Joe Bauer

Douglas, exactly. For almost 30 years Fox news has been a big factor in the diversion of the JFK event into the realm of conspiracy kooks. Instead giving Bill O'Reilly's farce implied legitimacy.

It isn't a stretch to imagine Jeffery Epstein telling his closest attorneys he wanted to commit suicide rather than spend the rest of his days in prison, and asking them to facilitate this by demanding he be taken off suicide watch. They may have stated to Epstein their belief that a long prison sentence would probably be the outcome of any trial and not disagreed with Epstein ( through silence) regards his ultimate escape plan. Perhaps his attorneys were palmed some grease for their efforts? For example, being given $250,000 each for executing his will after his death? I am also guessing that Epstein felt he was in a totally no-win situation, even if he gave up everything he knew about others involved with his crimes. If he gave up everything for maybe the possibility of a parole 10 years from now, he would still be a man marked for death anyway by the powers to be that simply could not allow him to blow the lid off this global conspiracy and if he did, exact the kind of retribution that would send a strong message to others not to do the same in the future. If it's true that Epstein went so far as to deposit funds in all the other prisoners accounts for some type of lessening of their molester revenge sympathies (or other reason? ) it would not be impossible to believe that he also made some arrangement ( through 3 or 4 removed level channels) to compensate his two jail attendants for their convenient falling asleep actions the night of his demise. There are so many illogical circumstances with this whole affair, a reasonable person is forced to consider it with much valid suspicion.

Fascinating and importantly thought provoking articles on Bernays and his work and his later years reflections. Makes you aware of just how much we and much of the world has been manipulated through this realm. Much more than most have ever imagined. Seems to me the subject of Edward Bernays and his work should be included into our secondary public school curriculum in some way ( even small ) as a mandatory part of their basic American civics, history and social studies programs. If those courses even exist anymore. Since every young American is going to be hugely inundated the rest of their lives by the incessantly aggressive 24/7 efforts of these powerful psychological propaganda forces ( benignly called advertising/ public relations but often so powerfully influencing as to be called a "separate government" as Bernay's described) shouldn't they at least be made aware of these real life entities and their possible nefarious and dangerous agendas and effects on their lives? Roger Ailes and Fox News are one of Bernay's greatest media babies. Ailes rode the repressed American male sexual desire and cultural insecurity angle to the hilt. Good looking and good figure blonds, short neck and hemline dresses, hot red lipstick, mixed with liberal fear and anger inciting news reporting. Turn em on...and piss em off! That's how you get their riled up attention...and their support. Trump is the ultimate poster boy for this kind of frustrated and angry red state American male manipulation. Brag about your wealth, your ethnic heritage pride, your love it or leave it American patriotism, showcase your hot younger wife, insult your critics, even taunt and make fun of them. Rail against the loss of American values and control with mass illegal immigration anger talk. Call these poorer foreign societies for what they really are ...s###hole countries. Finally a G#D D#MN President who speaks our G#D D#MN language! Who speaks for "US" ... G#D D#MN it! White supremacy groups and outlaw biker gangs love this guy. Trump would have made the best carnival barker. He could get a crowd so worked up with exaggerated rhetoric shouting and animated facial and hand gestures, they'd be clamoring to get their tickets to see whatever side show he was promoting ... freaks of nature, jungle girl, mind readers, metal eaters ... you name it.

I never knew the JFK context of the Beach Boys Brian Wilson/Mike Love song "The Warmth Of The Sun" until just today. Hope the forum doesn't mind a touching tribute post regards this. Wilson and Love began composing the song on November 22, 1963, the day of the assassination of John F. Kennedy,[1]although the two co-authors give different accounts of the timing and whether it was begun before or after the killing. The subsequent recording of the song was informed by the emotional shock felt by its authors in the wake of Kennedy's death. In the 2016 autobiography I Am Brian Wilson, Wilson recalled that the song was written the day of the assassination, in response to it: Knowledge Result THE WARMTH OF THE SUN ~ THE BEACH BOYS. - YouTube https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kvzr2IT_AiQ

Interesting. However, doubters and critics could ask you to perform these same tests using publicly recorded statements by so many other closely connected main characters in the event such as Jack Ruby, Marina Oswald, Chief Curry, Captain Fritz, Dallas D. A. Henry Wade, George DeMohrenschildts, Secret Service agents, LBJ ( his " others may have been involved" interview with Walter Cronkite ) George Bush and on and on. My first choice would be Seth Kantor's recorded under oath testimony in his appearance in the "Trial Of Lee Harvey Oswald" documentary when he describes in detail personally meeting and talking to Jack Ruby at Dallas's Parkland Hospital the early afternoon of 11,22,1963.

Weird coincidence. Sunday the 18th of August I was pet sitting three dogs in a Carmel, Calif. hotel room. My employers were attending the world famous Concours D' Elegance event held at nearby Pebble Beach, Ca. In the room I was in lay some brochures advertising the week long event with one listing the many classic cars displayed for judging and/or auction and their owners. Way down the list I see a classic car that is owned by non-other than Jeffery Epstein major figure associate "Les Wexner." Guess Jeffrey Epstein didn't clean out Wexner completely.

12:00NOW PLAYING Jeffrey Epstein's Butler: The Truth About Power Epstein's butler served a longer sentence than Epstein! And his was "real" time. Not day time free and only nights spent in a secured cell. The FBI did NOT indict Jeffrey Epstein. The instead indicted his BUTLER, who claimed to have the names and contact ...

I will check the specifics. John you are correct. I must fact check before posting. My bad and my apologies.

Reported today in the media that just two days before he died, Jeffrey Epstein had a new will drawn up, leaving everything to his brother. Please weigh in with your thoughts on this Epstein action. I believe that someone in Epstein's legal and personal circle knew ahead of time that he was going to try to kill himself again while custody.

Joe McBride. Thank you for posting the entire text of the Mae Brussell 1971 KLRB radio interview ( Mae Magnin from the I.Magnin family ) instead of just a link. It's too easy to choose not to click on a link for so many reasons.

Doug thank you for your comments.

Ha!

What's mind boggling suspicious and beyond any believable negligence, is that just two weeks after Epstein's first serious injury suicide attempt/physical assault at the Metro jail, his security there became even "more lax" and was "worse" than when his first injury event occurred! WORSE! Just two guards ( one doing five straight midnight overtime shifts and one not officially a guard) who both fell asleep while on duty? With Epstein left alone unchecked for hours and these two then falsifying their cell check logs? No cameras recording that could show any noticeable movement near or in Epstein's cell throughout the night? A "bunk bed" with a higher hanging fixture left in a room with only one occupant? This is all "after" Epstein's serious injury event while in custody just two weeks earlier? As I mentioned previously, didn't federal Bureau Of Prisons head AG Bill Barr or one of his deputies or at least someone higher up than this warden contact the warden of this jail after Epstein's first near death episode to remind this warden how important it was to maintain security for Epstein beyond normal protocols, if for no other reason than Epstein's extremely high profile as a criminal suspect/prisoner with tens of millions of people following this story and the potential for an unprecedented national PR/ public trust disaster if Epstein was killed or killed himself while in custody before his trial? To know that Epstein's security situation at this jail deteriorated to an even worse level than what it was when Epstein was first injured..."begs" serious rational suspicion. No conspiracy theory "obsession" needed.

Cliff, true..but Jackson also borrowed from Jackie Wilson. Jackson adored Jackie Wilson and his energized style of singing and dancing performance. Trump's idols weren't dancers and singers. They were "strong leader" demagogues.

When does Trump ever look at and study up on all the highest importance information ( must be reams of this ) that the average citizen has always figured was presented to him on a daily basis so that he could make incredibly responsible and informed decisions regards the subjects they address? Half my life I've had minimum wage jobs that required more of my mental focus and concentration than Trump needs to spend in make up, traveling to and from and performing at these totally mindless rallies that are just like those crazy, farcical WWF professional wrestling events ( which Trump was a big fan of ) with loud braggadocio yelling and taunts and jokes with accompanying making-fun facial expressions. What a childish, shameful waste of super important Presidential energy and time! Trump clearly gets off playing the bombastic professional wrestler/stand up comedic role and working his idolizing audience into a frenzy of hate shouts and adoration chants. How many rallies has his team organized and has he gone to? 50? More? I guess his re-election campaign funds pay for the costs of all of these which must be tens of millions of dollars with the use of Air Force 1, the entourage vehicles, the heavy security and who knows what other costs? Sure hope it isn't our tax dollars paying for any of these bombastic self-promoting WWF events. I have heard that Trump wakes up very early in the morning ( 4:AM? ) and spends hours watching Fox news and other venues, mostly to see who is criticizing him so that he can then tweet to his 60 millions followers his personal attacks against them. The whole scenario of Trump and his daily routines of much wasted time devoted to his own self aggrandizement and personal paybacks is not just outrageously immature ... it's disturbingly sad. Again, don't we all want a President who spends all these hours studying the needs and problems of the country in a responsible and professional way versus this totally immature and emotionally stunted man/child who uses the office mainly for his self-promotion ( look at me! ) playground antics? When you see Trump's worked up crowd shouting blind loyalty slogans and hateful sound bites with gleeful smiles and laughter you can't help but see the similarities to Nazis rallies of the past. Have you ever watched Mussolini give his large crowd speeches when he was Il Duce? His highly animated mannerisms, arm movements, finger movements and facial expressions look uncannily like Trump's. If Trump was bald, he would also look remarkably like Mussolini.

I'm doing this for YOU ... J.Edgar Hoover fans.

Elizabeth Warren is the closest thing to FDR imo.

Reports of certain bones in Epstein's neck being fractured have brought out debate as to what this indicates or doesn't indicate regards a suicidal hanging versus a strangulation homicide. One expert stated that a certain percentage of self-hanging suicides have resulted in these bone fractures although this percentage is much lower than strangulation bone fractures. A couple of questions: Does the type of hanging suicide position have any increase bearing on these neck bone fractures? For instance, if someone ties a rope or other material type sling above them and stands on a chair or other platform and then kicks the chair out from underneath themselves and/or jumps from the platform with the full weight of their bodies yanking down on the neck hugging noose you would certainly expect some neck bone breaks. But what about someone hanging themselves from a low place ( like a bed frame? ) with their full body weight not free falling and snapping their neck? Does this different hanging technique dynamic effect the chances for neck bone breaks? Seems obvious it would. When we find out the exact method of hanging in the Epstein case, I wonder how this will effect the neck bone fracture debate either way. And what about the neck burn and/or bruising from a rope fashioned sheet? If Epstein's neck shows this "above" the hyoid bone location ( instead of around the quite low Adam's Apple ) wouldn't that be a valid and worthy clue in determining how this particular bone was broken?

Even money?

After Epstein's "almost successful" suicide attempt in this federal Metropolitan Correctional Center facility ( or his being beaten up ) you would think that Epstein's high powered lawyers, and maybe his brother as well, would have been so concerned for his future physical security there ( above and beyond normal ) that they would have demanded through official channels ( in writing ) that extra attentive and verifiable precautionary measures be taken to better protect their highly at risk client to assure this didn't happen again. Does anyone know if they did so? You would also think that highest level Bureau Of Prison officials ( all the way to Barr ) would have been in touch with the Warden of this Epstein holding facility after Epstein's near death event there and personally reminded him of the extra-importance of this type of P.R. disaster ( with the whole world press watching ) not happening again. You have to wonder how the Warden of this facility could see his world famous, highest profile and monumentally at risk prisoner "almost die" in his facility and not personally review the circumstances with extraordinary concern and scrutiny and personally confront his staff to make sure this didn't happen again, especially considering he must have known about the shortages in trained police guard staffing that were reportedly so bad unqualified clerks and dishwashers were relied upon to fill them. To hear that "after" Epstein's near death event in this seriously poorly staffed facility his security went from bad to worse with one untrained filler and one trained guard falling asleep and not checking on Epstein for hours at a time ... makes you sick it's so absurdly and disturbingly improbable. The Warden of this facility should be fired and investigated. Not simply transferred. Barr is head of the BOP and this society wide mistrust travesty happened under his watch. We had the Labor Department head resign under pressure for his controversial role in the Epstein affair. Barr should also resign considering the level of society wide trust damage Epstein's failed security has caused under his watch.

I am taking a break from the thread, however, just wanted to mention one weirdly disturbing coincidental fact reported in the link Rob provided above. Rapist Bill Cosby's victim drugging Manhattan residence was "right across the street" from Epstein's own prolific sex abusing den ?

Jeffrey Epstein. The most important and highest profile criminal suspect in America since Lee Harvey Oswald and Richard Nixon - Higher than Bernie Madoff, O.J. Simpson, Timothy McVeigh, Bill Cosby, Kenneth Lay, Jeffrey Skilling, Boesky, Keating, Stanford , Rod Blagojevich, Martha Stewart, Pete Rose, Paul Manafort, Michael Cohen, El Chapo, Noriega, etc.etc. Maybe higher than Marc Rich, Jimmy Hoffa, E. Howard Hunt and G. Liddy ... And the only one of this elite group who "actually tried to kill himself" in jail pre-trial. And one who is placed in a jail security situation where only one guard and maybe a clerical worker were checking on him just days after his previous suicide attempt and who neglected the expected highest priority security protocol to the point of not even checking on suicidal attempt Epstein for hours at a time ? They fell asleep? Please...you don't have to be a conspiracy minded person to see this as beyond simple negligence. Epstein would have had a better security situation in sheriff Andy Taylor and Barney Fife's Mayberry jail or Barney Miller's NYC 12th precinct one. Yes, most of those others were held in cushy jail accommodations, but still, if your prisoner "has already tried to do himself in while in custody just two weeks earlier" ...and he possesses knowledge of widespread complicity of others in his criminal activities who are stationed in some of the highest levels of political office, business, celebrity, royalty, foreign governments, law, etc. you don't place this person in anything but the most secure jail situation possible. And by not doing so the worst possible public trust and confidence ruining disaster scenario plays out? Barr himself should resign over this Oswald-killed-in-police-custody level Jeffrey Epstein security failure.

Talk about thickening the suspicion soup! If this is THAT Michael Baden ... you've got to be kidding me. Sandy Larsen, your thoughts?

Oswald's murder inside a police department building still shocks the senses. Trey Gowdy wasn't even born when Ruby whacked Oswald.