Jim Hargrove
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Posts posted by Jim Hargrove
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8 hours ago, John Butler said:
I've always thought that Harvey Oswald and Lee Oswald could be anything. I believe when they were taken to New York as teens they were taken directly into the MKUltra program
John,
You probably already know that Louise Robinson, employed for six weeks in 1953 by Marguerite to clean house in her New York City apartment, claimed that Marguerite told her that she had brought her son to New York so that he could have mental tests performed at the Jacobi Hospital.
This was certainly the era of MK/ULTRA.
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13 hours ago, Steve Thomas said:
Jim,
I have compiled 49 different instances of the use of the name.
Steve Thomas
Steve,
I was hoping you’d see this and take a look at John A’s “Harv or Harvey” file, which includes Peter Dale Scott's list. It’s all more than 20 years old, but there might be some stuff you haven't seen yet.
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On 5/7/2022 at 3:49 AM, Jeremy Bojczuk said:
Milton Jones's description of the man did not match the real-life, one and only Lee Harvey Oswald.
In CE 2641, Jones described the man as:
- aged 30-35 (Oswald was 24 years old),
- 5' 11" tall (Oswald was 5' 9" tall),
- 150 pounds in weight (Oswald was weighed that very day at 131 pounds),
- and wearing a blue jacket (Oswald's blue jacket was in the book depository).
If Jones's description is accurate, the man on the bus was not Oswald.
Again....
Really? According to his Marine Corps discharge data, Oswald was 5’11” (71”) tall and weighed 150 lbs., EXACTLY matching the estimates by Jones. Earl Rose’s autopsy report estimated Oswald’s weight at 150 pounds, also EXACTLY matching the estimate by Jones. (Rose measured Oswald’s height a 5’9”.)
As I’ve already explained, but Mr. B. continues to ignore, bus driver McWatters testified that he gave out only two transfers during his run at the time of the assassination, one to a blond woman and the other to Oswald, who apparently got on at the same time. Jones also said that a blond woman got on the bus at the same time as the man he described so accurately (missing only the age by six years).
Jones indicated that “A blond woman and a dark haired man [Oswald] boarded the bus approximately six blocks before Houston Street. The man sat in the seat behind him and the woman occupied a seat further to the rear of the bus.” Jones told the FBI the man sitting behind him wore a “light blue jacket and grey khaki trousers.”
McWatters later told the WC, “Yes, sir; I gave him one [bus transfer] about two blocks from where he got on [at Griffin]... that is the transfer because it had my punch mark on it.... I gave only two transfers going through town on that trip and that was at the one stop of where I gave the lady and the gentlemen that got off the bus, I issued two transfers.…
By the way, since Mr. B. believes that an eyewitness estimate of a man’s height that is off by 2 inches means it must be a different person, no doubt Mr. B. will agree that the LHO who left the Marine Corps measured at 5’11” tall simply cannot be the same LHO who was measured on a slab by Earl Rose at 5’9”. These are measurements by medical professionals, not estimates by casual eyewitnesses.
I'm sure Mr. B. will agree that the height distinctions indicate there were two different LHOs!
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2 hours ago, John Butler said:
Jim,
That is a lot of references for Harvey Lee Oswald going back years before the JFKA.
Any idea who Donald Andrew Wolf was? The letter is strange with Wolf claiming best bud status with Oswald, and him being one of only 10 friends of Oswald.
I was wondering about him too. He isn't mentioned in H&L and that handwritten letter and envelope are the only things I can remember ever seeing about him. Weird...
...but not as weird as the Harvey Lee "Tex" business. As you know, John A. thinks American-born LEE was a killer. Sheesh!
Steve Thomas has got this Harvey Lee tiger by the tail, but who knows where it will lead, if anywhere.
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2 hours ago, Jonathan Cohen said:
How can there have been a "coordinated effort" to "give a clean bill of health" to someone who you claim was actually two different people?
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As you probably know, page 2 of that cable indicated that “life in Soviet Union clearly had a maturing effect on Oswald.” That cable was issued just a couple of months after Oswald’s arrest for alleged violence in support of Communist Cuba!
A really disturbing thing about that cable is that it was sent at almost exactly the same time (10/10/63) that the FBI cancelled the “Wanted Notice” on LHO.
All this gives the impression that elements of the CIA and the FBI made a coordinated effort to give a clean bill of political health for LHO. Concentrating on the mole hunt business, in my opinion, is just a smokescreen to take attention away from this remarkable coincidence.
These two documents, issued nearly simultaneously, clearly took the federal spotlight off Oswald less than two months before the assassination of JFK.
I wrote up a more complete analysis of all this HERE.
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Back in 1996, Peter Dale Scott prepared a list of References to “Harvey Lee Oswald.” It was forwarded to John A. and can be read in it’s entirety at the link below to Baylor University’s JFK/John Armstrong Collection.
This is a lengthy PDF file and Mr. Scott’s list appears on pp. 28-36, although there are a number of other interesting documents in the file.
Probably the easiest way to read this is to download the whole “Harv or Harvey” file. Just click the DOWNLOAD button, select “Full Asset,” and click Download again.
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The evidence handling of the entire Walker shooting is an obvious scam designed to implicate Oswald.
In the photos below, CE 573 is a bullet allegedly dug out of Walker’s house. CE 399 is the infamous “Magic Bullet” Oswald allegedly used to shoot at JFK. Note that they are both copper jacketed bullets.
Sure look similar, don’t they?
But as you can see in the original report filed by Dallas police, it was a steel-jacketed bullet dug out of Mr. Walker's house. Somehow it transformed itself into a copper jacketed bullet! It’s another Magic Bullet!
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Dan Rice was probably referring to the infamous CIA cable of October 10, 1963 (see below).
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1 hour ago, Steve Thomas said:
While they were there, Gannaway called them and asked them to cross-reference the list of TSBD employees against the CID's Intelligence Files. When they did, they recognized Joe Molina's name. Gannaway told them to bring the whole file downtown.
Fascinating! Why on earth would Capt. Gannaway want the list of TSBD employees to be cross-referenced against CID Intel files? Makes me think of William Weston’s work searching for Intel ties to the TSBD.
And why didn’t the employee list include either member of the Dynamic Duo® starring William Shelley and Billy Lovelady? Did I miss both names? I don’t think so.
Bill Shelley was LHO’s supervisor, fer cryn’ out loud. In a 1989 letter Dallas journalist Elzie Glaze described interviews with another TSBD employee who had worked under Shelley and Glaze said that this employee indicated that “Mr. Shelley claims to have been an intelligence officer during World War II and thereafter joined the CIA."
If you pay a bit of attention, this is all getting pretty smelly. Again, the absence of Shelley and Lovelady from the list of TSBD employees is weird! "Harvey Lee Oswald" is just part of the weirdness here.
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17 hours ago, John Butler said:
But, that too is wrapped up in the mystery of Harvey and Lee. Wasn't this information given to the DPD by an Army colonel or am I mis-remembering how the DPD got that name an address.
It’s kind of weird that no mail forwarding instructions were ever released for both the Elsbeth and W. Neely addresses.
Lieutenant Jack Revill was gathering information on Oswald and prepared a list of TSBD employees and their addresses. On Oswald's employment application at the TSBD, and his W-4 form, he listed his address as 2515 W. 5th Street, Irving, Texas 41. But Lieutenant Revill listed his name as Harvey Lee Oswald and his address as 605 Elsbeth. Oswald had not lived on Elsbeth since March 1963 and there was nothing related to the Elsbeth address in TSBD records.42 1t remains unknown where Lieutenant Revill obtained this address, although the address may have come from Oswald's library card. (H&L p. 901)
The handwritten note on the document below is John A’s and says, “The same transposed name and erroneous address found in military intel files!”
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Oswald clearly hid his fluency in Russian from the Soviet authorities. Here's even more evidence of that:
Medics at Botkinskaya Hospital in Moscow, who treated Oswald’s self-inflicted wrist wound, realized that “The patient apparently understands the questions asked in Russian. Sometimes he answers correctly, but immediately states that he does not understand what was asked.”
Marina may have been trying to hide her fluency in English at around the time she met Oswald in the USSR. Robert Wesbster, the Rand Corporation worker who "defected" to Russia about the same time as Oswald, told Dick Russell in a 1997 interview that when he (Webster) met Marina in Russia, they spoke together in English for hours. Webster said Marina spoke English well but had a heavy accent. I can't prove it, but my bet is that Marina and "Oswald" spoke English, at least during their earliest meetings. Harvey Oswald tried to hide his command of Russian from most of the people he met in Moscow and Minsk.
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One more thing about the bus and taxi Oswald leaving the TSBD.
To those people who believe only in the Nash Rambler Oswald, I'd like to point out again that according to the Official Story®, the bus transfer was found just after 4 pm on 11/22. Dallas Transit System Division Superintendent F.F. Yates immediately indicated that transfer #004459 came from a book of transfers issued that morning to Cecil McWatters. Was Yates part of the conspiracy? This hardly seems to be made up because…..
Just two hours later, McWatters was staring at LHO in a police lineup. Regardless of what you think of the bus and taxi evidence, if this was all invented, how did it start so quickly in the way it apparently did?
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On 7/11/2021 at 4:58 AM, Karl Kinaski said:
There is no 1960 Memo signed by Thomas B. Casasin, which is 2. the Pseudonym of CIA Japan Station Chief G. B Richardson, and 3. not the Pseudonym of Richard Helms as suggested by a crazy Armstrong-footnote Nr. 39 (page 314 H&L)
This formerly secret document indicates the following: Thomas P. Cassasin (pseudo), resigned. Working abroad for U.N. organization. (Previously requested). He was Chief SR-6 from October 1960 to August 1962.”
As to the 11/25/63 memo, as you can plainly see, Casasin was talking about activities from “Summer 1960”:

Adam Johnson is exactly right about Oswald hiding his knowledge of Russian. On Stanislaw Shuskevich, who was hired to teach Oswald Russian in the USSR:
On Sushkevich:
The Interloper: Lee Harvey Oswald Inside the Soviet Union
By Peter SavodniAuthor Peter Savodni interviewed the Russian worker--Stanislaw Shushkevich--who tried to give Oswald a few lessons in the Russian language. According to the author, Shushkevich told him that Oswald "knew very few words" in Russian and that he "found it hard to communicate with his 'comrades' in any meaningful way." When Oswald planned to attend a concert by a Russian singer, Shushkevich noted that "it would have been impossible for Oswald to understand the lyrics."
Shushkevich also indicated that he suspected his real assignment was not to teach Oswald Russian but "to get information--in this case, to see how much Russian Oswald really knew...." Which Oswald apparently tried to indicate wasn't very much.
On Ernst Titovets....
Titovets considers the idea that Oswald was connected to either American or Russian intelligence the “wildest speculation.” “A James Bond fantasy.” He ignores the evidence of Oswald’s connections to American intelligence as revealed in many books, and seems to hope his readers will ignore it as well, thereby effectively cutting the marionette’s wires.
Here’s what Dr. James Norwood wrote about Titovets in his article Oswald’s Proficiency in the Russian Language:
One of Oswald’s friends in Minsk was a medical student named Ernst Titovets, who acknowledged in his 2013 book Oswald: Russian Episode that Oswald spoke in a “faltering Russian.” [44] In JFK studies, Titovets was a johnny-come-lately, waiting until the approach of the fiftieth anniversary of the assassination to bring out his memoir. After his book publication, Titovets has attempted to discredit John Armstrong’s research into the period in which Oswald was in residence in Minsk. Using sleight-of-hand, specious arguments, and hearsay testimony, Titovets attempts to name individuals who heard Oswald speaking competent Russian during his stay in Minsk. Undoubtedly, Oswald gave the appearance of attempting to learn the native language over the course of his two-and-a-half years in the Soviet Union. But nowhere does Titovets provide an example of Oswald’s unsurpassed command of the Russian language, as attested by those in America who appeared before the Warren Commission. About the best testimonial to Oswald’s language competency while in the Soviet Union was given by Belarusian President Shuskevich, Oswald’s former tutor in Minsk, who described Oswald’s spoken Russian as “passable.” [45]
Along with his book, Titovets released a set of tape recordings in which he is in conversation with Oswald. Those tapes offer examples of Titovets and Oswald speaking only in English. But according to Norman Mailer, who was granted access to the KGB files, Titovets also recorded conversations in which Oswald was attempting to speak in Russian: “His [Titovets’] Russian-speaking tapes were also studied [by the KGB] to explore any possibility that he [Oswald] was concealing a better knowledge of their language than he pretended to have.” [46] In other words, the KGB was concerned about the main point raised in this essay, namely, Oswald’s intention of “concealing” to his hosts his fluency in Russian.
If Titovets genuinely wishes to do a service in the interest of the historical record, he would release the tapes in which he was conversing with Oswald in Russian to offer the public first-hand evidence into Oswald’s Russian language skills while living in the Soviet Union. Until that happens, Titovets is offering only second-hand evidence with a personal agenda. At present, there is nowhere in Titovets’ writings an instance of a laudatory comment about Oswald’s fluency in Russian to compare with the superlative tributes given by Oswald’s acquaintances in the United States. The question is: Why? Researcher Millicent Cranor has raised the most pertinent question about Ernst Titovets: “In his book, Titovets appears to be defending Oswald—but is he really defending the C.I.A.?” [47]
NOTES
[44] Ernst Titovets, Oswald: Russian Episode (Belarus: Mon Litera Publishing, 2013), 111.
[45] Fred Weir and Marie Eckel, “Why Soviets Were No Fans of Lee Harvey Oswald,” The Christian Science Monitor (November 21, 2013):
https://www.csmonitor.com/World/Europe/2013/1121/Why-Soviets-were-no-fans-of-Lee-Harvey-Oswald
[46] Mailer, 121. Mailer also offers a character sketch of Ernst Titovets from the perspective of one of his friends in Minsk, a young woman named Albina: “She [Albina] had always thought Erich [Ernst Titovets] was a little strange, and nothing about him was fun….Some students used to speak of him as manerniy—full of mannerisms. So, nobody liked him much, but then he always wanted to show people he was better….Titovets always wanted to impress people that he was not average, and so he always did things by himself.” (99-100)
[47] Milicent Cranor, “Is US Effort to Block Oswald Friend and His ‘Revelations’ Another Deception?”, Who.What.Why.: https://whowhatwhy.org/2013/08/27/is-us-effort-to-block-oswald-friend-and-his-revelations-itself-a-further-deception/ -
21 hours ago, John Butler said:
Jeremy finds facts as inconvenient and "un-nuanced" when they don't agree with his beliefs. Being an intelligent fellow, he will find the language to refute whatever you say. The difference between 5'9" and 5'11" would be simply an age difference, or a measurement mistake, or an unreliable witness. Whatever it takes and I'm sure it will sound reasonable to some. But, when you look at what he says it is simply assumptions with little evidence to back it up.
On 5/10/2022 at 4:29 AM, Jeremy Bojczuk said:Sure, but from the time Oswald left the Marine Corps (late 1959) until he was measured at the 1963 autopsy by Earl Rose, he lost 2 inches in height. Perhaps someone will post evidence that men in their early 20s lose typically lose a couple of inches in height as they age for four years, but I’ll be surprised to see it. I think we all will, eh?
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On 5/7/2022 at 3:49 AM, Jeremy Bojczuk said:
Milton Jones's description of the man did not match the real-life, one and only Lee Harvey Oswald.
In CE 2641, Jones described the man as:
- aged 30-35 (Oswald was 24 years old),
- 5' 11" tall (Oswald was 5' 9" tall),
- 150 pounds in weight (Oswald was weighed that very day at 131 pounds),
- and wearing a blue jacket (Oswald's blue jacket was in the book depository).
If Jones's description is accurate, the man on the bus was not Oswald.
Really? According to his Marine Corps discharge data, Oswald was 5’11” (71”) tall and weighed 150 lbs., EXACTLY matching the estimates by Jones. Earl Rose’s autopsy report estimated Oswald’s weight at 150 pounds, also EXACTLY matching the estimate by Jones. (Rose measured Oswald’s height a 5’9”.)
As I’ve already explained, but Mr. B. continues to ignore, bus driver McWatters testified that he gave out only two transfers during his run at the time of the assassination, one to a blond woman and the other to Oswald, who apparently got on at the same time. Jones also said that a blond woman got on the bus at the same time as the man he described so accurately (missing only the age by six years).
Jones indicated that “A blond woman and a dark haired man [Oswald] boarded the bus approximately six blocks before Houston Street. The man sat in the seat behind him and the woman occupied a seat further to the rear of the bus.” Jones told the FBI the man sitting behind him wore a “light blue jacket and grey khaki trousers.”
McWatters later told the WC, “Yes, sir; I gave him one [bus transfer] about two blocks from where he got on [at Griffin]... that is the transfer because it had my punch mark on it.... I gave only two transfers going through town on that trip and that was at the one stop of where I gave the lady and the gentlemen that got off the bus, I issued two transfers.…
By the way, since Mr. B. believes that an eyewitness estimate of a man’s height that is off by 2 inches means it must be a different person, no doubt Mr. B. will agree that the LHO who left the Marine Corps measured at 5’11” tall simply cannot be the same LHO who was measured on a slab by Earl Rose at 5’9”. These are measurements by medical professionals, not estimates by casual eyewitnesses.
I'm sure Mr. B. will agree that the height distinctions indicate there were two different LHOs!
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Thanks again to Gil Jesus for all his brilliant work on this case! I don’t believe the cartridges were missed on the first search of Oswald either, but the transfer may be a different story.
According to the Official Story®, the transfer was found just after 4 pm on 11/22. Dallas Transit System Division Superintendent F.F. Yates immediately indicated that transfer #004459 came from a book of transfers issued that morning to Cecil McWatters. Was Yates part of the conspiracy? This hardly seems to be made up because…..
Just two hours later, McWatters was staring at LHO in a police lineup. Regardless of what you think of the bus and taxi evidence, if this was all invented, how did it start so quickly in the way it apparently did?
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3 hours ago, Jeremy Bojczuk said:
Jim also writes that I have "declined to comment on this in the topic it was posted in".
I'm sorry to disappoint Jim, but I don't hang around here all day with my metaphorical shovel and bucket, waiting for the next steaming pile of 'Harvey and Lee' nonsense to be deposited on the forum. I check the forum most mornings, scribble whatever I feel like scribbling, then I get on with more interesting and productive (and usually non-JFK-related) activities. I very rarely visit this forum more than once a day.
Why did Jim expect an instant reply? Why was he so worked up about something so trivial as what Jonathan and I think about impersonations? Bearing in mind Jim's recent thread in which he seemed to think that the lizard people had been plotting against him to censor his comments, is he feeling OK?
Or was it just an excuse to start yet another 'Harvey and Lee' thread, re-hashing the same old nonsense that has been discussed ad nauseam on numerous other threads?
If he wants to discuss something, he could start by answering the question he has been avoiding. What was the thinking behind the supposed 'Harvey and Lee' project? Why did the masterminds decide to go with a long-term plan involving two pairs of doppelgangers when they had a far simpler solution available?
Again, that simply isn’t true.
J. Cohen made the post indicating “Jeremy and I have always agreed that there is evidence Oswald was impersonated at various points in his life” Thursday, May 5 at 9:40 am.
I called it out about half a day later with this post at Thursday May 5 at 4:37 pm.
With this post, I said, “ Perhaps Mr. B. will tell us, specifically, which times Oswald was impersonated” on Friday, May 6, at 8:16 am.
The next day, after all of that, Mr. B made three lengthy posts a little before 4 am on Saturday, May 6 here, here, and here. As you can see, none of them mentioned Mr. Cohen’s claim.
Since Mr. B chose not to respond, I started this thread a few hours later, on May 7 at 6:47 am.
This is not a big deal, but it is strange that Mr. B. chooses to misrepresent what happened. I do appreciate him going on the record about his beliefs in possible Oswald impersonations. That's what I wanted.
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36 minutes ago, Greg Doudna said:
Greg,
Thanks for the serious response to my list (I'm not sure why your words didn't post above). I'd enjoy having a full debate about this with you starting around next Wednesday when I will have more time available to find my evidence for this stuff.
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1 hour ago, Sandy Larsen said:
Nice list of evidence summaries supporting the Harvey and Lee theory, Jim. All corroborating each other and supported by the J. Edgar Hoover's memo.
I would add to the list the apparent fact that one Oswald lost a tooth in a ninth grade fight, got a crown to replace it, only to have the crown fail when he was in the Marines. While the other Oswald always had a full set of natural teeth.
Thanks, Sandy. How could I forget that great work you did on the missing tooth! I’m so glad you posted a link to your essay so that anyone interested can see how strong the evidence is. John Butler also found an interesting photo of Lee Oswald with what sure appears to be a missing tooth in New Orleans.
Btw, because of a prior commitment, I won’t be able to post much for several days after early tomorrow morning. This would be a great time for H&L critics to declare victory several thousand times!
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9 hours ago, Jeremy Bojczuk said:
The Blue Jacket Cannot Have Been Planted
But the way the blue jacket was "accounted for" did not support the Warren Commission's case that Oswald was on McWatters' bus. The discovery of the jacket in the book depository contradicts the claim that Oswald was on that bus. It cannot have been planted by anyone who wanted Oswald to have been on that bus.
The authorities needed to show that Oswald got away from the book depository without assistance. The only option they had was to claim that he was on McWatters' bus. All three of the supposed witnesses to this event stated that the man in question was wearing a blue jacket. If Oswald owned a blue jacket, the authorities needed to show that Oswald was wearing that jacket when he got on McWatters' bus.
The discovery in the book depository of a blue jacket, attributed to Oswald, refuted the authorities' claim that Oswald was on McWatters' bus. The jacket simply cannot, as Jim claims, have been planted by the authorities! They had every reason not to plant the jacket.
Incidentally, this doesn't prove that Oswald was the young white man who got into the car as seen by Roger Craig and two motorists. Oswald was a generic-looking young white man, at a glance easily mistaken for any number of other young white men.
What it does prove is that, if the three witnesses were correct that the man they saw was wearing a blue jacket, that man cannot have been Oswald.
The existence of a blue jacket in the book depository demonstrates that the man on McWatters' bus was not Oswald. This leaves a big hole in both the lone-gunman theory and the ridiculous 'Harvey and Lee' theory.
More nonsense. As I said before, how can you believe that this blue/grey jacket wasn’t seen at the TSBD for days after the assassination? Hindsight is often 20-20, but this was clearly a cover-up unfolding, at least partially, in real time. My suspicion is that Roy Truly planted the jacket in the building because he knew that Westbrook and company had been waving around a white “Oswald” jacket near 10th and Patton and he didn’t want anyone to have to explain away two “Oswald” jackets.
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7 hours ago, Jeremy Bojczuk said:
In CE 2641, Jones described the man as:
- aged 30-35 (Oswald was 24 years old),
- 5' 11" tall (Oswald was 5' 9" tall),
- 150 pounds in weight (Oswald was weighed that very day at 131 pounds),
- and wearing a blue jacket (Oswald's blue jacket was in the book depository).
If Jones's description is accurate, the man on the bus was not Oswald.
Oh, please. Oswald sat behind Jones for a short time on the bus. We’re lucky that he remembered anything about Oswald. The fact that he missed Oswald’s age by six years, his height by two inches and his weight by 19 pounds is hardly dismissive. And Oswald’s blue jacket was NOT in the depository, not yet. It was obviously planted there days later. Do you seriously think all the cops, FBI personnel, Secret Service guys, etc. missed seeing it for days? Seriously?
Jones did recall, agreeing with McWatters and Oswald himself, that a blond woman got on the bus at the same time as Oswald.
Jones apparently indicated that “A blond woman and a dark haired man [Oswald] boarded the bus approximately six blocks before Houston Street. The man sat in the seat behind him and the woman occupied a seat further to the rear of the bus.” Jones told the FBI the man sitting behind him wore a “light blue jacket and grey khaki trousers.”
McWatters later told the WC, “Yes, sir; I gave him one [bus transfer] about two blocks from where he got on [at Griffin]... that is the transfer because it had my punch mark on it.... I gave only two transfers going through town on that trip and that was at the one stop of where I gave the lady and the gentlemen that got off the bus, I issued two transfers.…
Oswald told Capt. Fritz about the blond-haired lady who asked Whaley to call her a taxi. And Whaley told the same story to the police.
From Whaley’s WC testimony:
Mr. WHALEY. The lady, I don't remember whether she was very old, but she was middle-aged. She bent down and stuck in and said, "Can I have this cab?" And he cracked the door open like he was going to get out. I thought he was going to let her have it.
I told her there would be another one, and she said, "Would you please call me one."
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Thanks for coming back, Jonathan! I have to admit that I believe EVIDENCE is more important than "nuance." But why argue about semantics?
Again, please tell me about the EVIDENCE you and Mr. Bojczuk have always agreed on that Oswald was impersonated, as you say, "at various points in his life." Let me offer, again, a list of suggestions to get you started. Do you agree with any of these instances, or are you referring to different evidence?
1. Way back in 1948, one LHO was living at 101 San Saba in Benbrook while the other was at 3330 Willig St. (and then 7408 Ewing) in Fort Worth.
2. In 1953 the Russian-speaking LHO (Harvey) was sent to Youth House for truancy, fled to Stanley, North Dakota to avoid further entanglement with the NYC legal system, and started attending Beauregard JHS in New Orleans that fall, all the while the American-born LHO (Lee) had good attendance both semesters at PS 44 in NYC.
3. During the fall semester of 1954, Harvey attended Stripling School in Fort Worth while Lee attended Beauregard School in New Orleans.
4. By the mid-1950s, both Oswalds had various sometimes conflicting jobs, which eventually required the FBI to destroy all the original employment (and school) records for both young men and to create a false employment and education legend. The Social Security Administration refused to corroborate the Official Story® of "Oswald's" pre-1962 income, offering instead "Copies of three pages of the Warren Commission Report regarding employment of Lee Harvey Oswald prior to service in the Marine Corps."
5. The Marine Corps records are a gold mine: My favorite chronicles Harvey Oswald's trip to Formosa (Taiwan) while Lee was being treated for VD in Japan. Other examples from USMC unit diaries and testimony show how the two LHOs associated with completely different groups of Marines both early and late in their enlistment periods.
6. While Russian-speaking HARVEY was in the Soviet Union, American-born LEE was active briefly as an agent provocateur in NYC, working with Marita Lorenz and anti-Castro Cubans in and around Florida, visiting Bolton Ford dealership in New Orleans, and much more.
7. One Oswald never had a driver’s license and could not drive while the other had a valid Texas driver’s license and could drive, including doing work for Jack Ruby in 1963 involving cars.
8. American-born LEE Oswald appeared in Baytown, TX on Labor Day weekend in 1963 attempting to purchase rifles from Fidel Castro’s friend and gun supplier Robert McKeown. At the time, Russian-speaking HARVEY Oswald and his family were on holiday with the Murrets at Lake Pontchartrain in Louisiana.
9. In October 1963, two different young men, both claiming to be “Lee Harvey Oswald,” appeared before Texas Employment Commission employee Laura Kittrell, the first on October 3 and again a few days later, the second on October 22. Ms Kittell told the HSCA’s Gaeton Fonzi that the second Oswald “looked the same,” and had “the same general outline and coloring and build, but there was something so different in his bearing.”
10. While the other Oswald was elsewhere, LEE Oswald visited the Sports Drome Rifle Range on Oct. 26, Nov. 9, Nov. 10, and again on Nov. 17, several times creating a scene and once shooting at another guy's target.
11. On Nov. 2 one LHO visited Morgan's Gun Shop in Fort Worth.
12. Also on Nov. 2 LEE Oswald visited the Downtown Lincoln Mercury dealership where he test drove a car at recklessly high speeds saying he would soon come into enough money to buy a new car. (Remember that Russian-speaking HARVEY Oswald did not have a driver’s license.)
13. On Nov. 6 or 7 LEE Oswald visited the Irving Furniture Mart for a gun part and was referred by the ladies there to the shop where Dial Ryder worked.
14. On Nov. 15, LEE Oswald went to the Southland Hotel parking garage (Allright Parking Systems) and applied for a job and asked how high the Southland Building was and if it had a good view of downtown Dallas.
15. On Nov. 20 “Oswald” hitch-hiked on the R.L. Thornton Expressway while carrying a 4 foot long package wrapped in brown paper and introduced himself to Ralph Yates as “Lee Harvey Oswald,” discussed the President's visit, and asked to be dropped across the street from the Texas School Book Depository (where Russian-speaking “Lee Harvey Oswald” was already working).
16. On Nov. 22, both LHOs were in Dealey Plaza. One left in a bus and then a taxi; the other got into a Nash Rambler station wagon.
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In the post shown above, forum member Jonathan Cohen wrote that he and Jeremy Bojczuk "have always agreed that there is evidence Oswald was impersonated at various points in his life."
Mr. Bojczuk, who for years has been attempting to deny almost every part of Harvey and Lee has, so far, declined to comment on this in the topic it was posted in, so I've started a new thread to give him another opportunity.
Is it true, Jeremy, that you and Jonathan Cohen "have always agreed that there is evidence Oswald was impersonated at various points in his life?"
Peter Dale Scott on “Harvey Lee Oswald”
in JFK Assassination Debate
Posted
Hi, Rick,
We think American-born LEE Oswald was escorted out the back of the theater, may well have been seen in a car with Carl Mather’s license plate (the Wes Wise allegation) and afterward may also have been seen boarding a C-54 cargo plane by Robert Vinson. Russian-speaking HARVEY Oswald, however, was a long-term impostor who was shot dead by Jack Ruby, and is the man most people think they know.
Here’s John’s brief write-up on Vinson from our website:
Paul,
Marina married Russian-speaking Harvey Oswald.