MFF law suit

[Roger Odisio]

Ben wrote:  

The Dictator-Puppet-in-Chief does a snuff job on the JFK Records Act, and legacy media looks away. 

I have a great deal of respect for Larry Schnapf and Andrew Iler, but fading respect for the judiciary.

How on earth can Biden's vulgar disregard for rule of law be upheld by the courts?

But Biden will be upheld, or the defense of Biden's snuff job dragged out so long with so many caveats and unenforcible codicils, as to uphold Biden in fact. 

I am a JFKA junkie, but also a serious citizen. I see no way to open up the JFK Records through the legal system.

The JFK Records must be opened by Presidential fiat. 

How does that happen? 

 

Your scorn for the judiciary, Ben, is in some case, well deserved.  Particularly for Judge Seeborg, whose initial decision in the MFF law suit is riddled with errors and gaps in reasoning. But it's premature to give upon the MFF law suit.

Seeborg claimed that Congress never intended NARA to take over the responsibility to see that remaining JFKA records yet unreleased be made available to the public, once the ARRB's doors closed.. He did so despite Congress setting a deadline of 2017 for all records to be released, but mandating the ARRB close its doors in 1998.  It must have occurred to the judge to ask whose responsibility it then was to complete the  job during those 19 years (and up to the present as it turns out).

Incredibly, the judge is silent on that question.

Fortunately the JFK Act is *not* silent.  Section 12 (b) of the Act says, "The remaining provisions of this Act [beyond those that pertain to the appointment and operation of the Review Board] *shall continue*until such time as the Archivist certifies to the President and the Congress that all assassination records have been made available to the public in accordance with this Act". That's NARA's archivist.

The judge never mentioned the Section 12 (b) responsibility.

In their August filing, Bill and Larry lay the issue directly in front of the judge:  "it is reasonable to state that powers conferred on NARA by 12(b) and 5(g)(2)(A) are to be utilized in the same fashion as the ARRB was charged to conduct its functions to obtain additional documents from agencies pursuant to 5(c)(2)(F) and 7(j)(1)(C). Otherwise, it would mean that NARA had exceeded its authority by the actions it has taken in seeking assassination documents from the agencies since 1998--and that the JFK Act could not be used to obtain additional documents after 1998." 

If NARA's Archivist has the responsibility to certify that all records had been released, how could NARA itself not be the agency in charge of seeking the remaining records still outside its JFK Records Collection (which the Act set up to be the repository within NARA for all JFKA records)?   I hope the judge finds it harder to ignore this point in the next round of discussions.

In an email to me earlier this year, NARA acknowledged their responsibility to seek outstanding records and asked for recommendations  to pursue.  They have not followed through on my recommendation that they seek Darnell and Wiegman (clearly JFKA records) and are unlikely to do so as the law suit proceeds.

Darnell and Wiegman are on the list of records to pursue should NARA's responsibility seek outstanding records be finally acknowledged.

Note to Bill and Larry:  Am I correct that arguments on your amended filing were supposed to be held on Sept 21?

Whatever happened to your idea of pinning discussion of the JFK Act, Sandy? 

 

[Michael Crane]

If push comes to shove....can the next president reverse this order?

Edited October 2, 2023 by Michael Crane

[Benjamin Cole]

5 hours ago, Roger Odisio said:

Ben wrote:  

The Dictator-Puppet-in-Chief does a snuff job on the JFK Records Act, and legacy media looks away. 

I have a great deal of respect for Larry Schnapf and Andrew Iler, but fading respect for the judiciary.

How on earth can Biden's vulgar disregard for rule of law be upheld by the courts?

But Biden will be upheld, or the defense of Biden's snuff job dragged out so long with so many caveats and unenforcible codicils, as to uphold Biden in fact. 

I am a JFKA junkie, but also a serious citizen. I see no way to open up the JFK Records through the legal system.

The JFK Records must be opened by Presidential fiat. 

How does that happen? 

 

Your scorn for the judiciary, Ben, is in some case, well deserved.  Particularly for Judge Seeborg, whose initial decision in the MFF law suit is riddled with errors and gaps in reasoning. But it's premature to give upon the MFF law suit.

Seeborg claimed that Congress never intended NARA to take over the responsibility to see that remaining JFKA records yet unreleased be made available to the public, once the ARRB's doors closed.. He did so despite Congress setting a deadline of 2017 for all records to be released, but mandating the ARRB close its doors in 1998.  It must have occurred to the judge to ask whose responsibility it then was to complete the  job during those 19 years (and up to the present as it turns out).

Incredibly, the judge is silent on that question.

Fortunately the JFK Act is *not* silent.  Section 12 (b) of the Act says, "The remaining provisions of this Act [beyond those that pertain to the appointment and operation of the Review Board] *shall continue*until such time as the Archivist certifies to the President and the Congress that all assassination records have been made available to the public in accordance with this Act". That's NARA's archivist.

The judge never mentioned the Section 12 (b) responsibility.

In their August filing, Bill and Larry lay the issue directly in front of the judge:  "it is reasonable to state that powers conferred on NARA by 12(b) and 5(g)(2)(A) are to be utilized in the same fashion as the ARRB was charged to conduct its functions to obtain additional documents from agencies pursuant to 5(c)(2)(F) and 7(j)(1)(C). Otherwise, it would mean that NARA had exceeded its authority by the actions it has taken in seeking assassination documents from the agencies since 1998--and that the JFK Act could not be used to obtain additional documents after 1998." 

If NARA's Archivist has the responsibility to certify that all records had been released, how could NARA itself not be the agency in charge of seeking the remaining records still outside its JFK Records Collection (which the Act set up to be the repository within NARA for all JFKA records)?   I hope the judge finds it harder to ignore this point in the next round of discussions.

In an email to me earlier this year, NARA acknowledged their responsibility to seek outstanding records and asked for recommendations  to pursue.  They have not followed through on my recommendation that they seek Darnell and Wiegman (clearly JFKA records) and are unlikely to do so as the law suit proceeds.

Darnell and Wiegman are on the list of records to pursue should NARA's responsibility seek outstanding records be finally acknowledged.

Note to Bill and Larry:  Am I correct that arguments on your amended filing were supposed to be held on Sept 21?

Whatever happened to your idea of pinning discussion of the JFK Act, Sandy? 

 

Thanks RO.

I can understand the intricacies of central banking...but the legal system flummoxes me. I cannot follow the train of thought in legal labyrinths.

The JFK Records, 60 years old and more, should be released. 

I know nothing of Seeborg. Maybe he is looking for a legal justification to do the expedient thing. 

[Benjamin Cole]

2 hours ago, Michael Crane said:

If push comes to shove....can the next president reverse this order?

Oh, maybe the next President, if not Biden or Trump, will open the JFK Records. 

Who might that be? 

[Michael Crane]

2 hours ago, Benjamin Cole said:

Oh, maybe the next President, if not Biden or Trump, will open the JFK Records. 

Who might that be? 

My take?

No president is going to open up the records.If RFK.Jr decides to open them up....they will be bullsh*t documents,but I can see the CIA or Secret Service saying that the documents are now "missing"

Other presidents besides Kennedy's will be persuaded by "others" to keep them sealed.

What can you do if the documents are stolen or missing? complain and that's probably it. 

Edited October 3, 2023 by Michael Crane

[Michael Crane]

12 minutes ago, Benjamin Cole said:

Oh, maybe the next President, if not Biden or Trump, will open the JFK Records. 

Who might that be? 

I was just able to see one of the withheld documents & this is what it looked like.

 

 

Edited October 3, 2023 by Michael Crane

[Benjamin Cole]

52 minutes ago, Michael Crane said:

I was just able to see one of the withheld documents & this is what it looked like.

 

 

Verily. Evidently, the ONI long ago destroyed docs relating to LHO. 

Moreover, Bill Harvey said he would create a false paper trail to cover up CIA ops, including assassinations. 

But the Joannides New Orleans files might have survived washings....and few other files that would indicate the CIA had an operational interest in LHO. 

 

[Michael Crane]

If the documents ever get released,it's going to be a letdown IMHO.

[Benjamin Cole]

57 minutes ago, Michael Crane said:

If the documents ever get released,it's going to be a letdown IMHO.

Until some time back, I might have agreed with you.

But the ferocity with which the CIA/Deep State and coopted media are fighting release...makes me wonder. 

A near-total blackout on the JFK Records in legacy media. Snow jobs on Biden's snuff job. 

The one candidate who would open up the JFK Records is getting the Oliver Stone treatment, in spades and on steroids. 

Tucker Carlson zapped off the air. 

If "nothing is in the records" why this stonewalling? 

True, since the records are paper, maybe the CIA plans some nighttime burglaries to make certain records disappear. I sure hope copies have been made, and downloaded somewhere. 

Many serious researchers say records have already disappeared. 

If true...if there is nothing to hide, why are certain records disappearing? 

 

 

[David Boylan]

And here is what one of the 2018 released documents looks like (Luis Angel Castillo) - https://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=148969

And this counts as a released document??? The only thing we know about this is his name.

 

[Michael Crane]

4 hours ago, David Boylan said:

And here is what one of the 2018 released documents looks like (Luis Angel Castillo) - https://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=148969

And this counts as a released document??? The only thing we know about this is his name.

 

Wow,I was just being overly sarcastic with my post of the documents being totally black.

[William Paris]

Jim D mentioned somewhere….listen to the recent Black Op Radio.  It’s fantastic on this topic.  Has something like this ever happened before concerning an act of Congress?

[James DiEugenio]

That is a good question William.

There have been cases where the Court overruled the president, or ruled a congressional law unconstitutional.

And there have been times that congress negated a president's executive order, like neutralizing the Gulf of Tonkin resolution.

But I would have to look up if a president just tossed aside an act of congress like this.