Bill Miller

The more I watch this slowed version of the two men - they are much closer to the island side of the street than the opposite side from which they came. It also appears that after passing the running woman who turns her head towards them in passing as if saying something ... the men look like they may have headed for the Island once they passed the rear of the car they were next to. In the still image below ... the two men look too big compared to the car across the street that was parked along the TSBD, but they do match more in size to the car parked near the tree on the Island.

MPI changed the aspect ratio of the frame - I bet if you changed yours, then they would match up really well.

Makes sense seeing how he wanted to film the President

You got that right! The Zapruder film picks up the limo before the first shot was ever fired. And could you imagine that had Abe's film stopped because the time on the winding he gave it had quit because he used it up filming Elm Street before JFK was on it .... the accusations against Zapruder would be flying like dung through a scatter gun!

Oh wonderful, Chris! The head shot occurred in less than 1/18th of a second. It takes stabilized views like these to break down any subsequent moment .... In this slowed down version ... how much of the distance between JFK's back and the seat do you attribute to the rotation of the limo as it moves across Zapruder's field of view? Would you give it about as much as Connally's tie and face against Nellie's head in the background? Not much difference that I can tell, so did Connally's tie move violently forward as well .... I mean really? Now that we have seen the super slow stabilized version ... Didn't rather watch the film at normal speed. Do you think for one millisecond that Dan Rather could have seen that kind of detail in 1/18th of a second with the film being played in real time and without the use of stabilized magnified frames to scrutinize. If so, then I expect old Dan could count how many times a hummingbird flaps its wings a second. Utter nonsense in my view.

I think I only spoke to his saying that he saw the limo turn onto Elm Street. Rather may have seen the President's car had turned onto Elm Street from viewing the film, but he didn't see the limo actually make the turn onto Elm Street. Rather addressed his error in 1977. The President was not driven forward with the head shot and Connally didn't fall backwards - Nellie reached out and pulled him back towards her. Those things are mis-interpretations that Rather made.

Alistair, The orange dot on your illustration is in the wrong street. Baker parked his bike on the street Kennedy's limo traveled. Also, try to remember that these people are being filmed from a skewed line of sight. To say one is 1' from the other has not been established. As I stated earlier - the people in the Zapruder film look to be shoulder to shoulder when in face a photo taken with frontal few shows far more spacing between those people.

Yes, I believed Gary Mack when one of the main conspiracy people in the field had examined the camera original Zfilm alnd told me the same thing. And I will say this again, Ray ... Zapruder would let his film out of his possession, so he went to the lab to have a first generation copy made and then two other copies made from the first generation copy. The FBI and the Secret Service got the two copies made from the first generation copy Zapruder had made. Zapruder kept his copy and the camera original. The next day, Life Magazine went to work at purchasing the camera original. The first generation copy remained with Zapruder. There is nothing on the first generation copy of Zapruder's that is not on the two copies and the original. Both Groden and Zavada have studied the said original Zapruder film and have confirmed it is the real deal. Now back to Dan Rather - he also said the President was hit in the head and driven forward. Out of all those who was along Elm Street when the President was shot in the head has any of them ever said Kennedy was driven forward. Of all those people who was there and who has since seen the Zapruder film have ever said that it depicts anything other than what they saw. Only Dan Rather made that claim. However, since that time Dan Rather had commented about his blatant error in the reporting he made of the Kennedy assassination. He said in his 1977 autobiography The Camera Never Blinks, Rather said the following in response to why he claimed JFK's head moved forward - "At the risk of sounding too defensive, I challenge anyone to watch for the first time a twenty-two second film of devastating impact ... then describe what they had seen in its entirety, without notes." So not a theory, Ray ... you tie your wagon to Dan Rather remark if you like - I stand by the evidence as I know it to be.

To claim conspiracy where there is no evidence of any only hurts the good evidence that supports there was a conspiracy. Each claim of alteration for example should be thoroughly considered. To hold the position that we should remain loyal to everything as being conspiratorial demonstrates we are biased and that are examinations should be suspect because of that bias.

And nowhere was it said that Oswald claimed to have been standing outside talking to his carpool pal Frazier when the shooting occurred. That is correct. Frazier did ask what was the package about and Lee gave a satisfactory answer that made sense seeing how Lee was coming from one location and would be going back to the rooming house.

Alteration believers forget that Zapruder kept a first generation copy of the film with him and as far as I can tell it shows everything the original and copies do.

Alistair - Did not Sandy say that Baker was running in line with his shadow? If so, then Baker's right step ... it will step in his shadow and his street shadow is not on the blue line but clearly above it. And I still want to know why the blue line bends just before the curb???

Why does your blue line make a turn right before getting to the curb?

His post was up on the board for about 20hrs before I cited one of the sentences from it. Then immediately after that was done - his post was deleted.

The insult is someone claiming alteration without even knowing the processes needed to have been done such a thing to know if it was possible or not.

Really? Your position was there was no evidence other than the Zapruder film that the bone plate dislodged from there head - I believe you stated that no medical personnel at Parkland noticed such a wound. Dr. Jenkins was filmed discussing it and how big the bone plate was based on the size of his hand. Then there is Moorman's photo. Did you not see the top of the had missing? Is it your position that Moorman had a photo alteration lab in her coat pocket - while standing in the Plaza - and before a cameraman filmed a close-up of her Polaroid following the assassination?? I hope we are not going to hear any more 'Beautiful Mind' type reasoning. So without going there - tell me how it is you can still say that frame Z313 is a paint job!

I disagree, Sandy. You have simply drawn lines on a two dimensional image from a skewed line of sight which leaves a considerable margin for error in my view. The world as I know it is the dimensional. Your two parallel lines don't account for Baker's shrinking in size by the time he gets to the other side of the street, nor do they tell the viewer how far west of the line is Baker when he starts and finishes his run before the camera moves off of him. In other words - from the camera man's angle .... those lines without accounting for perspective are misleading in my view. Your base line appears to be running towards a location east of the stairs with no reference as to how far in reality is Baker to the west of the line. Both the upper and lower blue lines should be on some path that should eventually meet a horizon point, but they appear parallel - again misleading. Patrolman Baker is decreasing in size quite rapidly which means he is moving away from the camera. I believe if you were to show your animation to a someone who is skilled in Photogammetry that that Baker is far enough west of your blue line to place him on a course with the base of the stairs leading up to the entrance of the TSBD. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Perspective_distortion_(photography)

The line drawn onto the Moorman photo does not start at the Badge Man location. The limo is several feet west from its location at Z312/313.

So much being discussed about from where the shot that killed Kennedy came from as if the bullet was a through and through shot, which it was not. The bullet was a tangential strike to the President's skull. Two things will happen from a tangential strike. One is that the brain will appear to have been shredded instead of having more of a refined bored hole through it. And the other is that the bullet can change direction as it passes through the head. Then there is the possible fragmenting of the lead which can have pieces go on several directions. Here is a link showing a tangential bullet strike hitting water alone. Start at the 2:50 second mark and watch what happens to the 357 bullet when it hits the water. That bullet shed its energy so fast that it made an abrupt turn in short order. The bullet that fractured the bone plate could have done the same thing inside the President's head and probably did. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dihs9JcVt3E

Ok - so let us examine the curb part of your response. It is hard for me to actually hard for me to even see the top of his shadow reach the curb before the man coming from the right blocks the view to Patrolman Baker's shadow. So let us discuss the lower portion of the shadow leading back to Baker. It is clearly not at the curb Bart, I am not interested in your excuse that everyone must have lied nonsense. So don't waste your breath on me unless you have nothing better to do. I am interested only at this time what information can be drawn from the film images. There is no evidence that Baker ran to the corner of the building to look up and down Houston and he never mentions doing that in his re-enactment. No one claims to have seem him do that either, nor run across the street to the Dal-Tex building that I am aware of. If you have witnesses that saw him shoot past the stairs and did any of those things, then I will hear it. If not, then its all jibber-jabber to me and why I am looking towards the info the Darnell film may have to offer. Thanks!

I would think just the opposite for those people on the right appear to be in a position to see the Patrolman coming and would know to move in a way to let him through. People walking up the stairs with their back to the officer would not even know he is approaching.