Official J.D. Tippit Website

[Tim Gratz]

Are members familiar with this web-site? Just discovered it so I have not carefully reviewed its content:

http://www.jdtippit.com/

It seems to be heavily influenced by Dale Myers and promotes his book on the Tippit slaying.

Edited January 13, 2006 by Tim Gratz

[Brian LeCloux]

Well, historian David R. Wrone makes a pretty good case that the Warren Commission's David Belin showed that Oswald couldn't have even arrived at the scene until 1:22. Tippit was shot---and dead---by 1:10 according to eyewitness T.F. Bowley as Wrone cites his statement published by the Commission.

Cicero's Lament

Wrone is very meticulous in his research and basically anihilates the case against Oswald shooting Tippit. I doubt those who created this site would want to take on Wrone in a debate about the facts of the shooting.

Brian LeCloux

[Jim Root]

Brian

I believe that Gary Mack did a History Channel program where it was demonstrated that Oswald could in fact have made it to the scene of the Tippit crime in the limited amount of time that was available. The problem, as I recall, was that there was a discrepancy in eyewitness accounts. Two separate accounts (the one Wrone sites and another) had Oswald traveling on two different streets toward the scene of the Tippit murder. Since both eyewitnesses each claimed that Oswald traveled different routes at the same time, one must be wrong. One route is shorter and more direct. This direct route would have allowed Oswald plenty of time to make it to the scene of the Tippit murder. The other, less direct and longer (Wrone) route would not have allowed Oswald the time to make it to the scene of the crime.

One fact is for certain. Between where Oswald was living and the movie theater where he was arrested Jefferson Davis Tippit was killed.

What I find most interesting is not the possibility of "if" Oswald could have made it to the scene and was therefore the killer but the inconclusive ballistics evidence gathered from the scene.

Jim Root

[Robert Howard]

I can't speak for the rest of the Forum members, but I am getting the strong impression that we have entered a new phase in the JFK Saga, where media promoting the 'Warren Commission/No conspiracy/Lone Nut Oswald' can reach any television and cable network without a problem and the 'conspiratorial view' is as always mocked. The website referenced reminds me of some of the cable shows of 2005 I saw, which went to great lengths to prove, yes Oswald could have done all the things he has already been ostensibly recorded as doing, leaving TSBD, Cab to rooming house, shot Tippit etc....etc...

What entered my mind is that I have a difficult time believing that the 'individuals' that produce this material are some 'grass roots historians' who want to defend the Warren Commission's findings. What is the other possibility?

With regards to Dale Myers work 'With Malice' , I thought it was well written, but my problem with it was that it appeared like he 'tried to play it safe,' with the body of information he was drawing from. I felt the same way after reading it, that I did after reading Mailer's Oswald biography, Mailer didn't seem to want to write anything that would upset the 'traditionalists' nod, nod, wink wink.

I wonder if 'Operation Mockingbird' might have morphed into 'Operation Big Brother', as in total government control of the media, because either that is what has happened or there are a lot of stupid people in this country.

Thought for the Day: If a domestic intelligence agency in America, ever wanted to clandestinely 'turn secular America into a hostile entity against Christianity and how Christianity is percieved in America, they could not do a better job than the one Pat Robertson is currently doing.'

Edited January 13, 2006 by Robert Howard

[Pat Speer]

One fact is for certain. Between where Oswald was living and the movie theater where he was arrested Jefferson Davis Tippit was killed.

What I find most interesting is not the possibility of "if" Oswald could have made it to the scene and was therefore the killer but the inconclusive ballistics evidence gathered from the scene.

Jim Root

Not to be a pain in the caboose, Jim, but the movie theatre was actually several blocks back towards the boarding house from the Tippit site. Even so, it still makes sense that Oswald would go there to hide from the police...

I've pointed it out several times but perhaps it bears repeating. While the program with Gary Mack and Dave Perry demonstrated that Oswald had plenty of time to get to the Tippit site if he was heading east, it also showed he wouldn't have had enough time if he was heading west. By demonstrating that Oswald was heading east, they showed that Oswald was heading in the direction of Jack Ruby's apartment. While this could be a coincidence, the failure of the program to point this out was, in my opinion, indicative of its bias. (A bias shared strangely by all the recent programs.)

[Jim Root]

Pat

Thank you for the information.

When it comes to the slaying of Officer Tippit, as I understand it, the balistics were never able to be positivly associated with the pistol that Oswald had when arrested. I believe it was .38 vs .38 special ammunition of something like that. I must admit that I have trouble with an assassin that loads his weapon with the wrong amunition.

Do you have anymore insights on this information.

As you know my research centers around the Edwin Anderson Walker. This research has led me to Maxwell Taylor and John J. McCloy etc. as potential conspirators. I will usually defer to other researchers, many of whom have researched in a great deal more depth than myself, when it comes to the events of November 22, 1963.

Jim Root

[Thomas H. Purvis]

Pat

Thank you for the information.

When it comes to the slaying of Officer Tippit, as I understand it, the balistics were never able to be positivly associated with the pistol that Oswald had when arrested. I believe it was .38 vs .38 special ammunition of something like that. I must admit that I have trouble with an assassin that loads his weapon with the wrong amunition.

Do you have anymore insights on this information.

As you know my research centers around the Edwin Anderson Walker. This research has led me to Maxwell Taylor and John J. McCloy etc. as potential conspirators. I will usually defer to other researchers, many of whom have researched in a great deal more depth than myself, when it comes to the events of November 22, 1963.

Jim Root

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

When it comes to the slaying of Officer Tippit, as I understand it, the balistics were never able to be positivly associated with the pistol that Oswald had when arrested. I believe it was .38 vs .38 special ammunition of something like that. I must admit that I have trouble with an assassin that loads his weapon with the wrong amunition.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

If one fully studies the history of these pistols, then they understand that this is the exact "norm" and any variation would be questionable.

These "old" pistols were part of a large purchase in which the barrel was cut down to the "snub-nose" variation.

In addition, the bore was also slightly changed, which almost eliminated the riflings, thus making any bullet identification difficult.

The fired rounds did not fit "snug" inside the barrel and in fact had space in which to almost "wobble", thus making ballistic comparison virtually impossible from round to round.

The weapon had virtually no accuracy, however was certainly deadly close up.

And of course the primary advantage being that, to an almost certainty, it was impossible to ballistically tie any fired bullets to the gun.

[Pat Speer]

Jim, Tom is correct in that the bullets were never tied to Oswald's gun. The shells recovered at the scene, however, were. Strangely, however, the officer who claimed to have initialed those shells couldn't find his intiials on them later. This is one of the many reasons people suspect something's fishy with the Tippit slaying.

I have resigned myself to the probablity it was Oswald.

An often-overlooked element of the Tippit slaying is that the number of shots fired conflicts with the earwitnesses. While the doctors discovered four bullets, and the police discovered four shells, the shells didn't match the bullets. This meant there was one shot fired that no one found and one shell used that was never recovered. (Unless of course the shells were a DPD plant.) This led the WC to conclude there were 5 shots fired. Amazingly, however, the majority of earwitnesses heard only 3 shots. That the WC failed to acknowledge thiat something similar could have happened in Dealey Plaza is indicative of its bias, IMO.

[Mark Stapleton]

Jim, Tom is correct in that the bullets were never tied to Oswald's gun. The shells recovered at the scene, however, were. Strangely, however, the officer who claimed to have initialed those shells couldn't find his intiials on them later. This is one of the many reasons people suspect something's fishy with the Tippit slaying.

I have resigned myself to the probablity it was Oswald.

An often-overlooked element of the Tippit slaying is that the number of shots fired conflicts with the earwitnesses. While the doctors discovered four bullets, and the police discovered four shells, the shells didn't match the bullets. This meant there was one shot fired that no one found and one shell used that was never recovered. (Unless of course the shells were a DPD plant.) This led the WC to conclude there were 5 shots fired. Amazingly, however, the majority of earwitnesses heard only 3 shots. That the WC failed to acknowledge thiat something similar could have happened in Dealey Plaza is indicative of its bias, IMO.

Pat,

There's something fishy about the Tippit slaying, to be sure. I can't resign myself to accepting LHO as the killer, though. I can't see why he would commit such a serious crime as killing a cop when he obviously didn't kill the President. This would require accepting that Oswald obligingly turned into a murderer just as he was being fitted up for another murder (of which he was innocent). What a stroke of luck for the conspirators--and how considerate of Oswald.

Edited January 13, 2006 by Mark Stapleton

[Thomas H. Purvis]

Jim, Tom is correct in that the bullets were never tied to Oswald's gun. The shells recovered at the scene, however, were. Strangely, however, the officer who claimed to have initialed those shells couldn't find his intiials on them later. This is one of the many reasons people suspect something's fishy with the Tippit slaying.

I have resigned myself to the probablity it was Oswald.

An often-overlooked element of the Tippit slaying is that the number of shots fired conflicts with the earwitnesses. While the doctors discovered four bullets, and the police discovered four shells, the shells didn't match the bullets. This meant there was one shot fired that no one found and one shell used that was never recovered. (Unless of course the shells were a DPD plant.) This led the WC to conclude there were 5 shots fired. Amazingly, however, the majority of earwitnesses heard only 3 shots. That the WC failed to acknowledge thiat something similar could have happened in Dealey Plaza is indicative of its bias, IMO.

Pat,

There's something fishy about the Tippit slaying, to be sure. I can't resign myself to accepting LHO as the killer, though. I can't see why he would commit such a serious crime as killing a cop when he obviously didn't kill the President. This would require accepting that Oswald obligingly turned into a murderer just as he was being fitted up for another murder (of which he was innocent). What a stroke of luck for the conspirators--and how considerate of Oswald.

This would require accepting that Oswald obligingly turned into a murderer

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Under the general assumption that he also took the shot at Walker, then it obviously was not an "instantaneous" transgression.

Especially if one considers the possibility/probability that he "stalked" Walker.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

[Paul Kerrigan]

Jim, Tom is correct in that the bullets were never tied to Oswald's gun. The shells recovered at the scene, however, were. Strangely, however, the officer who claimed to have initialed those shells couldn't find his intiials on them later. This is one of the many reasons people suspect something's fishy with the Tippit slaying.

I have resigned myself to the probablity it was Oswald.

An often-overlooked element of the Tippit slaying is that the number of shots fired conflicts with the earwitnesses. While the doctors discovered four bullets, and the police discovered four shells, the shells didn't match the bullets. This meant there was one shot fired that no one found and one shell used that was never recovered. (Unless of course the shells were a DPD plant.) This led the WC to conclude there were 5 shots fired. Amazingly, however, the majority of earwitnesses heard only 3 shots. That the WC failed to acknowledge thiat something similar could have happened in Dealey Plaza is indicative of its bias, IMO.

Officer J.M. Poe testified to marking the shells and his superior Sergeant Gerald Hill also testified that he told Poe to make "sure" that he marked the shells. In addition, Hill, when examining the shells determined that they were from a .38 automatic. It is difficult to claim that Hill was mistaken because .38 automatic shells are marked .38 AUTO at the bottom of them.