Thomas Graves Posted February 2, 2017 Share Posted February 2, 2017 10 minutes ago, Bill Miller said: I think after they passed the running woman - they went around the back of the car they were passing and entered onto the Island in time to look back and see Truly and Patrolman Baker about to enter the TSBD, Here is the link to a discussion that Larsen has been participating in ....... That's the Black guy's head, right? -- Tommy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Miller Posted February 2, 2017 Share Posted February 2, 2017 4 hours ago, Thomas Graves said: That's the Black guy's head, right? -- Tommy Yes - that is the black guy. The reference is to head size when moving from the TSBD to the Island. Someone had posted a slow motion clip that went just a frame or so longer which allowed Lovelady's head to be seen bigger than what it was when he first left the stairs. My point was that had he been walking away towards the RR Yard and not angled towards the Island, then his head should have gotten smaller which it did not. Just at the end of the slow motion clip it seems to get larger meaning to me he had changed course once he passed the parked car next to the Island. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sandy Larsen Posted February 2, 2017 Share Posted February 2, 2017 15 hours ago, Thomas Graves said: On 12/5/2015 at 10:59 PM, Thomas Graves said: [...] bumped for Sandy Larsen PS I believe that's Officer Baker running off-screen, at the far right. Either him or Running Lady (lol). Tommy, Baker is already running across the street by this time (what we see in this clip), so that can't be him on the far right. (Besides, Baker's helmet is white, and this person is dark on top.) That could be Running Lady. But she seems to be moving too slowly. She's running in the other film (Couch/Darnell?). Maybe she started out slower and then sped up. I can't find any other candidate in the other films for this person, so I think it must be Running Lady. If so... judging by where Running Lady is in this clip and where she is in the others (Couch/Darnell?), alleged-Shelley and alleged-Lovelady should still be in view here. Those two guys moving left in the background, roughly in the middle of the frame, must be them. The two have split up now. Oh I remember now... this is the clip where you're thinking that it might be showing Shelley walking over to the park. Well I agree that that does seem to be the Shelley character. But it's hard for me to say whether he's walking toward the park. Maybe Bill can tell. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomas Graves Posted February 2, 2017 Share Posted February 2, 2017 (edited) 1 hour ago, Sandy Larsen said: [...] Oh I remember now... this is the clip where you're thinking that it might be showing Shelley walking over to the park. Well I agree that that does seem to be the Shelley character. But it's hard for me to say whether he's walking toward the park. Maybe Bill can tell. Sandy, If you look at Gerda Dunkel's synchronized Couch - Darnell clip a few times and literally force your eyes to keep following "Shelley" and "Lovelady" to the bitter end no matter what gyrations the two clips are doing, you'll realize that the two men in this very short bit, above, must be the same as the two men we've been wondering about in Darnell in which they can be seen walking / running down Elm Street Extension towards the railroad yard (while Running Woman, on the sidewalk, is approaching them and then then passing them). I.e., they must be the "Shelley" and "Lovelady" that we've been speculating about in Darnell for so long now. -- Tommy Edited February 2, 2017 by Thomas Graves Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sandy Larsen Posted February 2, 2017 Share Posted February 2, 2017 36 minutes ago, Thomas Graves said: Sandy, If you look at Gerda Dunkel's synchronized Couch - Darnell clip a few times and literally force your eyes to keep following "Shelley" and "Lovelady" to the bitter end no matter what gyrations the two clips are doing, you'll realize that the two men in this very short bit, above, must be the same as the two men we've been wondering about in Darnell in which they can be seen walking / running down Elm Street Extension towards the railroad yard (while Running Woman, on the sidewalk, is approaching them and then then passing them). I.e., they must be the "Shelley" and "Lovelady" that we've been speculating about in Darnell for so long now. -- Tommy Thanks Tommy. I'm glad to hear that it is pretty much confirmed that the two men are the same. I tried to find a large version of Gerda Dunkel's synchronized Couch/Darnell clip. Unfortunately I couldn't and had to enlarge the small version in my browser. Unfortunately, the gif no longer runs properly once enlarged. But I'm sure you're right about this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomas Graves Posted February 2, 2017 Share Posted February 2, 2017 (edited) 12 hours ago, Sandy Larsen said: Thanks Tommy. I'm glad to hear that it is pretty much confirmed that the two men are the same. I tried to find a large version of Gerda Dunkel's synchronized Couch/Darnell clip. Unfortunately I couldn't and had to enlarge the small version in my browser. Unfortunately, the gif no longer runs properly once enlarged. But I'm sure you're right about this. Great! IMHO, the two men are starting to cross over Elm Street Extension towards the "island." -- Tommy Edited February 3, 2017 by Thomas Graves Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomas Graves Posted February 3, 2017 Share Posted February 3, 2017 (edited) On 2/2/2017 at 10:08 AM, Sandy Larsen said: Thanks Tommy. I'm glad to hear that it is pretty much confirmed that the two men are the same. I tried to find a large version of Gerda Dunkel's synchronized Couch/Darnell clip. Unfortunately I couldn't and had to enlarge the small version in my browser. Unfortunately, the gif no longer runs properly once enlarged. But I'm sure you're right about this. In the short GIF on this page, above, the two men are starting to cross over Elm Street Extension towards the "island." -- Tommy bumped for Sandy Larsen to comment upon Edited February 4, 2017 by Thomas Graves Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomas Graves Posted February 4, 2017 Share Posted February 4, 2017 21 hours ago, Thomas Graves said: In the short GIF on this page, above, the two men are starting to cross over Elm Street Extension towards the "island." -- Tommy bumped for Sandy Larsen to comment upon bumped again for Sandy Larsen, who seems to have missed it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sandy Larsen Posted February 4, 2017 Share Posted February 4, 2017 (edited) I did see that post Tommy. I didn't reply because I had already commented that I couldn't tell what direction alleged-Shelley was going. (And then I suggest that maybe Bill could tell.) But I didn't comment on what direction I thought alleged-Lovelady was going. To me it looks like he is walking toward the RR yard, and that he is walking on the Elm Street extension along its north edge. The reason I locate Lovelady there specifically is because I believe I can see his head bobbing higher than normal one time. It makes me think he took just one step up on the sidewalk with his right foot, but then decided to stay on the road. Stepping up on the sidewalk would explain his head bobbing up. I would be interested in knowing if anybody else sees Lovelady's head bob up. Edited February 4, 2017 by Sandy Larsen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Miller Posted February 5, 2017 Share Posted February 5, 2017 On 2/2/2017 at 10:51 AM, Sandy Larsen said: Tommy, Baker is already running across the street by this time (what we see in this clip), so that can't be him on the far right. (Besides, Baker's helmet is white, and this person is dark on top.) That could be Running Lady. But she seems to be moving too slowly. She's running in the other film (Couch/Darnell?). Maybe she started out slower and then sped up. I can't find any other candidate in the other films for this person, so I think it must be Running Lady. If so... judging by where Running Lady is in this clip and where she is in the others (Couch/Darnell?), alleged-Shelley and alleged-Lovelady should still be in view here. Those two guys moving left in the background, roughly in the middle of the frame, must be them. The two have split up now. Oh I remember now... this is the clip where you're thinking that it might be showing Shelley walking over to the park. Well I agree that that does seem to be the Shelley character. But it's hard for me to say whether he's walking toward the park. Maybe Bill can tell. Shelley and Lovelady start off walking from the stairs towards the running woman. Once they pass her - Lovelady over-takes Shelley and starts to trot towards the Island. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomas Graves Posted February 5, 2017 Share Posted February 5, 2017 1 hour ago, Bill Miller said: Shelley and Lovelady start off walking from the stairs towards the running woman. Once they pass her - Lovelady over-takes Shelley and starts to trot towards the Island. Huh? Looks to me as though the dark-suited "Shelley" figure is the one who's crossing over Elm Street Extension towards the "island." Not sure where the other guy is going, but maybe towards the "island," too. -- Tommy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Miller Posted February 5, 2017 Share Posted February 5, 2017 (edited) 4 hours ago, Thomas Graves said: Huh? Looks to me as though the dark-suited "Shelley" figure is the one who's crossing over Elm Street Extension towards the "island." Not sure where the other guy is going, but maybe towards the "island," too. -- Tommy I recently saw a larger and longer version where it appeared that Lovelady moved towards the Island after passing the car parked on that side of the street. I wish now I would have saved it. Below is another slow-motion clip that shows Lovelady over-take Shelley before the animation was stopped. I believe Billy said they walked and then trotted which the film tends to show. Mr. BALL - Right after you talked to Gloria, did you leave the steps and go toward the tracks? Mr. LOVELADY - Yes. Mr. BALL - Did you run or walk? Mr. LOVELADY - Medium trotting or fast walk. Mr. BALL - A fast walk? Mr. LOVELADY - Yes. Mr. BALL - How did you happen to turn around and see Truly and the policeman go into the building? Mr. LOVELADY - Somebody hollered and I looked. Mr. BALL - You turned around and looked? Mr. LOVELADY - Yes. Edited February 5, 2017 by Bill Miller Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomas Graves Posted February 5, 2017 Share Posted February 5, 2017 (edited) 1 hour ago, Bill Miller said: [...] Dear William, Have you not seen this? This is what I was referring to. It's what Sandy Larsen and I have been talking about on this page. D'oh. -- Tommy Edited February 5, 2017 by Thomas Graves Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Miller Posted February 5, 2017 Share Posted February 5, 2017 (edited) ^^ I believe that both men had been angling across the street to a point where they cut between the parked cars and onto the Island just as they testified. The lighter clothing of Lovelady and the motion blur makes it difficult to track, but everything seen here has been recorded as it happened and isn't subject to stress or confusion. I had said early on that people in stressed situations will often lose track of time and make errors over the order of events when trying to piece them together, which in this case has given birth to some really outlandish conspiracy claims about lies and deception. Let us also keep in mind that once these men sat foot on the Island that they heard someone yell which caused them to look back towards the TSBD which in turn allowed them to see Truly and Baker about to enter the doorway. This too fits the timing of what is seen in this clip despite the camera not staying on the stairs long enough to watch it happen. Edited February 5, 2017 by Bill Miller Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Clark Posted February 5, 2017 Share Posted February 5, 2017 10 hours ago, Bill Miller said: As an aside to this discussion.... In the smaller, inserted GIF, you can see what looks like cop running and drawing his gun. He is running across the garage/entryway. i just wanted to point that out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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