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  3. Oswald Leaving TSBD?

    Thanks Andrej.
  4. This has been known to researchers for decades (and published in books about the assassination). It's funny how the mainstream meadia picks up on stories like this that have been out there for a long time. Imagine what kind of stories there could be if the MSM were actually fair and paying attention.
  5. Oswald Leaving TSBD?

    Robin: This is what I was able to collate thus far. Shelley's and Sanders's statements are the strongest to point to Stanton's presence on the top landing. William Shelley testimony for the Warren Commission: Mr. BALL - Why did you go to the front? Mr. SHELLEY - Oh, several people were out there waiting to watch the motorcade and I went out to join them. Mr. BALL - And who was out there? Mr. SHELLEY - Well, there was Lloyd Viles of McGraw-Hill, Sarah Stanton, she's with Texas School Book, and Wesley Frazier and Billy Lovelady joined us shortly afterwards. Mr. BALL - You were standing where? Mr. SHELLEY - Just outside the glass doors there. Mr. BALL - That would be on the top landing of the entrance? Mr. SHELLEY - yes. Pauline Sanders, FBI report, 3/19/1964: … I took up a position at the top of the front steps of the Depository building facing Elm Street. To the best of my recollection, I was standing on the top step at the east end of the entrance. I recall that while standing there I noticed Mrs. Sarah Stanton standing next to me, but I am unsure as to the others. Mrs. Stanton is likewise an employee of the Texas School Book Depository… Pauline Sanders, FBI report, 11/24/1963 “She said she did not see OSWALD during this time and she stood in the last line of spectators nearest the door to the Texas School Book Depository building.” [AS: if Pauline Sanders stood nearest to the door and Sarah Stanton stood next to her, then Stanton also stood on the top landing.] Buell Wesley Frazier, interview for the Sixth Floor Museum, August 27, 2013, 33’50’’: Mr. Fagin: In the chaos that followed the shooting, did you see Oswald at all? Mr. Frazier: I did. This was all... I do not know exactly how many minutes later, but the lady I was standing next to. Some of the people, Bill Shelley and Mr. Billy Lovelady, they went down towards the Triple Underpass because before they went down there, a lady come by, a woman came by, and she was crying and she said "Somebody has shot the President". And so we looked bewildered. And I turned to Sarah: she said "She said somebody shot the President", I said I doubt that's what she said. She said that she did say that. So we stood there for a few minutes, and, and I walked down to the first step, where Billy was standing down there, by myself so I looked around. And it was just total chaos there. And then from there I started to go down to see if I could find Bill Shelley and Billy Lovelady, there was so much chaos down there. I said, well, I better go back to work, go back to the steps, so now, and I did, I walked back to the bottom of the steps, and then I walked out to the corner of the building right there where Houston comes up beside the building. And I was talking to someone, it was a lady, and I looked to my left, and come walking along the side of the Texas School Book building was Lee Oswald. Billy Lovelady, Warren Commission testimony: Mr. LOVELADY - That's on the second floor; so, I started going to the domino room where I generally went in to set down and eat and nobody was there and I happened to look on the outside and Mr. Shelley was standing outside with Miss Sarah Stanton, I believe her name is, and I said, "Well, I'll go out there and talk with them, sit down and eat my lunch out there, set on the steps," so I went out there. Mr. BALL - You ate your lunch on the steps? Mr. LOVELADY - Yes, sir. Mr. BALL - Who was with you? Mr. LOVELADY - Bill Shelley and Sarah Stanton, and right behind me Mr. BALL - What was that last name? Mr. LOVELADY - Stanton. Mr. BALL - What is the first name? Mr. LOVELADY - Bill Shelley. Mr. BALL - And Stanton's first name? Mr. LOVELADY - Miss Sarah Stanton. Mr. BALL - Did you stay on the steps Mr. LOVELADY - Yes. Billy Lovelady, HSCS testimony, 24’50’’ , http://www.prayer-man.com/tag/hsca Lovelady mentioned Frazier, Shelley, Stanton and some other ladies as standing on steps. Notably, Lovelady stood on the top landing at least during a part of the period when the motorcade was passing in front of the Depository. The three people he named were likely his closest neighbors on steps.
  6. Oswald Leaving TSBD?

    quote: 9. The presence of Mr. Stanton on the top landing fits with the testimonies of Pauline Sanders, Bill Shelley and Billy Lovelady, and with interviews given by Mr. Frazier. Andrej , is it possible to post the relevant parts of these testimonies into one single post, so that it is easy to read them at a glance. The parts in question i am referring too, are any sections where it places Sarah Stanton on the top landing, and not down on the steps ?
  7. Oswald Leaving TSBD?

    Robin: would you agree that if the other lady standing on the top landing was taller than the lady we are discussing then the shorter of the two ladies would be Mrs. Sarah Stanton? It appears that we need to find the other lady to be able to decide on the identity of this one. The 3D model is in the last stage of its development although still not completed yet. I am not sure about the exact depth of the doorway, however, the interval of possible doorway depths is already quite narrow: 41.5' - 45'' which is only about 10 cm in the metric system. The shorter the interval is, the more difficult it becomes to decide. Let me summarise the observations speaking in favor of Mrs. Stanton to be the person of interest: 1. The person of interest is a white Caucasian. 2. The person is not seen to be ascending in the earlier part of Darnell film and therefore this person was most likely standing on the top landing seconds or minutes earlier. 3. The person seems to be in shadow which means that s/he was standing very close (maybe touching?) the glass window. 4. The height of the person is about 5'3'' or 63''. The average body height of a woman at their fortieth in 1963 was 63.2'' with the standard error of the mean of 0.1'' . This data can be read from the National Health Examination Surveys published in https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/data/ad/ad347.pdf , Table 8. 5. The person of this height could only be a woman because men's body height values were 5'' larger than those of women. The 95% confidence interval of body heights in men (aged 40-49) in 1963 was 68.1-68.5. Thus, with a probability nearing certainty this person could not be a man. 6. In contrast, the height of this person would be close to the 95% confidence interval for women, 63'0 - 63''4'. The lady we see in Darnell's still ( about 63'') would be close to the lower confidence level (63.0'') or just below it. 7. The body height of this lady would be appropriate to match Billy Lovelady's description of Sarah Stanton as "heavy set and short" lady. 8. This woman stood close to the glass windows and since she was short, she would not be seen in films or pictures while standing nearer to the centre of the doorway. She would be obfuscated by the figures of taller people than herself, Bill Shelley and Billy Lovelady, who stood close to her but in front of her. 9. The presence of Mr. Stanton on the top landing fits with the testimonies of Pauline Sanders, Bill Shelley and Billy Lovelady, and with interviews given by Mr. Frazier. This lady would not be seen in Darnell did she remain at the spot closer to the centre of the doorway. We see her in one of the late Darnell frames because she moved from the more central spot to the east, possibly to be able to see the Tripple Underpass and grassy knoll area. Therefore, it was possible for Mr. Frazier to talk to Mrs. Stanton about the shots when shots rang out (she was standing closer to him than in the Darnell' still) and to move about one step to the east later to be able to see more of the scene of interest which was the grassy knoll- Tripple Underpass area. The late part of Darnell's film would be shot about 40 seconds after the last shot giving plenty of time for Mrs. Stanton to move about 2 feet eastwards from her previous location at the centre of the doorway.
  8. Oswald mock trial drop box of CLE course materials

    Dawn: I watched the whole thing. I was disappointed in many different aspects. And I agree, the lawyers did not do a good job either keeping things simple enough for the jury, or in countering the circumstantial case. Plus, they let the prosecution get away with saying that there was no evidence of any other kind of weapon or ammo. My God, what do you call the recovery by the FBI of a 7.65 Mauser shell in Dealey Plaza and the three reports of the rifle being a Mauser in the Commission volumes? And I agree that they should have said something like, yep LHO was really in a panic to get away. He walked toward the bus station about four blocks away to get on a bus going back to the scene of the crime. That bus stopped in traffic and he got off in the Plaza. He then hailed a cab, but then offered the cab to an older lady first. Public transportation to beat a murder charge. And BTW, did they did not use the other way to counter that: Roger Craig and Marvin Robinson. What made that hurt was this: the guy who made that Nash Rambler escape famous was sitting at the defense table: TInk Thompson. PS Dawn, I want to send you a message but your box is full.
  9. The Newly Declassified JFK Files

    To answer your question Ron, yep it has. But I think it was a good appearance on Coast to Coast tonight. They have me two hours to go through this stuff and about 1.5 million people go to hear the real story of what is going on in this disgraceful charade that is, for me, the last triumph of the fascist state over JFK. So I told the audience to go to the White House web site and email or call the number and tell Trump that these people are breaking the law and you are the only person who can stop them. You screwed up once but not you can make it up, declassify everything en toto by April 26th. Because that sure is not happening now, not by a long shot.
  10. I agree, anyone have more substantive info on this?
  11. Trump got rolled as a teenager. He never knew what hit him. He's been used as a tool ever since, when needed.
  12. The Newly Declassified JFK Files

    Actually Joe I was being sarcastic regarding the last part. I have a pessimistic streak which leaves me cynical. Though I don't (generally) try to offend others. All this could well mean that some of the Generals were in cahoots with Wall Street and their minions at the CIA to use Oswald as a patsy, though only a Very few were aware of him. Not to detract from the thread or site but draw attention to them: https://www.bing.com/search?q=black+sabbath+war+pigs&form=PRUSEN&mkt=en-us&httpsmsn=1&refig=8fb43a792c6b483a9292f7206603fdd5&sp=-1&pq=black+sabbath+war+pigs&sc=9-22&qs=n&sk=&cvid=8fb43a792c6b483a9292f7206603fdd5
  13. The Newly Declassified JFK Files

    Jim, has your thread been hijacked? Difficult to tell some times.
  14. Wait, the "pool of blood on the grassy knoll" guy was being serious?
  15. The Dual Life of Albert Osborne

    Has any new documents been released on Osborn?
  16. Bobby Baker dies at 89

  17. Oswald mock trial drop box of CLE course materials

    You insist on drawing a distinction without any logical basis. There is a chain of possession for any photo of the shirt; there is no chain of possession for the BOH autopsy photo, no proof that the photo shows the body of JFK. I think you're inventing distinctions out of whole cloth.
  18. Oswald mock trial drop box of CLE course materials

    That makes no sense at all. The Oswald defenders in the mock trial impeached the chain of possession of the Magic Bullet, so why couldn't they have impeached the authenticity of the autopsy photo? There are no such deficiencies. They didn't bring CE-399 into court, did they? They didn't bring the police dictabelt into court and test it in front of the jury, did they? Factually incorrect. There is no chain of possession for the autopsy photos, and you insist on pressing a false equivalency between photos and physical evidence.
  19. Bobby Baker dies at 89

    Very Interesting bio-article by Neil Genzlinger.
  20. Did the Dallas Radical Right kill JFK?

    Thank you Kirk, At some point we lose traction with the terms "Right" and "Left" . We then have to consider terms like "oligarchy" " Royalism" "Class" and "Money". Right or left, America does not exist without liberal values. The right to Bear Arms, the Right of Assembly, Freedom of Speech, and Press, and, indeed, The Bill of Rights are, in fact, liberal traditions. This debate makes think of, and want to read Christoper Hitchens' book: Blood, Class and Nostalgia: Anglo-American Ironies.
  21. Did the Dallas Radical Right kill JFK?

    Castro was never a rightist. Castro started out primarily as an anti imperialist. I believe at one time he met Batista, but he was running for Congress when Batista seized control in a coup.Then Castro denounced him. At one point, not knowing Castro's allegiances,the CIA did back him over Batista.
  22. Did the Dallas Radical Right kill JFK?

    Reading with interest. Let's not forget David Phillips - he promoted Alvarado's bogus stories.
  23. Did the Dallas Radical Right kill JFK?

    If you mean Mafia interests in Cuba -- I know they were involved in the casinos but not sure how much they were involved with the corporate interests.
  24. Bobby Baker Scandal and the Assassination of JFK

    http://educationforum.ipbhost.com/topic/24183-mary-jo-kopechne-and-the-jfka/
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