Vanessa Loney Posted April 7, 2015 Share Posted April 7, 2015 Not at all Bob. I'd love to comment on the GIF but I can't download it due to my hopeless browser. I'll try tomorrow when I'm on a better computer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Prudhomme Posted April 7, 2015 Share Posted April 7, 2015 I will describe it to you. It is very short, and from the Wiegman film, and shows PM and Lovelady side by side on the top step of the entrance to the TSBD. At a glance, the 5'8" tall Lovelady can be seen to be taller than PM. We get only a brief view of this, as Lovelady then steps down to the next step. This obviously presents a problem, as Oswald was 5'9" tall, and should have been seen to be taller than Lovelady, not shorter, if Oswald was indeed PM. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vanessa Loney Posted April 7, 2015 Share Posted April 7, 2015 Thanks for that description Bob. It does sound intriguing that's for sure. Is PM clearly on the top landing (or step) though? I didn't think he was ever on the top level. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomas Graves Posted April 7, 2015 Share Posted April 7, 2015 (edited) Hi Tommy Another one of those six degrees of separation that crops up constantly in this. Although in his case it sounds like only 2 degrees of separation between him and Oswald. Were you able to find out where he sent the telegram from? Vanessa, Here it is, but now I'm not sure it was a telegram. Maybe a letter. Mailed / sent on 11/24, not 11/22. My bad. Det. Paul Bentley Dallas Police Dept. Dallas, Texas 7960 June Lake Dr. San Diego, 19, Calf. 24 Nov. 1963 Dear Paul, Perhaps you are aware that ONI has quite a file on Oswald, which no doubt has been made avbailable on the Washington level. If not I am certain that this information can be obtained for you through our resident special agent in charge of our Dallas office, A.C. Sullivan, who is a wonderful agent, and whom I hope you know. As a personal friend I congratulate you - wish you continued success - and pray that your guardian angel will remain close at hand and vigilant, always. Respectifully, Robert D. Steel Commander USNR-R Originally posted by the illustrious Bill Kelly. Spelling errors are Kelly's. http://jfkcountercoup2.blogspot.com/2013/01/dallas-police-detective-paul-bentley.html --Tommy Edited April 7, 2015 by Thomas Graves Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomas Graves Posted April 7, 2015 Share Posted April 7, 2015 (edited) I see everyone is steadfastly ignoring the 800 pound gorilla in the room, and merrily chatting about other things. Not a single comment about Chris Davidson's gif.? No comments about the obvious, that the 5'8" Billy Lovelady is obviously taller than PM, until he steps off of the top step onto a lower step? I would dearly love for PM to be Oswald, too, but I refuse to ignore the obvious in the process. Dear Bob, If "Prayer Man" wasn't Oswald, who do you think he or she might have been? Respectfully, --Tommy Edited April 7, 2015 by Thomas Graves Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Prudhomme Posted April 7, 2015 Share Posted April 7, 2015 I see everyone is steadfastly ignoring the 800 pound gorilla in the room, and merrily chatting about other things. Not a single comment about Chris Davidson's gif.? No comments about the obvious, that the 5'8" Billy Lovelady is obviously taller than PM, until he steps off of the top step onto a lower step? I would dearly love for PM to be Oswald, too, but I refuse to ignore the obvious in the process. Dear Bob, If "Prayer Man" wasn't Oswald, who do you think he or she might have been? Respectfully, --Tommy Joe Molina, who stood 5'7". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Prudhomme Posted April 7, 2015 Share Posted April 7, 2015 (edited) Thanks for that description Bob. It does sound intriguing that's for sure. Is PM clearly on the top landing (or step) though? I didn't think he was ever on the top level. Lovelady testified to standing on the top step. If PM is on the next step down, and Lovelady is 5'8" tall, and the vertical rise of the step is 7", PM would have to be 6'2" tall in order to be seen in the photo as one inch shorter than Lovelady. As Oswald was 5'9" tall, this too would disqualify him from being PM. If both Lovelady and PM are on the next step down from the top, we are back to Square One, with Lovelady being taller than PM. Edited April 7, 2015 by Robert Prudhomme Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vanessa Loney Posted April 7, 2015 Share Posted April 7, 2015 Thanks Bob. I have to say I take the testimony of everyone on the steps that day with a grain of salt. None of them saw PM and several of them gave contradictory testimony about what they did before and after the shots ie Shelley and Lovelady. I would take the films over their testimony in this case. In the Weigman and Darnell films it doesn't look to me as if PM is ever on the top landing of the steps - otherwise we are going back to PM being a diminutive 5 foot-ish. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Prudhomme Posted April 7, 2015 Share Posted April 7, 2015 (edited) Vanessa You do not understand what I am saying. It is a simple matter of mathematics. Both PM and Lovelady are quite identifiable in this film. IF they are both on the same step, be it top step or the next one down, the 5'8" Lovelady is taller than PM, and PM cannot be the 5'9" Oswald. IF PM is a step down from Lovelady, PM has to be 6'2" in order to be seen as one inch shorter than Lovelady, and the 5'9" Oswald is disqualified. IF PM is a step up from Lovelady, he would have to be 5'1" tall, in order to appear to be one inch shorter than Lovelady, and, once again, the 5'9" tall Oswald is disqualified. It has nothing to do with testimony. Edited April 7, 2015 by Robert Prudhomme Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darren Hastings Posted April 7, 2015 Share Posted April 7, 2015 It's all about perspective. The view we have of the TSBD steps in both frames is that we are looking upwards at PM and Lovelady. I tend to agree with where Robin Unger places PM (in the back corner against the glass). Since Lovelady is at the FRONT of the top landing (confirmed as he steps down) AND closer to the camera AND due to our perspective of looking upwards at them .......PM appears shorter in the frames but isn't actually shorter. The TSBD top landing is quite deep as per Robins photo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Prudhomme Posted April 7, 2015 Share Posted April 7, 2015 It's all about perspective. The view we have of the TSBD steps in both frames is that we are looking upwards at PM and Lovelady. I tend to agree with where Robin Unger places PM (in the back corner against the glass). Since Lovelady is at the FRONT of the top landing (confirmed as he steps down) AND closer to the camera AND due to our perspective of looking upwards at them .......PM appears shorter in the frames but isn't actually shorter. The TSBD top landing is quite deep as per Robins photo. Wrong. In 1963, the space between the break over of the top step and the entrance door was extremely narrow. Years later, it was renovated and this landing area made much wider. I will try to find a photo to demonstrate this to you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Prudhomme Posted April 7, 2015 Share Posted April 7, 2015 The entrance in 1963: Following renovation, with the original location of glass door shown by a red line, some three feet from the breakover: However, as this still shows, PM was not backed up against the glass door but, rather, appears to be up against the side wall of the entrance: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darren Hastings Posted April 7, 2015 Share Posted April 7, 2015 (edited) I respectfully disagree. Look at this image. http://www.show-the-house.com/sitebuildercontent/sitebuilderpictures/BushJfkBookDepo2.jpg The door is open and there is space between the door and the middle handrail. This means it MUST be at least 3ft...I'd estimate it to be at least 6 ft based on various photos. EDIT: you posted while I was typing. If it is confirmed as 3ft then we still have a perspective issue which would make PM appear shorter. Edited April 7, 2015 by Darren Hastings Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Prudhomme Posted April 7, 2015 Share Posted April 7, 2015 I respectfully disagree. Look at this image. http://www.show-the-house.com/sitebuildercontent/sitebuilderpictures/BushJfkBookDepo2.jpg The door is open and there is space between the door and the middle handrail. This means it MUST be at least 3ft...I'd estimate it to be at least 6 ft based on various photos. Read Post # 1808. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Prudhomme Posted April 7, 2015 Share Posted April 7, 2015 (edited) Can perspective account for the difference in height seen in this still from Wiegman? Edited April 7, 2015 by Robert Prudhomme Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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