David Josephs Posted June 22, 2015 Share Posted June 22, 2015 T hru January 12, 1954 Greg... Both the school records and FBI report extend thru 1/12/54 when he supposedly went to Beauregard... why you stop at at 9/11/53 is where you are falling short. The semesters ends june 29th as you pointed out... there is nothing to count in the summer... no school in the world counts unattended summer vacation as potential school days attended... call your own board of Ed and check your local school records officials... they will tell you the same. Asking for other student's private records will not happen and is yet another FBI tactic .. I've made the same argument about the rifle records... I dont need to show you records for summer when common sense or a call to your school board will do... You yourself argue there are 180-190 days of school to attend in any given year... That's without summer school Greg. you're grasping at straws and you keep coming up with the short stick... The excel table with all the dates is not hard to follow and counts EVERY day... even WITH summer it does not add to 200 of 210 days... nice try though... I stop there because that is the end of the school year. The 53-54 school year - or the PS44 start to it shows... 73 days attendance and absences from 9/14/53. I count the number of available school days between then and the end of of December as being 81. I could be out because I might be missing one or two holiday days. I can't locate anything giving the date he last attended, but really all it means to me is that he actually stopped going around mid-December - and I believe that may actually have been the case. I checked the manuscript of my first volume to see if I found it then, but what i wrote was that he left in December or early January. That was based on Lana Greenberg's memory of taking a note to school for Marguerite saying they had left. She couldn't pin down the exact time - only saying it was Dec or Jan. Forget the godamn FBI report,. You are just using it to support that some sort of hocus-pocus happened with the records - but can't even explain what your alleged discrepancy means. The figures for 52-53 add up correctly. The Figures for the balance of his time at PS44 probably do, but without having an exact end date, it's impossible to be 100% certain. Wrong.. plain and simply wrong Greg. We are not talking only about the 52-53 year on these records. We have 3 total semesters here Greg... Fall 1952, Spring 1953 and Fall 1953. He only starts attending regularly on March 23, 1953. His last day of NYC school is Jan 8, 1954 according to the records He did not attend summer school in 1953 (or any other year for that matter) The records for the SPRING 1953 semester are completely FUBAR and would have been filled in prior to the start of the 53-54 school year on Sept 14, 1953. No administrator in their right mind would enter 127 days of attendance since 3/23... there are simply not enough days to count So, Let's start with the Sept 30, 1952 thru the end of the 65 days of attendance/absences recorded and take that off the plate Seems pretty close Greg... start on Sept 30th with records taking us thru the January transfer From Jan 19 - Mar 23 1953 there are 45 weekdays to attend school which are not recorded anywhere as either TRUANT, ATTENDED or ABSENT (as shown highlighted below in reddish) Now, let's forget the FALL 1953 semester of the 53-54 school year which has the correct number at 65 + 8/2 days = 69 days to take us thru Jan 8 1954 - the last day of school supposedly attended in NYC ============================= What we are focusing on is the record of attendance between March 23, 1953 and June 26, 1953... the time this boy attended ANY SCHOOL. The records have him there 109 3/2 + 15 3/2 days for a total of 127 actual, physical weekdays this boy was involved with school. Show us how 127 days fits in the time frame from March 23 to June 26 which offers only 70 TOTAL days of possible school INCLUDING Youth House and Spring break. "Attendance" does not include when he was not at school be it for Truancy, Youth House or Summer Break. (although we are giving him PS44 credit for Youth House in this calculation) There are only 70 days of school available from 3/23 to 6/26 - the remainder of the SPRING 1953 7th grade semester. The above record is a forgery as no school administrator would keep attendance in this manner... after the transfer to PS44 (Manhattan and/or the Bronx) the records go off the rails and are returned to normal starting in Sept 1953... To be remembered, these NYC records are all copies of copies while the originals are gone. The FBI lied about providing the "originals" to the WC... after corroborating that they did acquire them from the school district. No matter how hard you want to continue to confuse the issue Greg... you can't get this round peg into the square opening... but you just keep on banging away ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greg Parker Posted June 22, 2015 Share Posted June 22, 2015 (edited) You are taking it through to the transfer which is different to the date he stopped attending PS 44. If he stopped, as I suspect he did, Mid to late December, the figures total up just fine. The real problem appears to be simply that you have a different "accounting" method than everyone else. I don't know - yours may well be the one that should be used.... but it's still not the one used by everyone else on this. Edited June 22, 2015 by Greg Parker Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Josephs Posted June 22, 2015 Share Posted June 22, 2015 You are taking it through to the transfer which is different to the date he stopped attending PS 44. If he stopped, as I suspect he did, Mid to late December, the figures total up just fine. The real problem appears to be simply that you have a different "accounting" method than everyone else. I don't know - yours may well be the one that should be used.... but it's still not the one used by everyone else on this. Semesters don't end cause YOU want them to Greg. They end when they're done. They usually run from Sept thru Jan - and Feb thru June for a total of 180-190 days. Nothing here is me versus you Gerg... it's a calendar for pete's sake. It's a standard school year. You can't get 127 days into the SPRING 1953 semester. End of story. that these records exactly match the FBI's terrible report is no coincidence Greg. WAKE UP ALREADY !!!! the problem is your inability to find yourself incorrect about anything and even worse, that you can't admit it if you finally do. These years are only critical to the H&L switch and have ZERO to do with the JFK assassination investigation... There are no mistaken identities prior to this time and nothing but conflicts since... As I said before Greg... that you are "Playing Dumb" and refuse to show you can add is only a reflection on who you are mate.... The rest of us know how to count... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Trejo Posted June 22, 2015 Share Posted June 22, 2015 (edited) Some interesting testimony from MIchael Paine: Mr. LIEBELER - Did you ever discuss with him driving an automobile or obtaining a driver's license? Mr. PAINE - I probably said it would be well to get a driver's license. It would be well--I probably said, "You probably need a car to get around here." In other words, effectively; no. Mr. LIEBELER - Did he ever indicate to you that he planned to purchase an automobile? Mr. PAINE - I bought this second-hand car for $200. Mr. LIEBELER - What kind of a car is that? Mr. PAINE - That is a 1956 Oldsmobile. Mr. LIEBELER - When did you buy it? Mr. PAINE - I bought it while they were there, while Marina was staying with us, which was sometime in November. Either October or November, probably the early part of November. They went out to admire the car. $200, I suppose, didn't seem out of their reach then. Mr. LIEBELER - Did he indicate to you that he was thinking-- Mr. PAINE - Therefore, I think Ruth, they went out to admire the car and, of course, I was thinking that it, this might make it appear to them that the car was within reach, and driving was something to be sought. ... The WC obsession to always portray Lee Harvey Oswald using public transportation is palpable. We see this in the FBI forgery of bus records to prove that Oswald entered Mexico City by bus. (It was forbidden to suggest that Oswald was a passenger in somebody's car.) We see this in the mythology that Lee Harvey Oswald coordinated his Edwin Walker shooting with a bus schedule. (It was forbidden to suggest that Oswald was a passenger in somebody's car.) We see this in the denial of the FBI that Dallas Deputy Sheriff Roger Craig saw Lee enter a Green Rambler driven by a dark-skinner fellow, outside the TSBD in the minutes after the JFK murder. (It was forbidden to suggest that Oswald was a passenger in somebody's car.) There is so much crud underneath the CIA-did-it theory, that Ruth and Michael Paine's kind efforts to teach Lee Harvey Oswald to drive are often transformed into a CIA plot, all on their own. It's almost funny. Regards, --Paul Trejo Edited June 22, 2015 by Paul Trejo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greg Parker Posted June 22, 2015 Share Posted June 22, 2015 (edited) You are taking it through to the transfer which is different to the date he stopped attending PS 44. If he stopped, as I suspect he did, Mid to late December, the figures total up just fine. The real problem appears to be simply that you have a different "accounting" method than everyone else. I don't know - yours may well be the one that should be used.... but it's still not the one used by everyone else on this. Semesters don't end cause YOU want them to Greg. They end when they're done. They usually run from Sept thru Jan - and Feb thru June for a total of 180-190 days. Nothing here is me versus you Gerg... it's a calendar for pete's sake. It's a standard school year. You can't get 127 days into the SPRING 1953 semester. End of story. that these records exactly match the FBI's terrible report is no coincidence Greg. WAKE UP ALREADY !!!! the problem is your inability to find yourself incorrect about anything and even worse, that you can't admit it if you finally do. These years are only critical to the H&L switch and have ZERO to do with the JFK assassination investigation... There are no mistaken identities prior to this time and nothing but conflicts since... As I said before Greg... that you are "Playing Dumb" and refuse to show you can add is only a reflection on who you are mate.... The rest of us know how to count... Apparently you also confuse Mr Tidd. The figures add up. End of story. You and your crowd are the only ones who are trying to force the square peg into the round hole. What you are really saying is that "everyone else, the school and the FBI, should have done the figures the same way I do" Get over it, They didn't. Edit to add: the reason they didn't do it "your" way may well be because the note taken in Dec was taken as being his last day there. The fact that he didn't register in NO until later in January is neither here nor there. In short, you are trying to add days to PS 44 when as far as the school knew, he had left. Edited June 23, 2015 by Greg Parker Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steven Gaal Posted June 22, 2015 Share Posted June 22, 2015 You are taking it through to the transfer which is different to the date he stopped attending PS 44. If he stopped, as I suspect he did, Mid to late December, the figures total up just fine. The real problem appears to be simply that you have a different "accounting" method than everyone else. I don't know - yours may well be the one that should be used.... but it's still not the one used by everyone else on this. Semesters don't end cause YOU want them to Greg. They end when they're done. They usually run from Sept thru Jan - and Feb thru June for a total of 180-190 days. Nothing here is me versus you Gerg... it's a calendar for pete's sake. It's a standard school year. You can't get 127 days into the SPRING 1953 semester. End of story. that these records exactly match the FBI's terrible report is no coincidence Greg. WAKE UP ALREADY !!!! the problem is your inability to find yourself incorrect about anything and even worse, that you can't admit it if you finally do. These years are only critical to the H&L switch and have ZERO to do with the JFK assassination investigation... There are no mistaken identities prior to this time and nothing but conflicts since... As I said before Greg... that you are "Playing Dumb" and refuse to show you can add is only a reflection on who you are mate.... The rest of us know how to count... Apparently you also confuse Mr Tidd. The figures add up. End of story. You and your crowd are the only ones who are trying to force the square peg into the round hole. What you are really saying is that "everyone else, the school and the FBI, should have done the figures the same way I do" Get over it, They didn't. Edit to add: the reason they didn't do "your" way may well be because the not taken in Dec was taken as being his last day there. The fact that he didn't register in NO until later in January is neither here nor nor there. In short, you are trying to add days to PS 44 when as far as the school knew, he had left. There are only 70 days of school available from 3/23 to 6/26 - the remainder of the SPRING 1953 7th grade semester. The above record is a forgery as no school administrator would keep attendance in this manner... after the transfer to PS44 (Manhattan and/or the Bronx) the records go off the rails and are returned to normal starting in Sept 1953... ]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]] PAUSE AND REFLECT Pause and reflect Pause and reflect THE FBI loses original documents in the MURDER OF THE POTUS......not possible see http://educationforum.ipbhost.com/index.php?showtopic=19762&p=306404 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greg Parker Posted June 22, 2015 Share Posted June 22, 2015 Will someone shove a sock in his mouth? Thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Hargrove Posted June 23, 2015 Share Posted June 23, 2015 The Story of Two Steve Landesbergs In the 1960s there were two young men living in and around Greenwich Village (in New York City) named “Steve Landesberg.” Although they were similar in age and appearance, there were distinct differences between them. One boy, Stephen Harris Landesberg (the student), was from Queens. He was quiet, introverted, kept to himself, a bookworm, and an honor student. He had black hair, a life-long speech impediment, stuttered profusely when excited, never wore glasses, and had no southern accent. The other boy, Stephen Richard Landesberg (a future actor), from the Bronx, was outgoing, likable and gregarious. He had reddish brown hair, occasionally wore rimless eyeglasses, enjoyed being around people, had no speech impediment, and acquired a Southern accent that he could use or not use at will. In late 1961 and early 1962 Stephen Richard Landesberg became entangled in activities involving the harassment of liberal and minority-oriented political groups that were active in and around the Village. During this time he befriended and became involved with American-born Lee Oswald, while at the same time Harvey Oswald and Marina were living in Russia. In the 1970s Stephen Richard Landesberg gained notoriety as an actor on the TV show, Barney Miller. The actor's relationship with Oswald motivated a number of JFK researchers, including author Carleton W. Sterling, Professor Stan Weeber (UNT, Denton, TX), attorney Carol Hewitt, author/researcher Joachim Joesten, and myself to investigate the two "Steve Landesbergs." To read the remainder of John Armstrong's updated write-up, click here: http://harveyandlee.net/Landesberg/Landesbergs.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Trejo Posted June 23, 2015 Share Posted June 23, 2015 The Story of Two Steve Landesbergs In the 1960s there were two young men living in and around Greenwich Village (in New York City) named “Steve Landesberg.” Although they were similar in age and appearance, there were distinct differences between them. One boy, Stephen Harris Landesberg (the student), was from Queens. He was quiet, introverted, kept to himself, a bookworm, and an honor student. He had black hair, a life-long speech impediment, stuttered profusely when excited, never wore glasses, and had no southern accent. The other boy, Stephen Richard Landesberg (a future actor), from the Bronx, was outgoing, likable and gregarious. He had reddish brown hair, occasionally wore rimless eyeglasses, enjoyed being around people, had no speech impediment, and acquired a Southern accent that he could use or not use at will. In late 1961 and early 1962 Stephen Richard Landesberg became entangled in activities involving the harassment of liberal and minority-oriented political groups that were active in and around the Village. During this time he befriended and became involved with American-born Lee Oswald, while at the same time Harvey Oswald and Marina were living in Russia. In the 1970s Stephen Richard Landesberg gained notoriety as an actor on the TV show, Barney Miller. The actor's relationship with Oswald motivated a number of JFK researchers, including author Carleton W. Sterling, Professor Stan Weeber (UNT, Denton, TX), attorney Carol Hewitt, author/researcher Joachim Joesten, and myself to investigate the two "Steve Landesbergs." To read the remainder of John Armstrong's updated write-up, click here: http://harveyandlee.net/Landesberg/Landesbergs.html Well, Jim, thanks for sharing that link regarding the confusion of the Landesbergs and the Oswalds. IMHO, there is nothing convincing in the tale that Lee Oswald was in New York City -- what I see here is a simple case of mistaken identity -- not based so much on appearance as on name-similarity. We should probably try to tally how many people in the USA had the name, "Lee Oswald" in 1963. But the Big Lie of the "Lone Nut" theory should not spur us to take every account of mistaken identity seriously -- or as a CIA plot. Regards, --Paul Trejo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
W. Tracy Parnell Posted June 23, 2015 Share Posted June 23, 2015 At the DPF a few days ago, Jim Hargrove said: John is currently revising an article on the Steven Landesberg affair, and it is shaping up to be every bit as dangerous to the status quo as the rest of H&L. When it's done, and it's nearly there, I'm hoping EF will feel compelled to erupt in some sort of nuclear way, not just the usual panties in a twist snits. Should be fun! Well, we now have the "dangerous" article available to all and I must say it is really more of the same from John Armstrong. I will be doing a complete write-up when I get time since I believe this nonsense needs to be addressed, but I will summarize the piece briefly. After his extremely ambiguous treatment of the Landesberg affair in Harvey & Lee, Armstrong has at least taken a position with this unsourced article. Where he previously only hinted at his involvement, he is now clearly inserting the late actor Steve Landesberg into his fantasy. I can guarantee that if Landesberg were still alive, he would not be doing this, since a call from his head of security caused both Armstrong and Jack White to retreat from their ridiculous assertions and fall silent. I personally find it shameful that Armstrong is willing to besmirch the reputation of a talented man who was admired by millions of people with no supporting evidence-only self serving nonsense. The following paragraph summarizes the new Armstrong position: "Our national security network, including the FBI, CIA, and the Warren Commission selectively drew upon eyewitnesses and documents that suited their purposes in order to craft the biography of one "Lee Harvey Oswald." In the case of Stephen Harris Landesberg (the student) and Stephen Richard Landesberg (the actor), the FBI did exactly the same thing. With the alleged admission from Stephen Harris Landesberg (the student) that he had used the name "Steven Yves L'Eandes," the Bureau was able to claim these two people were one and the same." In other words, in addition to "Harvey & Lee" and the two Marguerites, we now have a third pair of operatives for Armstrong to work with. Armstrong now claims that "Steve L'Eandes", who was the man who became the actor of "Barney Miller", fame was the individual that participated in the 1961 and '62 political rally disruptions (perhaps working with the "other" Landesberg"). Stephen Harris Landesberg (the student) called the FBI after the assassination because he "wanted the public to know that Oswald, the agitator and protestor, had been in the Village in 1961-62." Armstrong does here what he does throughout his book-uses two individuals to attempt to explain discrepancies in the record and create an alternate universe. And when he encounters something that refutes his theory he either ignores it (as with the LHO exhumation) or says it is fabricated. As an example, Landesberg the student admitted to the FBI that the actions that he had attributed to L’Eandes were in fact his own actions using that name. How does Armstrong answer this? "These alleged admissions allowed the Bureau to erroneously conclude that Steven Yves L'Eandes (the student) and Stephen L'eandes (the actor) were the same person." This convenient and selective branding of FBI statements as phony is puzzling to me since Armstrong uses the FBI as a source for dozens and dozens of citations in his book. How is he able to tell when the bureau is telling the truth and when it is not? I would maintain that perhaps it depends on whether the fact in dispute agrees with the H&L theory or not. Armstrong also seems to assert that Landesberg, L'Eandes, Oswald and Perry were all (or could have been) working together at the rallies. This is easily refuted by the fact that the Village Voice reported in detail on Landesberg's (posing as L'Eandes) political activities and never mentioned Oswald taking photos or a group assisting him. There was a mention of a girl who appeared to be working with Landesberg but that would not yet seem to fit Armstrong's evolving narrative. So we have more of the same from Armstrong-find a discrepancy or a witness statement and mold it to the H&L theory. If needed, create a double or find someone with the same name and weave them into the narrative. I urge readers to read my original article on the subject and please check my sources for yourself. When you do that, you will find that Armstrong has twisted the evidence to fit his assertions as usual. http://wtracyparnell.com/the-hoaxster-and-the-conspiracy-theorists/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Hargrove Posted June 23, 2015 Share Posted June 23, 2015 The FBI went out of its way to cover-up the entire Landesberg affair, which would have exposed the two Oswalds within days of the assassination. The story linked below provides all the gory details, but a couple of examples: Instead of locating and interviewing an important witness to Lee Oswald's activities in NYC while Harvey Oswald was in Russia, the FBI questioned Earl Sheldon Perry instead of Earl Eugene Perry. In its effort to locate the paymaster for Landesberg's and Oswald's agent provocateur activities in NYC, the FBI went to the Roosevelt Hotel in New Orleans, instead of the Roosevelt Hotel in NYC, where the paymaster stayed. Even more importantly, the FBI substituted and made a patsy of a student named Stephen Harris Landesberg, instead of interviewing the real provocateur who had worked with Oswald, Stephen Richard Landesberg, who later became an actor on the Barney Miller television show. There is much more to this coverup, including the disappearance of all U.S. District Court files and backup files related to the commitment of Landesberg the Patsy to Bellevue Psychiatric Hospital for the crime of “lying” to the FBI. Read the details here: http://harveyandlee.net/Landesberg/Landesbergs.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
W. Tracy Parnell Posted June 23, 2015 Share Posted June 23, 2015 (edited) Lets see, I posted at 3:41 eastern and Jim responded at 3:42. I guess he had a "canned" response ready. Earl Perry is a red herring. There is no evidence Landesberg the student actually knew anyone named Earl Perry and he certainly didn't specify a middle name. The FBI may have gotten their wires crossed and gone to the wrong hotel. But in Armstrong's world, that is something sinister not just a mistake or incompetence. It is a moot point since there is no evidence for "Regan" other than Landesberg's imagination. I really hope for Armstrong's sake that the heirs of the actor don't read these forums. Otherwise he may be in trouble again. Edited June 23, 2015 by W. Tracy Parnell Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steven Gaal Posted June 23, 2015 Share Posted June 23, 2015 (edited) Lets see, I posted at 3:41 eastern and Jim responded at 3:42. I guess he had a "canned" response ready. Earl Perry is a red herring. There is no evidence Landesberg the student actually knew anyone named Earl Perry and he certainly didn't specify a middle name. The FBI may have gotten their wires crossed and gone to the wrong hotel. But in Armstrong's world, that is something sinister not just a mistake or incompetence. It is a moot point since there is no evidence for "Regan" other than Landesberg's imagination. I really hope for Armstrong's sake that the heirs of the actor don't read these forums. Otherwise he may be in trouble again. http://media.nara.gov/dc-metro/rg-272/605417-key-persons/oswald_lee_h_pre_russian_period_6_military_service_nov-dec_1963/oswald_lee_h_pre_russian_period_6_military_service_nov-dec_1963.pdf (see page 153 pdf above RE EUGENE PERRY) = On Nov 25 SA J. Richard Nichols contacted Major Robert C. Whitebread of the USMC in an attempt to locate Earl Perry, who knew L'eandes (the actor) and Oswald. Nichols learned that the only Earl Perry on active duty was assigned to the Marine Supply Center in Barstow, CA., and was from El Paso, TX. But on Nov 26, instead of requesting the military file for Earl Eugene Perry (El Paso, TX), SA Leonard Lewis obtained the file for Earl Sheldon Perry from the Military Personnel Records Center in St. Louis. Earl Sheldon Perry was from Casper, Wyoming, joined the US Army in 1954, and was discharged in 1956. The FBI avoided contacting Earl Eugene Perry from El Paso, who was mentioned as an acquaintance of Oswald and L'eandes (the actor) by James Rizzuto, and instead collected information on Earl Sheldon Perry, a former chaplain's assistant in the US Army. The FBI's coverup relating to L'eandes (the actor) and Oswald continued. (H & L site) =============================================================================== In late 1961 and early 1962 Stephen Harris Landesberg, Earl Perry, and (LEE) Oswald were involved in demonstrations in New York City (ARRB Rec. Nos. 124-10058-10262 and 124-10164-10225 and 180-10015-10389). H & L site ,GAAL --------------------------------------------------- Edited June 23, 2015 by Steven Gaal Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Hargrove Posted June 23, 2015 Share Posted June 23, 2015 We're talking about this updated essay by John Armstrong on the two Steve Landesbergs: http://harveyandlee.net/Landesberg/Landesbergs.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
W. Tracy Parnell Posted June 23, 2015 Share Posted June 23, 2015 Steve Gaal Said: instead of requesting the military file for Earl Eugene Perry (El Paso, TX), SA Leonard Lewis obtained the file for Earl Sheldon Perry from the Military Personnel Records Center in St. Louis. They were checking several "Earl Perrys". Contrary to what Armstrong maintains one Earl Perry wasn't any more interesting than another. Landesberg refers to knowing "Perry" as far back as 1956 so it doesn't make sense that an "Earl Perry" who was on active duty would be any more likely to be the "right" Perry. It is just more another case of Armstrong trying to show a "coverup". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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