William Kelly Posted September 5, 2007 Share Posted September 5, 2007 (edited) I would like to find an original, clear copy of this memo, if it is available on line. Jim Hargrove and Phil Hopley helped me find it before. Thanks, Does this say what I think it says? BK FBI US Government Memo Date: 12/2/63 To: Unreadable From: ? H. Jovens Subject : ASASSINATION OF PRESIDENT KENNEDY My memorandum of 11/2263, set out additional information relating to the sale and distribution of the Western manufactured 6.5 mm Manlicher-Carcano ammunition used in the assassination. That memorandum was written in response to Mr. Belmont's instructions that every effort be made to track the ammunition on the possibility that some of it may be traced into Oswald's hands. The Springfield office has advised that they have obtained through contact at the Wastern Cartridge Corporation, East Alton, Illinois, copies of that Corporation's records relating to the manufacture of this ammunition. Western manufactured four million rounds of this ammunition for the United States Marine Corps during 1954. Attached is a two-page copy of the records of Western relating to the complete manufacture of this order of assassination was authorized under Government contract of [unreadable] The interesting thing about this order is that it is for ammunition which does not fit and cannot be fired in any of the USMC weapons. This gives rise to the obvious speculation that it is a contract for ammunition placed by the CIA with Western under USMC cover for concealment purpose. ACTION: This information is being furnished Division 5 and 6 for whatever further investigative activity is deemed warranted. Mr. Tolson Mr. Belmont Mr. Mohr Mr. DeLoach Mr Rosen Mrs. Sullivan Mr. Thompson Edited September 5, 2007 by William Kelly Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James Richards Posted September 5, 2007 Share Posted September 5, 2007 Bill, This is the best version I have. James Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
William Kelly Posted September 5, 2007 Author Share Posted September 5, 2007 Bill,This is the best version I have. James Thanks James, My copy I can 't make out who it is from or too - can you? BK Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James Richards Posted September 5, 2007 Share Posted September 5, 2007 (edited) Bill, It is to a Mr. Conrad and it is from R.H. Jevons. Ivan Conrad - Assistant to the Director in charge of the FBI laboratory. Roy Jevons - Section Chief of the Physics and Chemistry Department of the FBI laboratory. James Edited September 5, 2007 by James Richards Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
William Kelly Posted September 5, 2007 Author Share Posted September 5, 2007 Bill,It is to a Mr. Conrad and it is from R.H. Jevons. James Gee James, From 1:55 to 2:21 - that wasn't bad. If it was a scavanger hunt you would have won. Had to start a new card on those guys, you got a make on them? BK Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James Richards Posted September 5, 2007 Share Posted September 5, 2007 (edited) Bill,It is to a Mr. Conrad and it is from R.H. Jevons. James Gee James, From 1:55 to 2:21 - that wasn't bad. If it was a scavanger hunt you would have won. Had to start a new card on those guys, you got a make on them? BK Bill, I added some info to my post above while you were posting. James Edited September 5, 2007 by James Richards Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
William Kelly Posted September 5, 2007 Author Share Posted September 5, 2007 You the best. A feather in your cap. Maybe we should have a scavanger hunt. Singles and team play. Point scale for various docs, records, witnesses and evidence. 20 points for the missing AF1 radio tapes. 50 points for Jim Braden's address. A hundred points for DeMorn's missing film. Two hundred points for JFK's brain. Two points for documents implicating RFK in plots to kill Castro. The Great JFK Asassination Scavanger Hunt. What ya say? BK Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
William Kelly Posted September 5, 2007 Author Share Posted September 5, 2007 Bill,It is to a Mr. Conrad and it is from R.H. Jevons. Ivan Conrad - Assistant to the Director in charge of the FBI laboratory. Roy Jevons - Section Chief of the Physics and Chemistry Department of the FBI laboratory. James It seems that Roy H. Jevons only handled all of the evidence at one time or another, and worked closely with SA Robert E. Neill. Thanks again James, BK Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim Gratz Posted September 5, 2007 Share Posted September 5, 2007 (edited) BK wrote: Two points for documents implicating RFK in plots to kill Castro. Come on, Bill, you know better than that! You know full well the CIA was careful not to put anything in writing about its involvement in assassination plots. So the absence of RFK documents re assassination plotting means absolutely nothing! Find documents linking Bissell, Edwards, Helms or Harvey to assassination plotting. And I am sure that you would be among the first to argue that the absence of documents showing persons conspired to kill JFK does not mean there was no conspiracy. I post this not to argue that RFK approved the plots but only to demonstrate what can only be considered carelessness in your reasoning on this one point. Again, I find the vast majority of your posts articulate and well-reasoned. Edited September 5, 2007 by Tim Gratz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
William Kelly Posted September 5, 2007 Author Share Posted September 5, 2007 BK wrote:Two points for documents implicating RFK in plots to kill Castro. Come on, Bill, you know better than that! You know full well the CIA was careful not to put anything in writing about its involvement in assassination plots. So the absence of RFK documents re assassination plotting means absolutely nothing! Find documents linking Bissell, Edwards, Helms or Harvey to assassination plotting. And I am sure that you would be among the first to argue that the absence of documents showing persons conspired to kill JFK does not mean there was no conspiracy. I post this not to argue that RFK approved the plots but only to demonstrate what can only be considered carelessness in your reasoning on this one point. Again, I find the vast majority of your posts articulate and well-reasoned. Tim, I only put that in there to rile you up. BK Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim Gratz Posted September 5, 2007 Share Posted September 5, 2007 Now that's a true conspiracy theory! Are you sure you are not KUBARK? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pat Speer Posted September 5, 2007 Share Posted September 5, 2007 BK wrote:Two points for documents implicating RFK in plots to kill Castro. Come on, Bill, you know better than that! You know full well the CIA was careful not to put anything in writing about its involvement in assassination plots. So the absence of RFK documents re assassination plotting means absolutely nothing! Find documents linking Bissell, Edwards, Helms or Harvey to assassination plotting. And I am sure that you would be among the first to argue that the absence of documents showing persons conspired to kill JFK does not mean there was no conspiracy. I post this not to argue that RFK approved the plots but only to demonstrate what can only be considered carelessness in your reasoning on this one point. Again, I find the vast majority of your posts articulate and well-reasoned. Tim, there are a number of documents connecting Harvey to Zr/Rifle etc. There were also assassination lists found in the CIA files for both the Guatemala and Cuba Ops, so some assassination documents do exist. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim Gratz Posted September 5, 2007 Share Posted September 5, 2007 A point well taken re Guatemala. Re ZR/Rifle, I do not recall the documents specified assassination capabilities as such. Nor do I think the "Cuban Ops" did, if you are referring to the Op 40 stuff. But you did leave out Operation Zipper. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim Gratz Posted September 5, 2007 Share Posted September 5, 2007 Back to the issue at hand. Do we know if this information was ever provided to either the WC or the HSCA? Should it be a topic for the (cross your fingers) new investigation if not previously investigated? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomas H. Purvis Posted September 5, 2007 Share Posted September 5, 2007 (edited) I would like to find an original, clear copy of this memo, if it is available on line. Jim Hargrove and Phil Hopley helped me find it before. Thanks, Does this say what I think it says? BK FBI US Government Memo Date: 12/2/63 To: Unreadable From: ? H. Jovens Subject : ASASSINATION OF PRESIDENT KENNEDY My memorandum of 11/2263, set out additional information relating to the sale and distribution of the Western manufactured 6.5 mm Manlicher-Carcano ammunition used in the assassination. That memorandum was written in response to Mr. Belmont's instructions that every effort be made to track the ammunition on the possibility that some of it may be traced into Oswald's hands. The Springfield office has advised that they have obtained through contact at the Wastern Cartridge Corporation, East Alton, Illinois, copies of that Corporation's records relating to the manufacture of this ammunition. Western manufactured four million rounds of this ammunition for the United States Marine Corps during 1954. Attached is a two-page copy of the records of Western relating to the complete manufacture of this order of assassination was authorized under Government contract of [unreadable] The interesting thing about this order is that it is for ammunition which does not fit and cannot be fired in any of the USMC weapons. This gives rise to the obvious speculation that it is a contract for ammunition placed by the CIA with Western under USMC cover for concealment purpose. ACTION: This information is being furnished Division 5 and 6 for whatever further investigative activity is deemed warranted. Mr. Tolson Mr. Belmont Mr. Mohr Mr. DeLoach Mr Rosen Mrs. Sullivan Mr. Thompson A few items which may (or may not) prove to be ultimately worthwhile. 1. The "contract" is a Department of the Army (DA) reference. 2. The letter references the USMC and it's lack of weapons, without any confirmation that it was in fact the USMC or whoever, that placed the order with Western Cartridge Company for the ammunition. 3. Somewhere within my boxes I have the additional information that the order which directed the manufacture of these bullets, remains a classified document which is not even scheduled to be reviewed for de-classification until the year 2025. In fact, somewhere, I once had a letter in which US Senator David Boren, Chairman, Senate Intelligence Committee, was informed of this, as well as the problems which this secrecy creates in attempting to correlate the originally designated purchaser & source for these bullets, with LHO and exactly how he would have known that this excellent quality ammunition for the Carcano was available. Lastly! As those who have been around for some time may recall, (and again posted for those who were not here), manufacture of the 6.5mm Carcano ammo by Westeren Cartridge Company was about as clandestine as "Pink Elephant in the Wal-Mart Parking Lot"! Each box of ammo contained a slip of paper which clearly identified the manufacturer of the ammo as well as the DA Ordinance Code to which the ammo was manufactured. Each round of the ammo, clearly has stamped on the base of the cartridge casing "WCC 6.5mm". Both items of which no doubt have their specific reasonings, and which most certainly have nothing to do with "cover for concealment". Edited September 5, 2007 by Thomas H. Purvis Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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