'ok, that was a one-shot, that's over'.
What would have happened if instead of just having a lot of jet fuel on those planes, they had had anthrax [inaudible]. 

I confess all the above does raise one or two questions.

Speculation - if the guys in the vans had not been arrested and proven Israeli, the story could have been sent out that the guys driving a van with a big mural on the side of it were Palestinian. You have to presume any Israelis involved in the plot would rather things be blamed on Palestinians, instead of Israelis. "The Palestinians are the problem." "They look Palestinian" -  footage of Middle Eastern folk (in Gaza?) cheering the attacks - Israeli PM Barak announcing to the West that the war on terror has started - the Kagan neocon duo foaming at the mouth demanding a Delta Force invade Gaza.

A case could be made that a planned, then abandoned part of the 9/11 plot was to paint Palestine as being involved somehow. This was likely dropped after the various arrests that day made it difficult to proceed with it. From memory (based on other articles I've read), Israel chose to do another military attack on the Palestinians that week anyway, while the world's focus was elsewhere. Sadly for the Israelis, they couldn't drag the US into an attack on Palestine that week, and would have to make do with US forces participating in the decapitation of Iraq a year and a half later.

Included at the bottom of this post, Daniel Hummel's useful 2010 masters thesis from Colorado State University, Israel and the Rise of the Neonservatives, 1960 - 1976   (156 pages), includes with some related links just above it. The file size restriction (just a few megabytes) stops me sharing something even better, Muhammad Idrees Ahmad's out-of-print 2014 book from Edinburgh University Press, The Road to Iraq: The Making of a Neoconservative War.

From my longer essay, cut down for COUP IN DALLAS

Quote

 

In late 1986, Fred Ikle participates in a Washington conference on the subject of political warfare and psychological operations, and suggests that their use is justified in the pursuit of national security goals. Around this time, James P. Wade Jr., a DoD official and physicist who frequently participates in DSB studies, leaves office. Wade was an assistant to Donald Rumsfeld during the Ford administration, and is President of Systems Planning Corporation. Through this period, Congress passes a regulation prohibiting Pentagon officials from taking jobs in the defense industry for two years after leaving Government. The regulation, scheduled to commence on April 16th the following year, encourages a clique of defense professionals to leave. Richard Perle, John Lehman and Dov Zakheim depart in early 1987, and Zakheim joins Wade’s Systems Planning Corporation. In 1988, Wade contributes to studies submitted to the Commission on Integrated Long-Term Strategy. (54.)

(54.) Ikle’s presentation is reprinted in Political Warfare and Psychological Operations - Rethinking the US Approach. The departure of US defense officials is discussed in PENTAGON OFFICIALS BAILING OUT BEFORE LAW SHUTS REVOLVING DOOR. Wade contributed to Discriminate Deterrence - Report of the Commission on Integrated Long-Term Strategy.

 

Zakheim's heartwarming quote from the cited article.

https://www.chicagotribune.com/news/ct-xpm-1987-03-26-8701230518-story.html

Quote

''I`ve had six satisfying years here,'' Zakheim said in a telephone interview. ''Now I want to spend more time with my family and, frankly, to make more money.''

The above events were concurrent with a sweeping, escalating panic in government over defence spending. All parties had a lot of time on their hands to think about how things could be solved. Will cut this short for now, but this is an interesting discussion.

The neoconservative roots of the war in Iraq

https://dro.dur.ac.uk/5599/1/5599.pdf

 

Israel and the rise of the Neoconservatives, 1960 - 1976 (154 pages)

https://api.mountainscholar.org/server/api/core/bitstreams/8213346b-3b04-45aa-a67f-7db9e227e15a/content

 

The Committee on the Present Danger. the Demise of Detente, and Threat Inflation, 1976 - 1980  (285 pages)

https://research-repository.st-andrews.ac.uk/bitstream/handle/10023/8243/NicholasBlackbournPhDThesis.pdf?sequence=3&isAllowed=y

 

Spear Carriers for Empire: The Alliance for American Militarism after the Vietnam War, 1867 - 1988. (328 pages)

https://repository.library.brown.edu/studio/item/bdr:419438/PDF/

 

Neoconservatism: Origins and Evolution: 1945 - 1980

https://core.ac.uk/download/pdf/210602457.pdf

Israel and the Rise of the Neoconservatives.pdf

Edited August 7, 2023 by Anthony Thorne